ally
New Member
Posts: 25
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Post by ally on Aug 14, 2007 10:41:51 GMT -5
Just curious:
To those of you on this board who are currently porfessing and attending meetings please can you tell me what it is about the meetings that you believe makes it the one true way, the only path to heaven?
A sincere question,
rgds Ally
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Post by diet coke on Aug 14, 2007 10:54:58 GMT -5
I don't believe that. But, I don't count, Ally. I realize I am far from mainstream, but then, mainstream f&w's are not interested in this board. The answer you are looking for is not going to come.
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Post by someguy on Aug 14, 2007 11:00:51 GMT -5
I don't believe it either ally, however, as diet coke pointed out the answer you are looking for most likely won't come here. I too feel I am far from mainstream.
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Post by Sylvestra on Aug 14, 2007 11:30:06 GMT -5
My mother, who has attended the meetings of the F & W since her birth in 1923, told me recently that she "still believes the "Truth" is the right way to follow Jesus because of the workers without a home and the meetings in the home like we were instructed in the Bible". I'm not a current 2x2, but that is the best I can do for you. I agree with the two responses that we have already, that you likely won't get this answered by anyone from the F & W who comes here! Edy
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Post by junia on Aug 14, 2007 11:40:44 GMT -5
I don't believe it either. In fact, I'll go as far as to say if you do believe it, your faith is in something other than Christ, and you may still be lost.
There are a couple of participants here who believe the 2x2 church is the true church, but good luck getting a straight answer from them!
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Post by freespirit on Aug 14, 2007 12:40:13 GMT -5
I believe that Jesus is the way.
In fact, one of the speakers at the last convention that I went to was quite clear on this point. (Of course some others were a little more... uh... murky.) peace, freespirit
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Post by Stefan on Aug 14, 2007 13:23:30 GMT -5
Just curious: To those of you on this board who are currently porfessing and attending meetings please can you tell me what it is about the meetings that you believe makes it the one true way, the only path to heaven? A sincere question, rgds Ally I'm not professing but I was B&R and I am the only one in my family that is not professing. Most of my relatives are professing too. My professing relatives of my generation (most of them) don't seem to believe that it's the "only way." They believe that the relationship between a person and God is what is important, not a system. They enjoy the fellowship of being a 2x2 and they believe that the "2x2 way" is the closest to what the Bible teaches. The 2x2 system helps them have the close relationship with God that they seek. My mom pretty much believes the same thing. I could never see myself as a 2x2 once I became a teenager and I asked her many times if she thought I was hellbound. She just smiled and said, "God knows the heart of everyone." She has made a point to tell me several times in my life that I have a wonderful heart. Don't you just love moms! I do believe that my professing grandpa believes that 2x2's know the only way to Heaven. It's all he's ever known. I think he professed when he was about 12. I may not agree with him on that one, but he is still a fantastic grandpa anyway. He has never treated a non-professing person with any less respect than a professing person. Despite me not being a 2x2, I probably have a closer relationship with him than anyone else does. Seems conflicting doesn't it? So maybe he isn't as exclusive as I think he is. Stefan
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savedbyblood
Junior Member
Eventually we'll figure it all out!
Posts: 57
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Post by savedbyblood on Aug 15, 2007 2:07:50 GMT -5
Just curious: To those of you on this board who are currently professing and attending meetings please can you tell me what it is about the meetings that you believe makes it the one true way, the only path to heaven? A sincere question, rgds Ally Ally, This is something I used to believe and I thought it so wonderful that I (Yes! ME!) Who had nothing in his short years to make my God in Heaven look down on me with Special Favor! My Parents professed when I was 5 or 6 so I might as well say that I was B&R in this Way. I never knew anything else. And it was all good. These professing Friends helped my folks through some very tough times what with having three children, two with severe heart problems and one (li'l ole me, the first with heart and kidney problems) (man, I got to stop giving this evidence out because the Workers are gonna find me here and clobber me!!!) (At least I did not mention my adopted sister, that would have been a dead giveaway!) Then one day in High School, one of the two other professing friends there riled on my best buddy for being a Methodist and told him in no uncertain terms that he was going to Hell. :(This kind of treatment embarrassed me. Even if we were better than everybody else, we did not need to go around condemning them. This was to be the job of Jesus Christ on the Day of Judgment unless I had misunderstood and we were not to judge here on the earth. Long story short, 30+ years later I am still friends with both of these people. The professing one from high school is still professing and married to a professing man with professing children. I am a professing man married to (but separated from at her desire to leave her family) a professing woman and I have custody of our 6 year old child. Not even marrying in the Truth is safe anymore, and more posts will come on this matter. (The man shot down by the professing student is still the best friend I have on this earth. (Sorry Workers, but he is a searching agnostic and deserves my friendship and prayers.) When I was dying in the Hospital a couple of years ago I did get a few visits from the Friends and Workers. I got many more from my wife and child and parents. My wife even spent many nights at my bedside with me in a recliner or roll-away in order to be near me. This crazy agnostic spent every day between shifts with me even over the long days of my coma. He was there as much or more than my own family. His twin Brother has died recently and he has began to think more about his future and his own mortality and is asking me some of Jesus. I will be here for him. ;D My mother's parents died outside the Truth. Her dad professed for a number of years but when he became bedridden the friends in his city began to neglect him. Mom and I know that he is saved. Mom's mother, my granny could barely read or write her name. She never knew the year of her birth. The Church of Christ got their clutches in her and were so much more willing to see her get to church than the friends were to help grandpa that this is where she put her trust in Jesus. Mom and I know she is saved because she loved Jesus. ;D A great uncle of my wife is unable to attend meetings and so people do not visit him. He was never a Super Saint therefore forgotten but for me and my wife. His professing wife died and since it had been so long since the Friends or Workers here had visited them he chose a Minister out of the Phone book to give the Eulogy for his wife. Not as many friends showed up as they do when a Super Saint dies. Sometimes the treatment within the Way is pitifully lacking. Jesus left a way for all to be saved, not just a "chosen few" So after all of the long-winded talk, I cannot tell you I think that this Way is the One and Only True Way, or the only Path to Heaven. I think this Way is secure as long as you do not allow petty rules that have little or nothing to do with believing in Jesus Christ as your Lord and King and God in Heaven is our Ruler, the one we worship. We will find pettiness anywhere we have man attempting to control something given us by Sacrifice. This Sacrifice was made because God in Heaven so loved the world that He gave His Only Begotten Son for this purpose. Peace in Him SBB
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Post by ranman77007 on Aug 15, 2007 2:22:38 GMT -5
Just curious: To those of you on this board who are currently porfessing and attending meetings please can you tell me what it is about the meetings that you believe makes it the one true way, the only path to heaven? A sincere question, rgds Ally because Jesus speaks through the people, and the Spirit is refreshing.... its like coming out of the cold, and walking into a warm room.....
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Post by ii on Aug 15, 2007 3:05:21 GMT -5
My mother, who has attended the meetings of the F & W since her birth in 1923, told me recently that she "still believes the "Truth" is the right way to follow Jesus because of the workers without a home and the meetings in the home like we were instructed in the Bible". I'm not a current 2x2, but that is the best I can do for you. I agree with the two responses that we have already, that you likely won't get this answered by anyone from the F & W who comes here! Edy you be a good gall and listen to your mom now
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Post by ii on Aug 15, 2007 3:10:01 GMT -5
I believe that Jesus is the way. In fact, one of the speakers at the last convention that I went to was quite clear on this point. (Of course some others were a little more... uh... murky.) peace, freespirit i believe that Jesus is the way also and follow Him in the way He left on record of how to follow Him is it believing Jesus is the way by following Him in a man made way? can we follow Jesus by doing so?
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Post by gloryintruth on Aug 15, 2007 3:55:18 GMT -5
To those of you on this board who are currently porfessing and attending meetings please can you tell me what it is about the meetings that you believe makes it the one true way, the only path to heaven?
I believe the fellowship to be the truest Church on the earth. I do not believe in an unbroken succession of ministry from the time of the Lord Jesus to the present, but this is not necessary, in my view for the Church to be true.
It must never be forgotten that the Church, and its few, but scriptural traditions, offers comfort to thousands of simple Christians, whilst concurrently sending ministers to lands where millions have never heard the name of Christ. I find in the Church much comfort for my soul, and much feeding for my spirit. I have found my past spiritual experiences to be so intense and powerful that I have no doubt that the Church teaches correctly.
However, the way is not the Church; the Church is merely the instrument by which God, who predestinated the saved from before the foundation of the world, leads people to the true Way, which is Jesus Christ, the Son of God, and Almighty Saviour.
But, in keeping with the new spirit of openness and kindness which Zorro has laboured to promote, I do not expect everyone to hold to my view, of course. This is merely the way I feel about my home, my fold, my Church, my brothers and sisters, and my spiritual teachers and leaders - the workers - and the One Lord the Church promotes.
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_
Junior Member
Posts: 71
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Post by _ on Aug 15, 2007 4:27:58 GMT -5
To those of you on this board who are currently porfessing and attending meetings please can you tell me what it is about the meetings that you believe makes it the one true way, the only path to heaven?I believe the fellowship to be the truest Church on the earth. I do not believe in an unbroken succession of ministry from the time of the Lord Jesus to the present, but this is not necessary, in my view for the Church to be true.
It must never be forgotten that the Church, and its few, but scriptural traditions, offers comfort to thousands of simple Christians, whilst concurrently sending ministers to lands where millions have never heard the name of Christ. I find in the Church much comfort for my soul, and much feeding for my spirit. I have found my past spiritual experiences to be so intense and powerful that I have no doubt that the Church teaches correctly.
However, the way is not the Church; the Church is merely the instrument by which God, who predestinated the saved from before the foundation of the world, leads people to the true Way, which is Jesus Christ, the Son of God, and Almighty Saviour.
But, in keeping with the new spirit of openness and kindness which Zorro has laboured to promote, I do not expect everyone to hold to my view, of course. This is merely the way I feel about my home, my fold, my Church, my brothers and sisters, and my spiritual teachers and leaders - the workers - and the One Lord the Church promotes. Thank you for providing a full and complete answer regarding your exclusive beliefs... I attempted to address your exclusive views in another thread, which did not result in any response from you... However, your above post is more then adequate to demonstrate the exclusiveness you uphold.
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Post by ranman77007 on Aug 15, 2007 4:36:41 GMT -5
GIT is absolutely right. Jesus has proven His presense with the friends and workers, and there is nothing as powerful...
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Post by GuestS on Aug 15, 2007 9:30:40 GMT -5
GIT is absolutely right. Jesus has proven His presense with the friends and workers, and there is nothing as powerful... He has? ?? You could have fooled me.
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timber
Senior Member
Posts: 249
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Post by timber on Aug 15, 2007 12:12:52 GMT -5
Meetings, conventions, workers, etc are all a means to an end to me - to get to know God more. They are by all means not salvation in and of themselves. Salvation only comes through a covenant (sealed by Our Lord's blood) relationship with Jesus.
I do think that its important to belong to a local church or fellowship - so many things happen here to nourish, encourage and sustain us in our journey.
I no longer feel I have the right to say who is saved and who is not - it has been brought to my mind and to my heart that I may be in danger of calling the Holy Spirit's work the work of the devil if I try to determine who is saved or not.
Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof..
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Post by Sylvestra on Aug 15, 2007 14:12:31 GMT -5
GIT is absolutely right. Jesus has proven His presense with the friends and workers, and there is nothing as powerful... But, the entire question is, "Is this work of Christ exclusive to the F & W, or is this work successful throughout Christian churches?"\ E
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Post by Zorro on Aug 15, 2007 14:29:11 GMT -5
Jesus has proven His presense with the friends and workers, and there is nothing as powerful...
Really, wouldn't it be more correct to state that you personally have never felt anything more powerful? You may not want to accept this, but I've had a good number of experiences since leaving that were more "powerful" than anything I experienced in 30 years in the F&Ws fellowship. That's not to say I never had positive, powerful experiences in fellowship with F&Ws - I did - but the belief that God's spirit doesn't work very powerfully outside of your fellowship is simply in error.
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Post by personally on Aug 15, 2007 16:05:26 GMT -5
Jesus has proven His presense with the friends and workers, and there is nothing as powerful...Really, wouldn't it be more correct to state that you personally have never felt anything more powerful? You may not want to accept this, but I've had a good number of experiences since leaving that were more "powerful" than anything I experienced in 30 years in the F&Ws fellowship. That's not to say I never had positive, powerful experiences in fellowship with F&Ws - I did - but the belief that God's spirit doesn't work very powerfully outside of your fellowship is simply in error. Zoro, Personally I think that your last sentence above should read," I personally feel that the belief that God's spirit doesn't work very powerfully outside of your fellowship is simply in error."
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Post by Zorro on Aug 15, 2007 16:28:58 GMT -5
Zoro, Personally I think that your last sentence above should read," I personally feel that the belief that God's spirit doesn't work very powerfully outside of your fellowship is simply in error."
I've discussed other's experiences after leaving the fellowship enough to have no qualms making the statement, and that it's not simply my personal opinion. Here's the difference between my statement and his statement that there is nothing as powerful...(as the F&Ws fellowship).....he was making an assumption about something he hasn't actually experienced. He doesn't have omniscient knowledge of something that other people have felt. I, and many others I know personally, actually have experienced it...it being the power of God "outside". I'm sorry if you can't accept that.
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Post by ranman77007 on Aug 15, 2007 16:33:00 GMT -5
GIT is absolutely right. Jesus has proven His presense with the friends and workers, and there is nothing as powerful... He has? ?? You could have fooled me. could have, but i guess Satan beat us to it....j/k man lmao.... ;D
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Post by ranman77007 on Aug 15, 2007 16:37:26 GMT -5
Jesus has proven His presense with the friends and workers, and there is nothing as powerful...Really, wouldn't it be more correct to state that you personally have never felt anything more powerful? You may not want to accept this, but I've had a good number of experiences since leaving that were more "powerful" than anything I experienced in 30 years in the F&Ws fellowship. That's not to say I never had positive, powerful experiences in fellowship with F&Ws - I did - but the belief that God's spirit doesn't work very powerfully outside of your fellowship is simply in error. i didnt say the Spirit doesn't operate outside the F&Ws.....but what the Spirit does outside the meetings is still directly related to whatever experience you may be going through in life, and still ties into the meetings. thats a miracle too.
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Post by Zorro on Aug 15, 2007 16:48:06 GMT -5
i didnt say the Spirit doesn't operate outside the F&Ws.....but what the Spirit does outside the meetings is still directly related to whatever experience you may be going through in life, and still ties into the meetings. thats a miracle too.
I think I understand what you're saying. But we still have a different perspective of the Spirit's work here. You appear to believe that the F&Ws fellowship is the "centerpiece" of the Spirit's work, yet God is gracious enough to work "outside", as well (I'm thinking that's why you would say that the Spirit's work still ties into the meetings). Is that fair to say? Correct me if I'm wrong. However, my perspective is that the F&Ws fellowship is simply one very small part of the universal, invisible Church (or body, if you prefer) and members are blessed no more or less than any other member of the body.
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Post by Hmmmmmm on Aug 15, 2007 16:57:35 GMT -5
I am sure there are some powerful experiences many outside the f&w group have felt. However, having a powerful spiritual experience does not mean salvation imho.
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_
Junior Member
Posts: 71
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Post by _ on Aug 15, 2007 16:59:15 GMT -5
I am sure there are some powerful experiences many outside the f&w group have felt. However, having a powerful spiritual experience does not mean salvation imho. Correct... salvation is through Jesus Christ alone... and what you will find is that many of the exes believe Jesus and his salvation is no longer restricted to the Friends and Worker's fellowship... even though we have been told this since birth...
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Post by Zorro on Aug 15, 2007 18:00:59 GMT -5
1 John 3:24
24And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.
Personally, I've always felt that the indwelling of the Spirit is proof of salvation. I believe this is referred to as a "seal" in another place.
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Post by Jessi on Aug 16, 2007 10:58:24 GMT -5
I see conversations go around in a circle as soon as somone says he personally has "felt" something "in his heart" or "in the depth of his being". If getting to the truth is a matter of what one personally thinks or feels -- then doesn't the truth become relative? That each person has his own truth?
But what is the measure for truth? Whether we personally have experienced something "powerful?" How do you know it's not the devil? He is very powerful.
If it's something one feels within HIMSELF that determines truth, then what did Jesus mean when He said, "I am the Truth?" Or when He said, "Thy Word is truth" (Jn 17:17)?
How do we determine what is really true? Our own personal feelings and emotions? Or something that happened outside ourselves, a long time ago in Golgotha or . . . when, in the beginning . . . was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God (Jn 1:1)?
Christ's Forever,
Jessi
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Post by zorro unplugged on Aug 16, 2007 14:40:37 GMT -5
Jessi, I believe your questions are valid, but I also wonder - just generally speaking - why Christians seem to downplay another's expression of feeling God's Spirit. That question isn't directed at you....just throwing it out there as food for thought. Anyway, the times I've felt the most profound sense of the Spirit working "powerfully" have been in settings of fellowship. A couple of different churches I've attended are pastored by very Godly men, preaching sound Christ centered doctrine. Among other things, the way they help prepare our hearts for communion is beyond anything I ever experienced previously. IMO, if I can't have confidence that what I'm experiencing in those moments is from God.....then what? I do understand what you're asking, and I believe your contention that the ultimate source of truth is scripture, which I agree with. Just the same, this all "comes alive" in our individual hearts. Somewhere along these lines is the mystery of true, Godly fellowship
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