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Post by verna on Sept 27, 2022 9:31:39 GMT -5
Growing up, I found it very hard to orientate myself to life. I was born and raised and felt a lot of guilt and confusion over leaving. But I’m glad for the journey, I believe it allowed me to be more thoughtful about things. The workers do a fairly good job of cultivating societal health in their flock. (Overall, as compared to societal health or lack there of in general). But when Jesus asks you to ponder hard over who your neighbor really is, It’s a lot like asking you to ponder hard over who you really are. I took the bait. I miss the good feelings and energy that can flow from being part of a tribe, but would not go back. In subtle and some not subtle ways, the workers’ idea of salvation is unhealthy and anti Christian. I like how you have put this Lee. I resonate with this. |
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Post by verna on Sept 27, 2022 9:40:57 GMT -5
I woke up early this morning around 3:30 AM and sit wondering why. Something seemed to be on my mind. I felt the need to do something but what? Then slowly it came to me, and I started thinking about when we look at the broad themes of Paul’s letters, they clearly paint a picture of Jesus as a hidden mystery only now being made known by Paul and other prophets like him, through divine revelation and scriptural interpretation. These ideas don’t come from isolated sentences, these ideas are the driving force behind Paul’s ministry. The whole point of Paul’s ministry according to Paul is to make the hidden mystery of Christ known, because without him and others like him, Jesus will remain unknown. I know I have written much about Paul on this board, but I have never been sure if I'm lost and alone in these thoughts. Will this thought be any different. and in the end what difference could it make? If I am correct why was there a need for a mystery? As usual intelchips I’m way behind you. However this is my sense. Paul believed he had a revelation and so went to great lengths to impart it. Not unlike William Irvine and maybe even some people in this board. They have been given the special revelation “Damn it - Listen to me”! I’m not a big fan of Paul. Maybe a blowhard. My sense was Jesus was a kinder gentler fellow. So no secret. Of course this is just how it sits with me. Pure conjecture of course. |
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Post by intelchips on Sept 27, 2022 9:45:57 GMT -5
I woke up early this morning around 3:30 AM and sit wondering why. Something seemed to be on my mind. I felt the need to do something but what? Then slowly it came to me, and I started thinking about when we look at the broad themes of Paul’s letters, they clearly paint a picture of Jesus as a hidden mystery only now being made known by Paul and other prophets like him, through divine revelation and scriptural interpretation. These ideas don’t come from isolated sentences, these ideas are the driving force behind Paul’s ministry. The whole point of Paul’s ministry according to Paul is to make the hidden mystery of Christ known, because without him and others like him, Jesus will remain unknown. I know I have written much about Paul on this board, but I have never been sure if I'm lost and alone in these thoughts. Will this thought be any different. and in the end what difference could it make? If I am correct why was there a need for a mystery? As usual intelchips I’m way behind you. However this is my sense. Paul believed he had a revelation and so went to great lengths to impart it. Not unlike William Irvine and maybe even some people in this board. They have been given the special revelation “Damn it - Listen to me”! I’m not a big fan of Paul. Maybe a blowhard. My sense was Jesus was a kinder gentler fellow. So no secret. Of course this is just how it sits with me. Pure conjecture of course. You may not agree with my acumen that there was a mystery. But, if you do then how do you answer my question? In case you missed it my question is contained in the last sentence. |
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Post by Lee on Sept 27, 2022 9:50:08 GMT -5
You are correct Intel.
The mystery of Christ is the mystery every serious person has ever concerned themselves with:
What were we meant to be. What would we be like if we were most who we are. Paul believed Jesus impersonated a man in whom a wisdom and self possession were timeless, the gold standard as it were. Paul believed as well, he was Gods olive branch offering to humanity.
Like any need to change, the essence of being saved consists of ceasing being one thing and hastening to something better, towards the grand benevolent social vision of the kingdom of heaven.
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Post by verna on Sept 27, 2022 10:09:51 GMT -5
As usual intelchips I’m way behind you. However this is my sense. Paul believed he had a revelation and so went to great lengths to impart it. Not unlike William Irvine and maybe even some people in this board. They have been given the special revelation “Damn it - Listen to me”! I’m not a big fan of Paul. Maybe a blowhard. My sense was Jesus was a kinder gentler fellow. So no secret. Of course this is just how it sits with me. Pure conjecture of course. You may not agree with my acumen that there was a mystery. But, if you do then how do you answer my question? In case you missed it my question is contained in the last sentence. Ya I guess I don’t get what you are saying again. You’re saying Paul thought there was a need for a mystery? Mystery is simply a fact of life to me. We don’t understand things? It’s a mystery. Yes some Christians want to see it as a mystery only revealed by the Holy Spirit. Seems to me that’s just a way to make some feel special. But intelchips I will butt out. As usual your questions interest me but I think maybe I just aggravate you because of my inability to understand. Please do not take it as a lack of interest. This inability to understand is the way I go through life. I aggravate a lot of folks. |
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Sept 27, 2022 12:36:03 GMT -5
As usual intelchips I’m way behind you. However this is my sense. Paul believed he had a revelation and so went to great lengths to impart it. Not unlike William Irvine and maybe even some people in this board. They have been given the special revelation “Damn it - Listen to me”! I’m not a big fan of Paul. Maybe a blowhard. My sense was Jesus was a kinder gentler fellow. So no secret. Of course this is just how it sits with me. Pure conjecture of course. You may not agree with my acumen that there was a mystery. But, if you do then how do you answer my question? In case you missed it my question is contained in the last sentence. My feeling is that Paul very much wanted to be the centre of attention, just like Irvine did. Cult leaders are much the same whatever the age. |
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Post by snow on Sept 27, 2022 13:27:01 GMT -5
I woke up early this morning around 3:30 AM and sit wondering why. Something seemed to be on my mind. I felt the need to do something but what? Then slowly it came to me, and I started thinking about when we look at the broad themes of Paul’s letters, they clearly paint a picture of Jesus as a hidden mystery only now being made known by Paul and other prophets like him, through divine revelation and scriptural interpretation. These ideas don’t come from isolated sentences, these ideas are the driving force behind Paul’s ministry. The whole point of Paul’s ministry according to Paul is to make the hidden mystery of Christ known, because without him and others like him, Jesus will remain unknown. I know I have written much about Paul on this board, but I have never been sure if I'm lost and alone in these thoughts. Will this thought be any different. and in the end what difference could it make? If I am correct why was there a need for a mystery? Paul never met Jesus. He taught a whole different message from the 12 apostles. He fell more into the group think of Jesus was not a flesh and blood person but a symbol which was part of Gnostic thought. His message was not apostle approved and they had to actually protect him when he visited Jerusalem because it was so off base. In one passage it tells of Paul having to refute what he was preaching so he could walk safely while visiting. Had to undergo an purification ritual. |
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Sept 27, 2022 13:37:51 GMT -5
I woke up early this morning around 3:30 AM and sit wondering why. Something seemed to be on my mind. I felt the need to do something but what? Then slowly it came to me, and I started thinking about when we look at the broad themes of Paul’s letters, they clearly paint a picture of Jesus as a hidden mystery only now being made known by Paul and other prophets like him, through divine revelation and scriptural interpretation. These ideas don’t come from isolated sentences, these ideas are the driving force behind Paul’s ministry. The whole point of Paul’s ministry according to Paul is to make the hidden mystery of Christ known, because without him and others like him, Jesus will remain unknown. I know I have written much about Paul on this board, but I have never been sure if I'm lost and alone in these thoughts. Will this thought be any different. and in the end what difference could it make? If I am correct why was there a need for a mystery? Paul never met Jesus. He taught a whole different message from the 12 apostles. He fell more into the group think of Jesus was not a flesh and blood person but a symbol which was part of Gnostic thought. His message was not apostle approved and they had to actually protect him when he visited Jerusalem because it was so off base. In one passage it tells of Paul having to refute what he was preaching so he could walk safely while visiting. Had to undergo an purification ritual. You could be describing Nathan's gospel. |
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Sept 27, 2022 13:57:32 GMT -5
Paul never met Jesus. He taught a whole different message from the 12 apostles. He fell more into the group think of Jesus was not a flesh and blood person but a symbol which was part of Gnostic thought. His message was not apostle approved and they had to actually protect him when he visited Jerusalem because it was so off base. In one passage it tells of Paul having to refute what he was preaching so he could walk safely while visiting. Had to undergo an purification ritual. You could be describing Nathan's gospel.
By the way, Paul met and saw the resurrected Jesus/God in Acts 9; 21. Jesus gave Paul the Revelation of Jesus Christ the New Testament covenant which bring better promises of eternal blessings, a better apostolic ministry than the temporary Levitical priesthood; a better New Testament of worship for believers; a better eternal Sabath/Christ and a New earth and heaven to enjoy.
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Post by verna on Sept 27, 2022 14:03:18 GMT -5
You may not agree with my acumen that there was a mystery. But, if you do then how do you answer my question? In case you missed it my question is contained in the last sentence. My feeling is that Paul very much wanted to be the centre of attention, just like Irvine did. Cult leaders are much the same whatever the age. That’s my impression too curly. |
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Sept 27, 2022 14:11:13 GMT -5
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Post by verna on Sept 27, 2022 14:16:54 GMT -5
You could be describing Nathan's gospel.
By the way, Paul met and saw the resurrected Jesus/God in Acts 9; 21. Jesus gave Paul the Revelation of Jesus Christ the New Testament covenant which bring better promises of eternal blessings, a better apostolic ministry than the temporary Levitical priesthood; a better New Testament of worship for believers; a better eternal Sabath/Christ and a New earth and heaven to enjoy.
Have you “met” Jesus Christ Nathan? |
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Sept 27, 2022 14:24:13 GMT -5
** King David once said The fool has said in his heart there is no God! The fools of today are saying the same thing! There is no God; no Jesus Christ; no heaven or hell. The fools say their ancestors are Apes and they are NOT create in the image and likeness of God. |
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Post by nathan2 on Sept 27, 2022 14:25:49 GMT -5
Yep! The 21st Century gospel of Jesus Christ to mankind... the coming of a NEW Dawn... 1000 yrs reign on earth and the Universe to come.
By the way, Paul met and saw the resurrected Jesus/God in Acts 9; 21.
Jesus gave Paul the Revelation of Jesus Christ the New Testament covenant which bring better promises of eternal blessings, a better apostolic ministry than the temporary Levitical priesthood; a better New Testament of worship for believers; a better eternal Sabath/Christ and a New earth and heaven to enjoy.
Have you “met” Jesus Christ Nathan? ** I have NOT met Christ in person, yet but I have heard His voice in my dream to guide me where to live/Oregon and start in the work there in 1986-93. Another time at the age of 17 I believed it was God's guidance to me in my dream through Buddha "What Christ has offered is better than what I can give you." I obeyed God's voice and became Jesus Christ follower The 12 apostles were stuck in the Old Testament covenant mode and didn't want to let it go! They want to keep NEW wine/Jesus New Testament teachings keep with the Old Covenant Moses teachings bottle/wine skins. It can't work! That way Because the New wine will burst the old wine skins bag. Paul told them to toss Moses Old Covenant wine skins bag away, it had served it temporary usefulness. They must put the New Wine/Jesus teachings in a New wines skin bottle/bag for it to work properly. |
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Post by snow on Sept 27, 2022 15:48:59 GMT -5
Paul never met Jesus. He taught a whole different message from the 12 apostles. He fell more into the group think of Jesus was not a flesh and blood person but a symbol which was part of Gnostic thought. His message was not apostle approved and they had to actually protect him when he visited Jerusalem because it was so off base. In one passage it tells of Paul having to refute what he was preaching so he could walk safely while visiting. Had to undergo an purification ritual. You could be describing Nathan's gospel. Pretty much. Nathan definitely doesn't follow the 2x2 beliefs. |
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Sept 27, 2022 16:55:44 GMT -5
You could be describing Nathan's gospel. Pretty much. Nathan definitely doesn't follow the 2x2 beliefs. ** I believe in the current 2x2 gospel, the apostolic 2x2 ministry and worshipping God, partake the emblems in the homes of believers on Sunday. I just disagree with the current workers in 1970s anti-Trinity and anti-Christ teachings to the fiends that He is NOT God the Second Person of the Triune God. The early days 2x2 most of the workers taught and believed in the Trinity and Jesus is God/Yahweh the Christ. I also believe Christ Jesus is alive and sharing the gospel message in the 21st century to mankind... To prepare the true believers for the New Dawn! A New beginning/Chapter. Christ/God The King of kings is coming to establish and RULE His eternal kingdom on earth and in the Universe with true believers from the Old and new Testament. Christ's head quarter will be built in Jerusalem. |
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Post by verna on Sept 27, 2022 20:46:28 GMT -5
Have you “met” Jesus Christ Nathan? ** I have NOT met Christ in person, yet but I have heard His voice in my dream to guide me where to live/Oregon and start in the work there in 1986-93. Another time at the age of 17 I believed it was God's guidance to me in my dream through Buddha "What Christ has offered is better than what I can give you." I obeyed God's voice and became Jesus Christ follower The 12 apostles were stuck in the Old Testament covenant mode and didn't want to let it go! They want to keep NEW wine/Jesus New Testament teachings keep with the Old Covenant Moses teachings bottle/wine skins. It can't work! That way Because the New wine will burst the old wine skins bag. Paul told them to toss Moses Old Covenant wine skins bag away, it had served it temporary usefulness. They must put the New Wine/Jesus teachings in a New wines skin bottle/bag for it to work properly. So then you do realize that Paul did not actually “meet” Jesus? |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2022 20:58:34 GMT -5
** I have NOT met Christ in person, yet but I have heard His voice in my dream to guide me where to live/Oregon and start in the work there in 1986-93. Another time at the age of 17 I believed it was God's guidance to me in my dream through Buddha "What Christ has offered is better than what I can give you." I obeyed God's voice and became Jesus Christ follower The 12 apostles were stuck in the Old Testament covenant mode and didn't want to let it go! They want to keep NEW wine/Jesus New Testament teachings keep with the Old Covenant Moses teachings bottle/wine skins. It can't work! That way Because the New wine will burst the old wine skins bag. Paul told them to toss Moses Old Covenant wine skins bag away, it had served it temporary usefulness. They must put the New Wine/Jesus teachings in a New wines skin bottle/bag for it to work properly. So then you do realize that Paul did not actually “meet” Jesus? He met his spirit not his body... |
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Sept 27, 2022 21:17:03 GMT -5
** I have NOT met Christ in person, yet but I have heard His voice in my dream to guide me where to live/Oregon and start in the work there in 1986-93. Another time at the age of 17 I believed it was God's guidance to me in my dream through Buddha "What Christ has offered is better than what I can give you." I obeyed God's voice and became Jesus Christ follower The 12 apostles were stuck in the Old Testament covenant mode and didn't want to let it go! They want to keep NEW wine/Jesus New Testament teachings keep with the Old Covenant Moses teachings bottle/wine skins. It can't work! That way Because the New wine will burst the old wine skins bag. Paul told them to toss Moses Old Covenant wine skins bag away, it had served it temporary usefulness. They must put the New Wine/Jesus teachings in a New wines skin bottle/bag for it to work properly. So then you do realize that Paul did not actually “meet” Jesus? *** Let me clarify Paul didn't meet Jesus in person when he was alive. However, he met some of Jesus apostles and followers of Jesus. Paul put some of Jesus followers in prison and he persecuted them very badly. Paul must have heard about Jesus life, death and resurrection from his followers in Jerusalem. The resurrected Christ Jesus saw Saul/Paul was a man with a good heart, a God fearing man but misguided in the wrong path from the will and way of God. The resurrected Christ appeared to Saul/Paul on the road to Damascus in His glorious God form bright like the noon day Sun. The resurrected Jesus/God spoke to him face to face and Paul recognized it was Jesus who spoke to him. Jesus to Ananais a follower of Jesus about Paul, and to baptize him. Jesus told Paul about Ananias, who would come and heal his eyes sight blinded by Christ/God glorious, bright form. Ananias came to the house where Paul was staying, he healed him and welcome him to stay with the followers of Jesus living in Damascus area. A few years later, the apostle Barnabas took Paul in the ministry Acts 11. Bananas was one of the 70 apostles in Luke 10. |
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Post by fixit on Sept 27, 2022 21:48:31 GMT -5
I woke up early this morning around 3:30 AM and sit wondering why. Something seemed to be on my mind. I felt the need to do something but what? Then slowly it came to me, and I started thinking about when we look at the broad themes of Paul’s letters, they clearly paint a picture of Jesus as a hidden mystery only now being made known by Paul and other prophets like him, through divine revelation and scriptural interpretation. These ideas don’t come from isolated sentences, these ideas are the driving force behind Paul’s ministry. The whole point of Paul’s ministry according to Paul is to make the hidden mystery of Christ known, because without him and others like him, Jesus will remain unknown. I know I have written much about Paul on this board, but I have never been sure if I'm lost and alone in these thoughts. Will this thought be any different. and in the end what difference could it make? If I am correct why was there a need for a mystery? The mystery is the Christ within. |
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Post by verna on Sept 27, 2022 21:52:03 GMT -5
I woke up early this morning around 3:30 AM and sit wondering why. Something seemed to be on my mind. I felt the need to do something but what? Then slowly it came to me, and I started thinking about when we look at the broad themes of Paul’s letters, they clearly paint a picture of Jesus as a hidden mystery only now being made known by Paul and other prophets like him, through divine revelation and scriptural interpretation. These ideas don’t come from isolated sentences, these ideas are the driving force behind Paul’s ministry. The whole point of Paul’s ministry according to Paul is to make the hidden mystery of Christ known, because without him and others like him, Jesus will remain unknown. I know I have written much about Paul on this board, but I have never been sure if I'm lost and alone in these thoughts. Will this thought be any different. and in the end what difference could it make? If I am correct why was there a need for a mystery? The mystery is the Christ within. But as I understand it intelchips wants to k ow specifically why there is a need for a mystery, not what the mystery is. |
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Post by Dan on Sept 27, 2022 23:05:58 GMT -5
I woke up early this morning around 3:30 AM and sit wondering why. Something seemed to be on my mind. I felt the need to do something but what? Then slowly it came to me, and I started thinking about when we look at the broad themes of Paul’s letters, they clearly paint a picture of Jesus as a hidden mystery only now being made known by Paul and other prophets like him, through divine revelation and scriptural interpretation. These ideas don’t come from isolated sentences, these ideas are the driving force behind Paul’s ministry. The whole point of Paul’s ministry according to Paul is to make the hidden mystery of Christ known, because without him and others like him, Jesus will remain unknown. I know I have written much about Paul on this board, but I have never been sure if I'm lost and alone in these thoughts. Will this thought be any different. and in the end what difference could it make? If I am correct why was there a need for a mystery?
There's no mystery, just an ongoing unveiling of the truth. Paul didn't talk in riddles, he explained everything in detail. When something is explained and you have a definitive answer, there's no more mystery about it.
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Post by Dan on Sept 27, 2022 23:15:34 GMT -5
** I have NOT met Christ in person, yet but I have heard His voice in my dream to guide me where to live/Oregon and start in the work there in 1986-93. Another time at the age of 17 I believed it was God's guidance to me in my dream through Buddha "What Christ has offered is better than what I can give you." I obeyed God's voice and became Jesus Christ follower The 12 apostles were stuck in the Old Testament covenant mode and didn't want to let it go! They want to keep NEW wine/Jesus New Testament teachings keep with the Old Covenant Moses teachings bottle/wine skins. It can't work! That way Because the New wine will burst the old wine skins bag. Paul told them to toss Moses Old Covenant wine skins bag away, it had served it temporary usefulness. They must put the New Wine/Jesus teachings in a New wines skin bottle/bag for it to work properly. So then you do realize that Paul did not actually “meet” Jesus?
Not in person, but in a sense, if someone talks to you and you converse with them, you've essentially met them. “And I fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to me, ‘Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?’ So I answered, ‘Who are You, Lord?’ And He said to me, ‘I am Jesus of Nazareth, whom you are persecuting.’ And those who were with me indeed saw the light and were afraid, but they did not hear the voice of Him who spoke to me. So I said, ‘What shall I do, Lord?’ And the Lord said to me, ‘Arise and go into Damascus, and there you will be told all things which are appointed for you to do.’ (Acts 22: 7-10)
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Post by BobWilliston on Sept 27, 2022 23:17:45 GMT -5
In enumerating the powers of government, and adopting a bill of rights, the framers of our constitution sought to protect us from our own “best” interests. What a farcical, pharisaical, concept of civil "rights" -- the right of the government determine what is YOUR best interest. The bill of rights contains the rights of individuals, not the rights of government. Right. If you had your druthers, what expression of governance would you choose to live under, or through? A full democracy. Scipture, please. Yes, "if" -- but they didn't. They were tired of the government doing "what the government thought was good for them". |
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Sept 27, 2022 23:55:55 GMT -5
So then you do realize that Paul did not actually “meet” Jesus?
Not in person, but in a sense, if someone talks to you and you converse with them, you've essentially met them. “And I fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to me, ‘Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?’ So I answered, ‘Who are You, Lord?’ And He said to me, ‘I am Jesus of Nazareth, whom you are persecuting.’ And those who were with me indeed saw the light and were afraid, but they did not hear the voice of Him who spoke to me. So I said, ‘What shall I do, Lord?’ And the Lord said to me, ‘Arise and go into Damascus, and there you will be told all things which are appointed for you to do.’ (Acts 22: 7-10)
Countless people hear voices in the head. It seems to be a great way to start a new cult. Common sense tells us that it's a load of bollocks. |
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Post by BobWilliston on Sept 28, 2022 0:04:48 GMT -5
So then you do realize that Paul did not actually “meet” Jesus? Not in person, but in a sense, if someone talks to you and you converse with them, you've essentially met them. “And I fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to me, ‘Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?’ So I answered, ‘Who are You, Lord?’ And He said to me, ‘I am Jesus of Nazareth, whom you are persecuting.’ And those who were with me indeed saw the light and were afraid, but they did not hear the voice of Him who spoke to me. So I said, ‘What shall I do, Lord?’ And the Lord said to me, ‘Arise and go into Damascus, and there you will be told all things which are appointed for you to do.’ (Acts 22: 7-10)
But Saul didn't see him. It was more of a dream-like experience, not really a brain-fart. |
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Post by chuck on Sept 28, 2022 4:04:33 GMT -5
Dan just because you dont see how the church could hurt someone does not mean the church has not and still does not hurt someone, it could just mean you cannot see it. I am all to familiar with the thought process of "everyone should see it like me" and if they can't something is wrong with them!. Regardless of whether my thought is correct or incorrect to approach it in this manner one has to elevate themselves above others, to do this is technically to be an "unbeliever" in the Christ character or an unbeliever in the Christ.
How did the church hurt you? Not agreeing with them is not necessarily a source of pain. A spiritual disagreement can be contentious, but I can't see how one can be hurt by it. The habitual complainers didn't like the rules (modest dress, worldly separation, etc), but I still don't completely interpret that as being hurt. It is what it is, i.e; The Seventh Day Adventist keep the Saturday sabbath, if you were a member and wanted to work on Saturdays, would you do a public podcast and whine about how they ruined your life?
Every church can come off as supercilious, they all interpret scripture and establish doctrine as confirmation of being correct. But I don't think its done in arrogance, they all sincerely believe that they are right, and they can't very well alter what they preach and teach in order to please every contentious objection. No one elevates themselves above Christ, the ultimate objective is to see it like he did, and that's an impossible task for an unbeliever.
I can see how overzealous parents can interfere with a normal childhood, whereby causing some resentment later in life. But some of the podcast commentaries seemed exaggerated and painted the W&F as extremist and religious zealots. If you compare the Truth to the Mennonites or Amish, they'd come off as being pretty passive. So I prefer to keep things in perspective, most of the complainers just felt that the church was too strict and they didn't like conforming to the rules.
It's not about me or me disagreeing with the church. I see the church hurting people all the time, I see people having mental breakdowns/issues because they cannot be what the church expects them to be so they take it out on others and themselves to the point that it actually kills them from time to time. I see it ripping families apart, I see it isolating young children, I see hurting people in all manner of ways in varying degrees. Some is done in arrogance, some is not, if you come from the religious position that you have something others don't you have already assumed a position of arrogance. Ie believer and unbeliever on the religious spectrum is highly arrogant all in its sincerity. I believe many elevate themselves above the Christ, Christ is a Character used by NT writer's, Most likely Jesus was a Hebrew man who displayed the Christ character according to NT writers. I don't believe your definition of and unbeliever bears much resemblance to the culture this idea came from. Sure there may have been some supernatural thought process going on but that was hardly the essence of being a believer in the death of the selfish character(man) and ressurection of the Christ Character(grace compassion ect). Death and ressurection is something you do if you believe in it, it is not something to be diminished down to a simple thought in your head about a supernatural superstition of a literal man coming out of the literal grave and if people do not think that is literally true in their own minds then they are a unbeliever, that is arrogance born from ignorance which leads to the church hurting other people. |
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Post by nathan on Sept 28, 2022 8:33:17 GMT -5
So then you/Nathan do realize that Paul did not actually “meet” Jesus?
Not in person, but in a sense, if someone talks to you and you converse with them, you've essentially met them.
“And I fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to me, ‘Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?’ So I answered, ‘Who are You, Lord?’ And He said to me, ‘I am Jesus of Nazareth, whom you are persecuting.’ And those who were with me indeed saw the light and were afraid, but they did not hear the voice of Him who spoke to me.
So I said, ‘What shall I do, Lord?’ And the Lord said to me, ‘Arise and go into Damascus, and there you will be told all things which are appointed for you to do.’ (Acts 22: 7-10)
Amen, Dan. Acts 22:17-22 And it came to pass, that, when I was come again to Jerusalem, even while I/Paul prayed in the temple, I was in a trance; And saw him/Jesus saying unto me, "Make haste, and get thee quickly out of Jerusalem: for they will not receive thy testimony concerning me."And I said, " Lord, they know that I imprisoned and beat in every synagogue them that believed on thee: And when the blood of thy martyr Stephen was shed, I also was standing by, and consenting unto his death, and kept the raiment of them that slew him." And he/Jesus said unto me, "Depart: for I will send thee far hence unto the Gentiles." And they gave him audience unto this word, and then lifted up their voices, and said, Away with such a fellow from the earth: for it is not fit that he should live. |
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