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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2015 21:41:26 GMT -5
Fred Quote - "I feasted at the workers table for 40 years before understanding that I was only getting milk but needed meat to mature.
Fred, what is this "meat" you say has "matured" you?
I have been to many churches over the years and found
no meat - often just men in gowns reading from notes
about generic Chrsitian ideas - and asking for more
money.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jul 24, 2015 21:41:52 GMT -5
No, Nathan, I can't explain how the animals will be in "heaven."
After all, we too are animals-(check it out instead of the Sci-Fic that is your usual reading.)
Maybe it is just because human animals have created a place called "heaven."
Why, are you keeping answering my posts, following me on TMB.
Can't you remember what you wrote?
However, periodically someone answers you in a post that I see. |
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Post by Roselyn T on Jul 24, 2015 21:47:24 GMT -5
That's been my experience Jesse.
I asked when it all started when I was young and I was told about the early Workers in Ireland.
Can't remember Irvine's name being mentioned
Did they tell you that the **TRUTH** **THE WAY** as you know it NOW, began with those early workers?
How did they explain it?
It wouldn't seem to me unusual for them to omit everything about Irvine!
After all, he was excommunicated by them!
It would be a bit awkward to bring his name into the picture after doing that.
Then they would have to explain to you, a Newbie, -why they excommunicated him; who was , if not the leader, at least one of the main workers.
My own opinion is that whole affair was the real reason that the workers just let the knowledge of when & by whom the **TRUTH** started slip into oblivion.
It was too awkward to let all the facts be public.
The trouble with doing that, however, is that it allowed whole generations of people professing to believe that the **TRUTH** did go all the way back to the apostles.
Now don't say that didn't happen, Bert!
Because it did!
If the workers hadn't done that, why would there have been so many people as upset as they were when the Truth about **TRUTH** was first made widely known?
Even young workers, out giving their lives assuming that what they were doing went all the way back to Jesus time, believed it and became very upset!
So, - just how did the workers explain all this to you?
Yes Bert, I would be interested in knowing how the workers explained this to you and when ? Considering there are people/workers in Australia today that are still not aware of who Irvine was.
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Post by Mary on Jul 24, 2015 22:59:36 GMT -5
Fred Quote - "I feasted at the workers table for 40 years before understanding that I was only getting milk but needed meat to mature.
Fred, what is this "meat" you say has "matured" you?
I have been to many churches over the years and found
no meat - often just men in gowns reading from notes
about generic Chrsitian ideas - and asking for more
money.That's not been my experience Bert. Not seen any gowns, or asking for money, nor reading from notes but then I do expect a good prepared sermon and not some old thing hashed off the top of their head spinning around the same few verses the worker preach from trying to convince themselves and others they are the only true way. All I've had is meat since leaving meetings. |
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Post by hberry on Jul 24, 2015 23:04:13 GMT -5
Fred Quote - "I feasted at the workers table for 40 years before understanding that I was only getting milk but needed meat to mature.
Fred, what is this "meat" you say has "matured" you?
I have been to many churches over the years and found
no meat - often just men in gowns reading from notes
about generic Chrsitian ideas - and asking for more
money.That's not been my experience Bert. Not seen any gowns, or asking for money, nor reading from notes but then I do expect a good prepared sermon and not some old thing hashed off the top of their head spinning around the same few verses the worker preach from trying to convince themselves and others they are the only true way. All I've had is meat since leaving meetings. Same here. Verse by verse teaching is a joy. |
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Post by Mary on Jul 24, 2015 23:08:04 GMT -5
Considering they took Edward Cooney's name off the hymn sheet a few years ago, they are trying to let all those past embarrassing exes disappear into thin air.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jul 24, 2015 23:10:56 GMT -5
Oh, I do have you on ignore, Nathan!
However, periodically someone answers you in a post that I see.
Why should I put you on ignore forever ?
Am I making you reconsider your beliefs? That can be uncomfortable.
You could just put me on ignore instead, -right? |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2015 4:15:23 GMT -5
Jesse quote - "P.S. Quoting the messenger's own words is NOT attacking the messenger!"
It was for me. I got some much vicious bile and personal
attacks I had to shut down my weekly quote thread.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2015 4:21:17 GMT -5
Considering they took Edward Cooney's name off the hymn sheet a few years ago, they are trying to let all those past embarrassing exes disappear into thin air.
I would have taken him off, too.
And I wish I could remove a few
relatives from our family history
book.
And there's a few friends of mine
I would like to forget as well.
ps Is Ilylo the author of the TTT? |
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Post by Mary on Jul 25, 2015 4:48:58 GMT -5
We loved your quote thread Bert. We just didn't like you spending so much time on us unworthy exes when you could be doing better things with your time.
P.S. I don't know who is the author of TTT or TLC or your website. All I know is when your lady Prue disappeared off your pic so did your website.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2015 5:50:01 GMT -5
Website will be up and running again, one day.
I just need to time to sort out a new ISP.
No big dramas.
I am about five years behind too with my new
site, the Q&A.
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Post by snow on Jul 25, 2015 9:58:54 GMT -5
The thread is Doug Parker.........evolution is doing it's job again. It's all my fault. I mentioned Rudolph (you know, the red-nosed guy)....and here we are. I'm not sure it is you're fault lol. howitis brought up the lie of Santa Claus, then Gene said he was writing a book exposing Santa Claus and then I asked if I was going to hell for not believing in Santa Claus and well, the rest as they say 'is history'. It evolved... ok all done now ha!  |
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Post by snow on Jul 25, 2015 10:02:03 GMT -5
Jesse quote - "P.S. Quoting the messenger's own words is NOT attacking the messenger!"
It was for me. I got some much vicious bile and personal
attacks I had to shut down my weekly quote thread.I looked forward to your weekly quote thread. And your hand drawn cartoons. |
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Post by CherieKropp on Jul 25, 2015 13:52:33 GMT -5
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Post by Jesse_Lackman on Jul 25, 2015 19:36:35 GMT -5
I've been wondering how The Secret Sect would have been received if A spiritual Fraud Exposed had never been published. If you think about it from a big picture point of view Doug poisoned his own well with A spiritual Fraud Exposed . Anyone who received that document was not likely to be too interested in The Secret Sect , and most likely would think it was going to be more of the same. Goes to show the tone of a message is probably as important as the message.
In A spiritual Fraud Exposed Doug makes it sound like there was more he published on the fellowship;
If there was more Doug published around 1954 where can it be found? Doug said in his 1995 testimony in Washington State "I also had a business - a newspaper business it was." Anyone know the name of his newspaper business?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2015 21:36:32 GMT -5
"If there was more Doug published around 1954 where can it be found? Doug said in his 1995 testimony in Washington State "I also had a business - a newspaper business it was." Anyone know the name of his newspaper business?"
Jesse would could go to Washington State and
research this guy. Write a book on him. If
someone doesn't like it we can say "Have you
done the research like we have? We were there."
But there's a problem - no former member is
going to read a "Member's Version" book. And
no Member is going to read it either - even
if you found a line of Workers going back to
Jesus. That's not what the Gospel is about.
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Post by Jesse_Lackman on Jul 25, 2015 21:49:37 GMT -5
"If there was more Doug published around 1954 where can it be found? Doug said in his 1995 testimony in Washington State "I also had a business - a newspaper business it was." Anyone know the name of his newspaper business?"
Jesse would could go to Washington State and
research this guy. Write a book on him. If
someone doesn't like it we can say "Have you
done the research like we have? We were there."
But there's a problem - no former member is
going to read a "Member's Version" book. And
no Member is going to read it either - even
if you found a line of Workers going back to
Jesus. That's not what the Gospel is about.Yes that is true. Doug is from Australia, he was in Washington State in 1995, while there he gave his testimony which was transcribed by Lloyd Fortt. It's on VOT, here is a google cache link to it; webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:Yj6GnmwMvTsJ:www.votisalive.com/content/doug-parkers-testimony+&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2015 22:04:13 GMT -5
Thanks for that.
Any material is helpful.
I began reading this but
it seems to be about about
himself.
I guess ordinary sermons
about Jesus won't wind up
on the internet.
Magowan seems to have
summed the man up pretty
well.
Just seeing the title "The
Secret Sect" summed him up
for me - as if we are secret,
as if we are a sect. "This
isn't going to a scholarly
book!" I thought as I began
reading.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jul 26, 2015 0:02:55 GMT -5
Why, Nathan?
Why should I put you on ignore forever ?
Am I making you reconsider your beliefs?
Hardly, dmg.
That can be uncomfortable.
Discussing things with you like banging my head against a brick wall. I Don't want to bang my head against a brick wall constantly.... It gives me too much headaches. The Best thing for me is to ignore your replies to my posts from now on.
You could just put me on ignore instead, -right? Yes, I will definitely ignore your replies to me on the TMB. This is my LAST and Final post to you on TMB.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2015 4:28:17 GMT -5
It's an interesting point.
Thanks.
There's this reasoning that if one church
is false, they are all false. That's no
different than saying that if one FAITH is
false (say Hinduism) then they are all
false.
And another reasoning which states you
need to judge churches by what they have
in common, not what makes them different.
And another that just as there's Shakers,
JW's, Mormons etc in the 19th Century
there was this same proliferation in the
1st Century, too.
You see what you want to see - both you
and me. I look at what differentiates us
from ALL churches, you look at inevitable
similarities.
You look at emergent churches, I look at
the foundation church.
As an aside, going back to home churches
was a serious issue during the 16th and
17th Centuries. As it was, those who did
just that were not seen by historians as
being "normal" churches.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2015 5:27:32 GMT -5
True, I basically agree with you on all points.
But on one point - you have heard it said that we
differ in "spirit."
That's wonderfully undefined to lots of people.
But last year I attended another convention for
one day - I honesty can't remember what church
it was, something supported by a college.
I was advised not to eat the food as I hadn't
paid so I went hungry. I could listen to a band
or do a "course" on the Trinity. I did the course.
We were given pen and paper and had to think of
something that was "three things in one - like an
egg is a yoke, shell and egg white." And then
draw a picture of our choice.
Frankly, I found the experience quite sad.
One church leased the farm next to ours in NSW.
They set up a Convention in some sheds.
We threatened to call the police because the kids
kept running sticks along the corrugated iron, or
banging on it. Every year...
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Post by CherieKropp on Jul 26, 2015 8:48:00 GMT -5
Thanks for that.
Any material is helpful.
I began reading this but
it seems to be about about
himself.
I guess ordinary sermons
about Jesus won't wind up
on the internet.
Magowan seems to have
summed the man up pretty
well.
Just seeing the title "The
Secret Sect" summed him up
for me - as if we are secret,
as if we are a sect. "This
isn't going to a scholarly
book!" I thought as I began
reading. I suspect they largely withdrew from the public (became secretive i.e. the secret sect) after the 8 lawsuits they went through around 1913--when Mr. Wilson accused them of white slave trafficking the sister workers. This is just my opinion. Read more here: www.tellingthetruth.info/founder_book/23wmibook.php |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2015 11:19:42 GMT -5
I am not in the public simply
because I can see that what I
live for is not acceptable to
other people.
I have friends who have known
me for thirty or forty years
and have never shown any
interest in asking me of my
church, or talking about things
of a religious nature.
Tying this to church policy,
particularly some policy from
1913, is ludicrous. It reminds
me of people here who say that
Jesus' story is a series of
unexpected events. Not so.
But thanks for the 1913 quote
anyhow - it is sounds so trite
and dismissive, which of course
it is.
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Post by Jesse_Lackman on Jul 27, 2015 14:35:14 GMT -5
Come on bert, you really don't think we should be defined by a highly objective and factual article like this one from 1912? Are you really going to try and convince anyone the fellowship meetings you go to today aren't like that?? |
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Post by jondough on Jul 27, 2015 16:18:43 GMT -5
In my opinion, exes and 2X2 (Athiest are the exception) agree on 90 percent. We all just argue hard over the 10 percent.
Hopefully we all agree on the most important things.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2015 17:51:43 GMT -5
Come on bert, you really don't think we should be defined by a highly objective and factual article like this one from 1912? Are you really going to try and convince anyone the fellowship meetings you go to today aren't like that??
Thanks. Where did THIS totally factual
and impartial observation come from? |
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Post by dmmichgood on Jul 27, 2015 20:19:39 GMT -5
In my opinion, exes and 2X2 ( Athiest are the exception) agree on 90 percent. We all just argue hard over the 10 percent. Hopefully we all agree on the most important things.
Should it be any wonder that the exe's & the 2x2's argue hard over the 10 percent?
When I first left the **WAY,** I was bereft for awhile.
After all, that had been my life until then!
(One thing about them is they certainly take up so much of your time you have very time for anything else)
I was in a sort of limbo.
That was when I begin looking at other Christian religions.
What did I find?
Basically the same thing as the **TRUTH** except they also argued all the time over nit-picking things.
So I begin to wonder why people need any religion in their lives to start with?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2015 20:24:24 GMT -5
I suppose one person's standard of
living is another person's "nit pick"
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