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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Dec 4, 2018 12:04:37 GMT -5
How about you open your eyes and your mind. Don't think I would like to be like you. Do you lack courage to question. Would you rather just go along with the crowd. Keep the peace within the social club?
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Post by snow on Dec 4, 2018 17:21:31 GMT -5
How about you open your eyes and your mind. Don't think I would like to be like you. I can understand why you might not want to see. What you might see might not be pretty. But until eyes are opened and things viewed for what they are, how can changes be made for the better. Every group can use betterment. Ignoring the issues is not going to make the needed changes. It's always good to strive towards doing things better.
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Post by speak on Dec 4, 2018 23:40:48 GMT -5
Don't think I would like to be like you. Do you lack courage to question. Would you rather just go along with the crowd. Keep the peace within the social club? All depends which crowd one follows, you follow the biggest crowd.
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Post by speak on Dec 4, 2018 23:41:47 GMT -5
Don't think I would like to be like you. I can understand why you might not want to see. What you might see might not be pretty. But until eyes are opened and things viewed for what they are, how can changes be made for the better. Every group can use betterment. Ignoring the issues is not going to make the needed changes. It's always good to strive towards doing things better. All depends what one is looking at.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2018 23:56:36 GMT -5
How to make the most of our life here on Earth Speak. As far as we know we only get one shot at it.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 5, 2018 5:54:36 GMT -5
Most everyone on TMB would welcome more emphasis in the fellowship on love rather than rules. The change in emphasis in New Zealand is appreciated by many. True but many would say that we show love by following the standards set by Jesus. That may be true, but from my experience I have seen very little of the "standards set by Jesus," in most religions.
I have found a lot of individual people who abide by those standards but there surely weren't very many in the one which I was in, -what we called the 2x2's.
I think there would have been more except for the well founded fear that they would be the next person attacked if they didn't hew the line.
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Post by openingact34 on Dec 5, 2018 19:52:53 GMT -5
He has spoken very forcefully at West Australian conventions about Jesus bringing a new and better way. And only two ‘laws’. He constantly said love, not rules. Also mentioned that the word standard was not mentioned in the bible. If that is taken on board, there may be hope for new and better things. Nothing new there. For the better part of a century, the senior overseers have preached "we have no rules" while simultaneously imposing draconian rules. For example, Evan Jones made a formal statement under oath to a court of law, saying: "Our organisation has no restrictions on music, dancing, television, sport, food, or anything else for that matter. We do not exercise any authority over an individuals faith. However a member of our faith would not be interested in Music, Television, or the like, as life is complete without them." Jack Carroll said: "All earthly kingdoms and institutions need rules, regulations and laws; but this Heavenly Kingdom on earth is a reign of love and not of law." Howard Mooney claimed: "We don't set down a list of rules or regulations and tell them what they can and cannot do. They are satisfied in Jesus." Harold Bennett stated: "This is not a sect or denomination or group held together by rules and regulations." If you want to see if there are any rules, just try breaking one! Have your divorced and remarried friends take part in a meeting. Or let your daughter wear a pair of slacks to her baptism. Or casually mention that several of you got together and had a little meeting and took the emblems in the home of someone who had been put out of fellowship.
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Post by Pragmatic on Dec 5, 2018 22:32:27 GMT -5
John Brasted used to say (privately), of course there are rules....you try breaking one and see! At least he was honest.
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Post by nathan on Dec 5, 2018 23:16:55 GMT -5
He has spoken very forcefully at West Australian conventions about Jesus bringing a new and better way. And only two ‘laws’. He constantly said love, not rules. Also mentioned that the word standard was not mentioned in the bible. If that is taken on board, there may be hope for new and better things. Nothing new there. For the better part of a century, the senior overseers have preached "we have no rules" while simultaneously imposing draconian rules. For example, Evan Jones made a formal statement under oath to a court of law, saying: "Our organisation has no restrictions on music, dancing, television, sport, food, or anything else for that matter. We do not exercise any authority over an individuals faith. However a member of our faith would not be interested in Music, Television, or the like, as life is complete without them." Jack Carroll said: "All earthly kingdoms and institutions need rules, regulations and laws; but this Heavenly Kingdom on earth is a reign of love and not of law." Howard Mooney claimed: "We don't set down a list of rules or regulations and tell them what they can and cannot do. They are satisfied in Jesus." Harold Bennett stated: "This is not a sect or denomination or group held together by rules and regulations." If you want to see if there are any rules, just try breaking one! Have your divorced and remarried friends take part in a meeting. Or let your daughter wear a pair of slacks to her baptism. Or casually mention that several of you got together and had a little meeting and took the emblems in the home of someone who had been put out of fellowship. There are standards in God's kingdom, you can't do with WHATEVER you want or desires and get away with it. God gave the children rules of do's and don'ts and they find loopholes and work around it. It's better when there is a standard, but allow the Spirit to guide, and convict each person according to their level of understanding and maturity.
God doesn't want the angels running around doing whatever they want! LOOK, what happened to Lucifer! God has reserved everlasting Lake of fire for Lucifer/Satan, 1/3 of the fallen angels and their followers.
Jude 6-11 And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day— just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
Yet in like manner these people also, relying on their dreams, defile the flesh, reject authority, and blaspheme the glorious ones. But when the archangel Michael, contending with the devil, was disputing about the body of Moses, he did not presume to pronounce a blasphemous judgment, but said, “The Lord rebuke you.” But these people blaspheme all that they do not understand, and they are destroyed by all that they, like unreasoning animals, understand instinctively. Woe to them! For they walked in the way of Cain and abandoned themselves for the sake of gain to Balaam's error and perished in Korah's rebellion.
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Post by snow on Dec 6, 2018 15:28:56 GMT -5
Nothing new there. For the better part of a century, the senior overseers have preached "we have no rules" while simultaneously imposing draconian rules. For example, Evan Jones made a formal statement under oath to a court of law, saying: "Our organisation has no restrictions on music, dancing, television, sport, food, or anything else for that matter. We do not exercise any authority over an individuals faith. However a member of our faith would not be interested in Music, Television, or the like, as life is complete without them." Jack Carroll said: "All earthly kingdoms and institutions need rules, regulations and laws; but this Heavenly Kingdom on earth is a reign of love and not of law." Howard Mooney claimed: "We don't set down a list of rules or regulations and tell them what they can and cannot do. They are satisfied in Jesus." Harold Bennett stated: "This is not a sect or denomination or group held together by rules and regulations." If you want to see if there are any rules, just try breaking one! Have your divorced and remarried friends take part in a meeting. Or let your daughter wear a pair of slacks to her baptism. Or casually mention that several of you got together and had a little meeting and took the emblems in the home of someone who had been put out of fellowship. There are standards in God's kingdom, you can't do with WHATEVER you want or desires and get away with it. God gave the children rules of do's and don'ts and they find loopholes and work around it. It's better when there is a standard, but allow the Spirit to guide, and convict each person according to their level of understanding and maturity.
God doesn't want the angels running around doing whatever they want! LOOK, what happened to Lucifer! God has reserved everlasting Lake of fire for Lucifer/Satan, 1/3 of the fallen angels and their followers.
Jude 6-11 And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day— just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
Yet in like manner these people also, relying on their dreams, defile the flesh, reject authority, and blaspheme the glorious ones. But when the archangel Michael, contending with the devil, was disputing about the body of Moses, he did not presume to pronounce a blasphemous judgment, but said, “The Lord rebuke you.” But these people blaspheme all that they do not understand, and they are destroyed by all that they, like unreasoning animals, understand instinctively. Woe to them! For they walked in the way of Cain and abandoned themselves for the sake of gain to Balaam's error and perished in Korah's rebellion.Then let God decide and punish. Men who are just as fallible shouldn't be in charge of punishing other men.
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Post by nathan on Dec 6, 2018 21:29:09 GMT -5
There are standards in God's kingdom, you can't do with WHATEVER you want or desires and get away with it. God gave the children rules of do's and don'ts and they find loopholes and work around it. It's better when there is a standard, but allow the Spirit to guide, and convict each person according to their level of understanding and maturity.
God doesn't want the angels running around doing whatever they want! LOOK, what happened to Lucifer! God has reserved everlasting Lake of fire for Lucifer/Satan, 1/3 of the fallen angels and their followers.
Jude 6-11 And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day— just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
Yet in like manner these people also, relying on their dreams, defile the flesh, reject authority, and blaspheme the glorious ones. But when the archangel Michael, contending with the devil, was disputing about the body of Moses, he did not presume to pronounce a blasphemous judgment, but said, “The Lord rebuke you.” But these people blaspheme all that they do not understand, and they are destroyed by all that they, like unreasoning animals, understand instinctively. Woe to them! For they walked in the way of Cain and abandoned themselves for the sake of gain to Balaam's error and perished in Korah's rebellion. Then let God decide and punish. Men who are just as fallible shouldn't be in charge of punishing other men. Jesus/God appointed the apostles/workers, church elders, bishops to guide, help, protect the churches/assembly of believers. Too bad, some of them abused their authority and power. Jesus said to the apostles FEED my Lambs and SHEEP NOT to drive them.
God will deal with them who abused their authority and place of position.
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Post by magpie1 on Dec 6, 2018 22:02:29 GMT -5
If your new Bishop can clean up the reason such articles as these get printed,and goes public,so the apology goes world wide public to reach the many him/her preacher paedophile's victims who have walked away from the Irvinist 2x2'because of it www.thelyingtruth.info/vot/sexualmi.php2x2ministry.org/problems/index.php https://www.theage.com.au>National>Victoria
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2018 4:18:33 GMT -5
Any update on the appointment of Victoria's new overseer?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2018 5:23:42 GMT -5
Allan Mitchell (Queensland worker who has been in New Guinea for years) is now in charge, as of today, 11 December 2018.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 11, 2018 6:01:42 GMT -5
Allan Mitchell (Queensland worker who has been in New Guinea for years) is now in charge, as of today, 11 December 2018. Do you know where Allan Mitchell was from originally? Illinois, by any chance?
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Dec 11, 2018 11:49:40 GMT -5
Ross, it all reminds me of the Titanic and the deck chairs.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2018 14:21:29 GMT -5
Sort of is a habit in Australia. We do it with Prime Ministers. Courses a bit of confusion and instability. Not new for Victorian 2x2's.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Dec 11, 2018 16:03:06 GMT -5
It's an indication that there is still a huge amount of disagreement within the various churches on how best to portray the god they invented so long ago.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2018 16:20:52 GMT -5
I can't understand why the "Perfect Way" has so many problems, especially in Victoria. Maybe they are better at theory, and not so good with practice.
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Post by Admin on Dec 11, 2018 17:11:43 GMT -5
Please keep this thread on topic. Other posts unrelated to the OP may be deleted, so best post them where they are relevant. Thanks.
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Post by magpie1 on Dec 11, 2018 18:34:44 GMT -5
Hi Ross,I believe the grapevine is so hot that the raisins and saltanas are being pre-dried,before picking. Magpie
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Post by speak on Dec 11, 2018 20:18:32 GMT -5
True but many would say that we show love by following the standards set by Jesus. That may be true, but from my experience I have seen very little of the "standards set by Jesus," in most religions.
I have found a lot of individual people who abide by those standards but there surely weren't very many in the one which I was in, -what we called the 2x2's.
I think there would have been more except for the well founded fear that they would be the next person attacked if they didn't hew the line. What about your loved ones?
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Dec 11, 2018 21:16:32 GMT -5
Hi Ross,I believe the grapevine is so hot that the raisins and saltanas are being pre-dried,before picking. Magpie Brilliant. Reminds me of the gossiping that used to go on between some of the workers and my mother.
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Post by sauerkraut on Dec 12, 2018 16:14:59 GMT -5
the Bible tells us that Christ is the head of the Church, well he ain't the head of this one
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 13, 2018 1:06:27 GMT -5
That may be true, but from my experience I have seen very little of the "standards set by Jesus," in most religions.
I have found a lot of individual people who abide by those standards but there surely weren't very many in the one which I was in, -what we called the 2x2's.
I think there would have been more except for the well founded fear that they would be the next person attacked if they didn't hew the line. What about your loved ones? My post was about my own experience with a run-in with a popular sister worker, -my own sister-in-law. There was NO one except ONE of the older women of the friends that said anything at all in my defense.
Even as I practically begged people for some consideration and even a little validation of my position, -people were too afraid to say ANYTHING and just remained silent.
But I didn't realize it was their fear and them saying nothing made we feel as if they agreed with her.
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Post by sauerkraut on Dec 13, 2018 1:42:11 GMT -5
Do you know where Allan Mitchell was from originally? Illinois, by any chance? No - Allan Mitchell is an Aussie. Apparently Allan Kitto, the NSW Head Worker had to leave Mudgee Convention in NSW last Friday to fly to Melbourne to attend an urgent meeting. The Victorian Head Worker a few weeks ago was David Leitch. He apparently wasn’t too keen on Graham Snow according to all reports but he is now out of the work completely. Jim McLean was then apparently appointed Head Worker of Victoria but as of yesterday it’s now Allan Mitchell. Tomorrow it could be someone else .... It seems like apostolic succession is alive and well in Victoria! David Leitch gone!!!!!! Oh how the mighty have fallen !!!!!! maybe his life is hanging by a thread now??
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Post by jay on Dec 20, 2018 19:06:39 GMT -5
Is there any more info on the Victorian saga?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2018 22:59:17 GMT -5
They would be busy with Conventions at the moment, would think Drouin would be on at the moment. They are not good with information nowadays, perhaps it is because Redback is too outspoken on TMB.
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