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Post by Deleted on Aug 5, 2012 21:40:06 GMT -5
Admin Your non emotional and wise response to this issue is appreciated. I understand and accept that you will need some time to seek advice and resolve this issue. Your forum rules state: We have a commitment with ProBoards that no libelous posts will be allowed. THIS INCLUDES POSTS THAT CONTAIN NAMES OR INITIALS OF LIVING PEOPLE ABOUT WHOM CRIMINAL ALLEGATIONS ARE MADE. I am unable to understand how Clearday's post is in accordance with the stated rules? To clear any misunderstanding I state that I have never met or had any association with the person that was named in clearday's post. I have personal abhorrence of CSA and fully support the efforts of WINGS. I do not support posts of the nature that clearday made where criminal allegations are made about named persons. The principle is that a moderator of the forum feels he is not bound by the clearly stated rules of this forum. He presently feels he is entitled to make a post containing criminal allegations against a named person. As I have previously stated if this forum is going to be a vehicle for the benefit of this church group and not just a domain for those of the mindset of those like clearday then resolution of this present matter will contribute to this goal. Admin; your just and correct resolution of this issue will be greatly appreciated. It very simple (name changing person). This site prohibits libelous posts. Admin gave you a rudimentary definition of a libelous post. If you need further help to understand libel, just ask. However, Google will be able to lead you to a better understanding of it. There are no libelous posts here. It is that simple. Furthermore you continue to rag on me while Admin and Mods have reiterated what I have said on this topic. Let's focus on the important issues: care and concern for past victims, the prevention of future victims, and helping offenders get their lives straightened around. The suppression of the facts impedes all goals. |
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Post by what is not clear on Aug 6, 2012 0:06:53 GMT -5
Admin:What is unclear or ambigious about the statement on your forum?
"We have a commitment with ProBoards that no libelous posts will be allowed. This includes posts that contain names or initials of living people about whom criminal allegations are made."
Clarification and explanation for viewers and posters will be appreciated.
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Ju
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Post by Ju on Aug 6, 2012 6:08:24 GMT -5
Admin Let's focus on the important issues: care and concern for past victims, the prevention of future victims, and helping offenders get their lives straightened around. The suppression of the facts impedes all goals. Couldnt agree more! |
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Post by Midway Camper on Aug 6, 2012 6:34:42 GMT -5
To those who are willing to have a go at trying on a few different pairs of shoes:
I can think of some very good reasons, the prime one among them being not doing further harm to anyone concerned, for limiting public supposition in the case of YY. Because really, the "camps" referred to earlier are both being represented by (well meaning) assumptions.
The letter put out by YY was appropriately succinct, and in no way misleading of itself, I think. YY has indeed, I believe, already been extremely frank with the police, if that comforts anyone.
No point stirring up a dust-storm, in the face of the pre-existing cyclone.
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Ju
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Post by Ju on Aug 6, 2012 6:44:11 GMT -5
Mid way camper, good reasons for what? J
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Post by sharonw on Aug 6, 2012 8:38:22 GMT -5
Mid way camper, good reasons for what? J midway guest wrote: "very good reasons, the prime one among them being not doing further harm to anyone concerned, for limiting public supposition in the case of YY. Because really, the "camps" referred to earlier are both being represented by (well meaning) assumptions Was it hard for you to separate out the prime reasons for libel not be found in this forum? |
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Ju
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Post by Ju on Aug 7, 2012 2:26:10 GMT -5
Mid way camper, good reasons for what? J midway guest wrote: "very good reasons, the prime one among them being not doing further harm to anyone concerned, for limiting public supposition in the case of YY. Because really, the "camps" referred to earlier are both being represented by (well meaning) assumptions Was it hard for you to separate out the prime reasons for libel not be found in this forum? Thanks Sharon...for deciphering the intent of the post. I agree there is no place for libel on this post but the quote I referred to and agreed with spoke of truth. The truth has no association with libel... Libel is only applicable if allegations are false. Do you believe the truth should not be told? |
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Post by JO on Aug 7, 2012 5:16:58 GMT -5
The truth has been hidden for too long. I can't imagine the apostles covering up sexual immorality for the sake of appearances.
............................. ............................ ............................ ..............
Ephesians 5
3 But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God’s holy people.
4 Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk or coarse joking, which are out of place, but rather thanksgiving.
5 For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person—such a person is an idolater —has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things God’s wrath comes on those who are disobedient.
7 Therefore do not be partners with them.
8 For you were once darkness, but now you are light in the Lord. Live as children of light
9 (for the fruit of the light consists in all goodness, righteousness and truth)
10 and find out what pleases the Lord.
11 Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.
12 It is shameful even to mention what the disobedient do in secret.
13 But everything exposed by the light becomes visible—and everything that is illuminated becomes a light.
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Post by who are they on Aug 7, 2012 6:39:16 GMT -5
The truth has been hidden for too long. I can't imagine the apostles covering up sexual immorality for the sake of appearances. ............................. ............................ ............................ .............. Ephesians 5 7 Therefore do not be partners with them. This is the word of God. Who are these partners of worker pedophiles? Can we name and shame them here? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2012 7:04:21 GMT -5
The truth has been hidden for too long. I can't imagine the apostles covering up sexual immorality for the sake of appearances. ............................. ............................ ............................ .............. Ephesians 5 7 Therefore do not be partners with them. This is the word of God. Who are these partners of worker pedophiles? Can we name and shame them here? Anyone who covers up criminal activity is a partner to that criminal activity. Are you one of them? |
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Post by JO on Aug 7, 2012 15:14:05 GMT -5
The friends who give workers so much power share some responsibility for the consequences. Who gave a pedophile the power to excommunicate a young woman on her wedding day? It was those who obeyed his ruling as if it came from God. whyisitso, we understand how hurt you must have been, because of the high handed action by a worker. The same thing happened to a Neice of ours in Victoria. The sanction was put on her by a worker on her wedding day. The worker has since been convicted of CSA. How crazy can that be. |
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Post by rational on Aug 7, 2012 15:18:24 GMT -5
What's worse, a CSA allegation of someone at age 29 is no longer in the realm of "youthful dumb mistake", " atheist indiscretion", or any other excuse. There are no excuses, it's outright criminal if true. Is this still believed in the 21 st century? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2012 15:32:33 GMT -5
What's worse, a CSA allegation of someone at age 29 is no longer in the realm of "youthful dumb mistake", " atheist indiscretion", or any other excuse. There are no excuses, it's outright criminal if true. Is this still believed in the 21 st century? It's all about the audience. Yes, apparently one of the excuses coming out of the admissions in this case is that some events happened during an atheist period of time. It works so well because the targeted audience thinks atheists are all one-eyed green monsters but wear masks and only look like the rest of us. |
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Post by snow on Aug 7, 2012 20:12:56 GMT -5
Is this still believed in the 21 st century? It's all about the audience. Yes, apparently one of the excuses coming out of the admissions in this case is that some events happened during an atheist period of time. It works so well because the targeted audience thinks atheists are all one-eyed green monsters but wear masks and only look like the rest of us. Oh, and here I thought that was the description of the Illuminati! Sorry... It's just so ridiculus that people still see atheists in that way. I understand you don't CD, just saying. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2012 1:20:06 GMT -5
Jo, I do agree with you that the friends do allow workers to have too much power.However we also know that anybody who stands up to a worker would also cop the chop. Obviously the rules re excommunication should be administered by a committee, and not left to the whims of an individual worker.
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Post by JO on Aug 8, 2012 1:56:29 GMT -5
Jo, I do agree with you that the friends do allow workers to have too much power.However we also know that anybody who stands up to a worker would also cop the chop. Obviously the rules re excommunication should be administered by a committee, and not left to the whims of an individual worker. Workers can't excommunicate people. All they can do is ask the friends to excommunicate them. The only power they have over the friends is what the friends give them. |
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Post by liberated on Aug 8, 2012 18:42:24 GMT -5
Jo, I do agree with you that the friends do allow workers to have too much power.However we also know that anybody who stands up to a worker would also cop the chop. Obviously the rules re excommunication should be administered by a committee, and not left to the whims of an individual worker. Workers can't excommunicate people. All they can do is ask the friends to excommunicate them. The only power they have over the friends is what the friends give them. Hi JO - is this a call for power to the people against people in power? Many are so afraid of excommunication that they will not stand for truth therefore evil prevails. |
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Post by sharonw on Aug 8, 2012 20:07:21 GMT -5
midway guest wrote: "very good reasons, the prime one among them being not doing further harm to anyone concerned, for limiting public supposition in the case of YY. Because really, the "camps" referred to earlier are both being represented by (well meaning) assumptions Was it hard for you to separate out the prime reasons for libel not be found in this forum? Thanks Sharon...for deciphering the intent of the post. I agree there is no place for libel on this post but the quote I referred to and agreed with spoke of truth. The truth has no association with libel... Libel is only applicable if allegations are false. Do you believe the truth should not be told? Painfully so! Truth does hurt, but those it hurts are not the victims of the lie, libel but are victims of the reason behind the reason for the need for truth. |
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Post by guest sauerkraut on Aug 8, 2012 23:16:09 GMT -5
hi TS, sent you a p.m. on the wings site,as i am registered there
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Post by JO on Aug 9, 2012 5:32:32 GMT -5
Workers can't excommunicate people. All they can do is ask the friends to excommunicate them. The only power they have over the friends is what the friends give them. Hi JO - is this a call for power to the people against people in power? Many are so afraid of excommunication that they will not stand for truth therefore evil prevails. It seems silly to support a pedaphile in his decree to excommunicate a girl on her wedding day. He could only achieve that with the support of the friends in the area. A worker can choose to shun someone if he wants to, but he can't force the friends to as well. It's dysfunctional that folks fear excommunication to the extent that evil remains unchallenged. Christ died to enable us to serve God without fear. ............................ ............................... ............................. ............. Luke 1:69 He has raised up a horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David 70 (as he said through his holy prophets of long ago), 71 salvation from our enemies and from the hand of all who hate us— 72 to show mercy to our ancestors and to remember his holy covenant, 73 the oath he swore to our father Abraham: 74 to rescue us from the hand of our enemies, and to enable us to serve him without fear 75 in holiness and righteousness before him all our days. |
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Post by emmarr75 on Aug 9, 2012 6:15:34 GMT -5
Amen JO
That's an awesome (in the most Holy sense) section of scripture - thanks for posting it
emmarr75
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Post by sharonw on Aug 9, 2012 9:09:03 GMT -5
This is the word of God. Who are these partners of worker pedophiles? Can we name and shame them here? Anyone who covers up criminal activity is a partner to that criminal activity. Are you one of them? Accessories after the fact! Actually! Isn't there a bible verse that says if we give a blessing to someone who is doing what we feel is not according to the bible and Hoyle, that that is agreeing with that action? |
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Post by sharonw on Aug 9, 2012 9:12:19 GMT -5
Jo, I do agree with you that the friends do allow workers to have too much power.However we also know that anybody who stands up to a worker would also cop the chop. Obviously the rules re excommunication should be administered by a committee, and not left to the whims of an individual worker. All they can do is ask the friends to excommunicate them. The only power they have over the friends is what the friends give them. JO, I think you're mistaken about the workers not being able to excommunicate people, for even in the Alberta tapes it WAS the workers who were excommunicating people. |
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Post by sharonw on Aug 9, 2012 9:20:19 GMT -5
Hi JO - is this a call for power to the people against people in power? Many are so afraid of excommunication that they will not stand for truth therefore evil prevails. It seems silly to support a pedaphile in his decree to excommunicate a girl on her wedding day. He could only achieve that with the support of the friends in the area. A worker can choose to shun someone if he wants to, but he can't force the friends to as well. It's dysfunctional that folks fear excommunication to the extent that evil remains unchallenged. Christ died to enable us to serve God without fear. ............................ ............................... ............................. ............. Luke 1:69 He has raised up a horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David 70 (as he said through his holy prophets of long ago), 71 salvation from our enemies and from the hand of all who hate us— 72 to show mercy to our ancestors and to remember his holy covenant, 73 the oath he swore to our father Abraham: 74 to rescue us from the hand of our enemies, and to enable us to serve him without fear 75 in holiness and righteousness before him all our days. Yes, JO, God does enable us to worship Him without fear. But is that going to be totally possible for the friends simply because they've put the workers before themselves in the proper placement as God? The only true way has wounded too many hearts so that the intellectual side of them are afraid to set aside all of that in order to worship God in spirit and in truth, for invariably the workers get in between them and God. IMO |
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Post by bfvernon on Aug 9, 2012 10:41:10 GMT -5
That's why it's a cult. Members give their personal power to a PERCEIVED higher authority. Ask people who have been excommunicated - they'll tell you that their families and the elders of their churches were too afraid to accept them as not excommunicated. That's why it's a cult. Covering up indiscretions is also aa attributes of a cult. If anything can't stand up to scrutiny it has flaws in it's foundations. The foundations of the 2x2s .......
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Post by snow on Aug 9, 2012 12:59:31 GMT -5
That's why it's a cult. Members give their personal power to a PERCEIVED higher authority. Ask people who have been excommunicated - they'll tell you that their families and the elders of their churches were too afraid to accept them as not excommunicated. That's why it's a cult. Covering up indiscretions is also aa attributes of a cult. If anything can't stand up to scrutiny it has flaws in it's foundations. The foundations of the 2x2s ....... My question is this. Why would anyone want to be part of an organization anyway after finding out there was such a thing as excommunication? I would be leaving so fast if someone told me to not have anything to do with my friends and family. It's so totally manipulative and I feel so bad for those left inside and have to make that kind of decision.  |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2012 14:48:45 GMT -5
That's why it's a cult. Members give their personal power to a PERCEIVED higher authority. Ask people who have been excommunicated - they'll tell you that their families and the elders of their churches were too afraid to accept them as not excommunicated. That's why it's a cult. Covering up indiscretions is also aa attributes of a cult. If anything can't stand up to scrutiny it has flaws in it's foundations. The foundations of the 2x2s ....... My question is this. Why would anyone want to be part of an organization anyway after finding out there was such a thing as excommunication? I would be leaving so fast if someone told me to not have anything to do with my friends and family. It's so totally manipulative and I feel so bad for those left inside and have to make that kind of decision. Every organization has procedures in place to remove members. I suppose in some sense, every organization is a cult, although most are benign. So from that point of view, 2x2 excommunication is ordinary practice. Where 2x2 excommunication gets really ugly is when you combine it with the idea that if you are sent outside the group, you are headed for a painful and eternal hell. That's nasty stuff. |
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Post by bfvernon on Aug 9, 2012 16:28:10 GMT -5
Yeah - don't need you to tell me that - praise the Lord, I've seen through that one. Not without a lot of sorrow, but it's great on the other side! I don't even feel sorry for the people in there, they've all seen enough in this day and age to be able to make some informed decisions. There aren't many illiterate white middle class people anymore and that's the 2x2 view of Christ and the world ....
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