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Post by Get off of TMB on Oct 20, 2017 18:09:06 GMT -5
I believe that some websites and blogs haven't adjusted to some of the more recent changes in the fellowship. Outside of meetings, the rule on trousers is long gone. Some middle aged and older women won't wear them but that is based upon personal choice at least in the US. I can't speak for Australia, New Zealand or Europe. In the lesser developed regions, I imagine things are still pretty strict. Are sister workers allowed to hike in trousers? In some places, yes. In other places, they might wear jogging pants under a dress lest they offend someone.
I probably have 200 professing facebook friends. So I use their photos as a guide to recent trends in the way.
Less of an issue today:
Sports in school especially if meeting attendance isn't compromised. Trousers on ladies-OK especially hiking or doing manual labor. Still taboo for meeting apparel. And they prefer little girls to wear dresses to school other than maybe P.E classes. As long as the hair is long enough for a bun, trimming hair is OK. Most men wear shorts on vacations or even to get togethers in some places. Movies-not an issue with Netflix. Facial hair is now allowed for men of all ages. Brother workers are mostly clean shaven though. Socializing after meeting. Dining after meeting on Sunday. Swimwear on the beaches. Working on Sundays
Frowned upon but tolerated: Women attending college and working at public jobs is now accepted in the Kingdom/Way. Limited makeup and jewelry especially for a babe who didn't grow up in the Way. TVs Being a member of a band. Talking 15 minutes or less before meeting. Marriage to outsiders or divorcees varies wildly in the Kingdom. Omitting Wednesday night bible studies or gospel meetings. , BANNED: Challenging a worker in meeting during testimony time. Stating in meeting that people in other faiths might be saved unless you are in really good standing. Working with other people to expose flaws in the fellowship...doctrine or practice. Creating a website exposing flaws or scandals in the fellowship. Posting photos of conventions on the enemies of Truth websites. ***
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Post by Admin on Oct 20, 2017 18:53:46 GMT -5
A reasonable list. It will be interesting to see what others add. If adding, giving your geographical location will help. Glad you said creating not managing
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Post by calleduntoliberty on Oct 20, 2017 19:47:32 GMT -5
Frowned upon but tolerated:Women attending college and working at public jobs is now accepted in the Kingdom/Way. You have this one backwards. Young women are expected to attend college. If a young woman chooses not to attend, her decision would generally be tolerated..
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Post by calleduntoliberty on Oct 20, 2017 19:48:52 GMT -5
Unfortunately you are correct about many of the worldly ways and even outright sinful behavior that is accepted and considered normal by many, though certainly not by all. Many minds have been conditioned to the world's ways of thinking and behaving.
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Post by Roselyn T on Oct 20, 2017 20:12:24 GMT -5
Frowned upon but tolerated:Women attending college and working at public jobs is now accepted in the Kingdom/Way. You have this one backwards. Young women are expected to attend college. If a young woman chooses not to attend, her decision would generally be tolerated.. Disagree calleduntoliberty, in Australia it is "Women attending college and working at public jobs is now accepted in the Kingdom/Way"
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Post by Roselyn T on Oct 20, 2017 20:13:39 GMT -5
Unfortunately you are correct about many of the worldly ways and even outright sinful behavior that is accepted and considered normal by many, though certainly not by all. Many minds have been conditioned to the world's ways of thinking and behaving. I am curious what you see/think are "worldly ways" calleduntoliberty ?
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Post by calleduntoliberty on Oct 20, 2017 22:53:23 GMT -5
You have this one backwards. Young women are expected to attend college. If a young woman chooses not to attend, her decision would generally be tolerated.. Disagree calleduntoliberty, in Australia it is "Women attending college and working at public jobs is now accepted in the Kingdom/Way" Certainly attending college and working at jobs are commonly accepted. But that doesn't mean they're "frowned upon". Attending college is basically expected by most people. Generally it's not even questioned.
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Post by Roselyn T on Oct 20, 2017 22:58:06 GMT -5
Disagree calleduntoliberty, in Australia it is "Women attending college and working at public jobs is now accepted in the Kingdom/Way" Certainly attending college and working at jobs are commonly accepted. But that doesn't mean they're "frowned upon". Attending college is basically expected by most people. Generally it's not even questioned. calleduntoliberty, that maybe the case now, but that was NOT the case 20 years ago. Also there are still people who do "frown upon" girls going to University. We are talking about females here not males.
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Post by calleduntoliberty on Oct 20, 2017 23:03:42 GMT -5
Unfortunately you are correct about many of the worldly ways and even outright sinful behavior that is accepted and considered normal by many, though certainly not by all. Many minds have been conditioned to the world's ways of thinking and behaving. I am curious what you see/think are "worldly ways" calleduntoliberty ? We've written on some of this before and you most certainly don't agree with me as I write from a Christian perspective. Some of what Get off of TMB listed above can reasonably be called worldly: most movies, Netflix, etc., wearing shorts, wearing makeup, school sports, and wearing of what is typically worn at beaches. If these are "accepted" (right or wrong), that is certainly due to influence from the world. I realize you do not see a problem in that. Some are more clearly worldly or more clearly sinful than others.
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Post by calleduntoliberty on Oct 20, 2017 23:05:05 GMT -5
Certainly attending college and working at jobs are commonly accepted. But that doesn't mean they're "frowned upon". Attending college is basically expected by most people. Generally it's not even questioned. calleduntoliberty, that maybe the case now, but that was NOT the case 20 years ago. That's not the point. This thread is specifically about now -- 2017. No doubt there are certain exceptional people. There is quite a lot of variety of people in this world!
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Post by Roselyn T on Oct 20, 2017 23:06:28 GMT -5
We've written on some of this before and you most certainly don't agree with me as I write from a Christian perspective. Some of what Get off of TMB listed above can reasonably be called worldly: most movies, Netflix, etc., wearing shorts, wearing makeup, school sports, and wearing of what is typically worn at beaches. If these are "accepted" (right or wrong), that is certainly due to influence from the world. I realize you do not see a problem in that. Some are more clearly worldly or more clearly sinful than others. So movies are worldly, but computers and smart phones aren't ? Do you live in the "world" ?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2017 23:06:59 GMT -5
Frowned upon but tolerated:Women attending college and working at public jobs is now accepted in the Kingdom/Way. You have this one backwards. Young women are expected to attend college. If a young woman chooses not to attend, her decision would generally be tolerated.. It's common in the US for even the "hard core" 2x2 women to attend college - I'd second that one. Maybe it varies outside the US?
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Post by calleduntoliberty on Oct 20, 2017 23:09:09 GMT -5
We've written on some of this before and you most certainly don't agree with me as I write from a Christian perspective. Some of what Get off of TMB listed above can reasonably be called worldly: most movies, Netflix, etc., wearing shorts, wearing makeup, school sports, and wearing of what is typically worn at beaches. If these are "accepted" (right or wrong), that is certainly due to influence from the world. I realize you do not see a problem in that. Some are more clearly worldly or more clearly sinful than others. So movies are worldly, but computers and smart phones aren't ? I did not say that. Of course. Where else would I live?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2017 23:09:58 GMT -5
We've written on some of this before and you most certainly don't agree with me as I write from a Christian perspective. Some of what Get off of TMB listed above can reasonably be called worldly: most movies, Netflix, etc., wearing shorts, wearing makeup, school sports, and wearing of what is typically worn at beaches. If these are "accepted" (right or wrong), that is certainly due to influence from the world. I realize you do not see a problem in that. Some are more clearly worldly or more clearly sinful than others. So movies are worldly, but computers and smart phones aren't ? Do you live in the "world" ? You forgot the rule: it's worldly if I don't do it. It's a necessity if I do.
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Post by Roselyn T on Oct 20, 2017 23:16:21 GMT -5
You have this one backwards. Young women are expected to attend college. If a young woman chooses not to attend, her decision would generally be tolerated.. It's common in the US for even the "hard core" 2x2 women to attend college - I'd second that one. Maybe it varies outside the US? In Australia, I would say it is common for girls to finish High School, get a job for a couple of years, get married anywhere from 21 and have children. Yes there are exceptions to that, also some families have realised that it is important for girls to have an education beyond High School. But then we have another issue, sex before marriage. So there must be more girls now on the contraceptive pill than there used to be.
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Post by Roselyn T on Oct 20, 2017 23:19:26 GMT -5
We've written on some of this before and you most certainly don't agree with me as I write from a Christian perspective. Some of what Get off of TMB listed above can reasonably be called worldly: most movies, Netflix, etc., wearing shorts, wearing makeup, school sports, and wearing of what is typically worn at beaches. If these are "accepted" (right or wrong), that is certainly due to influence from the world. I realize you do not see a problem in that. Some are more clearly worldly or more clearly sinful than others. Okay so I have mis-understood what you meant here calleduntoliberty "Some of what Get off of TMB listed above can reasonably be called worldly: most movies, Netflix, etc.," ? Maybe you could clarify ?
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Post by Roselyn T on Oct 20, 2017 23:22:40 GMT -5
Get off of TMB, I think we need to add to your list "Less of an issue today " : Girls taking the contraceptive pill before marriage.
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Post by ellie on Oct 20, 2017 23:34:34 GMT -5
That's not the point. This thread is specifically about now -- 2017. No doubt there are certain exceptional people. There is quite a lot of variety of people in this world! While tertiary education for professing women is tolerated in Australia it's not the ideal. Women marrying and looking after the home rather than spending money on education is preferred.
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Post by dmmichgood on Oct 20, 2017 23:57:57 GMT -5
Gill, I think that you are against "tats," Am I right?
Other day when we were at a doctor's office I noticed the receptionist's cross on a chain on her neck. Nothing unusual about that. But then I saw tats on each of her fingers (couldn't see exactly what they were) and tat of a cross on her wrist!
A new way of wearing your religion on your sleeve, I guess!
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Post by Grant on Oct 21, 2017 3:47:46 GMT -5
Gill, I think that you are against "tats," Am I right?
Other day when we were at a doctor's office I noticed the receptionist's cross on a chain on her neck. Nothing unusual about that. But then I saw tats on each of her fingers (couldn't see exactly what they were) and tat of a cross on her wrist!
A new way of wearing your religion on your sleeve, I guess! Like some people who wear their religion on the back of their head.
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Post by Grant on Oct 21, 2017 3:59:37 GMT -5
We've written on some of this before and you most certainly don't agree with me as I write from a Christian perspective. Some of what Get off of TMB listed above can reasonably be called worldly: most movies, Netflix, etc., wearing shorts, wearing makeup, school sports, and wearing of what is typically worn at beaches. If these are "accepted" (right or wrong), that is certainly due to influence from the world. I realize you do not see a problem in that. Some are more clearly worldly or more clearly sinful than others. So movies are worldly, but computers and smart phones aren't ? Do you live in the "world" ? Wearing shorts, make up, school sports are worldly? What is the world coming to? What about a flash house, expensive clothes, flash car, eating at restaurants, a woman wearing her hair up. I'm sure I can think of more worldly things which you had not thought of. In other words you can call anything you want worldly. Sport is healthy. Perhaps going to the gym is worldly too.
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Post by Get off of TMB on Oct 21, 2017 8:11:52 GMT -5
I personally think tats are disgusting. No young man with a snake on his neck is going to look like a gentleman no matter how nice of a guy he might be. That is just a personal opinion. When you are wearing long pants and a short sleeve shirt and you tattoos still show, you are limiting your chances of working at some jobs. That doesn't mean I think they are wrong. Just poor taste.
I wrote the above list in haste. There are regional and family differences in the kingdom, that's for sure.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 21, 2017 9:08:39 GMT -5
I personally think tats are disgusting. No young man with a snake on his neck is going to look like a gentleman no matter how nice of a guy he might be. That is just a personal opinion. When you are wearing long pants and a short sleeve shirt and you tattoos still show, you are limiting your chances of working at some jobs. That doesn't mean I think they are wrong. Just poor taste. I wrote the above list in haste. There are regional and family differences in the kingdom, that's for sure. I've never liked tats either, just personal taste. I've changed a little - I've seen some that aren't terribly vulgur that didn't look half bad imo. There is something so freeing about being able to say "not for me, fine for them" without looking down our nose at "them " as though they are somehow inferior humans. Works for religions too.
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Post by Get off of TMB on Oct 21, 2017 9:22:12 GMT -5
Young skin becomes old skin someday. A nursing home in 2080 is going to have old folks with tats, torn ears from piercings and old folks with their pants hanging down to their knees. I see all of this as poor taste and not necessarily wrong. I wouldn't want to treat the individual as inferior because once you get one, they are with you for life.
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Post by Grant on Oct 21, 2017 11:04:33 GMT -5
My father got tattoos while in the second world War and so did lots of soldiers. They were professionally done.
Tattoos are not new. I only ever knew him with tattoos on his arms. As a kid we thought they were cool. He would have been just over 100 now if he was still alive.
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Post by Get off of TMB on Oct 21, 2017 12:05:17 GMT -5
I would love for someone to share their observations on NOT AN ISSUE, FROWNED BUT TOLERATED & BANNED. 2017
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bgm
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Post by bgm on Oct 21, 2017 14:58:11 GMT -5
I would love for someone to share their observations on NOT AN ISSUE, FROWNED BUT TOLERATED & BANNED. 2017 Less of an issue today: Sports in school especially if meeting attendance isn't compromised. No issue today.Trousers on ladies-OK especially hiking or doing manual labor. No issue today. Still taboo for meeting apparel. YesAnd they prefer little girls to wear dresses to school other than maybe P.E classes. Very few families force girls into dresses at schoolAs long as the hair is long enough for a bun, trimming hair is OK. No issue wearing no bun, shoulder length hair.Most men wear shorts on vacations or even to get togethers in some places. Never heard of shorts as a problem for menMovies-not an issue with Netflix. Netflix widely used. Movie attendance is probably lowerFacial hair is now allowed for men of all ages. Brother workers are mostly clean shaven though. Beards no problem.Socializing after meeting. No problemDining after meeting on Sunday. Was always commonSwimwear on the beaches. Never known friends to swim in street clothesWorking on Sundays If people have a choice, they won't work on SundayFrowned upon but tolerated: Women attending college and working at public jobs is now accepted in the Kingdom/Way. Advanced education for women long acceptedLimited makeup and jewelry especially for a babe who didn't grow up in the Way. Make up common but natural coloursTVs Still uncommon but not a serious problemBeing a member of a band. DunnoTalking 15 minutes or less before meeting. Generally still very quiet
Marriage to outsiders or divorcees varies wildly in the Kingdom. Yes, wide variancesOmitting Wednesday night bible studies or gospel meetings. Not unusual to skip Wed and gospel mtgs., BANNED: Challenging a worker in meeting during testimony time. Meeting has never had a debate formatStating in meeting that people in other faiths might be saved unless you are in really good standing. You can get away with it but many will be biting their tongues Working with other people to expose flaws in the fellowship...doctrine or practice. Organizing of any kind is against the basic ethos.Creating a website exposing flaws or scandals in the fellowship. Definitely frowned upon and rejected by mostPosting photos of conventions on the enemies of Truth websites. DunnoA lot of this will vary not only by geography, but by individual experience and perception. Personally, I have never had any of the above foisted on me....but I am not exactly a shrinking violet either so that probably explains why no one has tried. For people who are less confident and seek group acceptance, they will be very much influenced by the more outspoken and rule-driven conservatives. The world exists largely as we are, not as it is.
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Post by Get off of TMB on Oct 21, 2017 16:25:42 GMT -5
Sounds like a fair and unbiased assessment, thank you bgm.
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