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Dean Bruer
Apr 20, 2023 20:16:47 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by jennyfromtheblock on Apr 20, 2023 20:16:47 GMT -5
Ya. I was looking into him. Lol. He seems the most likely. He was arrested in Sept 2022. Not sure how credible Enty Lawyer is, but he makes his living off of providing anonymous information and has for years. It’s weird that he’d have a 2x2 story. Most of his stories are about Hollywood.
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Post by jennyfromtheblock on Apr 20, 2023 20:17:12 GMT -5
I think the actual text needs posting here Jenny, FWIW:
Dear local reporters, Let me give you a little tip which will make those sweeps ratings periods starting in a couple of weeks all the richer for you and your stations. There is a trial set to start in Phoenix next week about a software company owner and the stash of self produced and traded for child p**n on his laptop. The guy belongs to a cult disguised as a religion called Two By Two. That is not mentioned in any of the news stories. Late last year one of the top five members of this cult/church (Two By Two) was found dead in a motel room in Bend, Oregon. He died in possession of a laptop that had thousands of images of self produced and traded for child p**n. There were also videos of some of the victims approaching his motel room door. Once, the church/cult discovered his death, they sent another church/cult leader (Two By Two) to collect the laptop and other possessions. For seven months he hid the laptop in his car, and refused to turn it over to the authorities until several of the victims went to law enforcement themselves. In Washington State right now, leaders from around the world of this church/cult (Two By Two) which professes to take in zero dollars from any of their members and owns no buildings or structures or property in the name of the church/cult have spent nearly a half million dollars on travel and lodging. Why? They need to replace one of the leaders of the cult who represents Washington and Alaska. Why? In the past month he has been accused of molesting d ozens of underage girls. He is not being forced out of the church/cult (Two By Two), just replaced. he also gets to weigh in on who should replace him. I can go on and on and on about how this is in every single local market across the country and around the world. This is about to explode. Now, about those May sweeps ratings? Get on it. Love & Bacon, Enty Hilarious!!! another 'true facts' winner post by pragamatic from his 'q anon' sources Just wait a day two (or more realistically a 1000 years) until this little treasure trove of true verified facts is splashed across the headlines of 100s of US news agencies! Thank for you scoop of truth !!!!!! Take a geek here for more of crazydaysandnights.net 's amazing fact based revelations and hot news! A new sucker born every minute!! Stop embarrassing yourself.
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Post by Pragmatic on Apr 20, 2023 20:52:26 GMT -5
I think a point too after a prosecution, is how does the victim feel. Was justice done, and seen to be done? How is the victim being treated by the other people in the church.
In the case of a church abuser case I was involved in prosecuting, a key issue was that the people in the church were either uncomfortable, afraid, or deliberately avoided the victim, and in some cases blamed the victim and her parents. (Not sure how an 11 year old girl could be blamed). Maybe it was because of a number of factors, a) they had lost their pastor b) they were uneducated as to the impact of paedophilia, c) they didn't understand the detail of what happened, or didn't want to know, d) their mis-placed faith in an institution had been shaken. The Pastor was given a minimum of three years behind bars to be server before being eligible for parole. The parole board sees no sign of him being safe in the community, so he is still serving at his Majesty's behest!
To their credit the church took on board suggestions from a counselor that they openly educate people on CSA, it's impact, and how to see things through the eyes of a victim, and how they (victims) should be treated.
From what I can see, the last part is a major piece of the puzzle that our church has yet to embrace. And I believe it will, as there are many good people and workers in it. But for the present, you only need to talk to a victim, albeit from years ago, to realise that a number of "the friends" are not socially, emotionally, or intellectually equipped to handle something like a CSA or Rape case in their area, and how to deal with the victim(s) going forward.
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
Posts: 662
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Post by peggysullivan on Apr 21, 2023 11:03:05 GMT -5
I think a point too after a prosecution, is how does the victim feel. Was justice done, and seen to be done? How is the victim being treated by the other people in the church. In the case of a church abuser case I was involved in prosecuting, a key issue was that the people in the church were either uncomfortable, afraid, or deliberately avoided the victim, and in some cases blamed the victim and her parents. (Not sure how an 11 year old girl could be blamed). Maybe it was because of a number of factors, a) they had lost their pastor b) they were uneducated as to the impact of paedophilia, c) they didn't understand the detail of what happened, or didn't want to know, d) their mis-placed faith in an institution had been shaken. The Pastor was given a minimum of three years behind bars to be server before being eligible for parole. The parole board sees no sign of him being safe in the community, so he is still serving at his Majesty's behest! To their credit the church took on board suggestions from a counselor that they openly educate people on CSA, it's impact, and how to see things through the eyes of a victim, and how they (victims) should be treated. From what I can see, the last part is a major piece of the puzzle that our church has yet to embrace. And I believe it will, as there are many good people and workers in it. But for the present, you only need to talk to a victim, albeit from years ago, to realise that a number of "the friends" are not socially, emotionally, or intellectually equipped to handle something like a CSA or Rape case in their area, and how to deal with the victim(s) going forward. You bring up some good points. People in general don't know how to approach victims, how to talk to victims, etc. So, they don't in many cases. So the victim feels they are being avoided and/or shunned. And, you will always find those that don't believe the victim. People don't like to address "unpleasant things". It's just how they are. They would rather not deal with it. But it needs to be dealt with, it really does. How would Jesus deal with a victim of SA? He would minister to that victim. I don't think the workers can be expected to minister to all the victims. The elders, and the friends need to step up. There are elders that I have known that are comfortable with their own circle of friends and don't really reach out to those in need of ministering. Or the "weak" saints. Or whatever. People need to get out of their comfort zones and reach out. It's what Christians are called to do.
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Post by snow on Apr 21, 2023 16:49:43 GMT -5
I think the actual text needs posting here Jenny, FWIW:
Dear local reporters,
Let me give you a little tip which will make those sweeps ratings periods starting in a couple of weeks all the richer for you and your stations. There is a trial set to start in Phoenix next week about a software company owner and the stash of self produced and traded for child p**n on his laptop. The guy belongs to a cult disguised as a religion called Two By Two. That is not mentioned in any of the news stories.
Late last year one of the top five members of this cult/church (Two By Two) was found dead in a motel room in Bend, Oregon. He died in possession of a laptop that had thousands of images of self produced and traded for child p**n. There were also videos of some of the victims approaching his motel room door. Once, the church/cult discovered his death, they sent another church/cult leader (Two By Two) to collect the laptop and other possessions.
For seven months he hid the laptop in his car, and refused to turn it over to the authorities until several of the victims went to law enforcement themselves.
In Washington State right now, leaders from around the world of this church/cult (Two By Two) which professes to take in zero dollars from any of their members and owns no buildings or structures or property in the name of the church/cult have spent nearly a half million dollars on travel and lodging. Why? They need to replace one of the leaders of the cult who represents Washington and Alaska. Why? In the past month he has been accused of molesting dozens of underage girls. He is not being forced out of the church/cult (Two By Two), just replaced. he also gets to weigh in on who should replace him.
I can go on and on and on about how this is in every single local market across the country and around the world. This is about to explode. Now, about those May sweeps ratings? Get on it.
Love & Bacon,
Enty
Wow, self produced child porn! Has this been verified. I knew from the letters he was an abuser, but I never realized that what they found were self produced child porn. That takes this to yet a whole new level imo. So Doyle was not telling the truth about handing the laptop over on his own, and in fact refused to give it to authorities. This beyond ugly because if there was self produced child porn on it they had to know those children and yet they didn't do anything. Do they really think he acted with no one else knowing? All child porn/abuse needs to be reported. I think it's time for the hierarchy to have to start compensating these families for the therapy these children are going to need. They have power over the friends, they receive a lot of money from the friends, so it's time they use that money to help the friends when one of their own has abused the friends/children.
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Dean Bruer
Apr 21, 2023 17:09:37 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by openingact34 on Apr 21, 2023 17:09:37 GMT -5
I think the actual text needs posting here Jenny, FWIW:
Dear local reporters,
Let me give you a little tip which will make those sweeps ratings periods starting in a couple of weeks all the richer for you and your stations. There is a trial set to start in Phoenix next week about a software company owner and the stash of self produced and traded for child p**n on his laptop. The guy belongs to a cult disguised as a religion called Two By Two. That is not mentioned in any of the news stories.
Late last year one of the top five members of this cult/church (Two By Two) was found dead in a motel room in Bend, Oregon. He died in possession of a laptop that had thousands of images of self produced and traded for child p**n. There were also videos of some of the victims approaching his motel room door. Once, the church/cult discovered his death, they sent another church/cult leader (Two By Two) to collect the laptop and other possessions.
For seven months he hid the laptop in his car, and refused to turn it over to the authorities until several of the victims went to law enforcement themselves.
In Washington State right now, leaders from around the world of this church/cult (Two By Two) which professes to take in zero dollars from any of their members and owns no buildings or structures or property in the name of the church/cult have spent nearly a half million dollars on travel and lodging. Why? They need to replace one of the leaders of the cult who represents Washington and Alaska. Why? In the past month he has been accused of molesting dozens of underage girls. He is not being forced out of the church/cult (Two By Two), just replaced. he also gets to weigh in on who should replace him.
I can go on and on and on about how this is in every single local market across the country and around the world. This is about to explode. Now, about those May sweeps ratings? Get on it.
Love & Bacon,
Enty
Wow, self produced child porn! Has this been verified. I knew from the letters he was an abuser, but I never realized that what they found were self produced child porn. That takes this to yet a whole new level imo. So Doyle was not telling the truth about handing the laptop over on his own, and in fact refused to give it to authorities. This beyond ugly because if there was self produced child porn on it they had to know those children and yet they didn't do anything. Do they really think he acted with no one else knowing? All child porn/abuse needs to be reported. I think it's time for the hierarchy to have to start compensating these families for the therapy these children are going to need. They have power over the friends, they receive a lot of money from the friends, so it's time they use that money to help the friends when one of their own has abused the friends/children. If there was anyone credible who could attest to that, the police should have been able to get a warrant to search the laptop.
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Dean Bruer
Apr 21, 2023 17:11:28 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by luke2236 on Apr 21, 2023 17:11:28 GMT -5
Latest letter from Doyle S. Tap to enlarge. As usual the internet is full of mis-information and speculation. Thank you Doyle for the transparency. For those who are speaking idle words and yet like to present themselves as religious, refer to Matthew 12:36. To summarise: - Dean passed away, his computer was accessed to get the list but his laptop wasn't "inspected" at that point. - Within 3 months of his death, 2 adult women came forward to say they had either an adult / adult relationship or an adult/minor abuse in the past, but the survivors are now adult (it isn't clear). - As a result of this revelation they looked at his computer and found Dean had looked at porn but nothing minor related, again, this was immoral but not illegal. - As more survivors came forward who were all adults there was no requirement to report abuse of a deceased abuser and it is up to the survivor to make that decision. I guess someone will find a big fault with this approach, but having known two abuse survivors (neither were minors), I completely see the point about it being sensitive to their needs - particularly when the abuser is dead. We have already had Mr Landless give one of his famous extended and detailed analysis of the situation on the Facebook group. I am looking forward to his 15 point analysis of this letter. Maybe Mr Landless should refer to Matthew 12:36 when he is spending his evening writing his next facebook post We probably need a new thread about how meeting needs to have programs that are taught to everyone about porn and that it should be normal to admit in meeting that you have a porn problem and how to overcome porn addiction because one hidden lust leads to another and the neuroscience behind the hidden porn addiction is clear and unfortunately the secret sin of most Christian men and over 25% of women. When there are no tools for fixing this addiction, the secret sin remains along with the shame. When people can stop hiding their sin they can work on it. God can use other men and women who God has helped to help other people. And people can pray together for God to have victory over the porn addiction.
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Post by snow on Apr 21, 2023 17:31:28 GMT -5
Wow, self produced child porn! Has this been verified. I knew from the letters he was an abuser, but I never realized that what they found were self produced child porn. That takes this to yet a whole new level imo. So Doyle was not telling the truth about handing the laptop over on his own, and in fact refused to give it to authorities. This beyond ugly because if there was self produced child porn on it they had to know those children and yet they didn't do anything. Do they really think he acted with no one else knowing? All child porn/abuse needs to be reported. I think it's time for the hierarchy to have to start compensating these families for the therapy these children are going to need. They have power over the friends, they receive a lot of money from the friends, so it's time they use that money to help the friends when one of their own has abused the friends/children. If there was anyone credible who could attest to that, the police should have been able to get a warrant to search the laptop. Good point. So not likely to be true and this is just one more person that claims to know stuff.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Apr 21, 2023 17:40:00 GMT -5
If there was anyone credible who could attest to that, the police should have been able to get a warrant to search the laptop. Good point. So not likely to be true and this is just one more person that claims to know stuff. I have had my doubts about some of the claims published on here about Bruer. I know there has been wise words said by mountain who is ex police and another who deals in forensics who have made good points. I will leave it up to the US police and Interpol to sort it out. Meanwhile keep reporting and exposing those who get their kicks from SA or CSA. And those who enable them.
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Post by Pragmatic on Apr 21, 2023 18:02:20 GMT -5
I think the actual text needs posting here Jenny, FWIW:
Dear local reporters,
Let me give you a little tip which will make those sweeps ratings periods starting in a couple of weeks all the richer for you and your stations. There is a trial set to start in Phoenix next week about a software company owner and the stash of self produced and traded for child p**n on his laptop. The guy belongs to a cult disguised as a religion called Two By Two. That is not mentioned in any of the news stories.
Late last year one of the top five members of this cult/church (Two By Two) was found dead in a motel room in Bend, Oregon. He died in possession of a laptop that had thousands of images of self produced and traded for child p**n. There were also videos of some of the victims approaching his motel room door. Once, the church/cult discovered his death, they sent another church/cult leader (Two By Two) to collect the laptop and other possessions.
For seven months he hid the laptop in his car, and refused to turn it over to the authorities until several of the victims went to law enforcement themselves.
In Washington State right now, leaders from around the world of this church/cult (Two By Two) which professes to take in zero dollars from any of their members and owns no buildings or structures or property in the name of the church/cult have spent nearly a half million dollars on travel and lodging. Why? They need to replace one of the leaders of the cult who represents Washington and Alaska. Why? In the past month he has been accused of molesting dozens of underage girls. He is not being forced out of the church/cult (Two By Two), just replaced. he also gets to weigh in on who should replace him.
I can go on and on and on about how this is in every single local market across the country and around the world. This is about to explode. Now, about those May sweeps ratings? Get on it.
Love & Bacon,
Enty
Wow, self produced child porn! Has this been verified. I knew from the letters he was an abuser, but I never realized that what they found were self produced child porn. That takes this to yet a whole new level imo. So Doyle was not telling the truth about handing the laptop over on his own, and in fact refused to give it to authorities. This beyond ugly because if there was self produced child porn on it they had to know those children and yet they didn't do anything. Do they really think he acted with no one else knowing? All child porn/abuse needs to be reported. I think it's time for the hierarchy to have to start compensating these families for the therapy these children are going to need. They have power over the friends, they receive a lot of money from the friends, so it's time they use that money to help the friends when one of their own has abused the friends/children. I am note sure how credible this is, or if there is some journalistic license that has been applied. Someone put up a link, so I grabbed the text from it to make it an easier read. It is obvious to anyone with an IQ greater than 50, that it is a journalistic piece and needs verification, but it highlights, the reputational damage the church is going to have to mend.
Personally, I think Doyle's explanation about the time lapse on the laptop is plausible, and I give him the benefit of the doubt. This is because he would be struggling with the feeling of being let down, and still wanting to believe something better than what he was seeing unfold. This psyche is common in these sorts of events.
I have no idea on the Phoenix issue, but if a journo is on the sniff, there's usually a reason why, and in a litigious society, places and institutional names are not usually mentioned unless there is something.
Let's await further information, I say.
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Post by jennyfromtheblock on Apr 21, 2023 18:12:28 GMT -5
Wow, self produced child porn! Has this been verified. I knew from the letters he was an abuser, but I never realized that what they found were self produced child porn. That takes this to yet a whole new level imo. So Doyle was not telling the truth about handing the laptop over on his own, and in fact refused to give it to authorities. This beyond ugly because if there was self produced child porn on it they had to know those children and yet they didn't do anything. Do they really think he acted with no one else knowing? All child porn/abuse needs to be reported. I think it's time for the hierarchy to have to start compensating these families for the therapy these children are going to need. They have power over the friends, they receive a lot of money from the friends, so it's time they use that money to help the friends when one of their own has abused the friends/children. I am note sure how credible this is, or if there is some journalistic license that has been applied. Someone put up a link, so I grabbed the text from it to make it an easier read. It is obvious to anyone with an IQ greater than 50, that it is a journalistic piece and needs verification, but it highlights, the reputational damage the church is going to have to mend.
Personally, I think Doyle's explanation about the time lapse on the laptop is plausible, and I give him the benefit of the doubt. This is because he would be struggling with the feeling of being let down, and still wanting to believe something better than what he was seeing unfold. This psyche is common in these sorts of events.
I have no idea on the Phoenix issue, but if a journo is on the sniff, there's usually a reason why, and in a litigious society, places and institutional names are not usually mentioned unless there is something.
Let's await further information, I say.
The Phoenix issue was a man name Raymond Zwiefelhofer. An elder of a meeting. He had his first trial date last week on April 8th, was originally arrested in Sept 2022.
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Post by Pragmatic on Apr 21, 2023 18:27:14 GMT -5
Thanks Jenny.
Obviously no-one knows apart from Doyle, and whoever is investigating Bruer's internet connected devices as to their content, be it law enforcement, Cynthia Liles and co, or anyone that has browsed it with the forensic tools.
A case I worked on yielded up images that were absolutely sickening, and recovered CCTV footage, showing the young people arriving for their "interviews" made by stomach turn with anger. It is entirely conceivable that this is some of the footage Enty is talking about, but someone would have had to leak that to him, unless it is hyperbole on his part.
Sometimes perpetrators do film themselves, so they can relook at the footage for their own gratification. Sickening.
If Zwiefelhofer is guilty, I hope there is healing and restitution for the victims, and those in his circle who are feeling badly let down.
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
Posts: 662
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Post by peggysullivan on Apr 21, 2023 18:41:29 GMT -5
I'm going to be real frank here. If these issues are not dealt with appropriately, the fellowship as we know it will likely implode. You will have people saying they can't be part of something that covers up SA or fails to address SA appropriately when they are aware of the problem. You will have elders that won't be elders of a church with these problems of cover ups. You will have workers who won't be part of a ministry that allows these things to go unheeded. They are so aggregiously wrong. Most of the flock didn't know about these things until now. But it's out now.
Also, the idea of a celibate ministry needs to be revisited and who all has a 'say' in who gets accepted into the ministry. Do the sister workers, for example have any input for sisters being accepted?
Sister workers have been raped at preps. It's happened more than once. Well, duh. You take a bunch of celibate, single men and women and put them on a farm together for 3 weeks with no oversight and what do you expect? It's needs to be revisited.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Apr 21, 2023 18:50:31 GMT -5
I'm going to be real frank here. If these issues are not dealt with appropriately, the fellowship as we know it will likely implode. You will have people saying they can't be part of something that covers up SA or fails to address SA appropriately when they are aware of the problem. You will have elders that won't be elders of a church with these problems of cover ups. You will have workers who won't be part of a ministry that allows these things to go unheeded. They are so aggregiously wrong. Most of the flock didn't know about these things until now. But it's out now. Also, the idea of a celibate ministry needs to be revisited and who all has a 'say' in who gets accepted into the ministry. Do the sister workers, for example have any input for sisters being accepted? Sister workers have been raped at preps. It's happened more than once. Well, duh. You take a bunch of celibate, single men and women and put them on a farm together for 3 weeks with no oversight and what do you expect? It's needs to be revisited. Sack the workers. Put an end to conventions and all the other talk fests and just have their fellowship meetings. That would go along way to removing the power from the workers and their enablers.
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Post by fixit on Apr 21, 2023 19:10:43 GMT -5
The case that intstud is referring to resulted in a successful prosecution and a sentence of home detention. Jail would have been more appropriate. As it was a successful prosecution I have to laugh at his belief that the whole thing is a lie. I repeat: I certainly will not be discussing any further on this public forum, that case in question. I remain unchanged in my statement. I 100% know the facts on the case and shame on Pragmatic for his misleading incorrect statement. If anyone wishes to contact me by PM (identifying themselves) I am quite open and happy to share, if it is appropriate to do so with the enquirer, the FACTS! It would be a very bad idea for anyone to identify themselves to our resident worker. Been there, done that. Very bad idea.
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Post by SharonArnold on Apr 21, 2023 19:13:17 GMT -5
I'm going to be real frank here. If these issues are not dealt with appropriately, the fellowship as we know it will likely implode. You will have people saying they can't be part of something that covers up SA or fails to address SA appropriately when they are aware of the problem. You will have elders that won't be elders of a church with these problems of cover ups. You will have workers who won't be part of a ministry that allows these things to go unheeded. They are so aggregiously wrong. Most of the flock didn't know about these things until now. But it's out now. Also, the idea of a celibate ministry needs to be revisited and who all has a 'say' in who gets accepted into the ministry. Do the sister workers, for example have any input for sisters being accepted? Sister workers have been raped at preps. It's happened more than once. Well, duh. You take a bunch of celibate, single men and women and put them on a farm together for 3 weeks with no oversight and what do you expect? It's needs to be revisited. I also believe that this is an existential threat to the future of the fellowship. On pretty much every level, how could it be otherwise? What pisses me off is that I could clearly see that it was an existential threat as a teenager. I expected that all adults (and all people in authority) could clearly see just that. So why wasn't all of this taken seriously 50 years ago? It could be that they were as naive as I was? (That takes quite a bit of naivete.) I could almost buy that explanation for up until the late 1990's, early 2000's. But, beyond that, it is a bit of a stretch. Or, has here been some sort of payoff for people in positions of authority? 👀 👀 👀
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Post by SharonArnold on Apr 21, 2023 19:18:49 GMT -5
I repeat: I certainly will not be discussing any further on this public forum, that case in question. I remain unchanged in my statement. I 100% know the facts on the case and shame on Pragmatic for his misleading incorrect statement. If anyone wishes to contact me by PM (identifying themselves) I am quite open and happy to share, if it is appropriate to do so with the enquirer, the FACTS! It would be a very bad idea for anyone to identify themselves to our resident worker. Been there, done that. Very bad idea. Oh, definitely. Even the people from the sidelines have seen this play before. I identify myself freely on an open forum, do not even hide behind PM's. But I would fail the "appropriate to do so" filter, I know.
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irish
New Member
Posts: 44
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Post by irish on Apr 21, 2023 19:22:54 GMT -5
I repeat: I certainly will not be discussing any further on this public forum, that case in question. I remain unchanged in my statement. I 100% know the facts on the case and shame on Pragmatic for his misleading incorrect statement. If anyone wishes to contact me by PM (identifying themselves) I am quite open and happy to share, if it is appropriate to do so with the enquirer, the FACTS! It would be a very bad idea for anyone to identify themselves to our resident worker. Been there, done that. Very bad idea. Yeah, don’t identify yourself to him. Is he willing to share his true ID? I seriously doubt it.
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Post by internationalstudies on Apr 21, 2023 20:08:39 GMT -5
I repeat: I certainly will not be discussing any further on this public forum, that case in question. I remain unchanged in my statement. I 100% know the facts on the case and shame on Pragmatic for his misleading incorrect statement. If anyone wishes to contact me by PM (identifying themselves) I am quite open and happy to share, if it is appropriate to do so with the enquirer, the FACTS! It would be a very bad idea for anyone to identify themselves to our resident worker. Been there, done that. Very bad idea. This..... while you regularly and ‘righteously‘ post about ad hominem attacks! 🤣 🤣 I have no apology to offer for challenging posters to substantiate the unsubstantiated incorrect allegations they make on this forum. About time someone did this rather than just applause from the team of cheerleaders.Nor for showing the hypocrisy of 'righteous' posters that howl in indignation about me doing this. Responding with ad hominem attacks. One of the things they so loudly condemn! 🤭🤷♂️🤨
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Post by internationalstudies on Apr 21, 2023 20:13:22 GMT -5
It would be a very bad idea for anyone to identify themselves to our resident worker. Been there, done that. Very bad idea. Yeah, don’t identify yourself to him. Is he willing to share his true ID? I seriously doubt it. Test your hypothesis by pm ing me if you wish? See if I am as evil as I am portrayed by some? Perhaps I am even worse than that?🤷♂️
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Dean Bruer
Apr 21, 2023 20:22:53 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by 1chinesewhispers on Apr 21, 2023 20:22:53 GMT -5
Yet another with a twist
Site logo image Wings for Truth Jerome Frandle letter to Kentucky and Tennessee friends and workers – April 2023
wingsfortruth2 Apr 21 April 15, 2023
Dear Friends and Fellow workers in Kentucky & Tennessee,
We have received word that Dean Bruer, a worker in Northwestern US, who died last fall had been living a double immoral life. There is substantial evidence that this Is true Also another man who was in this ministry and having a place of oversight, has been accused of abusing children, Needless to say. we are shocked by all this and have a heavy heart for the victims.
Our prayer is that the victims will continue to seek the Lord in their distress and experience His healing and comfort that He alone can give.
Wo are saddened that such horrible things have occurred among our people, that men who have been held in such high esteem and trust have turned out to be like those we hear of in the world, from time to time, without the fear of God, whose horrible deeds have been brought to light
To add to this, on Friday this week, a father told us of his daughter, when a girl of being abused by the son of a man who was attending our meetings. This Information just surfaced recently. Since that time, these horrible incidences have plagued her and been so distressing, to say the least. When we received this word, Darin Jensen and I reported the Information to the police in the county of occurrence,
We encourage all to report to the authorities (police in the county of occurrence! anyone whose behavior is inappropriate with children; family, neighbor, Worker, friend, etc. Or phone the CHILD ABUSE HOTLINE KY 877-597-2331 or TN 877-237-OCXM. The Workers in the ministry are responsible to notify the authorities as we are mandated reporters.
The Workers in Kentucky, Tennessee, Michigan. Ohio, West Virginia, Florida and other states have taken the Child Sexual Abuse Training with Ministry Safe, based at Ft. Worth Texas 6001 River Oaks Ft. Worth Texas 76114 Some states have taken their training every two years for the last ten years. Other states have this source of instruction. We have found this organization to be most helpful.
Though we are aware that we are limited, we will standby and support in any way we can, those who have suffered such humiliation and hurt through abuse, who seek help of the Lord and professional help if needed.
We are glad we can look to the Lord Jesus for comfort, who is pure, holy and undefiled. Also to those among us who are true, upholding the life of Jesus by word, example love and all purity.
Our Lord and chose who follow Him, suffer reproach, because of the corrupt actions of individuals.
Sincerely
Your brother [Signed by Jerome Frandle]
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Post by internationalstudies on Apr 21, 2023 20:28:25 GMT -5
Chinese whispers I want to make it clear that I am not including in my above post; This is the sincere respect I hold you, as I posted the other day: Chinese whispers I have no apology to make for calling out some posters when they have made baseless allegations and false statements. I challenged them to substantiate their false statements and baseless allegations and they couldn't. They are only polluting this thread. Most of them their first priority is using anything they find to have a crack, a criticism or mock at the church/workers/friends that they now despise. Dean Bruer is just a vehicle they use for that. The same goes for a couple of so called 'professing' /church member posters, who present all righteous and have a crack at me for challenging the above. They too only pollute this thread with their hypocrisy. From the way you write I think you have some friends/members of our church there who care and have compassion for you. I am happy about that! 👍 You need and deserve that! I am really pained and sorry about the awful experiences that you have had.
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Post by internationalstudies on Apr 21, 2023 20:31:40 GMT -5
Well yes I have heard that name …….. 2013: Overseer (head worker) Jerome Frandle was convicted of and sentenced for failure to report child sexual abuse of which he had knowledge in Michigan (USA) You are quite correct.
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Post by Pragmatic on Apr 21, 2023 21:08:48 GMT -5
Well yes I have heard that name …….. 2013: Overseer (head worker) Jerome Frandle was convicted of and sentenced for failure to report child sexual abuse of which he had knowledge in Michigan (USA) That really seems like a slap in the face Yes that is right, but he has no doubt learned from that experience, and his letter was well written. Counseling, apologies, restitution, love, compassion and impartiality also help with healing and comfort.
Hopefully this is the beginning or a turnaround
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Post by verna on Apr 21, 2023 21:31:18 GMT -5
Well yes I have heard that name …….. 2013: Overseer (head worker) Jerome Frandle was convicted of and sentenced for failure to report child sexual abuse of which he had knowledge in Michigan (USA) That really seems like a slap in the face Yes that is right, but he has no doubt learned from that experience, and his letter was well written. Counseling, apologies, restitution, love, compassion and impartiality also help with healing and comfort.
Hopefully this is the beginning or a turnaround
You see something about restitution in this letter? I’m not seeing it.
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Post by Pragmatic on Apr 21, 2023 21:33:07 GMT -5
Yes that is right, but he has no doubt learned from that experience, and his letter was well written. Counseling, apologies, restitution, love, compassion and impartiality also help with healing and comfort.
Hopefully this is the beginning or a turnaround
You see something about restitution in this letter? I’m not seeing it. No I didn't. I am saying that it is a necessary addition to what he said.
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Dean Bruer
Apr 21, 2023 22:08:07 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by luke2236 on Apr 21, 2023 22:08:07 GMT -5
I wonder how many Dean Bruers are created because they hide their lusts and let them grow in secret, but they look almost perfect in public.
Sure many of them would do whatever they want no matter what.
But, what if there had been programs available that would have helped the growing secret lust because the people were afraid of shame? What if the programs had helped one person avoid becoming an abuser? We won’t have that answer because meeting doesn’t have a system where people can address their lust without shame and this limits solutions that are available to help people get spiritual and physical help.
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
Posts: 662
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Post by peggysullivan on Apr 21, 2023 22:44:21 GMT -5
I wonder how many Dean Bruers are created because they hide their lusts and let them grow in secret, but they look almost perfect in public. Sure many of them would do whatever they want no matter what. But, what if there had been programs available that would have helped the growing secret lust because the people were afraid of shame? What if the programs had helped one person avoid becoming an abuser? We won’t have that answer because meeting doesn’t have a system where people can address their lust without shame and this limits solutions that are available to help people get spiritual and physical help. The requirement for a celibate ministry is a big part of the problem I think. And like you say… the shame attached to the very notion of sex…. Shh! Don’t talk about it!
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