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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 16:11:35 GMT -5
I have just heard a strong rumour that one of our NZ workers who has spoken up strongly in the past against csa has decided he will not be able to continue in the work this coming year. I understand that this decision is based on conscience due to a number of matters occurring within the ministry/fellowship that remain unaddressed. If this rumour is confirmed, I hope that many in NZ will pray for, and actively help this courageous man as he takes his next steps in life. Pray that he continues to stand and press for correct standards of truth within the fellowship and for the unacceptable wrongs to be put right. His courage and zeal over a number of years on these matters (with little or no tangible positive action taken in response) should be highly commended. In the last few years he has been a shining example of standing alone and standing tall for truth.
I added Grahams name to the thread title, as there are people here looking for the threads concerning him-Scott
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 16:16:27 GMT -5
Morriss, the more toxic the thread, the more hits it gets. So you should do well with this one. It's interesting that one of prime allegations made against us is this, quote "They always talk about the Workers, never about Jesus." --- end quote.
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Post by Mary on Jan 6, 2014 16:45:27 GMT -5
This is a positive thread, so why knock it, Bert?
I only know of 3 workers in NZ who have stood up against CSA. One who was posting on this board until 18 months ago but has been resting this last year due to genuine health problems.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 16:50:42 GMT -5
I have just heard a strong rumour that one of our NZ workers who has spoken up strongly in the past against csa has decided he will not be able to continue in the work this coming year. I understand that this decision is based on conscience due to a number of matters occurring within the ministry/fellowship that remain unaddressed. If this rumour is confirmed, I hope that many in NZ will pray for, and actively help this courageous man as he takes his next steps in life. Pray that he continues to stand and press for correct standards of truth within the fellowship and for the unacceptable wrongs to be put right. His courage and zeal over a number of years on these matters (with little or no tangible positive action taken in response) should be highly commended. In the last few years he has been a shining example of standing alone and standing tall for truth. I presume you are suggesting that Graham Thompson is out? If it is true, it is unfortunate but hardly a surprise. Let's hope things work out well for him.
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Post by Grief on Jan 6, 2014 18:35:58 GMT -5
Hope it's not GT, he'll be sadly missed.Can any one confirm this, as true?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 18:46:03 GMT -5
I have just heard a strong rumour that one of our NZ workers who has spoken up strongly in the past against csa has decided he will not be able to continue in the work this coming year. I understand that this decision is based on conscience due to a number of matters occurring within the ministry/fellowship that remain unaddressed. If this rumour is confirmed, I hope that many in NZ will pray for, and actively help this courageous man as he takes his next steps in life. Pray that he continues to stand and press for correct standards of truth within the fellowship and for the unacceptable wrongs to be put right. His courage and zeal over a number of years on these matters (with little or no tangible positive action taken in response) should be highly commended. In the last few years he has been a shining example of standing alone and standing tall for truth. rumour has it
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 18:47:31 GMT -5
I have just heard a strong rumour that one of our NZ workers who has spoken up strongly in the past against csa has decided he will not be able to continue in the work this coming year. I understand that this decision is based on conscience due to a number of matters occurring within the ministry/fellowship that remain unaddressed. If this rumour is confirmed, I hope that many in NZ will pray for, and actively help this courageous man as he takes his next steps in life. Pray that he continues to stand and press for correct standards of truth within the fellowship and for the unacceptable wrongs to be put right. His courage and zeal over a number of years on these matters (with little or no tangible positive action taken in response) should be highly commended. In the last few years he has been a shining example of standing alone and standing tall for truth. I presume you are suggesting that Graham Thompson is out? If it is true, it is unfortunate but hardly a surprise. Let's hope things work out well for him. spoke to Graham at convention he was looking forward to a new year
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 18:49:08 GMT -5
I have just heard a strong rumour that one of our NZ workers who has spoken up strongly in the past against csa has decided he will not be able to continue in the work this coming year. I understand that this decision is based on conscience due to a number of matters occurring within the ministry/fellowship that remain unaddressed. If this rumour is confirmed, I hope that many in NZ will pray for, and actively help this courageous man as he takes his next steps in life. Pray that he continues to stand and press for correct standards of truth within the fellowship and for the unacceptable wrongs to be put right. His courage and zeal over a number of years on these matters (with little or no tangible positive action taken in response) should be highly commended. In the last few years he has been a shining example of standing alone and standing tall for truth. what do you mean a big shame?
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 6, 2014 19:10:00 GMT -5
This is a positive thread, so why knock it, Bert? I only know of 3 workers in NZ who have stood up against CSA. One who was posting on this board until 18 months ago but has been resting this last year due to genuine health problems. Give him our best wishes for a speedy recovery! It sure has seemed to me that over the years I was in the 2x2's that any worker who was doing their honest best to be the worker that was needed usually ended up with busted nerves and real physical health issues.....why? Is it because the demands of the work and the ruling workers, etc make it nearly impossible for these upright workers to continue taking that slack because someone has made a criminal error?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 19:18:55 GMT -5
This is a positive thread, so why knock it, Bert? I only know of 3 workers in NZ who have stood up against CSA. One who was posting on this board until 18 months ago but has been resting this last year due to genuine health problems. yes that is true
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Post by fixit on Jan 6, 2014 19:35:20 GMT -5
This is a positive thread, so why knock it, Bert? I only know of 3 workers in NZ who have stood up against CSA. One who was posting on this board until 18 months ago but has been resting this last year due to genuine health problems. yes that is true One posted on TMB as Noels. Graham Thompson spoke about CSA at SM last year. Who is the third?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 20:21:06 GMT -5
I presume you are suggesting that Graham Thompson is out? If it is true, it is unfortunate but hardly a surprise. Let's hope things work out well for him. spoke to Graham at convention he was looking forward to a new year No doubt. That's what any worker would say prior to deciding to leave the work or prior to deciding to make it public.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 20:39:58 GMT -5
spoke to Graham at convention he was looking forward to a new year No doubt. That's what any worker would say prior to deciding to leave the work or prior to deciding to make it public. Maybe the fact he was leaving made it a new year he was looking forward to.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 21:12:46 GMT -5
spoke to Graham at convention he was looking forward to a new year No doubt. That's what any worker would say prior to deciding to leave the work or prior to deciding to make it public. of course how could he be so silly
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2014 21:17:15 GMT -5
No doubt. That's what any worker would say prior to deciding to leave the work or prior to deciding to make it public. of course how could he be so silly I have no idea what you mean. What else do you suggest he would he say if he hadn't yet decided or known what he was going to do?
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Post by Mary on Jan 6, 2014 22:43:19 GMT -5
One posted on TMB as Noels. Graham Thompson spoke about CSA at SM last year. Who is the third? I was thinking about Alan Richardson - the overseer of NZ. Although room for improvement he has made big strides in speaking out about CSA with his guidelines. From Clearday's post on another thread. Here is the full text of Mr.Richardson's directive on CSA found on wingsfortruth.info/breaking-the-silence-2/letters-to-friends-and-workers/alan-richardson-letter-to-new-zealand-workers-august-2012/ . These guidelines have been made public with Mr.Richardson's knowledge and no objections from him.
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Post by stevnz on Jan 7, 2014 1:00:51 GMT -5
I understand that Graham Thompson has decided that he can no longer remain a member of the ministry in good conscience due to the overseers' actions as rulers and in contradiction to the bible teachings. For many years he has drawn attention to numerous problems in the eldership (overseers) but has been faced with hostility, lack of interest and lack of change. His decision is not related to CSA matters.
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Post by sacerdotal on Jan 7, 2014 9:56:54 GMT -5
I have just heard a strong rumour that one of our NZ workers who has spoken up strongly in the past against csa has decided he will not be able to continue in the work this coming year. I understand that this decision is based on conscience due to a number of matters occurring within the ministry/fellowship that remain unaddressed. If this rumour is confirmed, I hope that many in NZ will pray for, and actively help this courageous man as he takes his next steps in life. Pray that he continues to stand and press for correct standards of truth within the fellowship and for the unacceptable wrongs to be put right. His courage and zeal over a number of years on these matters (with little or no tangible positive action taken in response) should be highly commended. In the last few years he has been a shining example of standing alone and standing tall for truth. The big shame is that the workers that are trying to be honest and promote honesty among ALL are finding that they are working in a hostile workplace that doesn't have the same values at the senior leadership level. A marriage where the couples have differing values is a very difficult marriage that often ends in divorce. Same for the workplace. Same for the workers. It is easy to be in the work if you don't have a backbone and buy into the hiearchy and not questioning the hiearchy no matter what they do. The key is not to question and obey unconditionally. And I do mean, unconditionally. Because, to do otherwise is considered rebellion and can and will get you put out of the work quickly- usually with trumped up charges- usually - "he just wanted to be the boss."
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2014 10:28:06 GMT -5
This tread makes me so sad. When will those in power care about the pain they have inflicted by their lack of compassion and empathy. How can they call themselves servants of God?
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Post by quizzer on Jan 7, 2014 11:05:28 GMT -5
Any info on how Alan Richardson and/or Graham Thompson will be able to support themselves when they leave the work?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2014 11:43:51 GMT -5
Any info on how Alan Richardson and/or Graham Thompson will be able to support themselves when they leave the work? In general, that often depends on the rumours following them when they leave the work. If they are seen as leaving honourably, there are sometimes friends somewhere who can offer them a job at least to get them started while they get training for something. That isn't always the case though and a worker who started young and leaves in his/her 50's, it's a pretty daunting task to start over from scratch. Hopefully something works out for Mr.Thompson.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2014 12:07:59 GMT -5
I understand that Graham Thompson has decided that he can no longer remain a member of the ministry in good conscience due to the overseers' actions as rulers and in contradiction to the bible teachings. For many years he has drawn attention to numerous problems in the eldership (overseers) but has been faced with hostility, lack of interest and lack of change. His decision is not related to CSA matters. Yes, I believe this sums the situation up very succinctly and accurately. I had always imagined that Graham would have continued on in the work trying to cajole the senior leadership on the wrongs that needed righting and reminding other workers why the different things need addressing. But when conscience calls, there can be only one way to go. So he’s right to leave for that reason. However, I fear the church leadership is now going to suffer through not having anyone in its ranks who will provide the necessary challenge when the church leadership finds itself off track. It feels like there is no-one left in the worker ranks to provide this. Graham has been a single voice (and no, I’m not referring to csa here). As you say, in response there has been a mix of “hostility, lack of interest and lack of change” . Having no open, honest worker-to-overseer ‘feedback’ going forward, is not a good position for the church leadership to be in, is it? But I fear that’s the situation it is in, as of now. I hope that Graham continues to follow his conscience. Actually, I am very confident (knowing a little of his character) that he will. I don’t know where his conscience will lead him (obviously that’s between him and God) but I hope that he does not now lay the serious issues aside, either still taking them to those in the ministry or, if that is no longer feasible, to take them to the wider church. If the latter, I hope there will be those there who will not remain unmoved, but who will seek the church’s cleansing from wrongs. These would be my hopes, but above all I hope Graham remains the man he has always been ie a man of courage and conviction.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2014 14:59:56 GMT -5
I understand that Graham Thompson has decided that he can no longer remain a member of the ministry in good conscience due to the overseers' actions as rulers and in contradiction to the bible teachings. For many years he has drawn attention to numerous problems in the eldership (overseers) but has been faced with hostility, lack of interest and lack of change. His decision is not related to CSA matters. Yes, I believe this sums the situation up very succinctly and accurately. I had always imagined that Graham would have continued on in the work trying to cajole the senior leadership on the wrongs that needed righting and reminding other workers why the different things need addressing. But when conscience calls, there can be only one way to go. So he’s right to leave for that reason. However, I fear the church leadership is now going to suffer through not having anyone in its ranks who will provide the necessary challenge when the church leadership finds itself off track. It feels like there is no-one left in the worker ranks to provide this. Graham has been a single voice (and no, I’m not referring to csa here). As you say, in response there has been a mix of “hostility, lack of interest and lack of change” . Having no open, honest worker-to-overseer ‘feedback’ going forward, is not a good position for the church leadership to be in, is it? But I fear that’s the situation it is in, as of now. I hope that Graham continues to follow his conscience. Actually, I am very confident (knowing a little of his character) that he will. I don’t know where his conscience will lead him (obviously that’s between him and God) but I hope that he does not now lay the serious issues aside, either still taking them to those in the ministry or, if that is no longer feasible, to take them to the wider church. If the latter, I hope there will be those there who will not remain unmoved, but who will seek the church’s cleansing from wrongs. These would be my hopes, but above all I hope Graham remains the man he has always been ie a man of courage and conviction. I suspect there is a whole lot more behind the scenes! I feel his stand on CSA was the beginning of the end of his workership! Those w ho overseer that area haven't been very friendly with the workers who want to put the CSA issue where it belongs! And I've heard the reason for that is some of them are guilty of some sinful behavior, etc! I'm hoping Graham can find a place for himself where he can find peace and contentment.....It wouldn't surprise me if he didn't leave the fellowship as well. I wonder if John will be able to go back into the work? His nerves are so bad, I don't see how he can do that Also since Alan Richardson has stuck his neck out in a positive manner about handling CSA, it amazes me that Graham would be retiring, but then he may feel that since Alan has said what he has said, that the workership doesn't need Graham anymore and he's tired of trying to get his overseers to do what the honest and best thing! Plus withstanding no tell how much meanness!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2014 15:15:39 GMT -5
Wish I lived closer to them, don't have much, but what I have I'd be willing to share with them.
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Post by Persona non grata on Jan 7, 2014 18:16:21 GMT -5
I understand that Graham Thompson has decided that he can no longer remain a member of the ministry in good conscience due to the overseers' actions as rulers and in contradiction to the bible teachings. For many years he has drawn attention to numerous problems in the eldership (overseers) but has been faced with hostility, lack of interest and lack of change. His decision is not related to CSA matters. A great loss to the ministry in NZ and a shame to those Australasian overseers who failed to address the concerns he raised. Mr Thompson remains a good example and an encouragement to us to stand true to our conscience. An honourable man.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2014 18:54:49 GMT -5
I understand that Graham Thompson has decided that he can no longer remain a member of the ministry in good conscience due to the overseers' actions as rulers and in contradiction to the bible teachings. For many years he has drawn attention to numerous problems in the eldership (overseers) but has been faced with hostility, lack of interest and lack of change. His decision is not related to CSA matters. would you be so kind as to showing the contradictions are that is causing Graham to part with the ministry?
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Post by fixit on Jan 7, 2014 19:00:55 GMT -5
I understand that Graham Thompson has decided that he can no longer remain a member of the ministry in good conscience due to the overseers' actions as rulers and in contradiction to the bible teachings. For many years he has drawn attention to numerous problems in the eldership (overseers) but has been faced with hostility, lack of interest and lack of change. His decision is not related to CSA matters. would you be so kind as to showing the contradictions are that is causing Graham to part with the ministry? You could follow the advice you often give - simply ask Graham.
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Post by stevnz on Jan 7, 2014 19:04:59 GMT -5
would you be so kind as to showing the contradictions are that is causing Graham to part with the ministry? You could follow the advice you often give - simply ask Graham. Graham's letter to Alan Richardson says [Note: 'eldership of the ministry' means 'overseers'] Masterton.
Monday, January 6
This is to advise you that I will not be going to the Wellington mission field this year, or any other field.
This is a conscience decision, based on principle. What I have observed and experienced in the eldership of the ministry over the years can not be reconciled with Scripture and is not according to Christ, and I can not participate in it or support it until this iniquity is purged.
I have waited until the present to take this step in the expectation that some steps would be taken to address this issue. That being not the case, I am left with no option as I can not support the lie.
I love the Gospel, the Flock, and I love our Lord Jesus. There is no other reason which would cause me to take this step; I do this solely because of the errors in the eldership which mean that I can not support this and consider myself a faithful servant of God and follower of our Lord Jesus Christ.
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