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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2015 17:13:01 GMT -5
I tend to think of a non exclusive 2x2 in the 2x2 church in the same way I would view a straight man at a gay orgy. I'm happy to accept at face value his claim that he is straight, but I do wonder what on earth he is doing there. Of course, as a straight man, I have no desire to be at a gay orgy, however I'm quite sure I would be tolerated if I did decide to turn up ..... so long as I played along. It's always worth remembering that a gay orgy is still a gay orgy whether there are straight men there or not. Matt10 OK. You have a point, -however could you use a different analogy than calling it a straight man at a gay orgy? How about using the term a gay man at a "heterosexual couple-swapping orgy?"
I could use a different analogy if I could think of one that made the point as well as the current one. But I'm afraid I can't. Your suggested alternative analogy doesn't really work. Matt10
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Post by Roselyn T on Nov 30, 2015 17:16:44 GMT -5
Nathan said ""]Yes, a person must find the workers or the friends in order for them to welcome to the fellowship/saved... Jesus said, He that receive the you/workers receive me/Jesus... He that reject/despise you/workers, they are despising me/Jesus, and Him that sent me/My heavenly Father. (Matt 10:40; Luke 10:16) That is a NO wishy washy there! [/font] nathan as I have asked you before if what you have stated above is right, what happens to all the people who lived & died before the workers came to their country ? [/quote] In every generation God has preserved His servants and people since the time of Jesus prior to the time of Faith Mission and the 2x2 workers, we don't need to worry about them. If they were seeker for Truth and Way of Jesus they would find it.
Romans chapter 11... Elijah said to God, "Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and torn down thine altars, and I am the ONLY one left." but god answered to him, "I have reserved for myself 7000 men, who have NOT bow to Baal..."
There were apostles and followers of Jesus Truth and Way prior to the Faith Mission and the 2x2s workers prior to the time of William Irvine, John Long, George Walker, Jack Carroll, etc... so we don't to worry about. They had the same opportunity as us to day in hearing the gospel.[/quote] nathan you have just contradicted yourself ! "Yes, a person must find the workers or the friends in order for them to welcome to the fellowship/saved..." Then you said "There were apostles and followers of Jesus Truth and Way prior to the Faith Mission and the 2x2s workers prior to the time of William Irvine, John Long, George Walker, Jack Carroll, etc"
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Post by Roselyn T on Nov 30, 2015 17:38:13 GMT -5
And what about your exclusive belief in your god? Or christianity? How is that exclusive belief different? Its different in that both Nathan and I supposedly have the same belief. That is, Christianity. Belief in Christ. Yet he somehow judges (against Christ command) the majority of all Christians to Hell. He calls them "Brother" and "Sister" yet does not consider them a "brother" or "sister". He believes I should leave our fellowship because I refuse to judge these people. He calls this "wishy washy". He adds words to the bible and conditions to Jesus words that are not there, yet we both believe in the same bible. He believes much differently than most F&W in his Trinity thinking (considered false doctrine by the Workers and most Friends), Thor, hollow earth, etc, yet thinks I should leave the fellowship simply for refusing to judge all other Christians, but his belief system that is so different is ok, and he should stay. Much different situation. Exactly !
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Post by jondough on Nov 30, 2015 20:06:53 GMT -5
Its different in that both Nathan and I supposedly have the same belief. That is, Christianity. Belief in Christ. Yet he somehow judges (against Christ command) the majority of all Christians to Hell. No, I just show what Jesus said those who do NOT follow his teachings will end up.He calls them "Brother" and "Sister" yet does not consider them a "brother" or "sister". I feel there is a kinship to some as my brothers and sisters in Christ on TMB. Whether they're Going to Hell that is between them and God. I He believes I should leave our fellowship because I refuse to judge these people. He calls this "wishy washy". He adds words to the bible and conditions to Jesus words that are not there, yet we both believe in the same bible. You believe it doesn't matter who preaches the word of God, or which church they attend, that is important.... I don't agree with this kind of non-exclusive thinking of yours. I call it's dangerous join the churches of your choice. 98% of the workers do NOT believe it doesn't matter who preaches the word of God, or go to any churches are OK with them.... This where the straw breaks the camel's back.He believes much differently than most F&W in his Trinity thinking (considered false doctrine by the Workers and most Friends), Thor, hollow earth, etc, yet thinks I should leave the fellowship simply for refusing to judge all other Christians, but his belief system that is so different is ok, and he should stay. The Trinity, Deity of Christ has been taught by most of the early workers among us for years, then MOST of the younger generation of workers, and the friends taught by senior workers to become anti-trinity (Arius bishop heretic in the 2nd century) believers, and have turned our group into a cult behaviors in the same class as the Mormons, Jehovah Witnesses, and a few other groups, which deny Jesus Divinity/God.
The workers and the friends worship the Trinity! The Father, Christ/Son and Holy Ghost in EVERY Sunday meetings around the world... So, they are NOT anti-trinity. They just don't know or understand the RCC Trinity teachings, so they say things which are incorrect, like Trinity is the Devil's doctrine, or it's heresy...
I back up my Hollow earth= the Garden of Eden, Valiant and Donn Thor= Angel/Messenger created and by Jesus to earth as our helpers with historical facts, plenty of evidences, and testimonies from eyewitnesses, NOT just HOT AIR! or made up stories.... Someday the Hollow Earth= the Garden of Eden and the existence of Valiant, Donn Thor will be known as historical Facts. Much different situation. Yep, you're correct. This is so "wishy washy" I'm not sure I want to respond. actually its pathetic, so I wont respond. Sorry. Maybe later when I''m not so frustrated.
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Post by rational on Nov 30, 2015 20:40:20 GMT -5
Its different in that both Nathan and I supposedly have the same belief. That is, Christianity. Belief in Christ. Yet he somehow judges (against Christ command) the majority of all Christians to Hell. He calls them "Brother" and "Sister" yet does not consider them a "brother" or "sister". He believes I should leave our fellowship because I refuse to judge these people. He calls this "wishy washy". He adds words to the bible and conditions to Jesus words that are not there, yet we both believe in the same bible. He believes much differently than most F&W in his Trinity thinking (considered false doctrine by the Workers and most Friends), Thor, hollow earth, etc, yet thinks I should leave the fellowship simply for refusing to judge all other Christians, but his belief system that is so different is ok, and he should stay. Much different situation. Exactly ! Are you saying that exclusivity is the same whether it is belief in a christian denomination, in christianity, or in a single god? I would agree. People who hold the belief that a single religion is the only way to eternal life or believe that their god is the only correct god are also exclusive.
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Post by BobWilliston on Nov 30, 2015 20:54:24 GMT -5
Then, why would you say such a thing about William Irvine taught/spoke we were NOT save by Jesus shed blood, Bob?
Because I read it in a reliable source. Check answer number 1.
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Post by emy on Nov 30, 2015 21:23:37 GMT -5
Maryhig...
I hope this comment was not directed to me.
Even though I have told you that I love God with all my heart, and we've spoken the scriptures together and i have opened my heart with you. But all as you can see, is that I believe it was wrong to kill Gods holy son and because of that I'm a sinner and unsaved?
If so, be assured that I feel I think more like you than possibly any other person here! If I offended you or hurt you, I am so sorry.
And this is very close to what I believe. It's what believing in Jesus is all about. But I do think his physically shed blood was involved in our salvation, too.
Back to Jesus' blood being shed to save us, yes I do believe the that. Only I don't believe his blood was shed on the wooden cross to save us. I believe Jesus poured out his blood, which is his life to save us. He took up his his cross and died to self, he lived out the way and brought us the truth and he is the life, by following him in death to self we become alive in God! And Christ can live through us because we are dead to the world and flesh, the more we die to self, the stronger we become in God and we are being saved!
Thank you for all you contribute here!
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Post by blandie on Nov 30, 2015 22:39:38 GMT -5
But isn't a clean soul the one that will have access to eternal life? Salvation is thru both forgiveness of trespasses and a righteous life. The former is the cleansing thru jesus and the latter is christ's righteousness thats imputed to our accounts and both constitute the free gift of salvation provided once for all - ' Much more then being now justified by his blood we shall be saved from wrath through him.' A person can refuse the gift but it was made available to everyone past present and future. The problem is that irvine and the living witness thing added conditions to it like hearing thru a certain type of ministry and only the certain preachers could impart life and the preachers and the way of meeting had to be followed only and the rest of the add-ons. The 2x2-ism teaching is that the blood is only for those in the F&W way but thats not what the bible says because both the cleansing and the righteousness were given ' while we were yet sinners' and its teaching one of many serious errors that contradicts instead of follows the bible - ' for if when we were enemies we were reconciled to god by the death of his son much more being reconciled we shall be saved by his life' - and I'm guessing thats why much of paul and some sayings of jesus get looked down upon by some F&W's and awkwardly dismissed. Christ didn't die so that a few faithful could have salvation if they heard the right preachers and met only in the right homes and stayed faithful in the right way to the end and submitted to the right standards in obedience to the right ministry without a home - he died for everyone and including sinners and enemies.
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Post by BobWilliston on Nov 30, 2015 23:05:06 GMT -5
#1 answer is NO, right. I hope your reliable source is NOT name "Nathan" again. Number 1 answer is not NO -- it is "because I read it in a reliable source. My reliable source is NEVER "Nathan".
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Post by Grant on Nov 30, 2015 23:23:35 GMT -5
Not to forget the early worker who said "How can the blood of a dead man save?" Which clearly is referring to Jesus dying on the Cross and sheding his blood.
Nathan, who decides who has got the right teaching.? You, the workers, the JWs, Mormons, Baptist or who? Obviously it can't be both you and the workers because you believe different from them. Maybe you need to join a church that preachers and believes the Trinity.
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Post by BobWilliston on Nov 30, 2015 23:27:19 GMT -5
Try check out your reliable source is like pulling teeth.
This is true. [/font] [/quote] You also believe that the earth is hollow.
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Post by jondough on Nov 30, 2015 23:52:46 GMT -5
Not to forget the early worker who said "How can the blood of a dead man save?" Which clearly is referring to Jesus dying on the Cross and sheding his blood. The author of the book Hebrews explained without the death of Jesus on Calvary's Cross and shedding his blood there would be NO forgiveness of sin.
it Hebrews 9:15-22 For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.
In the case of a will, it is necessary to prove the death of the one who made it, because a will is in force only when somebody has died; it never takes effect while the one who made it is living. This is why even the first covenant was not put into effect without blood. When Moses had proclaimed every command of the law to all the people, he took the blood of calves, together with water, scarlet wool and branches of hyssop, and sprinkled the scroll and all the people. He said, “This is the blood of the covenant, which God has commanded you to keep.” In the same way, he sprinkled with the blood both the tabernacle and everything used in its ceremonies. In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness. Nathan, who decides who has got the right teaching.? You, the workers, the JWs, Mormons, Baptist or who? Obviously it can't be both you and the workers because you believe different from them. Maybe you need to join a church that preachers and believes the Trinity. The workers and the friends worship the Trinity= Father, Christ/Son and Holy Spirit on EVERY Sunday... Most of them don't like to use the word Trinity... but they worship the Trinity. Most of the early workers founders taught the Trinity and Deity of Christ.When you say stuff like this, you loose credibility. The F&W believe the Trinity is false docrine. Its not the "word" that they are afraid of. They simply don't believe the doctrine. They Dont believe that Jesus is God. Please don't keep repeating that they are just afraid of a word. You are once again being dishonest. And yes, they believe in the Father who they believe is God, The Son, whom they believe is God's Son, and the Holy Spirit. Its as clear as that. Different than your belief. Not just a word they are afraid to use. You can talk about what the early workers taught all you want. I'm talking about the fellowship that you meet with today. I'm talking about the Friends and Workers of today. We are living and meeting with these people today. YOU are not going to convert them.
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Post by maryhig on Dec 1, 2015 0:24:58 GMT -5
Hi emy, well I'm sure glad you're not deciding whether I'm unsaved or not. But really, that's only Gods desision to make. And I'll find out when I die. Not anyone here can decide that! And so the debate rages on with people deciding whether I go to hell or not, by human beings that are also sinners! As for Jesus' blood being shed to save us, I do believe that, only not as you do. Jesus himself said it was wrong to kill him, in John 7 and John 8. So did the apostles. Jesus even said they were doing the works of their father the devil! (John 8:44) saying that the devil was a murderer from the beginning, so they listened to the devil and did his works and murdered Jesus! A sacrifice in the old testament was done by Gods people with a clean cut to the throat. Murdering Jesus was done at the hands of Satan and his children, and they beat him, mocked him, and crucified him. This is not of God! He said in John 7:19. Did Moses not give you the law? And yet none of you keep the law why do you go about to kill me? He's saying the law clearly says thou shalt not kill. So why aren't they keeping the law? When he said that, the people said thou hast a devil. Who go about to kill you? They said Jesus had a devil! Because he quoted the law of Moses telling them it was wrong to kill. Including killing him! Just like some of you seem seem to think of me by judging me as unsaved or going to hell. Even though I have told you that I love God with all my heart, and we've spoken the scriptures together and i have opened my heart with you. But all as you can see, is that I believe it was wrong to kill Gods holy son and because of that I'm a sinner and unsaved? Back to Jesus' blood being shed to save us, yes I do believe the that. Only I don't believe his blood was shed on the wooden cross to save us. I believe Jesus poured out his blood, which is his life to save us. He took up his his cross and died to self, he lived out the way and brought us the truth and he is the life, by following him in death to self we become alive in God! And Christ can live through us because we are dead to the world and flesh, the more we die to self, the stronger we become in God and we are being saved! And Jesus never sinned so he had the full strength of God in him. And because he never sinned, he was in the express image of God, he was Emmanuel (God with us) and with the strength of God, he endured to the end through whatever Satan threw at him showing love and mercy and he overcame Satan. He put satan to death in his flesh. He came and showed us how to do it, showed us the way back to God, and now we have no excuse, because we know the way. He reconciled us through his death, but saved us by his life! (Romans 5:10) and he will help us to overcome Satan when we give our hearts to God. Because we can't do it without God, as we are sinners! And Jesus is the only way. He is the only saviour. And we are saved by believing him and the gospel and by following him. First by repentance, then taking up our cross and denying ourselves, giving our hearts over to God to do the works within, then we live those works outwardly, showing Christ through us to others and being guided by the spirit we have the hope of bringing those around us home to God through Christ. I couldn't in my heart call another person unsaved. Or that anyone is going to hell. That's for God to judge. So when some of you make that desision about people in your hearts, please be careful. Because Jesus said we shouldn't judge Luke 6 Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again. It's the word of God that judges, not the flesh! And he judges each heart individually and we will find out when we die and stand before him whether we are saved or not. Thanks for this Mary. Mary, does your fellowship partake of the emblems? Do you break bread and drink of the cup as Jesus asked us to do in remembrance of him? Yes JD we do, to me the bread and wine are symbolic. They are symbols of taking the life of Jesus in, then living it out. We must do this spiritually as well as naturally. Paul said 1 Corinthians 11 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread: And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me. After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me. For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come. When Jesus broke the bread he said to eat it in remembrance of him, that's remembering his life. He didn't say on rememberance of his death at Calvary. He said in rememberance of him! Also, when he gave the cup. He said the cup was the new testament in his blood this do you, as often as you drink it in rememberance of me. Again, it's in rememberance of him, not in his death on the cross! Jesus had already laid down his life before he went on the cross, he had already finished the work that the father had given him to do. He was already dead to this world. This world had nothing in him. He also said it was the cup of the new testament, not the cup of his death on a wooden cross. The new testament is a new covenant and when we partake in this covenant we partake in his death and become alive in God. Look at the last sentence above in 1 Corinthians 11 (above) Paul said For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come. So as often as we eat the bread and drink from the cup, we show the lords death till he comes. That isn't the death on the cross that we show, we aren't crucified. We show death to self. By partaking in the bread and drinking from the cup we are spiritually taking in the life of Jesus, and if we are doing that, then that life within us will be putting our old man to death by the spirit and replacing us with the new man. Our thoughts and ways will be changing because we will be walking in spirit not in flesh, dying to the world but alive in God. And the spirit of Christ will be living through us, because he will be alive in us, and we will be alive in God!
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 1, 2015 0:35:16 GMT -5
This is true. You also believe that the earth is hollow. The different between you and me... I revealed my reliable sources, eyewitnesses for the readers to examine and check it out for themselves.
I'm happy about that. [/font] [/quote] No, I don't. But I know where to find it.
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Post by jondough on Dec 1, 2015 0:48:26 GMT -5
When you say stuff like this, you loose credibility. The F&W believe the Trinity is false docrine. Its not the "word" that they are afraid of. They simply don't beleive the doctrine. They Dont believe that Jesus is God. Please don't keep repeating that they are just afraid of a word. You are once again being dishonest. And yes, they believe in the Father who they believe is God, The Son, whom they believe is God's Son, and the Holy Spirit. Its as clear as that. Different than your belief. Not just a word they are afraid to use. Jesus is NOT God (the Father). Jesus is God (God's Son). If Jesus wasn't God he can't forgive anyone sin. ONLY God= Father, Christ/Son forgive our past and present. MANY of the workers and the friends DO NOT know the true teaching of the TRINITY, therefore they say is the Devil's doctrine. The friends have been misinformed by the workers for years, and years.
This is the doctrine and teaching of the TRINITY.... The Friends and workers BELIEVE in the Trinity! The worship Father, Christ/Son and Holy Spirit EVERY Sunday! AND they don't even Know or Understand it.The concept of the Triune God is taught in the Old and New Testament. In the 2nd century the second generation of the apostles/church fathers came up with a beautiful description word "Trinity" to describe the Triune God in the Bible.The 2nd century apostles....From A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David W. Bercot Hippolytus (205 A.D.) "Go and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." By this, He showed that whoever omits any one of them, fails in glorifying God perfectly. For it is through the TRINITY that the Father is glorified. For the Father willed, the Son did, and the Spirit manifested. It is the Father who commands, and the Son who obeys, and the Holy Spirit who give understanding. The Father is above ALL, the Son is through ALL, and the Holy Spirit is in ALL. Paul the apostle explains that there is the exact same order within the TRINITY, saying, "I want you to know that the head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God." (I Cor. 11:3). So the Father has authority over the Son. The Son is sent by the Father; the Son does the will of the Father; and the Son sits at the Father's right hand. This hierarchy of order can not be reversed. Yet this hierarchy of order in no way diminishes the Son's divinity. Tertullian (212 A.D.) For the very church itself is properly and principally the Spirit Himself, in whom is the TRINITY of the One Divinity: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
Cyprian (250 A.D.) Observing the third, sixth, and nineth month for a sacrament of the TRINITY, which was to be manifested in the last times. For the first hour in its progress to the third declared the completed number of the TRINITY. The TRINITY names of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.We are NOT ignorant that there is ONE God; and One Christ, the Lord; and One Holy Spirit. Jesus said, "Go therefore and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son, and Holy Spirit." He suggested that TRINITY, in whose sacrament the nations were to be baptized.Origin (225 A.D.) Saving baptism was NOT complete except by the authority of the most excellent TRINITY of them all. That is, it is made complete by naming the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. In this, we join the name of the Holy Spirit to the Unbegotten God (the Father) and to His Only-begotten Son. Why are you arguing this to me. I have seen your cut and paste on this 50 times if I've seen it this time. I'm only explaining that the F&W don't believe what you believe. I wasn't asking for what you believe. You believe different on the Trinity doctrine that they believe to be false docrine, as well as all your alien stuff, hollow earth stuff, Thor, underground tunnels, Reptilians, and many other things you believe in. Now don't start posting your cut and paste on all these things, I don't really care to see them again. I"m only pointing out that the Friends and Workers don't believe in all this. Your beliefs are much different than theirs.
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Post by jondough on Dec 1, 2015 0:58:12 GMT -5
NathanB Avatar Dec 20, 2012 at 8:10am NathanB said: 1) JD wrote: Nathan, I know this is changing the subject...but I don't want to start a new thread for this.... You made a prediction for tomorrow - some time ago....December 21st. Can you, for the record, state it one more time please? I know you didn't predict the end of the world, but you did say something like......Something catastrophic is going to happen on December 21st? ? Please clarify so we have for the record.... ~~ Nathan: We better NOT hijack that thread or we will get in trouble. Thanks, JD for asking..... According to Myan Calendar many believe the world will end on Dec, 21. The earth pole shift has began slowly 15 years ago. It has caused great catastrophe with many Huge earth quakes around the world, Big F-4/5 tornados, many Super hurricans, etc... 1)~~ NASA Employee SPEAKS About NIBIRU/Massive earthquakes, Great suffering for people on the earth to come. www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCtfTU787w4&feature=related2) ~~ Earth's Force Field: Pole Shift may be Imminent. The Earths magnetic field, the protector of all life on Earth is under constant attack from deadly cosmic radiation. This invisible shield that we live in is weakening in a region over the South Atlantic, leaving it exposed to potentially lethal radiation. Is the Earth losing its magnetic field and doomed to a fate similar to Mars? Many scientists believe the answer lies in paleomagnetic data, and that this weakening may be a precursor to a magnetic field reversal; scientists know Earth is long overdue. However, humans were not around when the last reversal took place, so what does this mean for life? www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XNMCTBdQtk&feature=related~~ 3) All around the world in 2011-12 reports of millions of animals dying and suddenly dropping dead such as Whales, Dolphins, Turtles, Fish, Birds, Crabs. People all around the world have also been hearing a very strange noise coming from the sky above. Strange occurrences happening in and around our sun with planet sized objects seen around it. (part 1&2) www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCqnND7qHQA&feature=relatedwww.youtube.com/watch?v=4RADvrtHe48&feature=relatedSo, my prediction things will get worse, after Dec, 21/2012. So, Put your seatbelts on for a wild rollercoaster rides. To the Christians, and 2x2s be alert and be ready because the Lord God Jesus Christ 2nd coming getting closer than We think. Halelujah! Lord Jesus cometh! to reign and rule the 1000 yrs on earth with thy people. (Jude 14,15) And Enoch the 7th from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, "Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, to execute judgment upon all, and to convict all that are Ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him. I Thess. 5:3,4 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall Say, PEACE! and SAFETY; then Sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall NOT escape.
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Post by jondough on Dec 1, 2015 0:59:34 GMT -5
Above is your prediction.
I know you will NEVER admit when you are wrong but there has been no rollor coaster ride. Its been 3 years now.
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Post by jondough on Dec 1, 2015 1:08:31 GMT -5
Why are you arguing this to me. I have seen your cut and paste on this 50 times if I've seen it this time. I'm only explaining that the F&W don't believe what you believe. I wasn't asking for what you believe. I know you have read them before but I posted so the NEW readers can read these information for themselves. You believe different on the Trinity doctrine that they believe to be false docrine, as well as all your alien stuff, hollow earth stuff, Thor, underground tunnels, Reptilians, and many other things you believe in. Aliens/Reptilians= Are the fallen angels, demons, Devil, Satan in the Bible, Hollow earth= Is the Garden of Eden in the Bible, Valiant, Donn Thor= Are the human-looking Guardian angels in the Old/New testament Bible, Now don't start posting your cut and paste on all these things, I don't really care to see them again. I"m only pointing out that the Friends and Workers don't believe in all this. Your beliefs are much different than theirs. That is why, I am trying to inform, educate, share these knowledge....But you thought I should leave the fellowship simply for refusing to judge the rest of the Christian world that don't meet with the F&W as wrong because you believe it doesn't go along with the F&Ws beliefs. Yet your beliefs are so much different than theirs as i explained above.....and your answer is, that "you are trying to educate them" Do you not find the humor in this?
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Post by jondough on Dec 1, 2015 1:10:02 GMT -5
Above is your prediction. I know you will NEVER admit when you are wrong but there has been no rollor coaster ride. Its been 3 years now. You got to be kidding, Have you read and seen the News around the world the last 3 yrs? Let me show you.... hold on.I watch the news every day. Not a whole lot different than any other year. Iraq war one year. Afaganstan the next. Viet Nam quite some time ago. Now ISIS. Same stuff, different year. No end of the world stuff going on.
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Post by jondough on Dec 1, 2015 1:18:22 GMT -5
But you thought I should leave the fellowship simply for refusing the rest of the Christian world that don't meet with the F&W as wrong because you believe it doesn't go along with the F&Ws beliefs. Yet your beliefs are so much different than theirs as i explained above.....and your answer is, that "you are trying to educate them" Do you not find the humor in this? I am a true blue 2x2 but NOT a typical "Party line" 2x2. I am NOT a traditional 2x2, KJV only kind of 2x2. I like different translations which help me to understand KJV better.Thats fine, but don't tell others that they should leave the fellowship when they think a little different than some on a certain issue. Thats called, take the beam out of your own eye first.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 1, 2015 1:19:59 GMT -5
Show us where you find it ..... Give us more information. I would have to look it up again. Why? [/font] [/quote] I don't care what you think about it.
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Post by jondough on Dec 1, 2015 1:24:01 GMT -5
I watch the news every day. Not a whole lot different than any other year. Iraq war one year. Afaganstan the next. Viet Nam quite some time ago. Now ISIS. Same stuff, different year. No end of the world stuff going on. You haven't heard or read the stuff which I have studied and read... I got all these events from the last 3 yrs, which you had no clue of.2x2friendsworkers.proboards.com/thread/98/angel-god-talked-eisenhower-1957You predicted that we would be on a roller coaster ride. I've never met a person who has rode a roller coaster and not known it. Have you? Your exact words "hang on to your seat belt". Well I'm hanging on, but my roller coaster must be broken down.
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Post by maryhig on Dec 1, 2015 1:27:39 GMT -5
Maryhig... I hope this comment was not directed to me. Even though I have told you that I love God with all my heart, and we've spoken the scriptures together and i have opened my heart with you. But all as you can see, is that I believe it was wrong to kill Gods holy son and because of that I'm a sinner and unsaved?If so, be assured that I feel I think more like you than possibly any other person here! If I offended you or hurt you, I am so sorry. And this is very close to what I believe. It's what believing in Jesus is all about. But I do think his physically shed blood was involved in our salvation, too. Back to Jesus' blood being shed to save us, yes I do believe the that. Only I don't believe his blood was shed on the wooden cross to save us. I believe Jesus poured out his blood, which is his life to save us. He took up his his cross and died to self, he lived out the way and brought us the truth and he is the life, by following him in death to self we become alive in God! And Christ can live through us because we are dead to the world and flesh, the more we die to self, the stronger we become in God and we are being saved! Thank you for all you contribute here! No emy, it wasn't. It was to all who are judging me and deciding whether I'm going to hell or not. My beliefs are what I believe from my heart. And only God can judge my heart. No man. And only God can judge anyone else's heart also, because only he knows what's in there. I was so shocked when I came on here yesterday and saw that people were discussing whether I'm saved or not! Even discussing whether I'm going to hell or not! I don't even know that myself yet, so how can anyone else know that about me, except for God? God knows the sincerity of my heart, and he will be the one who decides where my spirit goes when I leave my body. And I leave that in his hands. As i have said before, I'm more concerned with getting my heart right before God now than what's going to happen to me when I die, I don't worry about when I die, God knows what he's doing. I worry more about what I'm doing in my life to please God now, and I want to bring God to all of those around me, so they get to know him and I can't do that if I'm living my life in the flesh. Because the flesh is an enemy to God! So this is what I'm concerned about in this life. I don't want to be alive in the flesh and dead to God. I want to be dead to the in the flesh and alive in God. I want to be alive in the spirit and in Christ, so that I have a chance of bringing all those around me to God! Because I can't do it without him. Because I'm only dust!
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Post by jondough on Dec 1, 2015 1:28:05 GMT -5
Nathan, Of course you never admit when you're wrong, so I'm not expecting it now.
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Post by harcal on Dec 1, 2015 1:29:02 GMT -5
When you say stuff like this, you loose credibility. The F&W believe the Trinity is false docrine. Its not the "word" that they are afraid of. They simply don't beleive the doctrine. They Dont believe that Jesus is God. Please don't keep repeating that they are just afraid of a word. You are once again being dishonest. And yes, they believe in the Father who they believe is God, The Son, whom they believe is God's Son, and the Holy Spirit. Its as clear as that. Different than your belief. Not just a word they are afraid to use. Jesus is NOT God (the Father). Jesus is God (God's Son). If Jesus wasn't God he can't forgive anyone sin. ONLY God= Father, Christ/Son forgive our past and present. MANY of the workers and the friends DO NOT know the true teaching of the TRINITY, therefore they say is the Devil's doctrine. The friends have been misinformed by the workers for years, and years.
This is the doctrine and teaching of the TRINITY.... The Friends and workers BELIEVE in the Trinity! The worship Father, Christ/Son and Holy Spirit EVERY Sunday! AND they don't even Know or Understand it.The concept of the Triune God is taught in the Old and New Testament. In the 2nd century the second generation of the apostles/church fathers came up with a beautiful description word "Trinity" to describe the Triune God in the Bible.The 2nd century apostles....From A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David W. Bercot Hippolytus (205 A.D.) "Go and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." By this, He showed that whoever omits any one of them, fails in glorifying God perfectly. For it is through the TRINITY that the Father is glorified. For the Father willed, the Son did, and the Spirit manifested. It is the Father who commands, and the Son who obeys, and the Holy Spirit who give understanding. The Father is above ALL, the Son is through ALL, and the Holy Spirit is in ALL. Paul the apostle explains that there is the exact same order within the TRINITY, saying, "I want you to know that the head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God." (I Cor. 11:3). So the Father has authority over the Son. The Son is sent by the Father; the Son does the will of the Father; and the Son sits at the Father's right hand. This hierarchy of order can not be reversed. Yet this hierarchy of order in no way diminishes the Son's divinity. Tertullian (212 A.D.) For the very church itself is properly and principally the Spirit Himself, in whom is the TRINITY of the One Divinity: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
Cyprian (250 A.D.) Observing the third, sixth, and nineth month for a sacrament of the TRINITY, which was to be manifested in the last times. For the first hour in its progress to the third declared the completed number of the TRINITY. The TRINITY names of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.We are NOT ignorant that there is ONE God; and One Christ, the Lord; and One Holy Spirit. Jesus said, "Go therefore and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son, and Holy Spirit." He suggested that TRINITY, in whose sacrament the nations were to be baptized.Origin (225 A.D.) Saving baptism was NOT complete except by the authority of the most excellent TRINITY of them all. That is, it is made complete by naming the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. In this, we join the name of the Holy Spirit to the Unbegotten God (the Father) and to His Only-begotten Son. You are confused, Nathan. The F&W don't believe in the Trinity, and your arguments for the Trinity make about as much sense as the Athanasisn creed, which is a rambling and contradictory "creed" that contradicts the bible (and is extra-biblical).
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 1, 2015 1:29:25 GMT -5
I would have to look it up again. Why? Show me the MONEY! meant I want to see it/information. Thanks, if you can find it, I believe others on here would like to see it also. I'm busy. You can find it.
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Post by jondough on Dec 1, 2015 1:36:03 GMT -5
You predicted that we would be on a roller coaster ride. I've never met a person who has rode a roller coaster and not known it. Have you? Your exact words "hang on to your seat belt". Well I'm hanging on, but my roller coaster must be broken down. The world has been riding a roller coaster for 3 years famine, Ebola, birds flu, virus, wars, earthquake, Japan nuclear plants meltdown, ice storms, too many wild forest fire, burned thousands of homes, etc.... Hang on to your seat belt, JD... those from California, Oregon, Washington, B.C Canada and Mexico! Here comes the BIG ONE/earthquake which split California in HALF... Andreas fault line... NOT if but WHEN.Same stuff, different year
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Post by jondough on Dec 1, 2015 1:37:18 GMT -5
You predicted that we would be on a roller coaster ride. I've never met a person who has rode a roller coaster and not known it. Have you? Your exact words "hang on to your seat belt". Well I'm hanging on, but my roller coaster must be broken down. The world has been riding a roller coaster for 3 years famine, Ebola, birds flu, virus, wars, earthquake, Japan nuclear plants meltdown, ice storms, too many wild forest fire, burned thousands of homes, etc.... Hang on to your seat belt, JD... those from California, Oregon, Washington, B.C Canada and Mexico! Here comes the BIG ONE/earthquake which split California in HALF... Andreas fault line... NOT if but WHEN.Imagine what you would be claiming if you were of age during WWII
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