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Post by dmmichgood on Oct 12, 2019 17:49:12 GMT -5
** You folks haven't heard about U.S. Secret Space program? There are TWO U.S. Space Programs. 1) NASA that the public read and know about. 2)the Secret Space pprogram most Americans have never heard of it until the whistle blowers tell us about it. Google: Type U.S. Secret Space missions and listen to the men testmonies, who had gone on these missions in outer space for 20 yrs. I posted on TMB in the past. Thanks Nathan, -but I'll pass.
I do like science fiction & science fantasy but I don't like to mix them up with reality and thus fool myself as well as other people.
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Post by nathan on Oct 12, 2019 18:04:33 GMT -5
** You folks haven't heard about U.S. Secret Space program? There are TWO U.S. Space Programs. 1) NASA that the public read and know about. 2)the Secret Space pprogram most Americans have never heard of it until the whistle blowers tell us about it. Google: Type U.S. Secret Space missions and listen to the men testmonies, who had gone on these missions in outer space for 20 yrs. I posted on TMB in the past. I’ve read all about that but the site I posted is from the austrnauts ** The testimonies I posted in the past were astronauts in the Secret Space Programs. What you have posted is NASA program that most Americans know and read about.
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Post by nathan on Oct 12, 2019 18:07:52 GMT -5
** You folks haven't heard about U.S. Secret Space program? There are TWO U.S. Space Programs. 1) NASA that the public read and know about. 2)the Secret Space pprogram most Americans have never heard of it until the whistle blowers tell us about it. Google: Type U.S. Secret Space missions and listen to the men testmonies, who had gone on these missions in outer space for 20 yrs. I posted on TMB in the past. Thanks Nathan, -but I'll pass.
I do like science fiction & science fantasy but I don't like to mix them up with reality and thus fool myself as well as other people. ** Don't worry I am not to waste my time and energy with doubting Thomas and unbelievers on this matter. Do your own investigation because I have done mine own home work already.
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 12, 2019 19:17:19 GMT -5
I’ve read all about that but the site I posted is from the austrnauts ** The testimonies I posted in the past were astronauts in the Secret Space Programs. What you have posted is NASA program that most Americans know and read about. You mean the Nut House is now leaking too?
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Post by nathan on Oct 12, 2019 19:19:26 GMT -5
** The testimonies I posted in the past were astronauts in the Secret Space Programs. What you have posted is NASA program that most Americans know and read about. You mean the Nut House is now leaking too? hahaha... It's the nutters who don't believe it. Still living in Dark Ages and in the caves, who refused to go outside of the caves, afraid to see things that they haven't seen.
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 12, 2019 19:23:40 GMT -5
You mean the Nut House is now leaking too? hahaha... It's the nutters who don't believe it. Still living in Dark Ages and in the caves, who refused to go outside of the caves, afraid to see things that they haven't seen.You're adorable in a futuristic kind of way.
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Post by joanna on Oct 12, 2019 20:52:28 GMT -5
BobWilliston . I wonder if Nathan's wild imaginings have caused any believers to experience an epiphany that resulted in them dismissing their own equally zany supernatural and unevidenced beliefs. If only believers could appreciate that Nathan is a 'god'send if they were willing to take a reality check.
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Post by nathan on Oct 12, 2019 21:09:52 GMT -5
BobWilliston . I wonder if Nathan's wild imaginings have caused any believers to experience an epiphany that resulted in them dismissing their own equally zany supernatural and unevidenced beliefs. If only believers could appreciate that Nathan is a 'god'send if they were willing to take a reality check. Time will prove that many of the things I have shared on TMB are TRUE and it will come to pass. God is preparing us for the NEXT/futuristic book of Revelation chapters 19-12 was foretold by God to John the apostle 2000 yrs to begin perhaps in our 21st century/generation.
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Post by joanna on Oct 12, 2019 21:33:52 GMT -5
rossbowden to mountain
joanna to rossbowden x 2
No response yet again.
Maybe failing to answer is considered a superior reaction to deflecting questions?
rossbowden
Jesus only exists in the minds of believers.
Divinity is defined as "the state of being a god".
Christians will claim that Jesus is god but that is all they can do. There is no reality associated with this claim.
Think about it:
rossbowden and others have written more words about the divinity of Jesus than the authors of the first three gospels and in doing so, these modern day Christians claim to have more knowledge than Matthew, Mark and Luke who were writing within decades of Jesus' existence.
This is truly incredible given the bible is their salient reference.
Christians regard the bible as a guide and as an informative and reliable text.
The calibre of textbooks is extremely important and strict criteria is applied to ensure students are provided with peer-reviewed, reliable and consistent information- information that is continually reviewed and revised to ensure it conforms to the latest research.
Yet Christians esteem the bible as a reliable text, despite it being impossible to honestly deny that the bible is a flawed, inconsistent, anachronistic, unscientific, misleading set of books.
So many Christians (not all) use coping mechanisms such as being defensive/ indulging in ad hominem and / or avoiding answering the questions. At least this makes some sense.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Oct 13, 2019 0:21:51 GMT -5
rossbowden to mountain joanna to rossbowden x 2 No response yet again. Maybe failing to answer is considered a superior reaction to deflecting questions? rossbowden Jesus only exists in the minds of believers. Divinity is defined as "the state of being a god". Christians will claim that Jesus is god but that is all they can do. There is no reality associated with this claim. Think about it: rossbowden and others have written more words about the divinity of Jesus than the authors of the first three gospels and in doing so, these modern day Christians claim to have more knowledge than Matthew, Mark and Luke who were writing within decades of Jesus' existence.This is truly incredible given the bible is their salient reference. Christians regard the bible as a guide and as an informative and reliable text. The calibre of textbooks is extremely important and strict criteria is applied to ensure students are provided with peer-reviewed, reliable and consistent information- information that is continually reviewed and revised to ensure it conforms to the latest research. Yet Christians esteem the bible as a reliable text, despite it being impossible to honestly deny that the bible is a flawed, inconsistent, anachronistic, unscientific, misleading set of books. So many Christians (not all) use coping mechanisms such as being defensive/ indulging in ad hominem and / or avoiding answering the questions. At least this makes some sense. I doubt seriously that whatever answer Ross would give us going to change your tune in negatively attacking anyone that believes in God! That may be the reason he doesn’t bother.
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Post by joanna on Oct 13, 2019 1:41:06 GMT -5
sharingtheriches . Discussions or debates are important STR. You seem to be negating this. It is not about me nor is it about ross bowden. The focus should be on the content and whether the claims made by any of us are believable and supported by evidence. Intellectually honest discussion/debate relies on answering questions and providing informative explanations. Questions are welcomed when claims emanate from fact. I have educated and it was exciting to present new material, engage students and respond to their questions. If i did not have the answers, then we would source them together. I would never present facts which could not be supported. If we do not know the answer - then ignoring the question may be due to not wanting to admit we are wrong or having a poor understanding of the concept. If we answer with a non-answer, this also weakens our stance and reveals a lack of credibility. It is interesting that you refer to my questions as "negatively attacking anyone that believes in God". If my questions and responses are perceived as 'negative attacks', this says more about the belief and its' inability to withstand rational inquiry. Experts in their fields welcome questions as these provide an opportunity to educate and inform. I am genuinely interested in the mindset of those who believe in the bible and supernatural concepts such as "divinity". Having once been a member of a belief which Did promote the belief that Jesus was divine, and knowing the processes required to conform to that belief, i am motivated to question when ross and others make the same claims that the 2x2 workers did. The irony is that my leaving the 2x2's resulted from the same attitude and unanswered questions that Ross et al manifest on this forum. Had the 2x2 workers preached a rational belief which explained and evidenced the biblical accounts of Jesus' resurrection and 'divinity', i would still be in that group. The inability to honestly explain claims contained in the following quote is exactly why such beliefs are entirely dependent and supported by "Faith". Anyone who is prepared to make any assertion should be enthusiastic about backing up that assertion. A failure to do so undermines the validity of that assertion.
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Post by intelchips on Oct 13, 2019 8:11:29 GMT -5
BobWilliston . I wonder if Nathan's wild imaginings have caused any believers to experience an epiphany that resulted in them dismissing their own equally zany supernatural and unevidenced beliefs. If only believers could appreciate that Nathan is a 'god'send if they were willing to take a reality check. Joanna, speaking of epiphanies I have been thinking on the Boltzmann Brain problem. If as the Boltzmann Brain problem implies vacuum energy isn't eternal what then of Gods eternity? If equilibrium lasts forever then what?
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Post by sharingtheriches on Oct 13, 2019 12:53:34 GMT -5
sharingtheriches . Discussions or debates are important STR. You seem to be negating this. It is not about me nor is it about ross bowden. The focus should be on the content and whether the claims made by any of us are believable and supported by evidence. Intellectually honest discussion/debate relies on answering questions and providing informative explanations. Questions are welcomed when claims emanate from fact. I have educated and it was exciting to present new material, engage students and respond to their questions. If i did not have the answers, then we would source them together. I would never present facts which could not be supported. If we do not know the answer - then ignoring the question may be due to not wanting to admit we are wrong or having a poor understanding of the concept. If we answer with a non-answer, this also weakens our stance and reveals a lack of credibility. It is interesting that you refer to my questions as "negatively attacking anyone that believes in God". If my questions and responses are perceived as 'negative attacks', this says more about the belief and its' inability to withstand rational inquiry. Experts in their fields welcome questions as these provide an opportunity to educate and inform. I am genuinely interested in the mindset of those who believe in the bible and supernatural concepts such as "divinity". Having once been a member of a belief which Did promote the belief that Jesus was divine, and knowing the processes required to conform to that belief, i am motivated to question when ross and others make the same claims that the 2x2 workers did. The irony is that my leaving the 2x2's resulted from the same attitude and unanswered questions that Ross et al manifest on this forum. Had the 2x2 workers preached a rational belief which explained and evidenced the biblical accounts of Jesus' resurrection and 'divinity', i would still be in that group. The inability to honestly explain claims contained in the following quote is exactly why such beliefs are entirely dependent and supported by "Faith". Anyone who is prepared to make any assertion should be enthusiastic about backing up that assertion. A failure to do so undermines the validity of that assertion. The workers do say Jesus is “divine”, but have no idea when he became “divine”. Nor do they understand that saying Jesus is “Divine” means he is of Deity. They think it only means heavenly. And it’s that some do declare that Jesus became divine after his resurrection. Some do falter at John 1:1 where it says the Word was God and it was in the beginning. Most cannot put that into that was God’s only begotten Son who is the WORD, nor do they catch that that is the Word was God. Just like Mountain he beliefs thT the Father had sex with Mary and that’s when he begot his only begotten Son. He does not believe the Son was before the beginning of the world. Even though prophecies says “unto us a Son is given) meaning that Son was already begotten before he was given to us. Mountain doesn’t seem to understand “incarnate” principles. So if you think we have all been saying exactly what the workers said in your presence, you didn’t understand their backbreaking effort to get around the fact that the Bible clearing shows Jesus is God the Son,, and really what they themselves refuse to believe. Plus you don’t understand what we’ve been saying all along. This is why belief in God seems to be so foolish to you and that’s because you just don’t understand. And You will never likely understand as long as you see such as foolish and fairytailish.
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Post by mountain on Oct 13, 2019 13:12:24 GMT -5
sharingtheriches . Discussions or debates are important STR. You seem to be negating this. It is not about me nor is it about ross bowden. The focus should be on the content and whether the claims made by any of us are believable and supported by evidence. Intellectually honest discussion/debate relies on answering questions and providing informative explanations. Questions are welcomed when claims emanate from fact. I have educated and it was exciting to present new material, engage students and respond to their questions. If i did not have the answers, then we would source them together. I would never present facts which could not be supported. If we do not know the answer - then ignoring the question may be due to not wanting to admit we are wrong or having a poor understanding of the concept. If we answer with a non-answer, this also weakens our stance and reveals a lack of credibility. It is interesting that you refer to my questions as "negatively attacking anyone that believes in God". If my questions and responses are perceived as 'negative attacks', this says more about the belief and its' inability to withstand rational inquiry. Experts in their fields welcome questions as these provide an opportunity to educate and inform. I am genuinely interested in the mindset of those who believe in the bible and supernatural concepts such as "divinity". Having once been a member of a belief which Did promote the belief that Jesus was divine, and knowing the processes required to conform to that belief, i am motivated to question when ross and others make the same claims that the 2x2 workers did. The irony is that my leaving the 2x2's resulted from the same attitude and unanswered questions that Ross et al manifest on this forum. Had the 2x2 workers preached a rational belief which explained and evidenced the biblical accounts of Jesus' resurrection and 'divinity', i would still be in that group. The inability to honestly explain claims contained in the following quote is exactly why such beliefs are entirely dependent and supported by "Faith". Anyone who is prepared to make any assertion should be enthusiastic about backing up that assertion. A failure to do so undermines the validity of that assertion. The workers do say Jesus is “divine”, but have no idea when he became “divine”. Nor do they understand that saying Jesus is “Divine” means he is of Deity. They think it only means heavenly. And it’s that some do declare that Jesus became divine after his resurrection. Some do falter at John 1:1 where it says the Word was God and it was in the beginning. Most cannot put that into that was God’s only begotten Son who is the WORD, nor do they catch that that is the Word was God. Just like Mountain he beliefs thT the Father had sex with Mary and that’s when he begot his only begotten Son. He does not believe the Son was before the beginning of the world. Even though prophecies says “unto us a Son is given) meaning that Son was already begotten before he was given to us. Mountain doesn’t seem to understand “incarnate” principles. So if you think we have all been saying exactly what the workers said in your presence, you didn’t understand their backbreaking effort to get around the fact that the Bible clearing shows Jesus is God the Son,, and really what they themselves refuse to believe. Plus you don’t understand what we’ve been saying all along. This is why belief in God seems to be so foolish to you and that’s because you just don’t understand. And You will never likely understand as long as you see such as foolish and fairytailish. Madam Belt Buckle. Please correct your post. I have NEVER said that the Father had sex with Mary. Your claim that I have is an outright lie, which if you have any honesty in you, you will correct! The term 'incarnate' is never used by God, Jesus or any of the scriptural writers. It is not found in the Bible, so why rely on it! It is a figment of man's imagination. It comes from a pagan mindset and is believed by those who either wilfully or ignorantly succumb to paganism. You're right on the point that I do not believe that Jesus pre-existed his natural birth, but he was foremost in the mind and plan of his Father and his God from the beginning. The Bible clearly tells us that God created man from the dust of the ground; that he created woman from a man's rib. Jesus told the Pharisees that God could raise up children to Abraham from the rocks on the ground. When God the Father beget Jesus in the womb of Mary via his Holy Ghost, it was not a sexual act. It was a miraculous act. Your carnal mind limits God's creative ability and exactly what he can do with an obedient man. Your God the Son illusion will come back to haunt you some day! If I ask you to show one reference to God the Son from scripture, you will do impulsive gymnastics and convoluted responses, in a futile attempt to justify your assertion. It has already been pointed out to you that terms like 'divine' and 'divinity' were largely absorbed into Christianity from their more pagan usage. Do a personal study to see how often these terms are used in the Bible and their respective context. You just might get enlightened.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Oct 13, 2019 16:23:34 GMT -5
The workers do say Jesus is “divine”, but have no idea when he became “divine”. Nor do they understand that saying Jesus is “Divine” means he is of Deity. They think it only means heavenly. And it’s that some do declare that Jesus became divine after his resurrection. Some do falter at John 1:1 where it says the Word was God and it was in the beginning. Most cannot put that into that was God’s only begotten Son who is the WORD, nor do they catch that that is the Word was God. Just like Mountain he beliefs thT the Father had sex with Mary and that’s when he begot his only begotten Son. He does not believe the Son was before the beginning of the world. Even though prophecies says “unto us a Son is given) meaning that Son was already begotten before he was given to us. Mountain doesn’t seem to understand “incarnate” principles. So if you think we have all been saying exactly what the workers said in your presence, you didn’t understand their backbreaking effort to get around the fact that the Bible clearing shows Jesus is God the Son,, and really what they themselves refuse to believe. Plus you don’t understand what we’ve been saying all along. This is why belief in God seems to be so foolish to you and that’s because you just don’t understand. And You will never likely understand as long as you see such as foolish and fairytailish. Madam Belt Buckle. Please correct your post. I have NEVER said that the Father had sex with Mary. Your claim that I have is an outright lie, which if you have any honesty in you, you will correct! The term 'incarnate' is never used by God, Jesus or any of the scriptural writers. It is not found in the Bible, so why rely on it! It is a figment of man's imagination. It comes from a pagan mindset and is believed by those who either wilfully or ignorantly succumb to paganism. You're right on the point that I do not believe that Jesus pre-existed his natural birth, but he was foremost in the mind and plan of his Father and his God from the beginning. The Bible clearly tells us that God created man from the dust of the ground; that he created woman from a man's rib. Jesus told the Pharisees that God could raise up children to Abraham from the rocks on the ground. When God the Father beget Jesus in the womb of Mary via his Holy Ghost, it was not a sexual act. It was a miraculous act. Your carnal mind limits God's creative ability and exactly what he can do with an obedient man. Your God the Son illusion will come back to haunt you some day! If I ask you to show one reference to God the Son from scripture, you will do impulsive gymnastics and convoluted responses, in a futile attempt to justify your assertion. It has already been pointed out to you that terms like 'divine' and 'divinity' were largely absorbed into Christianity from their more pagan usage. Do a personal study to see how often these terms are used in the Bible and their respective context. You just might get enlightened. You said God “begat” his Son with Mary. Mary was human , so how are people supposed to interpret your idea if it doesn’t involve human relationship for begetting? I’m did not mean to “LIE” but interpreted what you said about God begat his Son with Mary. So this is your opportunity to explain how you think God could “begat Mary”otherwise. BTW, it is you who has the carnal mind unable to begin to understand the powers, wisdom, knowledge and understanding of our infinite God. God is a “spirit”, an eternal spirit. He does not need anything/anyone to create spirits . He created humans’ spirit at some point before they were ever conceived in a human body. It is DIFFERENT as to His Son, for he BEGAT his Son and did Not create him. His Son has the very “being” his Father has(which is what he is) but he is his own person (which is what makes him who he is). Otherwords, as the Bible says the SON is the VERY EXPRESS IMAGE of his FATHER. An exact replica. Because there was no one else involved in his begetting but the Father. Then God prepared a body for Jesus in Mary’s womb. As the Bible says in : Hebrews 10:5. Wherefore when he came into the world, he(Jesus) saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldst not, BUT A BODY THOU HAST PREPARE: ME. Which is from the prophecy in Psalm 40:6-8 God’s Son was embodied in that body that the Father had prepared in Mary’s womb. The word normally used is “incarnated”. Which the embodiment of his Son into a fetus is the meaning of incarnating. This is the “overshadowing” by the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit can only move spirits, not human tissue. Just as John the Apostle said that he was in the Spirit on the first day of the week and this is how he was able to go into heaven to receive the bridegroom’s message. Taken in the spirit by the Spirit is often spoken about. It happens.
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Post by mountain on Oct 13, 2019 16:39:34 GMT -5
Madam Belt Buckle. Please correct your post. I have NEVER said that the Father had sex with Mary. Your claim that I have is an outright lie, which if you have any honesty in you, you will correct! The term 'incarnate' is never used by God, Jesus or any of the scriptural writers. It is not found in the Bible, so why rely on it! It is a figment of man's imagination. It comes from a pagan mindset and is believed by those who either wilfully or ignorantly succumb to paganism. You're right on the point that I do not believe that Jesus pre-existed his natural birth, but he was foremost in the mind and plan of his Father and his God from the beginning. The Bible clearly tells us that God created man from the dust of the ground; that he created woman from a man's rib. Jesus told the Pharisees that God could raise up children to Abraham from the rocks on the ground. When God the Father beget Jesus in the womb of Mary via his Holy Ghost, it was not a sexual act. It was a miraculous act. Your carnal mind limits God's creative ability and exactly what he can do with an obedient man. Your God the Son illusion will come back to haunt you some day! If I ask you to show one reference to God the Son from scripture, you will do impulsive gymnastics and convoluted responses, in a futile attempt to justify your assertion. It has already been pointed out to you that terms like 'divine' and 'divinity' were largely absorbed into Christianity from their more pagan usage. Do a personal study to see how often these terms are used in the Bible and their respective context. You just might get enlightened. You said God “begat” his Son with Mary. Mary was human , so how are people supposed to interpret your idea if it doesn’t involve human relationship for begetting? beget in British (bɪˈɡɛt )
verb Word forms: -gets, -getting, -got, -gat, -gotten or -got (transitive) 1. to father 2. to cause or create Collins English Dictionary. Copyright © HarperCollins Publishers Derived forms begetter (beˈgetter) noun Word origin of 'begat' Old English begietan; related to Old Saxon bigetan, Old High German pigezzan, Gothic bigitan to find; see be-, get
I’m did not mean to “LIE” but interpreted what you said about God begat his Son with Mary. You definitely need to put the belt buckle away and LEARN that words or phrases may mean something very different from what you imagine!
So this is your opportunity to explain how you think God could “begat Mary”otherwise. Quite simply God Fathered Jesus, his human being Son, through a miraculous act of procreation. No sexual act was necessary. Humans require that to beget life. God does not! You should know that. Anyone who can create man from the dust of the ground, from a human rib, or raise up children to a human being from rocks, is quite capable of miraculously begetting a human being in a woman's womb! I have faith to believe that. I hope you do too!
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Post by sharingtheriches on Oct 13, 2019 16:51:04 GMT -5
You said God “begat” his Son with Mary. Mary was human , so how are people supposed to interpret your idea if it doesn’t involve human relationship for begetting? beget in British (bɪˈɡɛt )
verb Word forms: -gets, -getting, -got, -gat, -gotten or -got (transitive) 1. to father 2. to cause or create Collins English Dictionary. Copyright © HarperCollins Publishers Derived forms begetter (beˈgetter) noun Word origin of 'begat' Old English begietan; related to Old Saxon bigetan, Old High German pigezzan, Gothic bigitan to find; see be-, get
I’m did not mean to “LIE” but interpreted what you said about God begat his Son with Mary. You definitely need to put the belt buckle away and LEARN that words or phrases may mean something very different from what you imagine!
So this is your opportunity to explain how you think God could “begat Mary”otherwise. Quite simply God Fathered Jesus, his human being Son, through a miraculous act of procreation. No sexual act was necessary. Humans require that to beget life. God does not! You should know that. Anyone who can create man from the dust of the ground, from a human rib, or raise up children to a human being from rocks, is quite capable of miraculously begetting a human being in a woman's womb! I have faith to believe that. I hope you do too!I’m sure God can do the impossible but it says the “Holy Spirit” overshadowed Mary. The Spirit does not import human parts, he moves spirits. He moved God’s Son into the body already prepared in Mary’s womb, which was an asexual reproduction of human flesh so that Jesus’ human self was pure and sinless as Adam was when he was first created. Jesus’ human flesh was not begotten in sin because it was asexual. It was not procreation. It was God remaking the first Adam that had sinned, so the second Adam was sinless from asexual reproduction , so the sinless Son of God could inhabit that flesh which the Holy Spirit overshadowed and moved him into that body already prepared for the Son, though it was a fetus.
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Post by mountain on Oct 13, 2019 17:11:49 GMT -5
I’m sure God can do the impossible but it says the “Holy Spirit” overshadowed Mary. The Spirit does not import human parts, he moves spirits. He moved God’s Son into the body already prepared in Mary’s womb, which was an asexual reproduction of human flesh so that Jesus’ human self was pure and sinless as Adam was when he was first created. Jesus’ human flesh was not begotten in sin because it was asexual. It was not procreation. It was God remaking the first Adam that had sinned, so the second Adam was sinless from asexual reproduction , so the sinless Son of God could inhabit that flesh which the Holy Spirit overshadowed and moved him into that body already prepared for the Son, though it was a fetus. [ Shaz my dear, you do realise that God 'spoke' the world into existence? A new born babe is innocent until it sins. It is not disobedient to God until that happens. When the Bible says were are born in sin and shapen in iniquity, it means we are born with a sinful nature, i.e. a nature that is prone to sin, and is then shaped by sin as we grow. Jesus was miraculously procreated in the womb of Mary by the Holy Ghost. God 'poured' his spirit into Jesus without measure. It was this spirit which kept him from sinning. He did it by God's power. Not once giving in to temptation. It's not difficult to understand. Some of the stuff you have stated above gives Nathan a run for his money with his Jesus and Venus offerings!
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Post by sharingtheriches on Oct 13, 2019 19:01:30 GMT -5
I’m sure God can do the impossible but it says the “Holy Spirit” overshadowed Mary. The Spirit does not import human parts, he moves spirits. He moved God’s Son into the body already prepared in Mary’s womb, which was an asexual reproduction of human flesh so that Jesus’ human self was pure and sinless as Adam was when he was first created. Jesus’ human flesh was not begotten in sin because it was asexual. It was not procreation. It was God remaking the first Adam that had sinned, so the second Adam was sinless from asexual reproduction , so the sinless Son of God could inhabit that flesh which the Holy Spirit overshadowed and moved him into that body already prepared for the Son, though it was a fetus. [ Shaz my dear, you do realise that God 'spoke' the world into existence? A new born babe is innocent until it sins. It is not disobedient to God until that happens. When the Bible says were are born in sin and shapen in iniquity, it means we are born with a sinful nature, i.e. a nature that is prone to sin, and is then shaped by sin as we grow. Jesus was miraculously procreated in the womb of Mary by the Holy Ghost. God 'poured' his spirit into Jesus without measure. It was this spirit which kept him from sinning. He did it by God's power. Not once giving in to temptation. It's not difficult to understand. Some of the stuff you have stated above gives Nathan a run for his money with his Jesus and Venus offerings! This is where you do not understand that in John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word and the Word was WITH God and the Word was God. God’s Word was more then a spoken word he was a living person. As it says in Isaiah 44:24. Thus saith the Lord, Thy REDEEMER, and he that formed thee from the womb, I AM the Lord that makerh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens ALONE; that spreaders abroad the earth BY MYSELF; John 1:2-3 (the Word) The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him(the Word); and without him(the Word) was not anything made. In him(the Word) was life; and the Life was the light of men. Genesis 1:3-4. God said Let there be light(The Life-as in John 1:3) : and there was light. And God saw that light(the lifeJohn 1:3) that it was good. And God divided the light from the darkness. Revelations 21:23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and THE LAMB is the LIGHT thereof.
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Post by mountain on Oct 14, 2019 3:04:37 GMT -5
This is where you do not understand that in John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word and the Word was WITH God and the Word was God. God’s Word was more then a spoken word he was a living person. As it says in Isaiah 44:24. Thus saith the Lord, Thy REDEEMER, and he that formed thee from the womb, I AM the Lord that makerh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens ALONE; that spreaders abroad the earth BY MYSELF; John 1:2-3 (the Word) The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him(the Word); and without him(the Word) was not anything made. In him(the Word) was life; and the Life was the light of men. Genesis 1:3-4. God said Let there be light(The Life-as in John 1:3) : and there was light. And God saw that light(the lifeJohn 1:3) that it was good. And God divided the light from the darkness. Revelations 21:23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and THE LAMB is the LIGHT thereof. You continue to fall into the same old trap, thinking that the actual Word of God is Jesus, when it is not. From the beginning of the Bible to the end of the Bible the Word is ALWAYS the Father's Word. From the beginning of the Bible to the end of the Bible, God is always the Father. Both terms are 'entirely' synonymous. Jesus never says that he is the Word. He tells us several times that the words he spoke and the deeds he did were not his own but were the Father's Words (God's words). Any time he referred to God he was referring to the Father and vice versa. To Jesus they are one and the same thing. Do you believe Jesus?? Do you believe God. I challenge you to come up with a verse in the Bible that unequivocally establishes Jesus as being the Actual Word of God. He is the word of God through messengership only, through being God's representative, not through actuality. God the Father, spoke all things into existence. The Bible tells us this. It was 'his' words, no one else's. Jesus wasn't there in person, but he was the primary subject in the mind and plan of God. God created all things through or by this mind and plan. Some day the penny will drop for you Shaz. Instead of relying on the convoluted imaginings of certain theologians, just simply believe God and Jesus. Think very seriously about the below verses. This is God the Father telling Moses and us exactly how he would make HIS word flesh I latter times. Deuteronomy 18: 17 And the Lord said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken. 18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.
19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him. As said, God the Father spoke all things into existence. As John says, 'In the beginning was the Word (or Logos of God), and the Word (or Logos of God) was with God, and the Word (or Logos of God), WAS God. The Word or logos was the active means through which all things were created. It is God in much the same way as your word is actually you. It is not a separate person. It is your voice. This morning was the voice, and the voice was with Shaz, and the voice WAS Shaz.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Oct 14, 2019 10:31:59 GMT -5
You continue to fall into the same old trap, thinking that the actual Word of God is Jesus, when it is not. From the beginning of the Bible to the end of the Bible the Word is ALWAYS the Father's Word. From the beginning of the Bible to the end of the Bible, God is always the Father. Both terms are 'entirely' synonymous. Jesus never says that he is the Word. He tells us several times that the words he spoke and the deeds he did were not his own but were the Father's Words (God's words). Any time he referred to God he was referring to the Father and vice versa. To Jesus they are one and the same thing. Do you believe Jesus?? Do you believe God. I challenge you to come up with a verse in the Bible that unequivocally establishes Jesus as being the Actual Word of God. He is the word of God through messengership only, through being God's representative, not through actuality. God the Father, spoke all things into existence. The Bible tells us this. It was 'his' words, no one else's. Jesus wasn't there in person, but he was the primary subject in the mind and plan of God. God created all things through or by this mind and plan. Some day the penny will drop for you Shaz. Instead of relying on the convoluted imaginings of certain theologians, just simply believe God and Jesus. Think very seriously about the below verses. This is God the Father telling Moses and us exactly how he would make HIS word flesh I latter times. Deuteronomy 18: 17 And the Lord said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken. 18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.
19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him. As said, God the Father spoke all things into existence. As John says, 'In the beginning was the Word (or Logos of God), and the Word (or Logos of God) was with God, and the Word (or Logos of God), WAS God. The Word or logos was the active means through which all things were created. It is God in much the same way as your word is actually you. It is not a separate person. It is your voice. This morning was the voice, and the voice was with Shaz, and the voice WAS Shaz. Mountain, I’m afraid you’re hopeless! If you have no idea who your Saviour is, how do you expect him to know you? Might he have the right to say, “Depart from me I never knew you!”? God’s Word became living flesh!
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Post by mountain on Oct 14, 2019 11:14:39 GMT -5
Mountain, I’m afraid you’re hopeless! If you have no idea who your Saviour is, how do you expect him to know you? Might he have the right to say, “Depart from me I never knew you!”? God’s Word became living flesh! Just where you get the idea that I don't know who my saviour is, is nothing more than more ignorant speculation on your behalf. Yes God's word became living flesh and God himself told Moses exactly how that would occur, only YOU refuse to believe God. A sharp reminder of what God promised Moses: Deut. 18: 17 And the Lord said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken. 18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. 19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him. There that's exactly how God's word became flesh. And if you don't believe it, here is what Jesus told the Pharisees who didn't believe Moses! John 5:46-47 King James Version (KJV) 46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?
Is it any wonder you are floundering about in paganised Christianity when you neither believe what God has said or what Moses has written. Jesus tells us time and again that the words he spake were NOT HIS OWN, but were his Father's words. Are you honestly saying that 'the Word' denied speaking his words, but attributed them to another. If Jesus was the actual word then the words he spoke would have been his own. I'll finish off with Hebrews 1, further confirmation of God's promise to Moses. Hebrews 1 King James Version (KJV) 1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; 3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high: (Virgs)
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Post by sharingtheriches on Oct 14, 2019 11:26:35 GMT -5
Just where you get the idea that I don't know who my saviour is, is nothing more than more ignorant speculation on your behalf. Yes God's word became living flesh and God himself told Moses exactly how that would occur, only YOU refuse to believe God. A sharp reminder of what God promised Moses: Deut. 18: 17 And the Lord said unto me, They have well spoken that which they have spoken. 18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. 19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him. There that's exactly how God's word became flesh. And if you don't believe it, here is what Jesus told the Pharisees who didn't believe Moses! John 5:46-47 King James Version (KJV) 46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?
Is it any wonder you are floundering about in paganised Christianity when you neither believe what God has said or what Moses has written. Jesus tells us time and again that the words he spake were NOT HIS OWN, but were his Father's words. Are you honestly saying that 'the Word' denied speaking his words, but attributed them to another. If Jesus was the actual word then the words he spoke would have been his own. I'll finish off with Hebrews 1, further confirmation of God's promise to Moses. Hebrews 1 King James Version (KJV) 1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; 3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high: (Virgs) You quote all of that yet deny the record the Father gave if His Son. You lack understanding.
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Post by mountain on Oct 14, 2019 14:09:11 GMT -5
You quote all of that yet deny the record the Father gave if His Son. You lack understanding. In your opinion my dear Shaz, but I rather suspect your belt buckle has come loose?
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Post by sharingtheriches on Oct 14, 2019 15:45:53 GMT -5
In your opinion my dear Shaz, but I rather suspect your belt buckle has come loose? Ahah! You’re going around the barn about it but are admitting it anyway!
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Post by mountain on Oct 15, 2019 10:51:46 GMT -5
Ahah! You’re going around the barn about it but are admitting it anyway! No Shaz, I am being diplomatic. Perhaps in far too kind a way?
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