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Post by fixit on May 12, 2023 13:52:11 GMT -5
There simply have been way too many incidents abd events in my life that proved to me the existence and work of the Holy Spirit. I'd be a fool to put it all down to coincidence. If two people pray with the same earnestly about the same problem, and they both claim to have received an answer from God, through the Spirit, and their answers are contradictory to each other, at least one side has got a problem. James 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. So how do you explain the contradictions? Matthew 7:17 A good tree produces good fruit, and a bad tree produces bad fruit. 18 A good tree can’t produce bad fruit, and a bad tree can’t produce good fruit. 19 So every tree that does not produce good fruit is chopped down and thrown into the fire. 20 Yes, just as you can identify a tree by its fruit, so you can identify people by their actions.
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Post by snow on May 12, 2023 14:17:39 GMT -5
That they're not owning up to what they've done, apologise and step away from the work is a reflection of their character abd conscience. Also indicative of lack of integrity. Are they waiting to see if perhaps the falling axe will miss them? It boggles me that they can still continue. Where is the respect for truth? The longer they delay to own up, the more angry people will be. That's exactly what they are doing. They have managed to dodge the bullet before, everything calmed down, people forgot or left, so they will wait it out. I think that's the wrong game plan this time, but it will serve them right for staying silent about such serious issues and giving the offenders a safe refuge. They will look even worse for their inability this time to apologize for what they have done in the past. Most of the friends are pretty forgiving, so an apology for wrong doing and a show of integrity would probably go a long way towards continuing to be at least accepted in the group, if not still serving as workers and/or overseers.
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Post by snow on May 12, 2023 14:24:50 GMT -5
There simply have been way too many incidents abd events in my life that proved to me the existence and work of the Holy Spirit. I'd be a fool to put it all down to coincidence. If two people pray with the same earnestly about the same problem, and they both claim to have received an answer from God, through the Spirit, and their answers are contradictory to each other, at least one side has got a problem. James 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. Have you ever considered that the HS is always reflective of what that person is in the first place? Those who pray and the HS tells them to do the right thing, are usually people that would already do the right thing even if they didn't believe in a god? And, the opposite, those who pray and then cover things up are the type of person that would do that even if they didn't believe in a god? The only difference between an atheist and a god believer is that the atheist takes responsibility for their mistakes and a god believer when they get caught then blame their behavior on Satan for their inability to hear the right message from the HS. You would very likely be the one that did the right thing even if you weren't a god believer.
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Post by snow on May 12, 2023 14:27:46 GMT -5
So how do you explain the contradictions? Matthew 7:17 A good tree produces good fruit, and a bad tree produces bad fruit. 18 A good tree can’t produce bad fruit, and a bad tree can’t produce good fruit. 19 So every tree that does not produce good fruit is chopped down and thrown into the fire. 20 Yes, just as you can identify a tree by its fruit, so you can identify people by their actions. So the HS really has nothing to do with it then. If a person is bad the HS has no say and if a person is good you don't need an HS in order to do the right thing?
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Post by kitkat95 on May 12, 2023 14:42:13 GMT -5
That they're not owning up to what they've done, apologise and step away from the work is a reflection of their character abd conscience. Also indicative of lack of integrity. Are they waiting to see if perhaps the falling axe will miss them? It boggles me that they can still continue. Where is the respect for truth? The longer they delay to own up, the more angry people will be. My abuser said that 'God still wants him to be in the work, so he can't leave the work. God can forgive his sins by the blood of Jesus'. He was sorry that he got caught. He wasn't sorry that he abused me. His actions traumatised me. I ended up with mild PTSD. He doesn't care one bit about my well-being even though he's supposed to be 'a shepherd'.
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Post by Grant on May 12, 2023 14:52:18 GMT -5
There simply have been way too many incidents abd events in my life that proved to me the existence and work of the Holy Spirit. I'd be a fool to put it all down to coincidence. If two people pray with the same earnestly about the same problem, and they both claim to have received an answer from God, through the Spirit, and their answers are contradictory to each other, at least one side has got a problem. James 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. Have you ever considered that the HS is always reflective of what that person is in the first place? Those who pray and the HS tells them to do the right thing, are usually people that would already do the right thing even if they didn't believe in a god? And, the opposite, those who pray and then cover things up are the type of person that would do that even if they didn't believe in a god? The only difference between an atheist and a god believer is that the atheist takes responsibility for their mistakes and a god believer when they get caught then blame their behavior on Satan for their inability to hear the right message from the HS. You would very likely be the one that did the right thing even if you weren't a god believer. You over generalize. It is not correct that the believer blames the devil for what they do wrong. Some do but most believe that we are accountable for our actions. There is the world, the flesh and devil. The flesh is usually the cause. Do you really believe that Christians believe that God will accept the devil made me do it excuse or that he holds us accountable for how we lived our lives? Imagine trying that on God when we die. Your belief falls short in light of that.
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Post by Grant on May 12, 2023 15:10:51 GMT -5
That they're not owning up to what they've done, apologise and step away from the work is a reflection of their character abd conscience. Also indicative of lack of integrity. Are they waiting to see if perhaps the falling axe will miss them? It boggles me that they can still continue. Where is the respect for truth? The longer they delay to own up, the more angry people will be. My abuser said that 'God still wants him to be in the work, so he can't leave the work. God can forgive his sins by the blood of Jesus'. He was sorry that he got caught. He wasn't sorry that he abused me. His actions traumatised me. I ended up with mild PTSD. He doesn't care one bit about my well-being even though he's supposed to be 'a shepherd'. If your abuser had truly repented he would have left the work.
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Post by jonathan on May 12, 2023 15:22:18 GMT -5
There simply have been way too many incidents abd events in my life that proved to me the existence and work of the Holy Spirit. I'd be a fool to put it all down to coincidence. If two people pray with the same earnestly about the same problem, and they both claim to have received an answer from God, through the Spirit, and their answers are contradictory to each other, at least one side has got a problem. James 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. So how do you explain the contradictions? Clearly either only one, or none had their answer from the Spirit. Time will tell...
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Post by jonathan on May 12, 2023 15:25:21 GMT -5
There simply have been way too many incidents abd events in my life that proved to me the existence and work of the Holy Spirit. I'd be a fool to put it all down to coincidence. If two people pray with the same earnestly about the same problem, and they both claim to have received an answer from God, through the Spirit, and their answers are contradictory to each other, at least one side has got a problem. James 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. Have you ever considered that the HS is always reflective of what that person is in the first place? Those who pray and the HS tells them to do the right thing, are usually people that would already do the right thing even if they didn't believe in a god? And, the opposite, those who pray and then cover things up are the type of person that would do that even if they didn't believe in a god? The only difference between an atheist and a god believer is that the atheist takes responsibility for their mistakes and a god believer when they get caught then blame their behavior on Satan for their inability to hear the right message from the HS. You would very likely be the one that did the right thing even if you weren't a god believer. This happens quite a lot. Poor Satan gets blamed for far more than what he actually deserves! Also, people claim they're led by the Spirit but not long and the tree is known by its fruit...
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Post by jonathan on May 12, 2023 15:34:28 GMT -5
My abuser said that 'God still wants him to be in the work, so he can't leave the work. God can forgive his sins by the blood of Jesus'. He was sorry that he got caught. He wasn't sorry that he abused me. His actions traumatised me. I ended up with mild PTSD. He doesn't care one bit about my well-being even though he's supposed to be 'a shepherd'. If your abuser had truly repented he would have left the work. I agree 100%. When he abused you, he reneged on his calling to be in the work. He himself nullified it, destroyed it basically. To me, him telling you that God forgives him and still wants him to be in the word is further abuse. He has absolutely no basis for saying that, and he is abusing his position of authority to bully you into accepting what has happened. This is a person of very, very low character. And I can tell you, he couldn't have either peace nor joy in his soul continuing in the work after abusing you. I'm very sorry to hear he abused you and the also subsequently. I really hope he's come to his senses and did the honourable thing to step out from the work. I'm also sorry for the measure of confusion he brought upon you, on top of the initial abuse, with what he told you. He clearly has no clear revelation nor sound understanding of God's Righteousness.
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Post by snow on May 12, 2023 15:40:12 GMT -5
Have you ever considered that the HS is always reflective of what that person is in the first place? Those who pray and the HS tells them to do the right thing, are usually people that would already do the right thing even if they didn't believe in a god? And, the opposite, those who pray and then cover things up are the type of person that would do that even if they didn't believe in a god? The only difference between an atheist and a god believer is that the atheist takes responsibility for their mistakes and a god believer when they get caught then blame their behavior on Satan for their inability to hear the right message from the HS. You would very likely be the one that did the right thing even if you weren't a god believer. You over generalize. It is not correct that the believer blames the devil for what they do wrong. Some do but most believe that we are accountable for our actions. There is the world, the flesh and devil. The flesh is usually the cause. Do you really believe that Christians believe that God will accept the devil made me do it excuse or that he holds us accountable for how we lived our lives? Imagine trying that on God when we die. Your belief falls short in light of that. If there is really a god, then no I don't believe he will let that excuse be valid. Many in these letters have been blaming the 'Judas behavior' on Satan. I agree that not all Christians do that. My point in this post is that people make choices based on their mindset, who they are, and the HS really doesn't have anything to do with it. Some workers pray and do good because that is who they are, and some 'pray' and do bad because that's who they are. The workers that are writing the letters about other workers stepping down often refer to Judas, who everyone equates with someone that got tempted by Satan and failed the test. That's why I said that Satan gets blamed because that's how these letters read.
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Post by snow on May 12, 2023 15:44:39 GMT -5
If your abuser had truly repented he would have left the work. I agree 100%. When he abused you, he reneged on his calling to be in the work. He himself nullified it, destroyed it basically. To me, him telling you that God forgives him and still wants him to be in the word is further abuse. He has absolutely no basis for saying that, and he is abusing his position of authority to bully you into accepting what has happened. This is a person of very, very low character. And I can tell you, he couldn't have either peace nor joy in his soul continuing in the work after abusing you. I'm very sorry to hear he abused you and the also subsequently. I really hope he's come to his senses and did the honourable thing to step out from the work. I'm also sorry for the measure of confusion he brought upon you, on top of the initial abuse, with what he told you. He clearly has no clear revelation nor sound understanding of God's Righteousness. You say he couldn't have either peace nor joy in his soul continuing in the work after abusing her. I disagree. Anyone that could do what he did and then say what he did really doesn't care one bit about it all. He's probably just fine with it all and truly believes he is not accountable. Probably doesn't lose any sleep over it in the least. When he is outed the only thing he will feel bad about is that he got caught. It's how abusers work.
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Post by Grant on May 12, 2023 15:53:32 GMT -5
You over generalize. It is not correct that the believer blames the devil for what they do wrong. Some do but most believe that we are accountable for our actions. There is the world, the flesh and devil. The flesh is usually the cause. Do you really believe that Christians believe that God will accept the devil made me do it excuse or that he holds us accountable for how we lived our lives? Imagine trying that on God when we die. Your belief falls short in light of that. If there is really a god, then no I don't believe he will let that excuse be valid. Many in these letters have been blaming the 'Judas behavior' on Satan. I agree that not all Christians do that. My point in this post is that people make choices based on their mindset, who they are, and the HS really doesn't have anything to do with it. Some workers pray and do good because that is who they are, and some 'pray' and do bad because that's who they are. The workers that are writing the letters about other workers stepping down often refer to Judas, who everyone equates with someone that got tempted by Satan and failed the test. That's why I said that Satan gets blamed because that's how these letters read. That makes me think that often when people say they prayed and had peace about it they are saying their cognitive dissonance has gone as a result of doing what they wanted to do anyway.
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Post by Grant on May 12, 2023 16:01:14 GMT -5
I agree 100%. When he abused you, he reneged on his calling to be in the work. He himself nullified it, destroyed it basically. To me, him telling you that God forgives him and still wants him to be in the word is further abuse. He has absolutely no basis for saying that, and he is abusing his position of authority to bully you into accepting what has happened. This is a person of very, very low character. And I can tell you, he couldn't have either peace nor joy in his soul continuing in the work after abusing you. I'm very sorry to hear he abused you and the also subsequently. I really hope he's come to his senses and did the honourable thing to step out from the work. I'm also sorry for the measure of confusion he brought upon you, on top of the initial abuse, with what he told you. He clearly has no clear revelation nor sound understanding of God's Righteousness. You say he couldn't have either peace nor joy in his soul continuing in the work after abusing her. I disagree. Anyone that could do what he did and then say what he did really doesn't care one bit about it all. He's probably just fine with it all and truly believes he is not accountable. Probably doesn't lose any sleep over it in the least. When he is outed the only thing he will feel bad about is that he got caught. It's how abusers work. I agree but abusers often say they are fearful and looking over their shoulder when they hear a police car wondering if they are going to be arrested for it. This is more so since abusers are being reported but as you suggest they have no fear or for me that means no conscience so for many it will not be an issue especially in light that most don't report the abuse.
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Post by jonathan on May 12, 2023 16:09:44 GMT -5
Matthew 7:17 A good tree produces good fruit, and a bad tree produces bad fruit. 18 A good tree can’t produce bad fruit, and a bad tree can’t produce good fruit. 19 So every tree that does not produce good fruit is chopped down and thrown into the fire. 20 Yes, just as you can identify a tree by its fruit, so you can identify people by their actions. So the HS really has nothing to do with it then. If a person is bad the HS has no say and if a person is good you don't need an HS in order to do the right thing? The fruit of the actions, the results, will show of it was truly the unction of the Holy Spirit. Bad people can be led by the Spirt and do good things, like King Cyrus.
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Post by snow on May 12, 2023 16:26:48 GMT -5
If there is really a god, then no I don't believe he will let that excuse be valid. Many in these letters have been blaming the 'Judas behavior' on Satan. I agree that not all Christians do that. My point in this post is that people make choices based on their mindset, who they are, and the HS really doesn't have anything to do with it. Some workers pray and do good because that is who they are, and some 'pray' and do bad because that's who they are. The workers that are writing the letters about other workers stepping down often refer to Judas, who everyone equates with someone that got tempted by Satan and failed the test. That's why I said that Satan gets blamed because that's how these letters read. That makes me think that often, it's more likely when people say they prayed and had peace about it they are saying their cognitive dissonance has gone as a result of doing what they wanted to do anyway. Could be. Makes sense actually.
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Post by chuck on May 12, 2023 16:27:46 GMT -5
There simply have been way too many incidents abd events in my life that proved to me the existence and work of the Holy Spirit. I'd be a fool to put it all down to coincidence. If two people pray with the same earnestly about the same problem, and they both claim to have received an answer from God, through the Spirit, and their answers are contradictory to each other, at least one side has got a problem. James 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. Have you ever considered that the HS is always reflective of what that person is in the first place? Those who pray and the HS tells them to do the right thing, are usually people that would already do the right thing even if they didn't believe in a god? And, the opposite, those who pray and then cover things up are the type of person that would do that even if they didn't believe in a god? The only difference between an atheist and a god believer is that the atheist takes responsibility for their mistakes and a god believer when they get caught then blame their behavior on Satan for their inability to hear the right message from the HS. You would very likely be the one that did the right thing even if you weren't a god believer. This is why the Holy Spirit to the writers of scripture was an "Indwelling influence absent of bondage". It is not exclusive to those who SAY they believe in a God as you have just pointed out. And technically and Atheist demonstrating and Influence absent bondage is Believing in God, remembering though God is your highest ideals, not a man in the sky........ The Hebrew people said their God should be the LORD and the L O R D was a gracious compassionate slow to anger and abounding in love and forgiveness G O D, I see that character displayed by all sorts of people and religious beliefs are not a prerequisite to displaying this character. Satan is another character, its one you choose to let influence you just like the Holy Spirit or multiple other influences you could let lead your life and decisions, satan also isn't a man in the sky but rather something within your control, it's an Indwelling influence full of bondage..... Most people unless they are acutally sick or unwell can choose what sort of influence they let lead their lives. Religion is just another way of expressing an influence, obviously you will see what sort of G O D (highest ideals) people worship by the way they act.....its clear within the Christian religion there are many Gods, even within the same sects or denominations.....
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Post by snow on May 12, 2023 16:31:06 GMT -5
Have you ever considered that the HS is always reflective of what that person is in the first place? Those who pray and the HS tells them to do the right thing, are usually people that would already do the right thing even if they didn't believe in a god? And, the opposite, those who pray and then cover things up are the type of person that would do that even if they didn't believe in a god? The only difference between an atheist and a god believer is that the atheist takes responsibility for their mistakes and a god believer when they get caught then blame their behavior on Satan for their inability to hear the right message from the HS. You would very likely be the one that did the right thing even if you weren't a god believer. This is why the Holy Spirit to the writers of scripture was an "Indwelling influence absent of bondage". It is not exclusive to those who SAY they believe in a God as you have just pointed out. And technically and Atheist demonstrating and Influence absent bondage is Believing in God, remembering though God is your highest ideals, not a man in the sky........ The Hebrew people said their God should be the LORD and the L O R D was a gracious compassionate slow to anger and abounding in love and forgiveness G O D, I see that character displayed by all sorts of people and religious beliefs are not a prerequisite to displaying this character. Satan is another character, its one you choose to let influence you just like the Holy Spirit or multiple other influences you could let lead your life and decisions, satan also isn't a man in the sky but rather something within your control, it's an Indwelling influence full of bondage..... Most people unless they are acutally sick or unwell can choose what sort of influence they let lead their lives. Religion is just another way of expressing an influence, obviously you will see what sort of G O D (highest ideals) people worship by the way they act.....its clear within the Christian religion there are many Gods, even within the same sects or denominations..... You're entitled to your belief in God, but I see no evidence for that belief. So if you think that my making right choices is somehow because of an 'Influence absent of bondage' go right ahead. But I will admit I have no idea what you're talking about here. In my world a god of any kind does not exist.
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Post by chuck on May 12, 2023 17:07:02 GMT -5
This is why the Holy Spirit to the writers of scripture was an "Indwelling influence absent of bondage". It is not exclusive to those who SAY they believe in a God as you have just pointed out. And technically and Atheist demonstrating and Influence absent bondage is Believing in God, remembering though God is your highest ideals, not a man in the sky........ The Hebrew people said their God should be the LORD and the L O R D was a gracious compassionate slow to anger and abounding in love and forgiveness G O D, I see that character displayed by all sorts of people and religious beliefs are not a prerequisite to displaying this character. Satan is another character, its one you choose to let influence you just like the Holy Spirit or multiple other influences you could let lead your life and decisions, satan also isn't a man in the sky but rather something within your control, it's an Indwelling influence full of bondage..... Most people unless they are acutally sick or unwell can choose what sort of influence they let lead their lives. Religion is just another way of expressing an influence, obviously you will see what sort of G O D (highest ideals) people worship by the way they act.....its clear within the Christian religion there are many Gods, even within the same sects or denominations..... You're entitled to your belief in God, but I see no evidence for that belief. So if you think that my making right choices is somehow because of an 'Influence absent of bondage' go right ahead. But I will admit I have no idea what you're talking about here. In my world a god of any kind does not exist. It's only a belief in God if you act out what you say you believe. So belief in God is how I act it out and not a belief in my mind of something existent and tangible or a seperate entity, and technically saying "you are entitled to your belief in God" is not really possible for you to say because you really dont know me and If I act out what I say I actually believe in, and trust me I do not believe in my mind in some existent supernatural being let alone know how to act that out...... In the Hebrew worldview the existent God ceased to exist as well, by Jesus day the Hebrew G O D was most definitely something in you, it was not an existent God somewhere else that you believed in in your mind at all. I think what makes it confusing is people dont understand what these ancient people actually said about G O D and instead they only understand what the more modern Church has said about G O D, and that is G O D is a existent entity that has superpowers and will punish you if you do or dont xzy.
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Post by openingact34 on May 12, 2023 19:28:49 GMT -5
What's your take on the difference in the way the Holy Spirit led the oversight in California to act in a way contrary to the way the oversight in South Africa received Kingsley Stone, also supposedly praying about the same matter and also led by the same Spirit? I'm still very confused about what he was accused of, exactly what happened in the other meeting, etc. I'm not sure what to make of any of that situation yet. But there seems to be a lot of pressure on the California workers to follow what bitter exes, law enforcement, and other worldlings want. What is much more clear is that in case after case after case, for over 100 years, the overseers covered up abuse. Every. single. time. We know that there is a higher standard demonstrated in the Truth than in the world or false religions. Immense amounts of prayer are invested to assure this. The truth could have been different in keeping children safe from predators if that was what mattered to God. But the difference that matters is apparently how we dress and what we do with our hair.
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Post by Dan on May 12, 2023 22:22:41 GMT -5
That they're not owning up to what they've done, apologise and step away from the work is a reflection of their character abd conscience. Also indicative of lack of integrity. Are they waiting to see if perhaps the falling axe will miss them? It boggles me that they can still continue. Where is the respect for truth? The longer they delay to own up, the more angry people will be. My abuser said that 'God still wants him to be in the work, so he can't leave the work. God can forgive his sins by the blood of Jesus'. He was sorry that he got caught. He wasn't sorry that he abused me. His actions traumatised me. I ended up with mild PTSD. He doesn't care one bit about my well-being even though he's supposed to be 'a shepherd'.
Welcome... Sorry to hear your story. So did the abuser stay in the Work? While its true that God might forgive a truly repentant person, trust was violated and he should have been thrown out of the work. Depending on the extent of the abuse, every situation is different, but physical assault should never be tolerated. Hope you can put it behind you and move on.
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Post by rebekah on May 12, 2023 22:48:27 GMT -5
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Post by Dan on May 12, 2023 22:55:51 GMT -5
So the HS really has nothing to do with it then. If a person is bad the HS has no say and if a person is good you don't need an HS in order to do the right thing?
The Holy Spirit convicts the world of sin (John 16:8). He doesn't make decisions for you or tell you what to do, but sears right from wrong into your conscience.
While the indwelling of the H.S isn't inherit in everyone, I believe He does have an unction in every living soul, which makes us all accountable. (John 8:9)
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Post by verna on May 12, 2023 23:43:30 GMT -5
So the HS really has nothing to do with it then. If a person is bad the HS has no say and if a person is good you don't need an HS in order to do the right thing? The fruit of the actions, the results, will show of it was truly the unction of the Holy Spirit. Bad people can be led by the Spirt and do good things, like King Cyrus. Ok i’m so confused. So bad people can be led by the holy spirit and do good things? So what’s this about knowing a tree by it’s fruit? Seems contradictory.
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Post by Dan on May 13, 2023 0:14:46 GMT -5
The fruit of the actions, the results, will show of it was truly the unction of the Holy Spirit. Bad people can be led by the Spirt and do good things, like King Cyrus. Ok i’m so confused. So bad people can be led by the holy spirit and do good things? So what’s this about knowing a tree by it’s fruit? Seems contradictory.
We all have the knowledge of good and evil, but nonbelievers as well as believers have a choice. A bad person can choose to do something good, just as a Christian can choose to do something bad. We are all fallible to some extent, but just as Peter denied knowing Christ 3 times, his over-riding fruit was good, while the Pharaoh releasing the Hebrews as good, but he wasn't generally a very nice guy.
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Post by jonathan on May 13, 2023 0:18:20 GMT -5
The fruit of the actions, the results, will show of it was truly the unction of the Holy Spirit. Bad people can be led by the Spirt and do good things, like King Cyrus. Ok i’m so confused. So bad people can be led by the hilt spirit and do good things? So what’s this about knowing a tree by it’s fruit? Seems contradictory. Of an overseer or a worker, or anyone, tells you he prayed about the matter and asked God to lead him by the Holy Spirit, you just wait and see. Having prayed about the matter, doesn't mean a person will be led by the Holy Spirit. They can claim so (claim to be a certain fruittree), but really the way things unfold (the fruit) will tell.
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Post by Pragmatic on May 13, 2023 1:20:28 GMT -5
A certain amount of "praying about it" and being "led by the Holy Spirit" is actually psychosis and/or a means to justify what someone wants to do, regardless.
When it is real, it is obvious.
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Post by jonathan on May 13, 2023 1:24:21 GMT -5
A certain amount of "praying about it" and being "led by the Holy Spirit" is actually psychosis and/or a means to justify what someone wants to do, regardless. When it is real, it is obvious. Saying you have prayed about a matter and saying you're led by the Spirit could also be a means to justify your actions. Because, who dares to question you now?
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