|
Post by snow on Jun 19, 2024 14:47:49 GMT -5
CSA is actually a very easy thing to deal with, you simply throw anyone out of the church who does it and simultaneously call the police to report the crime.
Overseer's might be coming to that solution now, but they sure resisted acknowledging or doing anything about it in the past. Some are still treating it as a minor setback!
Your correct, its about time they put their foot down and relay zero tolerance for perverts in the church.. Hope its not too late.
Yes, most of us know what is the right thing to do about CSA for quite awhile now, but majority of the organized churches such as the RCC, Protestant denominations, Mormons, Jehovah Witnesses and and 2x2 leaderships have failed in this department very badly. I believe majority of 2x2 overseers are no longer take CSA lightly like two years ago. We have warned and tried to educate them back in the year 2000 on TMB, but they didn’t think it was no big deal. I wish the 2x2 leadership had taken the warnings seriously and had Zero tolerance policy on CSA back then, many lives would have been spared from the traumatic experiences in their lives. Amen, about zero tolerance on CSA/SA in our fellowship and in the world.👍 If Bruer hadn't been exposed they would still be saying that it's no big deal. But they can no longer sweep it under the rug and based on the last interview with Darryl Doland they are now even backing away from having any guidelines at all unless they are quotes out of the bible. That's insane and highly irresponsible if protecting children ever mattered to them.
|
|
|
Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jun 19, 2024 15:10:32 GMT -5
Gary is not a smooth talker, he has a hard time expressing and answering questions sometimes. However, he has a good heart, a caring person and is trying to do his best for people. There is tons of evidence that he did know about it. So him saying that he didn't never heard of it or saw it and then backing that up with saying he doesn't believe it happened, is not the definition of a caring person that is trying to do his best for people. He says the quality of the ministry comes first before the protection of children. That is insane! His outward demeanor that Nathan attests to does not match what is within. Beware of wolves in sheep clothing.
|
|
|
Post by snow on Jun 19, 2024 15:52:29 GMT -5
There is tons of evidence that he did know about it. So him saying that he didn't never heard of it or saw it and then backing that up with saying he doesn't believe it happened, is not the definition of a caring person that is trying to do his best for people. He says the quality of the ministry comes first before the protection of children. That is insane! His outward demeanor that Nathan attests to does not match what is within. Beware of wolves in sheep clothing. It appears that the ones that rose to the top of the hierarchy are the ones that could lie and pretend to care better than the others. They knew how to present themselves to others and knew how to hide who they really were.
|
|
nathan2
Royal Member
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Nathan again
50%
Posts: 4,263
|
Post by nathan2 on Jun 19, 2024 16:24:21 GMT -5
Gary is not a smooth talker, he has a hard time expressing and answering questions sometimes. However, he has a good heart, a caring person and is trying to do his best for people. There is tons of evidence that he did know about it. So him saying that he didn't never heard of it or saw it and then backing that up with saying he doesn't believe it happened, is not the definition of a caring person that is trying to do his best for people. He says the quality of the ministry comes first before the protection of children. That is insane! Gary knows about these things but not the extensive CSA as we know now. When I was in the work, I didn’t know or hear anything about CSA among the workers. Gary is trying to protect the ministry and the fellowship reputation.
|
|
|
Post by help on Jun 19, 2024 16:48:28 GMT -5
The fellowship reputation is in tatters, the majority of people don't see it as the "Perfect Way" anymore, not that it ever was. There is no such thing. And Workers trying to protect it is a waste of time, once the Genie is out of the bottle all the talk won't get it back. Plus of course Workers have never received proper training to deal with such situations. As Snow commented quoting the Bible as an excuse is insane.
|
|
nathan2
Royal Member
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Nathan again
50%
Posts: 4,263
|
Post by nathan2 on Jun 19, 2024 17:31:29 GMT -5
Yes, most of us know what is the right thing to do about CSA for quite awhile now, but majority of the organized churches such as the RCC, Protestant denominations, Mormons, Jehovah Witnesses and and 2x2 leaderships have failed in this department very badly. I believe majority of 2x2 overseers are no longer take CSA lightly like two years ago. We have warned and tried to educate them back in the year 2000 on TMB, but they didn’t think it was no big deal. I wish the 2x2 leadership had taken the warnings seriously and had Zero tolerance policy on CSA back then, many lives would have been spared from the traumatic experiences in their lives. Amen, about zero tolerance on CSA/SA in our fellowship and in the world.👍 If Bruer hadn't been exposed they would still be saying that it's no big deal. But they can no longer sweep it under the rug and based on the last interview with Darryl Doland they are now even backing away from having any guidelines at all unless they are quotes out of the bible. That's insane and highly irresponsible if protecting children ever mattered to them. I agree, God and Christ have their ways of cleansing and purifying their New Testament apostolic ministry and fellowship. The overseers will get their acts together some day once they see the numbers of the friends are going down and down because of theirs slowness in dealing with CSA.
|
|
|
Post by Annan on Jun 19, 2024 18:06:23 GMT -5
CSA is actually a very easy thing to deal with, you simply throw anyone out of the church who does it and simultaneously call the police to report the crime.
Overseer's might be coming to that solution now, but they sure resisted acknowledging or doing anything about it in the past. Some are still treating it as a minor setback!
Your correct, its about time they put their foot down and relay zero tolerance for perverts in the church.. Hope its not too late.
Yes, most of us know what is the right thing to do about CSA for quite awhile now, but majority of the organized churches such as the RCC, Protestant denominations, Mormons, Jehovah Witnesses and and 2x2 leaderships have failed in this department very badly. I believe majority of 2x2 overseers are no longer take CSA lightly like two years ago. We have warned and tried to educate them back in the year 2000 on TMB, but they didn’t think it was no big deal. I wish the 2x2 leadership had taken the warnings seriously and had Zero tolerance policy on CSA back then, many lives would have been spared from the traumatic experiences in their lives. Amen, about zero tolerance on CSA/SA in our fellowship and in the world.👍 WE? Who is WE? What you should have done is called the authorities like the police and the FBI. You failed the abused. You are complicit as you knew and did nothing.
|
|
|
Post by Dan on Jun 19, 2024 21:49:56 GMT -5
On one of the facebook groups a couple of people have commented. 1- There is zero chance that he nothing of the Reuben Mata situation. 2- He is referenced on Expressions site in respect to having been written to about abuse. 3- An ex worker who was a companion of his has said that they most definitely were aware of abuse during their time together. He seems to have a rather selective memory. Yes apparently there have been numerous times he's been made aware. But of course the party line is deny deny deny because if he says he knew then the next question would have to be 'so what did you do about it, if anything'. He would have to say nothing and that's not a good look. ![::)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/eyesroll.png)
Admitting that you knew about SA or CSA may make a person subject to prosecution. So I'm guessing Workers have been advised not to incriminate themselves by admitting they had any knowledge?
Failure to Report a Crime under Federal Law (18 U.S.C. section 4) prohibits concealing information about specific crimes, and many states also have laws that obligate you to report a crime, especially in cases of rape or CSA.
If you willfully conceal the commission of a felony, you can be charged with “misprision of a felony”, a form of obstruction of justice.
You don't have to find out if the harm actually happened. But if you have good reason to believe that a child under 16 has been harmed or might be harmed, you have a duty to report it. Some people who work with children can be charged with a crime if they don't report abuse. The "duty to report" includes family, friends, neighbors, teachers, doctors, nurses, daycare workers, family counselors, social workers, and religious leaders.
So self-preservation would encourage a Worker in the know to plead ignorance.
|
|
|
Post by snow on Jun 20, 2024 13:07:13 GMT -5
There is tons of evidence that he did know about it. So him saying that he didn't never heard of it or saw it and then backing that up with saying he doesn't believe it happened, is not the definition of a caring person that is trying to do his best for people. He says the quality of the ministry comes first before the protection of children. That is insane! Gary knows about these things but not the extensive CSA as we know now. When I was in the work, I didn’t know or hear anything about CSA among the workers. Gary is trying to protect the ministry and the fellowship reputation. It's a little late for that with all the evidence against them. He'd be smarter to acknowledge what's happening, showing some compassion for the survivors and be willing to protect the children that are still in the fellowship. He's doing the ministry more harm imo.
|
|
|
Post by snow on Jun 20, 2024 13:09:43 GMT -5
Yes apparently there have been numerous times he's been made aware. But of course the party line is deny deny deny because if he says he knew then the next question would have to be 'so what did you do about it, if anything'. He would have to say nothing and that's not a good look. ![::)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/eyesroll.png) Admitting that you knew about SA or CSA may make a person subject to prosecution. So I'm guessing Workers have been advised not to incriminate themselves by admitting they had any knowledge?
Failure to Report a Crime under Federal Law (18 U.S.C. section 4) prohibits concealing information about specific crimes, and many states also have laws that obligate you to report a crime, especially in cases of rape or CSA.
If you willfully conceal the commission of a felony, you can be charged with “misprision of a felony”, a form of obstruction of justice.
You don't have to find out if the harm actually happened. But if you have good reason to believe that a child under 16 has been harmed or might be harmed, you have a duty to report it. Some people who work with children can be charged with a crime if they don't report abuse. The "duty to report" includes family, friends, neighbors, teachers, doctors, nurses, daycare workers, family counselors, social workers, and religious leaders. So self-preservation would encourage a Worker in the know to plead ignorance.
Yes that's likely the case. Jerome Frandle did time for not reporting and they have to know that.
|
|
|
Post by fixit on Jun 20, 2024 14:49:33 GMT -5
There is tons of evidence that he did know about it. So him saying that he didn't never heard of it or saw it and then backing that up with saying he doesn't believe it happened, is not the definition of a caring person that is trying to do his best for people. He says the quality of the ministry comes first before the protection of children. That is insane! Gary knows about these things but not the extensive CSA as we know now. When I was in the work, I didn’t know or hear anything about CSA among the workers. Gary is trying to protect the ministry and the fellowship reputation. If they cared about protecting the ministry and the fellowship's reputation they would have dealt openly and honestly with CSA and SA from the beginning. The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery. ~ Galatians 5:19 Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them. ~ Ephesians 5:11
|
|
nathan2
Royal Member
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Nathan again
50%
Posts: 4,263
|
Post by nathan2 on Jun 20, 2024 14:59:46 GMT -5
Gary knows about these things but not the extensive CSA as we know now. When I was in the work, I didn’t know or hear anything about CSA among the workers. Gary is trying to protect the ministry and the fellowship reputation. If they cared about protecting the ministry and the fellowship's reputation they would have dealt openly and honestly with CSA and SA from the beginning. The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery. ~ Galatians 5:19 Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them. ~ Ephesians 5:11 Yes, that what I tried to convey the message back in the year 2000 about CSA and sexual immorality within the 2x2s. I didn’t know how extensive and spreading world wide it was…. The higher up/Overseers might have a better idea about it.
|
|
nathan2
Royal Member
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Nathan again
50%
Posts: 4,263
|
Post by nathan2 on Jun 20, 2024 15:10:22 GMT -5
Gary knows about these things but not the extensive CSA as we know now. When I was in the work, I didn’t know or hear anything about CSA among the workers. Gary is trying to protect the ministry and the fellowship reputation. It's a little late for that with all the evidence against them. He'd be smarter to acknowledge what's happening, showing some compassion for the survivors and be willing to protect the children that are still in the fellowship. He's doing the ministry more harm imo. Yes, I agree with you. Hopefully, Gary will read the reviews of his interview from the readers will help him to explain it better next time around for the victims and survivors. When I was with Gary, we had a major CSA case in the field and the authority was involved, I left the field the following year. Gary showed a lot of love and care for the family. The father abused his daughter.
|
|
|
Post by fixit on Jun 20, 2024 15:11:37 GMT -5
If they cared about protecting the ministry and the fellowship's reputation they would have dealt openly and honestly with CSA and SA from the beginning. The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery. ~ Galatians 5:19 Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them. ~ Ephesians 5:11 Yes, that what I tried to convey the message back in the year 2000 about CSA and sexual immorality within the 2x2s. I didn’t know how extensive and spreading world wide it was…. The higher up/Overseers might have a better idea about it. The higher up overseers have been very diligent at making an example of those in a D&R situation, while at the same time covering up CSA and SA.
|
|
nathan2
Royal Member
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Nathan again
50%
Posts: 4,263
|
Post by nathan2 on Jun 20, 2024 15:14:48 GMT -5
Yes, that what I tried to convey the message back in the year 2000 about CSA and sexual immorality within the 2x2s. I didn’t know how extensive and spreading world wide it was…. The higher up/Overseers might have a better idea about it. The higher up overseers have been very diligent at making an example of those in a D&R situation, while at the same time covering up CSA and SA. I know they got things out of wack! For sure on that one. I was in meetings with the D&R people who couldn’t take parts in testimonies and the emblems, they had the most beautiful spirits of them all. They were so happy to be in the worship Sunday morning gathering and contend with the workers decisions. They couldn’t speak their testimonies but their quite spirits spoke a great volume in the meetings.
|
|
janj
Senior Member
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Posts: 472
|
Post by janj on Jun 20, 2024 15:56:36 GMT -5
CSA is a tough situation to deal it, the overseers are trying their best on how to handle to make everyone satisfy and happy. The overseers must come together around the world and get CSA situation in the correct manners ASAP, it’s about time.
CSA is actually a very easy thing to deal with, you simply throw anyone out of the church who does it and simultaneously call the police to report the crime.
Overseer's might be coming to that solution now, but they sure resisted acknowledging or doing anything about it in the past. Some are still treating it as a minor setback!
Your correct, its about time they put their foot down and relay zero tolerance for perverts in the church.. Hope its not too late.
Sounds easy but do you throw out anyone that is accused of 'doing it' or charged with CSA? There is a huge difference and I think there lies the problem. People say 'just go to the police'. It sounds so simple but oh no- it's not. If people cannot mentally deal with police investigation(which is so common) but tell workers of alleged abuse, what then?
|
|
|
Post by Dan on Jun 20, 2024 19:39:14 GMT -5
CSA is actually a very easy thing to deal with, you simply throw anyone out of the church who does it and simultaneously call the police to report the crime.
Overseer's might be coming to that solution now, but they sure resisted acknowledging or doing anything about it in the past. Some are still treating it as a minor setback!
Your correct, its about time they put their foot down and relay zero tolerance for perverts in the church.. Hope its not too late.
Sounds easy but do you throw out anyone that is accused of 'doing it' or charged with CSA? There is a huge difference and I think there lies the problem. People say 'just go to the police'. It sounds so simple but oh no- it's not. If people cannot mentally deal with police investigation(which is so common) but tell workers of alleged abuse, what then?
The problem has been silence, you can't help or protect a victim who refuses to cooperate..That's the big issue now, all of these alleged victims coming out of the closet after the Dean Bruer incident, but since most were content to remain quiet for years, even decades, there isn't any real evidence that can be produced to substantiate their claims of abuse.
Workers won't punish anyone for a mere allegation, without proof they aren't in a position to condemn someone who's been accused without any evidence to back up the charge. That's why a victim needs to bypass the church and go directly to the authorities. Even then, without witnesses or DNA evidence, its a very difficult crime to prosecute.
I think if abuse is reported, Overseers need to confront the accused, but unless they confess, there's really not much else they can do. They should just refer the alleged victim to the professionals who are equipped to investigate. If mental anguish prevents a victim from reporting the abuse, then nothing will come of it. A Friend, Elder, or Worker should be suspended from meetings until a case is resolved, and imo excommunicated if found guilty.
|
|
|
Post by Pragmatic on Jun 20, 2024 20:34:40 GMT -5
I get where you're coming from.
I know of a victim who 50 years later refuses to lay a complaint. I don't know if it is stubbornness to admit publicly, unwillingness to have upset his daily routine, or whatever. I just don't know. Yet he is happy that others have come forward, and the perpetrator is being investigated. The abuse of others has gone on for decades.
This victim is inherently self centered, so it may be simply a case of wanting others to do the work for him.
I think when a number of victims come forward, and the stories are corroborated, then a perpetrator must be stood down from all contact with church members, and then the law gets involved. There is such a thing as being between a rock and a hard place though, when it comes to privacy issues, because you don't want to jeopardise a fair trial.
We have instances in our country where perpetrators have been well known to multiple victims for decades, and nothing was ever done. The oversight simply 'saw no evil, heard no evil'. Another victim told me that the oversight here told him,"We'd rather you didn't press charges".
In other words, "We're above the law, and the preservation of the church's reputation means more". Look where that got them.
|
|
|
Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jun 20, 2024 20:51:16 GMT -5
I get where you're coming from. I know of a victim who 50 years later refuses to lay a complaint. I don't know if it is stubbornness to admit publicly, unwillingness to have upset his daily routine, or whatever. I just don't know. Yet he is happy that others have come forward, and the perpetrator is being investigated. The abuse of others has gone on for decades. This victim is inherently self centered, so it may be simply a case of wanting others to do the work for him. I think when a number of victims come forward, and the stories are corroborated, then a perpetrator must be stood down from all contact with church members, and then the law gets involved. There is such a thing as being between a rock and a hard place though, when it comes to privacy issues, because you don't want to jeopardise a fair trial. We have instances in our country where perpetrators have been well known to multiple victims for decades, and nothing was ever done. The oversight simply 'saw no evil, heard no evil'. Another victim told me that the oversight here told him,"We'd rather you didn't press charges". In other words, "We're above the law, and the preservation of the church's reputation means more". Look where that got them. If you recall the case in Auckland where [the alleged perpetrator] was utilizing rent boys, there was a warrant out for his arrest. The two Willies and a Wally hid him when the police came looking and then managed to get him out of the country. That was to preserve the church's reputation. Here is the relevant law regarding conspiring to defeat the course of justice. Section 116 of the Crimes Act 1961. I have seen similar cases, first offence get three to four years jail for this. I used to laugh at the workers because of their idiotic religious beliefs. Now I laugh at them because they are liars, they are deceitful and they are not to be trusted. 116 Conspiring to defeat justice Every one is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 7 years who conspires to obstruct, prevent, pervert, or defeat the course of justice.
|
|
|
Post by fixit on Jun 20, 2024 22:43:11 GMT -5
I get where you're coming from. I know of a victim who 50 years later refuses to lay a complaint. I don't know if it is stubbornness to admit publicly, unwillingness to have upset his daily routine, or whatever. I just don't know. Yet he is happy that others have come forward, and the perpetrator is being investigated. The abuse of others has gone on for decades. This victim is inherently self centered, so it may be simply a case of wanting others to do the work for him. The perception of self-centredness may be a result of the abuse. Let's face it, so much was robbed from victims and they had no control over the situation, so it makes sense to take care of themselves going forward. Who can they trust to take care of them? It's extremely hard for a victim to go right back to the helpless child and relive the abuse. It takes an enormous toll, especially if they are dragged through a lengthy investigation and court procedures which can take a couple of years. Then the perp gets free counselling and a vastly reduced sentence and released from prison while the victim is still trying to get themselves back on an even keel.
|
|
|
Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jun 21, 2024 3:00:16 GMT -5
It's a little late for that with all the evidence against them. He'd be smarter to acknowledge what's happening, showing some compassion for the survivors and be willing to protect the children that are still in the fellowship. He's doing the ministry more harm imo. Yes, I agree with you. Hopefully, Gary will read the reviews of his interview from the readers will help him to explain it better next time around for the victims and survivors. When I was with Gary, we had a major CSA case in the field and the authority was involved, I left the field the following year. Gary showed a lot of love and care for the family. The father abused his daughter. Nathan said: When I was in the work, I didn’t know or hear anything about CSA among the workers. Gary is trying to protect the ministry and the fellowship reputation.
|
|
|
Post by Annan on Jun 21, 2024 5:55:28 GMT -5
I get where you're coming from. I know of a victim who 50 years later refuses to lay a complaint. I don't know if it is stubbornness to admit publicly, unwillingness to have upset his daily routine, or whatever. I just don't know. Yet he is happy that others have come forward, and the perpetrator is being investigated. The abuse of others has gone on for decades. This victim is inherently self centered, so it may be simply a case of wanting others to do the work for him. The perception of self-centredness may be a result of the abuse. Let's face it, so much was robbed from victims and they had no control over the situation, so it makes sense to take care of themselves going forward. Who can they trust to take care of them? It's extremely hard for a victim to go right back to the helpless child and relive the abuse. It takes an enormous toll, especially if they are dragged through a lengthy investigation and court procedures which can take a couple of years. Then the perp gets free counselling and a vastly reduced sentence and releaced from prison while the victim is still trying to get themselves back on an even keel. And I agree. I know someone who was married and was raped. She refused to tell her husband as she was afraid he would look at her liked soiled goods. Victims are often shamed. I know of a lady whose father sexually molested her. People called her "daddy's little girl". I was never a victim of CSA, but I know if it had happened to me with the workers that my parents would have found a way to blame me. That's how it was with the workers. Someone else here said the same thing. There are reasons victim keeps quiet.
|
|
|
Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jun 21, 2024 21:23:23 GMT -5
Yes, I agree with you. Hopefully, Gary will read the reviews of his interview from the readers will help him to explain it better next time around for the victims and survivors. When I was with Gary, we had a major CSA case in the field and the authority was involved, I left the field the following year. Gary showed a lot of love and care for the family. The father abused his daughter. Nathan said: When I was in the work, I didn’t know or hear anything about CSA among the workers. Gary is trying to protect the ministry and the fellowship reputation. This is a classic Nathan statement. One minute he does not know anything, the next he does. He says he has raised awareness of CSA but whining on TMB accounts for diddly squat. I have never seen him post on the fb pages for instance that have been set up to help victims and to organise the prosection of offenders. Wally is also absent from those pages. Both of them are all yap and no substance.
|
|
nathan2
Royal Member
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Nathan again
50%
Posts: 4,263
|
Post by nathan2 on Jun 22, 2024 7:41:00 GMT -5
Nathan said: When I was in the work, I didn’t know or hear anything about CSA among the workers. Gary is trying to protect the ministry and the fellowship reputation. This is a classic Nathan statement. One minute he does not know anything, the next he does. He says he has raised awareness of CSA but whining on TMB accounts for diddly squat. I have never seen him post on the fb pages for instance that have been set up to help victims and to organise the prosection of offenders. Wally is also absent from those pages. Both of them are all yap and no substance. Let me clarify what I wrote so, you don’t get all twisted up in your own crazy mind. When I was in the work from 1986-93 we had a few CSA cases among the friends and, where the authority were involved. I didn’t know about CSA committed by the workers during those years in the work, it happened but I didn’t know or hear about it, until I read it on TMB about Ira H. CSA case 10 years ago. 15 years ago, An ex-worker posted on TMB what he heard of certain worker committed CSA and was asked to leave the work. The overseers should have asked all of CSA workers to leave the work! Immediatedly. In the year 2000 some of the friends in Oregon and another state, my older companion and myself had posted articles with helpful information of CSA were taken places within the 2x2 fellowship, where to get help on CSA on my website and on TMB. On my website I posted how terrible the RCC leadership moved CSA priests to different parishes to committed more crimes against the children. I was hoping our overseers wouldn’t follow their bad and evil examples but they did exactly what the RCC had done by moving CSA workers to different fields or countries. Hoping, they would repent and change their horrible behaviors against the children. They were wrong because they didn’t understand it was almost impossible to change that kind of evil behaviors without professional help. Well, they learn that now, which is a little too late, the damage already done. The overseers, the friends need to help the victims to get help from professional with many therapies and healing for themselves and have zero tolerance CSA/SA within the ministry and fellowship. The friends who left their wills to the ministry, should mention 10% of the money goes to CSA victims therapy, and help for their needs.
|
|
|
Post by SharonArnold on Jun 22, 2024 14:36:56 GMT -5
The fellowship reputation is in tatters, the majority of people don't see it as the "Perfect Way" anymore, not that it ever was. There is no such thing. And Workers trying to protect it is a waste of time, once the Genie is out of the bottle all the talk won't get it back. Plus of course Workers have never received proper training to deal with such situations. As Snow commented quoting the Bible as an excuse is insane. I was astounded that he gave this interview. But it strikes me that he did it with a fair bit of sincerity, no matter how naive and siloed that may appear to onlookers. My question is, who helped him get set up for doing an online interview, because he doesn’t strike me as someone who would readily navigate the technical isssues/requirements. Two things I am sure of, since the Dean Breuer debacle: 1) The 2X2 system was designed by workers for workers. 2) It is a system that can almost unendingly deliver up a pool of potential victims for the unscrupulous amongst them. I recently watched a 2X2 funeral/gravesite service that popped up on my YouTube feed, even though I did not know the person who died. I found it difficult to attend to what was being said, because I started wondering/speculating who was misbehaving with whom there. There it is. Once you have seen it, you cannot unsee it. The fellowship reputation is indeed in tatters.
|
|
|
Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jun 22, 2024 15:44:41 GMT -5
Let me clarify what I wrote so, you don’t get all twisted up in your own crazy mind. When I was in the work from 1986-93 we had a few CSA cases among the friends and, where the authority were involved. I didn’t know about CSA committed by the workers during those years in the work, it happened but I didn’t know or hear about it, until I read it on TMB about Ira H. CSA case 10 years ago. 15 years ago, An ex-worker posted on TMB what he heard of certain worker committed CSA and was asked to leave the work. The overseers should have asked all of CSA workers to leave the work! Immediatedly. In the year 2000 some of the friends in Oregon and another state, my older companion and myself had posted articles with helpful information of CSA were taken places within the 2x2 fellowship, where to get help on CSA on my website and on TMB. On my website I posted how terrible the RCC leadership moved CSA priests to different parishes to committed more crimes against the children. I was hoping our overseers wouldn’t follow their bad and evil examples but they did exactly what the RCC had done by moving CSA workers to different fields or countries. Hoping, they would repent and change their horrible behaviors against the children. They were wrong because they didn’t understand it was almost impossible to change that kind of evil behaviors without professional help. Well, they learn that now, which is a little too late, the damage already done. The overseers, the friends need to help the victims to get help from professional with many therapies and healing for themselves and have zero tolerance CSA/SA within the ministry and fellowship. The friends who left their wills to the ministry, should mention 10% of the money goes to CSA victims therapy, and help for their needs. When I was in the work from 1986-93 we had a few CSA cases among the friends and, where the authority were involved. I didn’t know about CSA committed by the workers during those years in the work, it happened but I didn’t know or hear about it, until I read it on TMB about Ira H. CSA case 10 years ago. Well thanks for clarifying what you didn't know and did know. Not.
|
|
nathan2
Royal Member
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star.png)
Nathan again
50%
Posts: 4,263
|
Post by nathan2 on Jun 22, 2024 16:44:06 GMT -5
Let me clarify what I wrote so, you don’t get all twisted up in your own crazy mind. When I was in the work from 1986-93 we had a few CSA cases among the friends and, where the authority were involved. I didn’t know about CSA committed by the workers during those years in the work, it happened but I didn’t know or hear about it, until I read it on TMB about Ira H. CSA case 10 years ago. 15 years ago, An ex-worker posted on TMB what he heard of certain worker committed CSA and was asked to leave the work. The overseers should have asked all of CSA workers to leave the work! Immediatedly. In the year 2000 some of the friends in Oregon and another state, my older companion and myself had posted articles with helpful information of CSA were taken places within the 2x2 fellowship, where to get help on CSA on my website and on TMB. On my website I posted how terrible the RCC leadership moved CSA priests to different parishes to committed more crimes against the children. I was hoping our overseers wouldn’t follow their bad and evil examples but they did exactly what the RCC had done by moving CSA workers to different fields or countries. Hoping, they would repent and change their horrible behaviors against the children. They were wrong because they didn’t understand it was almost impossible to change that kind of evil behaviors without professional help. Well, they learn that now, which is a little too late, the damage already done. The overseers, the friends need to help the victims to get help from professional with many therapies and healing for themselves and have zero tolerance CSA/SA within the ministry and fellowship. The friends who left their wills to the ministry, should mention 10% of the money goes to CSA victims therapy, and help for their needs. When I was in the work from 1986-93 we had a few CSA cases among the friends and, where the authority were involved. I didn’t know about CSA committed by the workers during those years in the work, it happened but I didn’t know or hear about it, until I read it on TMB about Ira H. CSA case 10 years ago. Well thanks for clarifying what you didn't know and did know. Not. 🤠I didn’t KNOW about CSA worker from 1986-93. I heard and learned about CSA workers in 2000s from the Truth message board. We were involved with CSA cases among the friends when I was in the work from 1986-93.
|
|
|
Post by help on Jun 22, 2024 18:33:18 GMT -5
Ah, so it was happening in the Worker's club, but not talked about. But Workers shared information about laity. That sounds about right,they shared the contents of their little black note books, but no notes in them about Workers. Benefit of Workers being sacrosanct.
|
|