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Post by ohplease on Jan 2, 2007 11:56:55 GMT -5
You that oppose the Words of God and His stance on homosexuality are, if at best, hypocrites yourself.
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Post by webster on Jan 2, 2007 12:48:56 GMT -5
I watched bits and pieces of Gerald Ford's state funeral this a.m.
I didn't know GF was such a church man! The Episcopal priest shared the following.
Last summer, prior to the priest going to a large Episcopal meeting (obviously just for the hierarchy of the church) Gerald ask him what subjects were forefront. 'Human sexuality is one', replied the priest. Gerald replied, (not verbatim) 'let there be no decisiveness when man is following the commandments of "Love your God", and "Love your neighbor".
When Gene or justamom perform a service of love to their fellow man, should that service be deemed null & void b/c of their sexual orientation?
Need more be said?
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Post by Enough on Jan 2, 2007 12:58:04 GMT -5
Homosexuality is wrong. Everyone knows that the bible says so. There should be laws forbidding it in this country whether a majority agrees or not. The penalty should be a course of hormonal injections causing one to grow breasts. Adultery is also wrong and should be a made a felony. Any woman found in adultery should be stoned to death by the man. All sexual relations outside marriage should be prohibited and anyone found engaging in the sexual act should be utterly destroyed in the same manner as the people of Sodom and Gommorrah (but not Lot who was spared by God and celebrated by fornicating with his daughters) . Sexual relations within marriage should be limited to copulation for the purposes of reproduction and the prior permission of your local authority should be obtained prior to removing your underpants. Anyone found wearing a contraceptve device should have their genitals removed by the parish priest. There should be a law requiring all persons over the age of eighteen to sell all that they have and go and preach without shoes and with only one coat. Why are the Christian and Islamic Taliban of this world so obsessed with what they think God thinks of an individual's private sexual practices but whose God appears not to have any problem with the slaughter of the innocent? Are they simply not getting enough?
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Post by Gene on Jan 2, 2007 15:06:08 GMT -5
You that oppose the Words of God and His stance on homosexuality are, if at best, hypocrites yourself. As I understand hypocrisy, it involves pretense, insincerity, etc. I'm curious as to the sense in which you see me as a hypocrite. Is it because I claim to have a relationship with God and do not believe that my relationship with my partner is sinful? Or is it something more specific than that?
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Post by justamom on Jan 2, 2007 15:12:26 GMT -5
You that oppose the Words of God and His stance on homosexuality are, if at best, hypocrites yourself.
I lived for many years being a hypocrite when I wasn't honest with myself or those around me.....
I am so glad that I am free of that now!
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Post by seared on Jan 2, 2007 15:20:21 GMT -5
Some people on this board are so demonically oppressed, it is scary. How the enemy has seared your conscience.
The argument on whether or not acts are good are not good has nothing to do with sexuality or salvation. Good works, whether performed by a homosexual or heterosexual will still not merit one salvation.
When God Almighty has deemed something to be an abomination to Him, He does not change His mind. God was no more pleased with Lot, David or Saul when they were sinning against His commandments than anyone else. All had to bear a consequence in some way and all were repentent.
The question is, are you repentent?
If you are not, there is a big problem.
Your ultimate accountability is between you and God. His Word has already defined the outcome.
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Post by Observing on Jan 2, 2007 18:18:09 GMT -5
When God Almighty has deemed something to be an abomination to Him, He does not change His mind. Really? Do you think God forgot to mention that to Jesus? A lot of people will be very surprised to learn this. As I am sure you will recall: Leviticus 11:12 - Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you. Leviticus 11:42 - Whatsoever goeth upon the belly, and whatsoever goeth upon all four, or whatsoever hath more feet among all creeping things that creep upon the earth, them ye shall not eat; for they are an abomination. Deuteronomy 22:5 - The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God. And on and on. According to you these were, and still are, an abomination. I guess we should kiss cheeseburgers goodbye.
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jude
Senior Member
Christ Follower
Posts: 588
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Post by jude on Jan 2, 2007 23:26:11 GMT -5
Such extremes. Old testament applied alot to the times as they were the Jewish laws. Lets keep the conversation at an intellectual level.
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Post by Gene on Jan 3, 2007 0:56:40 GMT -5
Such extremes. Old testament applied alot to the times as they were the Jewish laws. Lets keep the conversation at an intellectual level. Jude, I do not wish to let your assessment of Observing's comments go unchallenged: 'Seared' said God does not change his mind about abominations. 'Observing' pointed out that God does, indeed, (if one believes the bible) change his mind about abominations. I think that's a rather important point, and not deserving of your admonition to 'keep things on an intellectual level.'
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Post by Observing on Jan 3, 2007 1:27:39 GMT -5
Such extremes. Old testament applied alot to the times as they were the Jewish laws. Lets keep the conversation at an intellectual level. Jude, would you like to keep this on an intellectual level? I would suggest as a start you might answer the points rather than glossing over them. The statement was made that God does not change his mind regarding things that He has said were an abomination to Him. I noted a number of things that were declared to be an abomination. Of course they were Jewish laws. Those are the people that God was talking to. He told then what they could eat and what they could not eat. He described the times when a woman was unclean because of her menses and exactly how she was to be dealt with and what he considered to be an abomination. You can call them what you wish but it was God giving the law. Now either these things are still an abomination or there has been a change in what God considers to be an abomination. If you would like to have an intellectual discussion, start discussing.
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jude
Senior Member
Christ Follower
Posts: 588
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Post by jude on Jan 3, 2007 2:09:54 GMT -5
God is very plain on the subject of homosexuality. Bringing up old Jewish laws from the Old Testament in order to dispute God's word on sexual immorality, that is plainly written about in the New Testament, is simply silly. This subject has been discussed at length already. It seems that we all go around in circles. What is the point?? In some instances the Bible leaves itself open to misinterpertation, But on the subject of Homosexuality it is plain to see that he did not intend for people of the same sex to engage in sexual relations. Exactly how could we add anything more to this subject? I don't want to hurt anyone or imply that if you are gay that you don't have a right to a relationship with Christ. Quite the contrary. If the Holy Spirit does indeed reside in someone who is gay, it will only be a matter of time before the Holy Spirit convicts that person of that sin. Just as all other sins, God slowly but surely helps us to know and cleanses us when he receives our true repentance.
Oh, and by the way, maybe your should change your name from observing to stalking!! Hee Hee, Just joshen ya!
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Post by testforyou on Jan 3, 2007 14:05:13 GMT -5
Let's get intellectual, then.
Gene, since you have declared that the Bible is a man-made book of doctrines, prove the Bible's fallacies.
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Post by say what you will on Jan 3, 2007 14:15:26 GMT -5
In the New Testament, it was made solidly clear in scripture that some things that had been previously considered *unclean* to eat, were now ok. Remember the apostles who ATE food that had been previously forbidden? They did with God's permission and INSTRUCTION.
There is no change in the New Testament about morality or sexuality. God is very clear that any sexual relations outside of marriage, whether consenting or not between anyone is not acceptable to God. God is then very clear that marriage is for a MAN and a WOMAN.
Nowhere in the Word of God is homosexuality or other fornicating *affairs* considered acceptable to God.
But, that is the GOD of the BIBLE. For those of you that consider it fallible, you will not accept this because you have made your own doctrine in which to live by. As God has said, YOUR doctrine will not merit your salvation or eternal existence. His doctrine will - His methods will.
Only Christ and repentence will, which are what God has made 100% clear in scripture.
Believe it or not.
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Post by Gene on Jan 3, 2007 14:43:03 GMT -5
Let's get intellectual, then. Gene, since you have declared that the Bible is a man-made book of doctrines, prove the Bible's fallacies. I would enjoy discussing it with anyone interested in the topic. However, for either you or me to try to prove our position to the other would be futile and annoyingly boring, so thanks, but I'll pass.
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Post by Observing on Jan 3, 2007 15:55:18 GMT -5
God is very plain on the subject of homosexuality. Bringing up old Jewish laws from the Old Testament in order to dispute God's word on sexual immorality, that is plainly written about in the New Testament, is simply silly. This subject has been discussed at length already. It seems that we all go around in circles. What is the point?? Jude, I wonder if you actually read the posts before responding to them. This point in the discussion was not about homosexuality at all. It was in reference to someone saying that once God said something was an abomination that it was always an abomination. I brought up the Old Jewish laws (aren't all Jewish laws old??) because in was in these laws that God pointed out to the Jews exactly what was and was not acceptable. As I noted, he designated some things to be an abomination. Later on, these things that were declared to be an abomination were no longer considered to be an abomination. Items declared to be unclean were no longer unclean. For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him unclean. That was the point I was attempting to make. God did change his mind. Or Paul was in error. We need to add nothing. Homosexuality had absolutely nothing to do with my original post. Unless, of course, the Holy Spirit has decided that homosexuality is no longer an abomination. It is just that you post such "interesting" comments that I feel they need to be addressed!
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Post by thanks on Jan 3, 2007 17:18:48 GMT -5
Regarding proving the Bible's fallibility, Gene says;
Gene, I'll refer to this as your "inability" to do so.
Thanks.
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Post by moot on Jan 3, 2007 17:53:22 GMT -5
gay people dont have a soul. so its a moot point anyways.
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jude
Senior Member
Christ Follower
Posts: 588
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Post by jude on Jan 3, 2007 18:18:25 GMT -5
That is a cruel and incorrect statement.
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Post by justamom on Jan 3, 2007 18:45:01 GMT -5
gay people dont have a soul. so its a moot point anyways.
awwwwww darn now our secret is OUT... life will just not be the same from now on......whatever will we do? LOL
Have a great day!
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Post by Brad Lewis on Jan 3, 2007 21:54:55 GMT -5
In the New Testament, it was made solidly clear in scripture that some things that had been previously considered *unclean* to eat, were now ok. Remember the apostles who ATE food that had been previously forbidden? They did with God's permission and INSTRUCTION. There is no change in the New Testament about morality or sexuality. God is very clear that any sexual relations outside of marriage, whether consenting or not between anyone is not acceptable to God. God is then very clear that marriage is for a MAN and a WOMAN. Nowhere in the Word of God is homosexuality or other fornicating *affairs* considered acceptable to God. But, that is the GOD of the BIBLE. For those of you that consider it fallible, you will not accept this because you have made your own doctrine in which to live by. As God has said, YOUR doctrine will not merit your salvation or eternal existence. His doctrine will - His methods will. Only Christ and repentence will, which are what God has made 100% clear in scripture. Believe it or not. Yay, let truth prevail Brad
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Post by What Will I do on Jan 3, 2007 23:14:58 GMT -5
I am a black women trapped in a white mans body. I have sexual and other emotions for males because I am on the inside a women. I also have emotions for those of my same race but get rejected all the time because the black men don't believe I am really black. Worse yet they don't believe I am a women. I tried to dress like a women once and even use a bunch of makeup to look more like my ethnic background which is black. I got beat up real bad. After all I do look white and did not have the correct body parts to be a women.
I went to the doctor to see about the sex change operation and also to get my skin color changed. The doctors thought I was pulling a prank and refused my request. i went to an attorney and tried to fill a complaint but he laughed me out of his office.
I fill out all of my applications by putting down my correct sex gender based on my internal feelings. I also claim my minority status but I keep getting rejected for things because the people reviewing my applications also think I am lying. I went to the Dept of State to correct my gender and ethnic status on my Drivers Lisc. They called the police on me thinking I was a terrorist.
Geez I cannot win in this world. I am well Scre--d as the saying goes.
What will I do
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Post by Gene on Jan 4, 2007 0:51:11 GMT -5
Regarding proving the Bible's fallibility, Gene says; Gene, I'll refer to this as your "inability" to do so. Thanks. That is correct.
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Post by Observing on Jan 4, 2007 1:41:04 GMT -5
Let's get intellectual, then. Gene, since you have declared that the Bible is a man-made book of doctrines, prove the Bible's fallacies. I'll bite. contradictions: Matthew 27:5 vs. Acts 1:18 - One man; two ways of dying. Luke23:46 vs John19:30 - what were the last words? Error in facts: Psalms 93:1 - The LORD reigneth, he is clothed with majesty; the LORD is clothed with strength, wherewith he hath girded himself: the world also is stablished, that it cannot be moved. Mark - 4:31 It is like a grain of mustard seed, which, when it is sown in the earth, is less than all the seeds that be in the earth:
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Post by ForeverFree on Jan 4, 2007 13:17:48 GMT -5
God will judge you for your sin, as He will every human being. It's nice to know that you're filling in for God while he's away...
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Post by answers on Jan 5, 2007 14:55:41 GMT -5
Mat 27:5 And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.
Act 1:18 Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.
Acts does not say the cause of death was falling headlong. It also does not state whether he was alive or dead during this occurance. This verse simply states that he fell and his bowels burst open. Scholars have cited this happening occurred after he had hung himself and fell from the hanging place.
Luk 23:46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.
Jhn 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost. Christ said both.
Luke accounted for the “commending of Christ’s spirit,” and John accounted the fact that Christ said, “it is finished.” One does not discount the other, stating the other was untrue. Therefore, they are not considered a contridiction to one another. You may say, “I like fine foods and eat at the Ivy.” I can say, “You like to eat at the Ivy.” Someone else can say, “You like fine foods.” Both are true statements, because you stated both. This does not make either statement contradictory.
I am not sure what your Psalms quote and Mark quote have to do with anything.
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Post by Mr T on Jan 6, 2007 3:10:24 GMT -5
As a heterosexual individual with a background in both religion (was professing but now in limbo) and psychology (BA Honors). I would like to weigh in on the notion of homosexuality being a choice. To begin it needs to be acknowledged that while sexuality can be influenced by environmental factors, these environmentally induced changes in sexual behavior seem to be temporary at best. An example of this would be homosexual behaviors observed in prison inmates who then revert to being straight as soon as they leave the institution. In fact much of the credible literature out there would suggest that sexuality is more or less hard wired. Think about it, when did you choose to 'become straight'. Myself, I remember having crushes on the opposite gender as early as age 4. As well, on a strictly logical level, why would an individual choose to be gay despite the myriad of stigmas, guilt, violence, etc... associated with being identified as gay.
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Post by juliette on Jan 6, 2007 3:12:47 GMT -5
Mr. T: How's "limbo" working out for you? Juliette
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Post by Observing on Jan 6, 2007 3:16:20 GMT -5
An example of this would be homosexual behaviors observed in prison inmates who then revert to being straight as soon as they leave the institution. Homosexual behavior and being a homosexual are two different things.
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