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Post by tell me on Jun 12, 2006 8:03:23 GMT -5
I feel that the overseers should discuss SEX at convention! Young professing folks don't hear enough about the subject because adults in the "truth" think the word is a dirty word. Some parents won't discuss this with their children either. There seems to be the belief in Eastern North America that "God's people don't have to worry about things that the world has to worry about!"
When a professing girl gets pregnant, they will be kicked out of the fellowship. So workers can say that none of their professing girls have had a baby out of the wedlock.
There is a scientific way to talk about sex. Not lewd or provocative. Just scientific. Too bad some workers try to assume that this topic isn't appropriate to discuss in a meeting.
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Post by How on Jun 12, 2006 9:34:37 GMT -5
I feel that the overseers should discuss SEX at convention! Young professing folks don't hear enough about the subject because adults in the "truth" think the word is a dirty word. Some parents won't discuss this with their children either. There seems to be the belief in Eastern North America that "God's people don't have to worry about things that the world has to worry about!" When a professing girl gets pregnant, they will be kicked out of the fellowship. So workers can say that none of their professing girls have had a baby out of the wedlock. There is a scientific way to talk about sex. Not lewd or provocative. Just scientific. Too bad some workers try to assume that this topic isn't appropriate to discuss in a meeting. How could they address a subject they have chosen to avoid all of their lives?
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Post by Could be on Jun 12, 2006 9:35:40 GMT -5
I feel that the overseers should discuss SEX at convention! Young professing folks don't hear enough about the subject because adults in the "truth" think the word is a dirty word. There are not many religions that discuss sex as part of their worship service. This is not really a 2x2 issue but a parenting issue. It is easy to see where it has its roots though. Post a nude on this site and listen to the noise. This is untrue and unsupported. We has a young woman in our meeting who had a child out of wedlock and she continued to be a member in good standing. Anyone can make a mistake. I don't think you are really looking for the science of sex but more about sex in relationships. The problem is that there is not a standard that all agree upon and even those who condemn sex before marriage know that the majority of people who are getting married have had sex already. As to not speaking about sex - maybe the workers are following the example set by Jesus. Other than accepting the woman taken by adultery He was also silent on this subject.
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Maggie
Senior Member
Posts: 347
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Post by Maggie on Jun 12, 2006 9:36:13 GMT -5
And why would you think that workers or overseers would have any useful or accurate knowledge, skill or ability to discuss this topic at convention or in any other setting?
I believe it may be useful for each of them to inform themselves about the issues, perhaps ask questions and with an open heart and mind talk and discuss but to speak from a position of authority? ....at convention....?
Whoa!!!! What are you thinking?
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Post by Obvious on Jun 12, 2006 9:48:05 GMT -5
How could they address a subject they have chosen to avoid all of their lives? The same way you would address the subjects of drugs, murder, rape, incest, robbery, or suicide (assuming you've never attempted any of these).
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Post by Skeptic on Jun 12, 2006 9:50:20 GMT -5
I agree... and I think the workers should discuss Afganistan and Iraq. I think the workers should discuss China's role in the arnament industry as revealed today by Amnestry International. I think the workers should discuss stem cells. I think the workers should discuss the next Presidential election (will it be Hillary?)
And when we are all done with talking about this, that and everything else, we will accuse the workers of being just like any other religious group.
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Post by Obvious on Jun 12, 2006 9:50:29 GMT -5
Perhaps it would be more clear to say that the workers should speak of the virtues of abstinence?
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Post by How on Jun 12, 2006 9:59:43 GMT -5
How could they address a subject they have chosen to avoid all of their lives? The same way you would address the subjects of drugs, murder, rape, incest, robbery, or suicide (assuming you've never attempted any of these). They address these issues? Study them? Know enough about them to discuss them?
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Post by Wot on Jun 12, 2006 10:07:37 GMT -5
to How... no, I am sure the workers don't know anything about druggs, murder, rape, incest, robbery and suicide - we leave these up to your local church people to deal with. If it was good enough for Jesus not to mention the problems of a world which hates God, it is good enough for us.
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Post by Roy on Jun 12, 2006 10:16:47 GMT -5
I would expect that a worker discussion of sex would be about as big of a hit as women's clothing and hair. How often have the workers brought their gospel to how to live it in today's world. It's one thing to speak about things that happened some 2k years ago and a totally different thing to deliver a message for practical living today. Today is what we get to deal with.
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Post by Obvious on Jun 12, 2006 10:42:23 GMT -5
They address these issues? Study them? Know enough about them to discuss them? A straw-man argument. How, please pull your head out of your A$$ and reread reply#4 in context.
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Post by ilylo on Jun 12, 2006 10:49:09 GMT -5
please pull your head out of your A$$ Perhaps you could demonstrate how this is done...
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Post by How on Jun 12, 2006 11:27:01 GMT -5
They address these issues? Study them? Know enough about them to discuss them? A straw-man argument. How, please pull your head out of your A$$ and reread reply#4 in context. Straw man argument? How so? OK. I pulled and re-read. Please put it in context for me. The workers dont' even know the book they constantly wave about. They live in some kind of make-believe world with Tangerene trees and Marshmellow skies. How on earth could they discuss things as far removed from their world as the subject proposed in this discussion? Why would they want to?
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Post by untrue on Jun 12, 2006 11:32:43 GMT -5
When a professing girl gets pregnant, they will be kicked out of the fellowship. So workers can say that none of their professing girls have had a baby out of the wedlock. this is an incredibly untrue statement. i can point to examples of this NOT happening, however i have no example of it happening. your credibility is shot
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Post by Obvious on Jun 12, 2006 11:40:33 GMT -5
The workers dont' even know the book they constantly wave about. They live in some kind of make-believe world with Tangerene trees and Marshmellow skies. How on earth could they discuss things as far removed from their world as the subject proposed in this discussion? Why would they want to? You asked a question earlier and I was just answering it. The problem is you seem to have forgotten that you asked a question, and you dove head-long into assuming that my answer somehow applied to the workers. Earlier when you said ... "How could they address a subject they have chosen to avoid all of their lives?" ... I was simply pointing out that one does not necessarily need experience in a matter to address the matter. Remember my example? I've never raped someone, but I know its wrong and have no problem telling others what I believe on the matter. Does the fact that I've never raped someone mean I have no authority to condemn it? The same applies for drugs, murder, incest, robbery, or suicide.
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Post by Bryanfromalaska on Jun 12, 2006 12:13:51 GMT -5
For what reason?
And so you think convention is the right place to hear about it?
My mother became pregnant with me in 1977… She wasn’t kicked out of the fellowship…
That might be true, but convention is not the right venue for such talks…
I quite agree with them… The last thing one needs to hear in convention is the proper way for married couples to make love...
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Post by Just say NO on Jun 12, 2006 12:25:22 GMT -5
And why would you think that workers or overseers would have any useful or accurate knowledge, skill or ability to discuss this topic at convention or in any other setting? I believe it may be useful for each of them to inform themselves about the issues, perhaps ask questions and with an open heart and mind talk and discuss but to speak from a position of authority? ....at convention....? Whoa!!!! What are you thinking? How could they be an authority at all. Just say NO when your a worker
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Post by Sooner fan on Jun 12, 2006 13:03:53 GMT -5
When a professing girl gets pregnant, they will be kicked out of the fellowship. So workers can say that none of their professing girls have had a baby out of the wedlock.this is an incredibly untrue statement. i can point to examples of this NOT happening, however i have no example of it happening. like when the father is a brother worker - and yes its happened
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Post by Remember on Jun 12, 2006 22:06:32 GMT -5
When a professing girl gets pregnant, they will be kicked out of the fellowship. So workers can say that none of their professing girls have had a baby out of the wedlock.this is an incredibly untrue statement. i can point to examples of this NOT happening, however i have no example of it happening. like when the father is a brother worker - and yes its happened There was that story that circulated regarding the workers on their "resting break" that got out of hand at the camp on the island in the sound. You certainly never hear much about that anymore. Talk about efective coverups.
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Post by Please list on Jun 12, 2006 23:09:02 GMT -5
Perhaps it would be more clear to say that the workers should speak of the virtues of abstinence? Exactly what are the virtues of abstinence? Frustration? Sex is a normal human drive and normal people have them. Abstinence is going against nature. Having kids take a vow of chastity is just pure hypocrisy.
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Post by a believer on Jun 13, 2006 1:47:24 GMT -5
When a professing girl gets pregnant, they will be kicked out of the fellowship. So workers can say that none of their professing girls have had a baby out of the wedlock. this is an incredibly untrue statement. i can point to examples of this NOT happening, however i have no example of it happening. your credibility is shot Those that I knew who got pregnant had to profess again. What of the guy - it takes 2 you know - or don't the workers know that?
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Post by JAH on Jun 13, 2006 7:53:30 GMT -5
Perhaps it would be more clear to say that the workers should speak of the virtues of abstinence? Are you serious? Do you have young children? Have you handed them a condom and said "shag away girls and boys, have fun"? So children and young adults should ignore morality and just do what their hormones tell them to? Many thing in life are "going against nature"; that doesn't make them wrong or not worth fighting for. My husband and I waited until we were married; we hope and expect the same of our children. Please tell how this is hypocrisy. You are a sick, frightening individual.
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Post by more than one way on Jun 13, 2006 8:40:49 GMT -5
Are you serious? Do you have young children? Have you handed them a condom and said "shag away girls and boys, have fun"? Well, you could go that root but that would be as stupid as saying just say no. A better approach would be to teach them about morality and self worth from an early age. Children need a foundation to build on and just saying abstain isn't going to work. Who said ignore morality? Sex is a normal function and to attempt to replace it with abstinence is simply not going to work. You may feel better thinking that your children will be sitting with their clothes buttoned up and their legs crossed but that is not reality. Your plan might stop v a g i n a l intercourse and if that is your definition of sex you may be successful but it is a bit short sighted. You have picked the wrong battle. Oh, a very narrow definition of sex, the refusal to recognize that people have been being punished and threatened for having sex since time began yet still continued to have sex, and the unrealistic expectation that people will get married and suddenly they will be completely compatible in all ways, including sexually. Marriage should last a lifetime. But the chances are not good if the people are not sexually compatible. Many Christian organizations are asking adolescents to take a virginity pledge. But research shows that more than half of them admit to breaking the pledge within the first year. Who knows how many do not admit it. So rather than being prepared with facts and knowledge about sex and the ways to prevent unwanted pregnancy and STD they are standing holding a piece of paper pledging to refrain from sex, perhaps pregnant and perhaps with an STD. The problem is that you cannot seem to extract a vow of celibacy and at the same time tell them to use condoms. Nope. Just a realistic person who has seem more teens in trouble than any one person should. You, on the other hand, are living in some fantasy world where the adolescents all sit and play pass the button or sing hymns. Did you ever wonder why the workers are out running around the convention grounds at night? Because they know there is a lot of sexual activity going on and they would like to curtail it as best they can.
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Post by ClayRandall on Jun 13, 2006 8:42:27 GMT -5
Exactly what are the virtues of abstinence? Frustration? 1) discipline and self-control 2) self-respect 3) peace of mind 4) sexual (and moral) purity 5) absence of risk for pregnancy and STDs. Sex is a normal human drive and normal people have them. No kidding? So is having a bowel movement. Abstinence is going against nature. By this statement I'll assume the poster is against all forms of birth control. Having kids take a vow of chastity is just pure hypocrisy. It may be wishful thinking, but it is hardly hypocritical to expect kids to exercise self-control and respect for the proper role of sex.
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Post by happy unlogged on Jun 13, 2006 8:51:19 GMT -5
Amen, Clay.
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Post by OK but on Jun 13, 2006 8:51:20 GMT -5
1) discipline and self-control 2) self-respect 3) peace of mind 4) sexual (and moral) purity 5) absence of risk for pregnancy and STDs. 6) The problem is that if all you teach is abstainence there is usually no additional sexual education along with it. When the adolescents do have sex, and studies all show that the majority of them will, their chances of pregnancy and STD is much higher. Exactly. Try to stop having them. Nope - just against telling people just to say "No" and thinking that that is all they need to know. The use of birth control and the prevention of SDT should be taught. Perhaps expecting the children to behave differently than their parents and hundreds of earlier generations is what was being looked at as hypocritical.
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Post by ClayRandall on Jun 13, 2006 9:03:14 GMT -5
The problem is that if all you teach is abstainence there is usually no additional sexual education along with it. When the adolescents do have sex, and studies all show that the majority of them will, their chances of pregnancy and STD is much higher. Hmm...... So, instead the message should be "Okay, kids, you need to be abstinent, but here are some condoms just in case". ?? Which view is hypocritical? Exactly. Try to stop having them. Just as children are taught the appropriate time to have a bowel movement (continuing the analogy), children can be taught the appropriate time to have sex. It is when people reduce sexual activity to a mere bodily function that it is used carelessly. Nope - just against telling people just to say "No" and thinking that that is all they need to know. The use of birth control and the prevention of SDT should be taught. But artificial birth control "goes against nature", too. Which view is hypocritical again? Perhaps expecting the children to behave differently than their parents and hundreds of earlier generations is what was being looked at as hypocritical. We must not be talking about the parents and hundreds of earlier generations who got marrried and had children in wedlock...
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Post by Howard6 on Jun 13, 2006 9:08:58 GMT -5
Mr. AnythingGoes (aka Please list, more than one way, OK but):
Do you believe children and young adults should learn self-control and abstain from premarital sex...
or...
Do you believe that they're going to do it anyway, so we may as well teach them how not to get diseased, pregnant, caught, etc?
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