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Post by chuck on Apr 19, 2023 1:55:06 GMT -5
They should use professional people from the community not just in the kingdom…. Still the mindset of keeping it in the kingdom. I think they are afraid of outsiders! "in the kingdom" Please explain??. |
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Post by learner on Apr 19, 2023 5:10:27 GMT -5
I appreciate these friends arranging this meeting with the workers and bringing matters that concern them to the workers' notice. Good, healthy and necessary for the church, the friends and the workers! It is the way forward to better days! 👍😀 We are missing some context. Who set up the meeting? Who is Shaun? I was told about Dean B by a brother who is still attends this Christianity focused social group - I haven’t paid any attention to this group for a while but have read enough over the last week to be shocked by the lack of leadership. The need for leadership around CSA has been known for 15-20 years, and yet in 2023 there is still this same minimising the harm, protecting the church’s reputation, … I left this Christianity focused social group (the ‘meetings’) a few years ago, mostly due to the lack of transparency of leadership and the narrow focus of the faith. For me, I needed to get involved in an active christianity that made an effort to help people in their lives (and one’s own life) - to support a ministry that works with the refugees, the single parents, the addicted, those who are impacted by climate change, wars etc. A calling to help people (and myself) to have more capacity in one’s life to honour and serve God. My righteousness is not my Dress code and not washing cars on Sunday, which are not matters of doctrine but custom. My righteousness is only through the blood of Jesus. I can see now that even the sending of a two by two ministry was a practice at that time/context in the New Testament. I know that the christianity focused social structure (the workers and friends) see the two by two as a point of difference/differentiation because it is New Testament practice. Evidence that it is the one true way, and if you don’t do it, you are going to hell. Well, so too was washing each others feet in the New Testament. Jesus did it. It certainly isn’t a New Testament practice that is followed in this Christianity focused social structure (the ‘meetings’). Incidentally, I did notice that the Pope recently washed the feet of young men who were in prison. I believe the gospel has a wider message for everyone - all should feel welcome, and not feel different when they attend. We know how weird the women who attend this christian focused social structure have to look. Anyway, I did tell the overseer (when I was attending) that if women/mothers had been involved in decision making about CSA issues, there would have been a better outcome. I think that about the Catholic Church, about the abuse of children in care in Australia, NZ, Canada through the years… if more mothers and women had been involved, more diversity in decision making, then I suggest the outcomes would be better. I am a professional woman with extensive experience working in government, business and education - particularly in organisation development. I would be asking the leadership who have swept this under the mat to be standing down. Each organisation, whether it be schools, government aid agencies, churches have these problems. It is the institutional response that is important. How do they handle it when this happens? Women, in this Christianity focused social structure, it is time to speak up. Get your voice at the table. You have noticed I call it a ‘Christianity focused social group/structure”. I was talking to a practising member recently (members of my family attend) and they shared with me that they were very uncomfortable with all these scandals but were not going to change their place of worship as they really liked the people they met with and didn’t like change. I guess I understand this point of view, but for me I need to have my faith practises in alignment with my christian values. Good luck everyone making sense of this mess. Just remember Jesus; he is the one we put our faith in. He alone saves us. |
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Post by jennyfromtheblock on Apr 19, 2023 9:41:40 GMT -5
I appreciate these friends arranging this meeting with the workers and bringing matters that concern them to the workers' notice. Good, healthy and necessary for the church, the friends and the workers! It is the way forward to better days! 👍😀 We are missing some context. Who set up the meeting? Who is Shaun? From what I’ve heard, the friends arranged the meeting and invited the workers. Obviously they are quite upset, considering Shaun apologized for their “harsh” letter. I can see where people have made comments in respect to the notes discussing the seriousness of CSA/SA to topics that seem more trivial, like pants. Which is totally a fair assessment. But I think folks on these boards and FB are missing context. In my experience this Dean Bruer thing is causing people to examine everything they’ve ever known. Maybe they could’ve had a separate meeting to bring that stuff up. Or maybe they could ask the trivial questions that they already know the answers too right then and there, while they had someone recording notes. For all we know these people have been called out for these trivial things they were asking about. Maybe this was an opportunity to say why do you care about women wearing pants, or people playing sports - but we’ve got pedos hanging around our kids at convention?! Whoever the fellow is with the pool table and car washing… this was probably a meeting he needed more than anyone. I hope he learnt something more than worker worship. |
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Post by 1chinesewhispers on Apr 19, 2023 9:51:01 GMT -5
Yes shift it to pool tables , and especially how the women in your cult are yet put down again . You are stupid , my own mother wore shorts and pants at certain times . She had been in the truth longer than you MA
ITS ALL ABOUT KEEPING THE WOMEN IN A PIEGON HOLE .
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Post by jennyfromtheblock on Apr 19, 2023 10:16:10 GMT -5
Yes shift it to pool tables , and especially how the women in your cult are yet put down again . You are stupid , my own mother wore shorts and pants at certain times . She had been in the truth longer than you MA ITS ALL ABOUT KEEPING THE WOMEN IN A PIEGON HOLE . Who is this addressed to? |
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Post by SharonArnold on Apr 19, 2023 10:28:10 GMT -5
I would suggest that the "friends' were probably maximising an opportunity to vent in a situation where they felt they could, something that had been denied them. But yes, it was strange how it overtook the weightier matter. Did I miss something, or was there no discussion about restitution, counseling or victim support?
I couldn't figure out if Jack Carroll being referred to was the long passed one, or another worker of the same name.
It is THE Jack Carroll. He is widely regarded as a standard bearer of forever stature in this part of the world. To my knowledge there never was another Jack Carroll worker. I was raised on many pronouncements, prefaced by "Jack Carroll always said..." Merlin grew up not far from me, and though we had very different family cultures, that may have been true for him as well. The good part of it, in my view, was these Jack Carroll references frequently came out when my mother disagreed with something someone was currently doing. It taught me it was okay to question things (which some people would have thought was a bad thing). |
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Post by jennyfromtheblock on Apr 19, 2023 10:36:46 GMT -5
It is THE Jack Carroll. He is widely regarded as a standard bearer of forever stature in this part of the world. To my knowledge there never was another Jack Carroll worker. I was raised on many pronouncements, prefaced by "Jack Carroll always said..." Merlin grew up not far from me, and though we had very different family cultures, that may have been true for him as well. The good part of it, in my view, was these Jack Carroll references frequently came out when my mother disagreed with something someone was currently doing. It taught me it was okay to question things (which some people would have thought was a bad thing). It seems to me that these Jack Carroll references were used in a similar way. |
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Dean Bruer
Apr 19, 2023 10:38:17 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by 1chinesewhispers on Apr 19, 2023 10:38:17 GMT -5
I was raised on many pronouncements, prefaced by "Jack Carroll always said..." Merlin grew up not far from me, and though we had very different family cultures, that may have been true for him as well. The good part of it, in my view, was these Jack Carroll references frequently came out when my mother disagreed with something someone was currently doing. It taught me it was okay to question things (which some people would have thought was a bad thing). It seems to me that these Jack Carroll references were used in a similar way. Yep , Jack C has been dead for a long time . |
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Post by jennyfromtheblock on Apr 19, 2023 10:43:14 GMT -5
Who is this addressed to? No one . It was just how that MEETING TRANSGRESSED INTO . Not addressing CSA/SA just more about keeping women in THEIR PLACE !!! By the work’z . Sorry if my posts confuse some ! Please remember I have a TBI and a brain that doesn’t work right do to trauma and medication’s I was put on by doctors . So ya I look back at my posts a giggle . Non functioning brain and dyslexia 🙃🙃🙃 It was supposed to be a session of CSA/SA but ended up not absolutely addressing THE FACTS ! DO NOT FORGET THERE IS STILL A OVERSEER IN THE SCOPE OF SOMEONE’S EYES ! YES YOU ARE NOT FREE OF THAT HANGING OVER YOUR HEAD ! All good. No worries. I was trying to figure out who MA was. But you’ve referenced overseer a few times, so I think I’ve figured it out. 🤓 |
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
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Post by peggysullivan on Apr 19, 2023 11:29:36 GMT -5
They should use professional people from the community not just in the kingdom…. Still the mindset of keeping it in the kingdom. I think they are afraid of outsiders! "in the kingdom" Please explain??. They brought up using a professional resource, a professing woman who has a PhD. In social work? I really do think it’s better if they consult with a non affiliated person for these matters. I think they can be more objective and bring different insights. Fresh insight is what is needed, IMO |
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Post by 1chinesewhispers on Apr 19, 2023 11:34:34 GMT -5
"in the kingdom" Please explain??. They brought up using a professional resource, a professing woman who has a PhD. In social work? I really do think it’s better if they consult with a non affiliated person for these matters. I think they can be more objective and bring different insights. Fresh insight is what is needed, IMO Agreed 💯 % . They should have no tie to the Truth period . Cause they can talk a good game especially for the worker’z not acceptable , bottom line . Conflict of interest immediately. |
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Post by 1chinesewhispers on Apr 19, 2023 11:37:34 GMT -5
They brought up using a professional resource, a professing woman who has a PhD. In social work? I really do think it’s better if they consult with a non affiliated person for these matters. I think they can be more objective and bring different insights. Fresh insight is what is needed, IMO Agreed 💯 % . They should have no tie to the Truth period . Cause they can talk a good game especially for the worker’z not acceptable , bottom line . Conflict of interest immediately. I do let’s have a group meeting with a pile of CSA/SA PEOPLE VICTIMS AND SURVIVORS AND ALL OTHER TYPES OF ABUSE THEY USE AND THEN THEY MIGHT GET THE MESSAGE . Sign me up please 🙏 |
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peggysullivan
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Post by peggysullivan on Apr 19, 2023 11:37:37 GMT -5
That is exactly what struck me. It starts out with CSA/SA and quickly moves to the weightier matters of pants, alcohol and pool tables. SO grateful that this is no longer my world. Life is way too short. The only thing that triggered me was regarding the CSA & SA . Other than that some ole bs just a different day , so grateful I was excommunicated because a little 13 year old who enticed a 19 year old . I don’t know if I can forgive my brother , for pawning me off to spend time with his girlfriend . Oh wait , I did forgive him but I WILL NEVER FORGET . Give me a break , same s-it different ways . Jack has been dead FOR YEARS NOW ! And my dad wondered why I beat the crap outta my brother a lot . My poor dad couldn’t apologize enough to me . I just said Dad , I didn’t tell you so you never knew . I just became a hippie and my cuz’s still call me that . I love my boys 💓💕💗💖 The truth and the work might turn even the most ardent redneck into a hippie!! Lol |
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peggysullivan
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What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
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Dean Bruer
Apr 19, 2023 11:44:53 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by peggysullivan on Apr 19, 2023 11:44:53 GMT -5
What’s wrong with pool tables?!? Good grief.
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Post by 1chinesewhispers on Apr 19, 2023 11:51:08 GMT -5
What’s wrong with pool tables?!? Good grief. well I have heard of a few using it to have sex on . Maybe that’s why rolfflmao . It’s all good till someone loses an eye , from the pool cue or a ball ………….. Jus sayin |
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peggysullivan
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What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
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Post by peggysullivan on Apr 19, 2023 12:00:58 GMT -5
Agreed 💯 % . They should have no tie to the Truth period . Cause they can talk a good game especially for the worker’z not acceptable , bottom line . Conflict of interest immediately. I do let’s have a group meeting with a pile of CSA/SA PEOPLE VICTIMS AND SURVIVORS AND ALL OTHER TYPES OF ABUSE THEY USE AND THEN THEY MIGHT GET THE MESSAGE . Sign me up please 🙏 The truther survivor rally! It might get a little too rowdy for the workers though. |
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Post by 1chinesewhispers on Apr 19, 2023 12:38:53 GMT -5
I suspect pool tables are out as most of the time there is a wager on the game . So my cuz and BF and I went to a bar one time in Sweetgrass . All of us excellent pool players . So we put our money down to challenge the winner , that’s how it works in my weird world . We let them take two games and the money was piling up . They we turned it on and took them out . We ran out the door with the money , because we hooked them . Next bar about 5 minutes down the road at 4 Corners , oh to be young and foolish again .
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Post by 1chinesewhispers on Apr 19, 2023 12:48:51 GMT -5
It will be a cold day in hell before I apologize to a worker , full-stop .
Ain’t ever gonna happen .
ouch , ouch my eye 👁️ is killing me
That’s my whine for today
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peggysullivan
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What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
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Post by peggysullivan on Apr 19, 2023 12:54:38 GMT -5
I suspect pool tables are out as most of the time there is a wager on the game . So my cuz and BF and I went to a bar one time in Sweetgrass . All of us excellent pool players . So we put our money down to challenge the winner , that’s how it works in my weird world . We let them take two games and the money was piling up . They we turned it on a took them out . We ran out the door with the money , because we hooked them . Next bar about 5 minutes down the road at 4 Corners , oh to be young and foolish again . LOL! The only thing I got outa pool at a pool joint was free beer! But anyway, here's something that happened to me once and it was an exercise in being assertive. We were out shooting pool one night; me and my date and my roommate. This sleazy looking little guy walks up to me and says, "I was wondering if I could borrow your legs for couple of hours." My date got his back up real quick. But I told him, "No, Let me handle this.". I walked over to the guy and I said, "I don't appreciate what you said to me just now and I need you to buzz off." Well! He went back to his table and sat down. Then, several minutes later he walked up to me and apologized for being disrespectful and rude. |
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
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Dean Bruer
Apr 19, 2023 13:20:43 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by peggysullivan on Apr 19, 2023 13:20:43 GMT -5
They should use professional people from the community not just in the kingdom…. Still the mindset of keeping it in the kingdom. I think they are afraid of outsiders! They do not use professionals who are exes. I know for a fact. Let's hope they cooperate with the prosecutor who is an ex. They have to cooperate with the Law. |
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Post by internationalstudies on Apr 19, 2023 13:35:36 GMT -5
Chinese Whispers,
I have come to appreciate and respect you. You have had some awful experiences in life and I have care and compassion for you in what you now suffer as a result of that.
Do you have any disagreement with this post I made;
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Post by internationalstudies on Apr 19, 2023 13:40:52 GMT -5
Chinese whispers I have no apology to make for calling out some posters when they have made baseless allegations and false statements. I challenged them to substantiate their false statements and baseless allegations and they couldn't. They are only polluting this thread. Most of them their first priority is using anything they find to have a crack, a criticism or mock at the church/workers/friends that they now despise. Dean Bruer is just a vehicle they use for that. The same goes for a couple of so called 'professing' /church member posters, who present all righteous and have a crack at me for challenging the above. They too only pollute this thread with their hypocrisy. From the way you write I think you have some friends/members of our church there who care and have compassion for you. I am happy about that!  👍 You need and deserve that! I am really pained and sorry about the awful experiences that you have had. |
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
Posts: 662
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Post by peggysullivan on Apr 19, 2023 14:50:42 GMT -5
They brought up using a professional resource, a professing woman who has a PhD. In social work? I really do think it’s better if they consult with a non affiliated person for these matters. I think they can be more objective and bring different insights. Fresh insight is what is needed, IMO Agreed 💯 % . They should have no tie to the Truth period . Cause they can talk a good game especially for the worker’z not acceptable , bottom line . Conflict of interest immediately. Totally agree. I mean, there are lots of nurses, Dr.'s, teachers, business owners, counselors, etc. in the 'truth', but they would bring bias into the mix whether they try to or not. That's just how it goes. This is precisely why professionals will recuse themselves from taking on certain cases and refer them to someone else. Your familiarity and bias can cloud your judgement. |
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Post by 1chinesewhispers on Apr 19, 2023 15:59:33 GMT -5
They do not use professionals who are exes. I know for a fact. Let's hope they cooperate with the prosecutor who is an ex. They have to cooperate with the Law. They are not below lying to the LAW ! |
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Post by chuck on Apr 19, 2023 16:06:31 GMT -5
"in the kingdom" Please explain??. They brought up using a professional resource, a professing woman who has a PhD. In social work? I really do think it’s better if they consult with a non affiliated person for these matters. I think they can be more objective and bring different insights. Fresh insight is what is needed, IMO What does that have to do with "in the kingdom"? who said the non affiliated person was not "in the kingdom"?. |
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Post by Pragmatic on Apr 19, 2023 16:08:33 GMT -5
Curly might correct me if I am wrong, but the word (direct) from one of the victims of the "fat slob" was that his defense managed to persuade the justice system to only implement home detention, so his "meeting in the home" could be preserved, and he could attend. And it all only came to light when one of the victims made it known that she would not attend the meeting in his home, and gave the reason why. He should have done jail time, based on what she says. To me, this was a blight on the those who sprang to his defense. All the crocodile tears shed at his convention testimonies in the years prior have a very hollow ring, as do the loud amens, by those who thought he "had it" and was a paragon of virtue.
In fairness to the current oversight, I think this occurred under the previous overseer who has since passed away. The one who would remove a meeting if there was a TV in the house!
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Apr 19, 2023 16:15:33 GMT -5
Curly might correct me if I am wrong, but the word (direct) from one of the victims of the "fat slob" was that his defense managed to persuade the justice system to only implement home detention, so his "meeting in the home" could be preserved, and he could attend. And it all only came to light when one of the victims made it known that she would not attend the meeting in his home, and gave the reason why. He should have done jail time, based on what she says. To me, this was a blight on the those who sprang to his defense. All the crocodile tears shed at his convention testimonies in the years prior have a very hollow ring, as do the loud amens, by those who thought he "had it" and was a paragon of virtue. Correct, |
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Dean Bruer
Apr 19, 2023 16:15:54 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by 1chinesewhispers on Apr 19, 2023 16:15:54 GMT -5
Wow that is truly dark and evil . For all involved
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👍 You need and deserve that! I am really pained and sorry about the awful experiences that you have had.
