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Post by sharonw on Jul 3, 2010 9:04:10 GMT -5
It has been my experience when a flock of sheep feel threatened, they're like people they will huddle in a mass and often with the leaders of the flock with their back to the flock and their horns to the outside to hook the next unwelcome or unknown entity. The Syrian guest who had been a shepherd told about the caring shepherd could utter a particular sound and the flock would rush together often killing the foe who was in the midst of them. So a caring shepherd could sound his flock into a protective mass and go find the lost sheep...but then a lot of shepherds used dogs to go hunt the lost sheep and then stay with it until the shepherd got there to retrieve the poor lost one. I have an old, old picture of a collie who had found the lost lamb, he's howling his find in the midst of a blowing snow storm...this too I have seen in actual life...there is nothing more touching to my mind and heart, then the finding of the little lost ones. I remember that picture from when I was a small child -- but when I was a child I thought it was a wolf about to eat the lamb. It gave me nightmares. Hah! Sorry, Gene! I had a collie that looked much like the one in that picture and my collie wouldn't bite a flea! lah!
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Pink
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Post by Pink on Jul 3, 2010 9:25:01 GMT -5
Very good and straightforward. Not "witchhunty" at all. Hopefully we have some workers reading on TMB and this will strike a chord in them. This is not a witchhunt and what you wrote should reveal that. It is plain and simple and is what the Lord and the Law requires from EVERYONE. Must be some excitement going on. Here's pink. Just kidding, pink. Nice to hear from you. gz is a little edge-y there I think. I don't think that style would ever catch the ear of a worker. Ha Ha! hi what. thanks for the welcome. Why do you think it is edgy and how could you reword it so it would catch the ear of a worker?
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Post by sharonw on Jul 3, 2010 15:30:57 GMT -5
If a person is convicted of 2nd degree CSC, are there changes to the above requirements...of course I mean besides a longer prison term?
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Post by Linford Bledsoe on Jul 3, 2010 16:52:18 GMT -5
Are we going to go full robin on this subject? A few posts ago you were going to ask admin to shut it down. I guess it's because we don't have anything juicier to discuss.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2010 16:58:26 GMT -5
Are we going to go full robin on this subject? A few posts ago you were going to ask admin to shut it down. I guess it's because we don't have anything juicier to discuss. Lin, didn't you suggest discussing workers' underwear...what could be juicier than that? and yet, no one took you up on it. Hard to believe.
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Post by Linford Bledsoe on Jul 3, 2010 17:49:51 GMT -5
No expertise on this subject I guess.
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Post by Jesse_Lackman on Jul 3, 2010 18:14:54 GMT -5
I agree, it seems like some who leave are that way, out to slam and broad brush everyone else. It is pretty amazing to watch. Researchers who have studied the believability of apostate testimony have even coined terms for the phenomina, one is -> "atrocity story". It's like your own halo glows brighter when broad brushing everyone else with black paint, I suppose it does - in the confines of your own mind. The key is to not get stuck staring crosseyed at one tree thinking it's the whole forest. Is it to much to comprehend that many still demand that their minsters/priests/workers/... have moral values? No, not too much to comprehend, as we can see those types of demands on this board over and over. What's hard to comprehend is how any can expect opinionated demands to be met. How can the one demanding give the demand teeth? They can't. Instead a demanding attitude is often a blustery subjective soapbox show that is counter-productive to meaningful conversation and results. Much better to inspire with wise words and actions. Reminds me of a post from earlier on this thread.
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Post by CherieKropp on Jul 3, 2010 20:00:40 GMT -5
Lin wrote:
Lin: I saw on amazon.com where a worker had a particular kind of socks on his "Wish List." Does that qualify?
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Post by Linford Bledsoe on Jul 3, 2010 20:39:53 GMT -5
Good one Cherie. I'd say that would qualify.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2010 20:40:08 GMT -5
Lin: I saw on amazon.com where a worker had a particular kind of socks on his "Wish List." Does that qualify? I'm not Lin, BUT I can't resist commenting...I think socks are a good way to start. Foundation stuff, I was thinking.
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Post by Linford Bledsoe on Jul 3, 2010 20:41:44 GMT -5
Lin: I saw on amazon.com where a worker had a particular kind of socks on his "Wish List." Does that qualify? I'm not Lin, BUT I can't resist commenting...I think socks are a good way to start. Foundation stuff, I was thinking. The start of a good understanding.
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Post by sharonw on Jul 3, 2010 20:45:07 GMT -5
Are we going to go full robin on this subject? A few posts ago you were going to ask admin to shut it down. I guess it's because we don't have anything juicier to discuss. Yes, it's noted you're back as well!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2010 20:47:11 GMT -5
I'm not Lin, BUT I can't resist commenting...I think socks are a good way to start. Foundation stuff, I was thinking. The start of a good understanding. Good one!
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Post by déjà vu on Jul 3, 2010 21:19:11 GMT -5
Lin: I saw on amazon.com where a worker had a particular kind of socks on his "Wish List." Does that qualify? I'm not Lin, BUT I can't resist commenting...I think socks are a good way to start. Foundation stuff, I was thinking. IMHO socks are the footing, foundation stuff is on a higher level
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2010 21:27:54 GMT -5
I'm not Lin, BUT I can't resist commenting...I think socks are a good way to start. Foundation stuff, I was thinking. IMHO socks are the footing, foundation stuff is on a higher level Ah well, not being knowledgeable about construction, I yield to your assessment .
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Post by What Hat on Jul 4, 2010 13:26:19 GMT -5
Okay, but you're talking about general issues. I'm talking about 'newsworthy' events. Certainly, the general media will pick up on something like the Mousseau story, and then you have a basis for discussion. However, there is a class of events which is not criminal, but are of concern to the fellowship. For example, a worker involved in a misdemeanor, or verifiable, immoral behaviour. These kinds of things are difficult to discuss because they relate to a specific event and no accurate reportage exists. Most churches have internal publications which cover off that kind of thing. And perhaps a worker having a child out of wedlock should not be reported. I personally don't know whether the "public"s right to know outweighs that worker's right to privacy. Maybe not. ` Just because a CSA offending or married-woman chasing Worker isn't charged or convicted would I want to know of such antics for the protection of my family? Absolutely. The Worker, or God, has chosen their ministerial position of leadership that includes guidance, teaching, moral responsibility in their choices in life, ... and stewardship of the faith's children on earth. Can one expect such information of Workers sexual activities and encroachment to be freely shared inside the fold? Absolutely not, that's the atmosphere that has occurred for years where the, so-to-speak, wolves have been doing nothing more than protecting themselves. The internet has become a great aid in victims realizing they are not alone, that these unwanted sexual antics from a Worker aren't isolated incidents, but are/have been occurring for years. The LW predicament has been know for a number of years now, nothing had been done until BB was strong-armed to act, just business as usual, even to the extent that sister Workers had informed their IN bordering state's Overseer they'd go home if LW was invited to any of their conventions. Would I want LW in my home where my wife might be exposed to his perverse antics? Absolutely not. A Worker/Overseer fathering a child out of wedlock, from my perspective, is a major breach of moral fiber that's unacceptable and if they don't take responsibility as the child's father then they are fair-game for any critiques on the internet. The Workers make the rules, no married Workers, celibacy-2x2(male-male, female female), ... so until their rules change such despicible individuals are no-more than 'DEAD-BEAT' fathers who seek to hide inside the ranks of the ministry. I think we're pretty much on the same page on this point, not necessarily on some of your others. The celibacy is totally irrelevant. Every church ministry has worked through these problems the last years, celibate or not. The biggest reason I can see for getting this info in the open is because we have thought our church ministry immune to this kind of behaviour. So in order for people to take reasonable cautionary measures and set bounds they have to know what can happen. It's why the media reports on car crashes, not for some vicarious thrill, but because we need to know they can happen. The second reason is to provide protection from specific perpetrators. The third reason is as an antidote to pride, and thinking that we must be the only true church. The problem is in how to accomplish the kind of reporting required. I'm no fan of the ability of counter-advocacy sites to report these events. If you look at how the legitimate media function, they consider the importance of people's privacy, fact-check their reporting, and avoid defamation issues, none of which the existing web sites or Internet forums have done very well.
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Post by sharonw on Jul 6, 2010 13:55:39 GMT -5
I don't expect a lot of changes due to the meeting...I suspect the mtg. will be to bring the overseers up to par with what "some" states have gotten into with the CSA and other sexual issues and some basic outline of instructions how to continue to treat such issues.
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Post by eyedeetentee on Jul 6, 2010 15:59:08 GMT -5
Some sperm cannot even say their ABC's, let alone count. I'd say you are expecting too much.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 6, 2010 16:10:51 GMT -5
Some sperm cannot even say their ABC's, let alone count. I'd say you are expecting too much. I don't think anyone was requiring the little rascals to recite the alphabet, but I believe excessive warmth has a deleterious affect on their ability to wiggle in a egg-ward direction.
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Post by Linford Bledsoe on Jul 6, 2010 16:56:57 GMT -5
I heard there is suppose to be a Workers/Overseers meeting in IL this month concerning the Workers and sexual issues, probably more CSA related. Most Overseers and senior Workers are in their convention rounds period this time of year, which might exclude many! But has anyone with any knowledge heard if this meeting is a regional meeting, that is east, bearing in mind the continuous frictions in uniform guidelines of the east vs. west vs Canadian ministry perceptions (most notably D&R)? Dale in CA has ignored the situation in CA, so if this is a regional, or just Midwest, pow-wow will anything be accomplished outside Midwest USA concerning sexual issues in the Worker-force? I thought according to our great TMB Hot Line, fair and balanced reporting, this meeting has already transpired.
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Post by Linford Bledsoe on Jul 6, 2010 17:00:47 GMT -5
I don't expect a lot of changes due to the meeting...I suspect the mtg. will be to bring the overseers up to par with what "some" states have gotten into with the CSA and other sexual issues and some basic outline of instructions how to continue to treat such issues. So the elders and those that finance, house, feed, ... the Workers have 'ZERO' input in these matters? It's good to see individuals like those in IN/IL with the LW issue and the MI victims of PM and DB step forward and make a positive effect on despicable acts by the faith's ministers (way to many initials!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!). You forgot to mention the victims of the Mich. twins and their despicable acts.
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Post by jhjmr on Jul 6, 2010 19:31:12 GMT -5
You could compare it to an earthquake. Many sank in the mud and many will never really recover. But, there was a mental problem there and that doesn't excuse anyone for the terrible actions, but it is at least some explainable. They will always be entwined in the deceit web, as that seems like it is the only thing that is available. Only those close to this case can ever comprehend the horrible stories and the actions of people. That is a complete description of despicable acts and of terrible actions to others. Getting reviewed the spirit of some is worse than having a bad reputation from a lie.
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Post by Scott Ross on Jul 6, 2010 19:47:13 GMT -5
I thought according to our great TMB Hot Line, fair and balanced reporting, this meeting has already transpired. This is an additional meeting that is planned. Scott
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Post by sharonw on Jul 6, 2010 20:00:01 GMT -5
Some sperm cannot even say their ABC's, let alone count. I'd say you are expecting too much. I don't think anyone was requiring the little rascals to recite the alphabet, but I believe excessive warmth has a deleterious affect on their ability to wiggle in a egg-ward direction. I've heard this all my life and when tight jeans became the fad, it was said that was the best way to get a large population of birth control...but some of the guys I've known that have worn those tight jeans for many years, have had apparently little problems with low sperm count! Go figure!
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Post by sharonw on Jul 6, 2010 20:03:52 GMT -5
I thought according to our great TMB Hot Line, fair and balanced reporting, this meeting has already transpired. This is an additional meeting that is planned. Scott Isn't always just the workers at these mtgs. and usually only the overseers and sometimes their 1st lieutenants? No friends and lesser ranked workers? I think these mtgs. are just used to bring everyone up to par on whatever and then it is left up to the individual overseers to alert their own staff...or it used to be that way!
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Post by rational on Jul 6, 2010 20:24:09 GMT -5
Only those close to this case can ever comprehend the horrible stories and the actions of people. It is almost like untrue statements were said about people and even after the truth was known there was no apology for the hurt and damage those untrue statements caused. Shameful behavior.
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Post by rational on Jul 6, 2010 20:29:46 GMT -5
I don't expect a lot of changes due to the meeting...I suspect the mtg. will be to bring the overseers up to par with what "some" states have gotten into with the CSA and other sexual issues and some basic outline of instructions how to continue to treat such issues. So the elders and those that finance, house, feed, ... the Workers have 'ZERO' input in these matters? We don't really know. This is just, as sharonw said, speculation.
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Post by rational on Jul 6, 2010 21:04:06 GMT -5
I've heard this all my life and when tight jeans became the fad, it was said that was the best way to get a large population of birth control...but some of the guys I've known that have worn those tight jeans for many years, have had apparently little problems with low sperm count! Go figure! Sometimes the things we hear all of our lives are simply not true. The results and conclusion of an actual study Results The mean scrotal temperature was 33.8 ± 0.8 and 33.6 ± 1.1 for the boxer and brief groups respectively. There were no significant temperature differences measured between the groups. Differential temperatures comparing core to scrotal temperature were likewise similar for the groups. Semen parameters were also not significantly different. These observations remained constant in the crossover group.
Conclusions The hyperthermic effect of brief style underwear has been exaggerated. In our study there was no difference in scrotal temperature according to underwear type. It is unlikely that underwear type has a significant effect on male fertility. The routine advisement of infertility patients to wear boxer shorts cannot be supported by available scientific evidence. Robert Munkelwitz, M.D. & Bruce R. Gilbert, M.D.,Ph.D. Department of Urology SUNY (Stony Brook)
On the other hand, I could not find where (if) this was published or if it had been peer reviewed. NB - the temperature was higher for the boxer group.
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