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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2020 3:45:39 GMT -5
Islamic doctrine says you will go to hell for not praying toward Mecca five times a day. Can you please explain why you believe that will not be the case. i'm not sure you are right on this do you have the sura that says praying towards mecca is a requirement for salvation? all i can remember is that praying towards mecca VALIDATES the prayer....
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2020 4:54:05 GMT -5
The more you learn about religion, the more confused your mind gets. There are just so many versions of it, each one trying to convince you that they have the right one. And only based on theories that have entered into the human mind, nothing factual. Give me Science any day, much more straight forward and credible.
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Post by benar on Jan 8, 2020 6:26:55 GMT -5
Islamic doctrine says you will go to hell for not praying toward Mecca five times a day. Can you please explain why you believe that will not be the case. i'm not sure you are right on this do you have the sura that says praying towards mecca is a requirement for salvation? all i can remember is that praying towards mecca VALIDATES the prayer.... I'm not sure either, Wally. But it's a technicality really - the core message is both religions say you'll go to hell for following the other religion and we know both can't be right at the same time. So either Christianity is correct and Christians are going to Islamic hell or the reverse... Then there's a third option of course - that neither are correct.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 8, 2020 10:55:59 GMT -5
Alternated elder is an elder if the elder NOT there to take the meeting! Yes, That is scary, reborn. He was NOT that bad 2x2, reborn. I knew him when he was supposedly a good 2x2. Is there such a thing as a "good" 2x2? There are quite a few good 2x2s.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 8, 2020 10:58:25 GMT -5
The more you learn about religion, the more confused your mind gets. There are just so many versions of it, each one trying to convince you that they have the right one. And only based on theories that have entered into the human mind, nothing factual. Give me Science any day, much more straight forward and credible. It’s making it a religion that creates the confusion.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 8, 2020 11:00:52 GMT -5
Read it again. He clearly did NOT say you were going to hell. I read it and I know what he said. He actually clarified himself in a later post. If I said I was a Christian his idea says Im going to Islamic hell. If I said Im Islamic then his idea says I’m going to Christian hell. Thus I said I’m not going to hell. Period.
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Post by nathan on Jan 8, 2020 11:21:08 GMT -5
i'm not sure you are right on this do you have the sura that says praying towards mecca is a requirement for salvation? all i can remember is that praying towards mecca VALIDATES the prayer.... I'm not sure either, Wally. But it's a technicality really - the core message is both religions say you'll go to hell for following the other religion and we know both can't be right at the same time. So either Christianity is correct and Christians are going to Islamic hell or the reverse... Then there's a third option of course - that neither are correct. ** Christ/God Jesus made it very plainly and clearly, I am the way, the truth and life NO man comes to God the Father but through me! Take heed and believe in Christ' s words because He is the ONLY God/Man can save your soul from the Second Eternal death.
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Post by snow on Jan 8, 2020 12:11:38 GMT -5
We do use wise judgement all the time. We just don't believe so what else could he be referring to other than being stupid for not believing in his god? I make wise judgement calls in my life all the time and I don't believe in your god. And, sometimes I don't make wise judgement calls. That's life and it seems that Christians are just as prone to both wise judgement and non wise judgement as much as atheists. It was about how hard dying is, not believing. Benar had said or the way he said it was he didn’t fear death. And I said if he knew how hard dying was he’d change his mind. I was talking in the literal and that’s what Jetmech was referring to. To say one doesn’t fear death is really not thinking wisely even literally. Only those who have sudden quick deaths might go that way but even some of sudden deaths face great fear and it’s the shock of one’s demise that kills them. I had a girl friend who I’d grown up with. She got married and she and her husband moved about 75 north of where her mother lived and they’d come back home on some weekends to see family. So one Sunday afternoon they were headed back north and it had been raining pretty hard. There is a place in that old highway that when heavy rains hit there is an oil slick that appears on top of that highway. It was an accident waiting to happen. We had many of those victims from that area when I worked with the neurosurgeon. But back to the girl and her husband. They saw the car coming at them from opposite direction spin in that oil slick and they knew they were going to be hit. The girl told her husband, “Clyde, I’m scared to death.” Those were the last words she said. She didn’t have deadly injuries like Clyde did, but she died in collision from the fear. So the autopsy doctors said. No physical reason found. There is a difference between being afraid of dying (the process) and death. I think everyone is not looking forward to the process of dying. But like Benar, I do not fear death itself. I have no reason to worry about it because I believe it's the end and that's fine with me.
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Post by snow on Jan 8, 2020 12:12:41 GMT -5
We've gotten totally away from the original point though. You said the man offering the lifeboat was extortion. I asked how that could be since he wasn't the reason the ship was sinking in the first place and all he was doing was offering a solution. Unlike when God makes the ship sink, gives you Jesus to offer you the lifeboat, and making it the only way to be saved. See the difference? If God hadn't made the ship sink in the first place then the offer of a lifeboat wouldn't be required. i think you meant to say salvation...i never said it was extortion...and as i showed benar its satan thats sinking the ship not God... Your God is everything so why would Satan be the sinking ship?
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Post by snow on Jan 8, 2020 12:25:25 GMT -5
I'm not sure either, Wally. But it's a technicality really - the core message is both religions say you'll go to hell for following the other religion and we know both can't be right at the same time. So either Christianity is correct and Christians are going to Islamic hell or the reverse... Then there's a third option of course - that neither are correct. ** Christ/God Jesus made it very plainly and clearly, I am the way, the truth and life NO man comes to God the Father but through me! Take heed and believe in Christ' s words because He is the ONLY God/Man can save your soul from the Second Eternal death. Trouble is we have absolutely zero proof that Jesus was anything other than a zealous man. What he said does not equate with reality as it's observed.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 8, 2020 13:41:14 GMT -5
i think you meant to say salvation...i never said it was extortion...and as i showed benar its satan thats sinking the ship not God... Your God is everything so why would Satan be the sinking ship? Jesus said that Satan is the “prince of this world and that I have nothing in him.”
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 8, 2020 13:43:13 GMT -5
** Christ/God Jesus made it very plainly and clearly, I am the way, the truth and life NO man comes to God the Father but through me! Take heed and believe in Christ' s words because He is the ONLY God/Man can save your soul from the Second Eternal death. Trouble is we have absolutely zero proof that Jesus was anything other than a zealous man. What he said does not equate with reality as it's observed. I have had proof he’s more then man but no one deigns to believe me nor the Bible. It’s like Abraham told the rich man that even though someone from the dead appeared and told you, you still wouldn’t believe.
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Post by snow on Jan 8, 2020 14:49:06 GMT -5
Trouble is we have absolutely zero proof that Jesus was anything other than a zealous man. What he said does not equate with reality as it's observed. I have had proof he’s more then man but no one deigns to believe me nor the Bible. It’s like Abraham told the rich man that even though someone from the dead appeared and told you, you still wouldn’t believe. If I said Allah appeared to me would you believe me? Of course we're skeptical. I do believe that you are telling the truth as you saw it. I just don't believe your interpretation of what you saw is one I can accept. But I believe you are being honest and that you do believe that what you say you saw is the truth for you.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2020 17:31:44 GMT -5
i think you meant to say salvation...i never said it was extortion...and as i showed benar its satan thats sinking the ship not God... Your God is everything so why would Satan be the sinking ship? satan likes and has the power to mess things up....
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 8, 2020 18:08:12 GMT -5
I have had proof he’s more then man but no one deigns to believe me nor the Bible. It’s like Abraham told the rich man that even though someone from the dead appeared and told you, you still wouldn’t believe. If I said Allah appeared to me would you believe me? Of course we're skeptical. I do believe that you are telling the truth as you saw it. I just don't believe your interpretation of what you saw is one I can accept. But I believe you are being honest and that you do believe that what you say you saw is the truth for you. If you said Allah appeared to you, I’d likely get excited and want to know what he looked like. Though if Allah is the same as my God, you shouldn’t be alive after seeing him. That’s what some have said to me, that If I saw Jesus I wouldnt have lived. But the point is it was Jesus, the SON OF GOD that I saw and not the Father. Jesus has appeared to some throughout the ages, and they lived to tell the story. And I think that’s why they lived.
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Post by joanna on Jan 8, 2020 19:56:48 GMT -5
sharingtheriches . You experienced a delusion STR and one in which you have chosen to uphold as a source of validation for your belief. There are very good reasons why we should not shy away from identifying behaviours and that starts with simple definitions: Definition of Delusion 1 a: something that is falsely or delusively believed or propagated
b: psychology : a persistent false psychotic belief regarding the self or persons or objects outside the self that is maintained despite indisputable evidence to the contrary
also : the abnormal state marked by such beliefs
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Post by BobWilliston on Jan 8, 2020 20:29:19 GMT -5
Read it again. He clearly did NOT say you were going to hell. I read it and I know what he said. He actually clarified himself in a later post. If I said I was a Christian his idea says Im going to Islamic hell. If I said Im Islamic then his idea says I’m going to Christian hell. Thus I said I’m not going to hell. Period. You missed the important word "if".
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Post by nathan on Jan 8, 2020 20:42:34 GMT -5
** Christ/God Jesus made it very plainly and clearly, I am the way, the truth and life NO man comes to God the Father but through me! Take heed and believe in Christ' s words because He is the ONLY God/Man can save your soul from the Second Eternal death. Trouble is we have absolutely zero proof that Jesus was anything other than a zealous man. What he said does not equate with reality as it's observed. You MUST trust in Jesus words, teachings... HE is your Creator and Your ONLY Hope of Salvation. You either bow now and receive Eternal life or Bow later by force and face the Second death yourself.
Philippians 2:5-12 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jan 8, 2020 21:14:36 GMT -5
Trouble is we have absolutely zero proof that Jesus was anything other than a zealous man. What he said does not equate with reality as it's observed. You MUST trust in Jesus words, teachings... HE is your Creator and Your ONLY Hope of Salvation. You either bow now and receive Eternal life or Bow later by force and face the Second death yourself.
Philippians 2:5-12 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.Why must we believe your myth?
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 8, 2020 21:35:13 GMT -5
sharingtheriches . You experienced a delusion STR and one in which you have chosen to uphold as a source of validation for your belief. There are very good reasons why we should not shy away from identifying behaviours and that starts with simple definitions: Definition of Delusion 1 a: something that is falsely or delusively believed or propagated
b: psychology : a persistent false psychotic belief regarding the self or persons or objects outside the self that is maintained despite indisputable evidence to the contrary
also : the abnormal state marked by such beliefs One doesn’t come out of a delusion with what I felt then or what has come from that visit. I know what you all think but you’re all as far from right on you ASSumptions as you can be!
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 8, 2020 21:38:02 GMT -5
I read it and I know what he said. He actually clarified himself in a later post. If I said I was a Christian his idea says Im going to Islamic hell. If I said Im Islamic then his idea says I’m going to Christian hell. Thus I said I’m not going to hell. Period. You missed the important word "if". I’m not going to hell. No “if” to it! I know in whom I believe!
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Post by dmmichgood on Jan 8, 2020 21:42:57 GMT -5
The more you learn about religion, the more confused your mind gets. There are just so many versions of it, each one trying to convince you that they have the right one. And only based on theories that have entered into the human mind, nothing factual. Give me Science any day, much more straight forward and credible. It’s making it a religion that creates the confusion. The only people trying to make science a religion are those same religious people who don't want any competition.
They refuse to admit that their own religious views can't stand up to science, -basically because of the method that science uses to obtain information that is reliable while their own religious views are only based on age old speculations.
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Post by nathan on Jan 8, 2020 21:58:25 GMT -5
You MUST trust in Jesus words, teachings... HE is your Creator and Your ONLY Hope of Salvation. You either bow now and receive Eternal life or Bow later by force and face the Second death yourself.
Philippians 2:5-12 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. Why must we believe your myth? You say Jesus Christ/God Savior my myth but HE is the ONLY God/Man on earth and in Heaven CAN save your soul from BURNING in the Lake of Fire/die the Second death for Eternity.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jan 8, 2020 22:09:49 GMT -5
sharingtheriches . You experienced a delusion STR and one in which you have chosen to uphold as a source of validation for your belief. There are very good reasons why we should not shy away from identifying behaviours and that starts with simple definitions: Definition of Delusion 1 a: something that is falsely or delusively believed or propagated
b: psychology : a persistent false psychotic belief regarding the self or persons or objects outside the self that is maintained despite indisputable evidence to the contrary
also : the abnormal state marked by such beliefs One doesn’t come out of a delusion with what I felt then or what has come from that visit. I know what you all think but you’re all as far from right on you ASSumptions as you can be! STR, -both you & and I are nurses. We both know how our brain works and how it affects all of our senses. We are learning more each day how it affects what we believe.
I have told of my own experience where the CT scan indicated my "brain" wasn't functioning correctly and that was the cause of "hallucinations" that I was having.
Without that scan, -which was not available years ago, -and I had been as religious as I was once, -I might well have believed that I was being told something by GOD!
The "bouquets of flowers" in the ambulance and the "pen without a hand writing back & forth on a tablet!" WOW! What more could you want?
But STR, - if you are content to believe what you do, -so be it. Peace be on you.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jan 8, 2020 22:11:04 GMT -5
Why must we believe your myth? You say Jesus Christ/God Savior my myth but HE is the ONLY God/Man on earth and in Heaven CAN save your soul from BURNING in the Lake of Fire/die the Second death for Eternity.
NOPE. WRONG AGAIN NATHAN...... NO CHRIST, NO HEAVEN. NO ETERNITY. NO HELL. Your beliefs are based on the vain imaginations of a people who want to live forever. When you die you are dead. And going to rot away just like I will.
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Post by nathan on Jan 8, 2020 22:31:54 GMT -5
You say Jesus Christ/God Savior my myth but HE is the ONLY God/Man on earth and in Heaven CAN save your soul from BURNING in the Lake of Fire/die the Second death for Eternity.
NOPE. WRONG AGAIN NATHAN...... NO CHRIST, NO HEAVEN. NO ETERNITY. NO HELL. Your beliefs are based on the vain imaginations of a people who want to live forever. When you die you are dead. And going to rot away just like I will. Well, After death you will find out the TRUTH, your body goes back to the dust but your soul lives on in HADES! waiting there for a long, long time before you stand before God and Christ to be sentenced and cast in the LAKE of fire for eternity.
Remember, don't say nobody has warned you about the miserable, regrets of what could have enjoyed for Eternity instead living in a HELL hole place in Hades/realm of the dead! until the judgement day you must face God and Christ face to face to be sentenced where you will spend the rest of your life for eternity.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 8, 2020 22:39:11 GMT -5
One doesn’t come out of a delusion with what I felt then or what has come from that visit. I know what you all think but you’re all as far from right on you ASSumptions as you can be! STR, -both you & and I are nurses. We both know how our brain works and how it affects all of our senses. We are learning more each day how it affects what we believe.
I have told of my own experience where the CT scan indicated my "brain" wasn't functioning correctly and that was the cause of "hallucinations" that I was having.
Without that scan, -which was not available years ago, -and I had been as religious as I was once, -I might well have believed that I was being told something by GOD!
The "bouquets of flowers" in the ambulance and the "pen without a hand writing back & forth on a tablet!" WOW! What more could you want?
But STR, - if you are content to believe what you do, -so be it. Peace be on you.
I’ve had drug caused hallucinations but when I saw Jesus no such case was hallucinations. I know you’ve all tried your best to convince the world I was delusional and/or hallucinating, but it doesn’t fit.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 8, 2020 22:40:48 GMT -5
NOPE. WRONG AGAIN NATHAN...... NO CHRIST, NO HEAVEN. NO ETERNITY. NO HELL. Your beliefs are based on the vain imaginations of a people who want to live forever. When you die you are dead. And going to rot away just like I will. Well, After death you will find out the TRUTH, your body goes back to the dust but your soul lives on in HADES! waiting there for a long, long time before you stand before God and Christ to be sentenced and cast in the LAKE of fire for eternity.
Remember, don't say nobody has warned you about the miserable, regrets of what could have enjoyed for Eternity instead living in a HELL hole place in Hades/realm of the dead! until the judgement day you must face God and Christ face to face to be sentenced where you will spend the rest of your life for eternity.
And from what the prophets and seers are saying that day is faster approaching.
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