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Post by tulip2 on Jul 9, 2024 17:35:59 GMT -5
This letter from overseers and their worker colleagues in America (Montana/Wyoming/Oregon/South Idaho staff) to meeting friends (laity):
July 3, 2024 Dear Friends in the Fendler Meeting,
We feel we need to be in touch with each of you in Eric and Marsha's Sunday and Wednesday meeting. Eric & Marsha have been in touch by email. They said, “We have been moved, without any doubt in our hearts, to step aside from the purview of the ministry at this time.” They did clarify this by saying, “The Spirit of God no longer moves us to associate with, and support a ministry who is not willing for serious self-examination and genuine repentance.” Our hearts are deeply saddened. The ministry was established from heaven even before fellowship and it is something that we cannot change. We absolutely know there are individuals that horribly abused place and power in the ministry and in the fellowship and have caused great harm. We cannot remove the ministry nor fellowship that God established, but rather the individuals that commit horrible abuse. You cannot have the fellowship without the ministry.
We feel each one of you should know about this and have the opportunity to declare your choice, whether to continue attending meetings at Eric and Marsha's home or move to a meeting that believes and follows the doctrine that was established, not by individuals, but by the God of heaven through Jesus, to the ministry. There is room in the other Sunday meetings, so please feel free to contact us IF you are wanting moved from the Fendler meeting. There will also be a new Wednesday morning meeting home, and we are in the process right now of sorting this out. Thank you for your patience with us as we seek God’s guidance and help.
We are not in the field, but after input and advice from Doyle and Tom we felt this shouldn’t wait till we are back in the field. I have phone service in Canada and will visit with anyone that needs/wants to visit via email, text or phone.
These are truly difficult times, but God in his infinite wisdom and time makes things very clear... There has to be a separation if we do not believe in what God established. We need your prayers so desperately.
With care, Doyle, Tom Tammy, Heidi & Alexis
Two statements stand out: "You cannot have the fellowship without the ministry."
Doyle & co. see "ministry" as 2x2 workers (who they seem to imagine stand in-between God and the common 2x2 church fellowship laity). Others of us believe in the truth that is in Jesus' recorded words in the scriptures, and consistent throughout the whole of the bible, which convicts us of a "ministry of all believers". Whose only head is Jesus.
In other words, the fellowship is the ministry.
Those men and women, Doyle, Tom, Tammy, Heidi and Alexis are nothing more nor less is status and importance to God than the smallest most humble member of our fellowship (the one crying out "God be merciful to me a sinner").
The second statement, "There has to be a separation if we do not believe in what God established." Perhaps it's time for Doyle & co. to examine closely and prayerfully and honestly the stand they've taken, the pedestal they seem to imagine themselves on. And if they continue with their scriptural error, to practice what they preach and separate themselves from our fellowship of bible-believing Christians.
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Jul 9, 2024 21:45:29 GMT -5
1) Doyle is correct! Eph. 4:11-14. God the Father and Christ established the apostolic ministry, Jesus gave gifts FIRST the Ministry calling= the apostles, the prophets, teachers, pastors, ministers and so on…. 2) You are correct! The apostles, evangelists, teachers, pastors to teach their converts/followers of Christ to be evangelists/teachers sharing the gospel of Christ to the whole world, pastors/elders to care for God’s lambs in their own home churches. Both callings apostles and friends ministry are working together to built up God and Christ’s kingdom on earth. The apostles and the friends ministry kingdom on earth will rule with Christ Jesus when He returns for 1000 years! We read in Acts 14 It was the ministry of Paul and Barnabas apostles appointed homes church elders among the believers. In Acts 19 Paul warned the days is coming the bishops/church elders will rise up and get rid of God established ministry on earth. This took place in the 3rd century in Rome, the bishops/church elders took over the leadership in the Church authority and get rid of God anointed ministry. Read what God has foretold about the EVILNESS bishops/popes of Rome ruling over billions of their followers around the world Rev. chapters 17-18. The day is coming God will destroy the anti-Christ Vatican City of Rome in ONE hour!
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Post by help on Jul 10, 2024 0:51:26 GMT -5
The 2x2 church has managed to destroy itself, without any help from God. In contrast the RC Church is still growing. In other words, the global Catholic story is not one of steady decline, but rather rapid growth. Through the last 100 years the Catholic Church has expanded more than any time in its 2,000 years of existence.”
They were the first Christian Church, and could be the last one standing.
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Jul 10, 2024 2:17:20 GMT -5
The 2x2 church has managed to destroy itself, without any help from God. In contrast the RC Church is still growing. In other words, the global Catholic story is not one of steady decline, but rather rapid growth. Through the last 100 years the Catholic Church has expanded more than any time in its 2,000 years of existence.” They were the first Christian Church, and could be the last one standing. The RCC Is NOT the First Christian Church. Peter is NOT the first Pope either! Peter would roll over his grave to see the RCC killed and tortured over millions and millions of true Christians, Muslims in the name of God. That is pure evil.
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Post by help on Jul 10, 2024 3:55:21 GMT -5
The Catholic Church is the only church that can claim to have been founded by Christ personally. Every other church traces its lineage back to a mere human person such as Martin Luther, John Wesley, or William Irvine, plus lots of others. The Catholic Church can trace its lineage back to Jesus Christ who appointed St. Peter as the first pope.
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Post by maryhig on Jul 10, 2024 4:03:02 GMT -5
The 2x2 church has managed to destroy itself, without any help from God. In contrast the RC Church is still growing. In other words, the global Catholic story is not one of steady decline, but rather rapid growth. Through the last 100 years the Catholic Church has expanded more than any time in its 2,000 years of existence.” They were the first Christian Church, and could be the last one standing. They are a false church with a false leader and they are corrupt. They should give away their billions to the poor, they could feed millions with the wealth they sit on. What would Jesus do? They are nothing like him!
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Post by maryhig on Jul 10, 2024 4:06:33 GMT -5
The Catholic Church is the only church that can claim to have been founded by Christ personally. Every other church traces its lineage back to a mere human person such as Martin Luther, John Wesley, or William Irvine, plus lots of others. The Catholic Church can trace its lineage back to Jesus Christ who appointed St. Peter as the first pope. What?? How do you make Peter the first pope? Where do you get that from? No way was the Catholic church founded by Christ, They're foundation is nothing like Christ. The Catholic church was founded my Constantine.
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Post by maryhig on Jul 10, 2024 4:07:02 GMT -5
The 2x2 church has managed to destroy itself, without any help from God. In contrast the RC Church is still growing. In other words, the global Catholic story is not one of steady decline, but rather rapid growth. Through the last 100 years the Catholic Church has expanded more than any time in its 2,000 years of existence.” They were the first Christian Church, and could be the last one standing. The RCC Is NOT the First Christian Church. Peter is NOT the first Pope either! Peter would roll over his grave to see the RCC killed and tortured over millions and millions of true Christians, Muslims in the name of God. That is pure evil. Something we agree on
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Post by help on Jul 10, 2024 4:19:46 GMT -5
In modern times, the Catholic Church is the largest non-government provider of health care in the world. Catholic religious have been responsible for founding and running networks of hospitals across the world where medical research continues to be advanced.
We have all beifited from that, irrespective as to whether we are religious or not. All people are treated as equal. A lot of Churches could learn from their humane example. Catholic Hospitals have some of the best Cardiac Units in the World. I am torever grateful for that, they saved my life and I am not a Catholic. They also saved our Wally recently and he is so good he is going to get married.
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Post by landdownunder on Jul 10, 2024 4:43:23 GMT -5
The RCC Is NOT the First Christian Church. Peter is NOT the first Pope either! Peter would roll over his grave to see the RCC killed and tortured over millions and millions of true Christians, Muslims in the name of God. That is pure evil. Pure evil! Kind of like, workers sexually abusing young children who they purport to be leading to Jesus?
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Post by maryhig on Jul 10, 2024 4:53:22 GMT -5
In modern times, the Catholic Church is the largest non-government provider of health care in the world. Catholic religious have been responsible for founding and running networks of hospitals across the world where medical research continues to be advanced. We have all beifited from that, irrespective as to whether we are religious or not. All people are treated as equal. A lot of Churches could learn from their humane example. Catholic Hospitals have some of the best Cardiac Units in the World. I am torever grateful for that, they saved my life and I am not a Catholic. They also saved our Wally recently and he is so good he is going to get married. Sorry but I've heard horror stories about them. They have billions, they should give up their money and give it to those in need. And all the emphasis on the buildings of their churches with their idols and ornaments within is disgusting, as are their false ways of worship. They are nothing like Jesus at all. Also, how do you get Peter to be the first pope? Thank you
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Post by landdownunder on Jul 10, 2024 4:56:51 GMT -5
No way was the Catholic church founded by Christ, Their foundation is nothing like Christ. The Catholic church was founded my Constantine. Historically that's pretty correct, Constantine from about 313-325 AD laid the foundations for the RCC. Although he wouldn't have seen it as such at the time. Perhaps the one true church from the Ascension of Christ until now is best described as the "invisible church". Which is a far cry from the institutional church in all its guises and denominations, including the RCC and the 2x2 church fellowship.
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Post by maryhig on Jul 10, 2024 5:04:10 GMT -5
No way was the Catholic church founded by Christ, Their foundation is nothing like Christ. The Catholic church was founded my Constantine. Historically that's pretty correct, Constantine from about 313-325 AD laid the foundations for the RCC. Although he wouldn't have seen it as such at the time. Perhaps the one true church from the Ascension of Christ until now is best described as the "invisible church". Which is a far cry from the institutional church in all its guises and denominations, including the RCC and the 2x2 church fellowship. Yes, the true church are those who truly follow Jesus Christ in the way that he laid out, without any manmade add ons that all the denominations have added. I think that's what William Irvine and Edward Cooney first set out to do at the beginning. To take away all the add ons, and live the simple life that Jesus lived and also taught, and then bring it to others through the gospel and by living it in their daily lives.
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Post by maryhig on Jul 10, 2024 6:33:12 GMT -5
The RCC Is NOT the First Christian Church. Peter is NOT the first Pope either! Peter would roll over his grave to see the RCC killed and tortured over millions and millions of true Christians, Muslims in the name of God. That is pure evil. Pure evil! Kind of like, workers sexually abusing young children who they purport to be leading to Jesus? If any workers do anything like that to children, or hide it, then they are not of God.
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Post by menatwork on Jul 10, 2024 8:17:21 GMT -5
This letter from overseers and their worker colleagues in America (Montana/Wyoming/Oregon/South Idaho staff) to meeting friends (laity): July 3, 2024 Dear Friends in the Fendler Meeting, We feel we need to be in touch with each of you in Eric and Marsha's Sunday and Wednesday meeting. Eric & Marsha have been in touch by email. They said, “We have been moved, without any doubt in our hearts, to step aside from the purview of the ministry at this time.” They did clarify this by saying, “The Spirit of God no longer moves us to associate with, and support a ministry who is not willing for serious self-examination and genuine repentance.” Our hearts are deeply saddened. The ministry was established from heaven even before fellowship and it is something that we cannot change. We absolutely know there are individuals that horribly abused place and power in the ministry and in the fellowship and have caused great harm. We cannot remove the ministry nor fellowship that God established, but rather the individuals that commit horrible abuse. You cannot have the fellowship without the ministry. We feel each one of you should know about this and have the opportunity to declare your choice, whether to continue attending meetings at Eric and Marsha's home or move to a meeting that believes and follows the doctrine that was established, not by individuals, but by the God of heaven through Jesus, to the ministry. There is room in the other Sunday meetings, so please feel free to contact us IF you are wanting moved from the Fendler meeting. There will also be a new Wednesday morning meeting home, and we are in the process right now of sorting this out. Thank you for your patience with us as we seek God’s guidance and help. We are not in the field, but after input and advice from Doyle and Tom we felt this shouldn’t wait till we are back in the field. I have phone service in Canada and will visit with anyone that needs/wants to visit via email, text or phone. These are truly difficult times, but God in his infinite wisdom and time makes things very clear... There has to be a separation if we do not believe in what God established. We need your prayers so desperately. With care, Doyle, Tom Tammy, Heidi & Alexis Two statements stand out: "You cannot have the fellowship without the ministry." Doyle & co. see "ministry" as 2x2 workers (who they seem to imagine stand in-between God and the common 2x2 church fellowship laity). Others of us believe in the truth that is in Jesus' recorded words in the scriptures, and consistent throughout the whole of the bible, which convicts us of a "ministry of all believers". Whose only head is Jesus. In other words, the fellowship is the ministry. Those men and women, Doyle, Tom, Tammy, Heidi and Alexis are nothing more nor less is status and importance to God than the smallest most humble member of our fellowship (the one crying out "God be merciful to me a sinner"). The second statement, "There has to be a separation if we do not believe in what God established." Perhaps it's time for Doyle & co. to examine closely and prayerfully and honestly the stand they've taken, the pedestal they seem to imagine themselves on. And if they continue with their scriptural error, to practice what they preach and separate themselves from our fellowship of bible-believing Christians. The friends & workers are obsessed with the method ( 2x2 homeless ministry and church in the home) and not concerned at all with preaching the true gospel that offers hope and salvation. The workers have built themselves little empires all over the world where they can exercise control over the friends leading to fear and abuse. They interpret the Bible through their own subjective views (eisegesis) leading to a false gospel devoid of any power to save. They have not been taught (or have any desire) to interpret the whole Bible in a critical and holistic fashion (exegesis). They attempt to preach their own version of the gospel from selective parts of scripture taken out of context. They do not believe in justification by faith alone apart from works. The group is starting to split as more and more people realise that the workers way is not the only way leading to salvation (or is even a way) It is a false gospel preached by false teachers that Paul warns about in Galatians “I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.” Galatians 1:6-9 ESV The workers need to repent and turn from their false ways and preach the true gospel or suffer the consequences.
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nathan2
Royal Member
Nathan again
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Posts: 4,263
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Post by nathan2 on Jul 10, 2024 9:10:33 GMT -5
The RCC Is NOT the First Christian Church. Peter is NOT the first Pope either! Peter would roll over his grave to see the RCC killed and tortured over millions and millions of true Christians, Muslims in the name of God. That is pure evil. Pure evil! Kind of like, workers sexually abusing young children who they purport to be leading to Jesus? The workers and the friends who committed CSA are evil and they must face the consequences that come to them. If they repent of their sins, God will forgive them but they must pay the penalty and consequences of their sin. NOT all workers are evil, who do such things to the children. Many of the workers and the friends are good, and godly people in their own community. The tares will be among us! Jesus will uproot the tares for us one by one, One way or another to keep His ministry healthy and pure.
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nathan2
Royal Member
Nathan again
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Post by nathan2 on Jul 10, 2024 9:22:09 GMT -5
This letter from overseers and their worker colleagues in America (Montana/Wyoming/Oregon/South Idaho staff) to meeting friends (laity): July 3, 2024 Dear Friends in the Fendler Meeting, We feel we need to be in touch with each of you in Eric and Marsha's Sunday and Wednesday meeting. Eric & Marsha have been in touch by email. They said, “We have been moved, without any doubt in our hearts, to step aside from the purview of the ministry at this time.” They did clarify this by saying, “The Spirit of God no longer moves us to associate with, and support a ministry who is not willing for serious self-examination and genuine repentance.” Our hearts are deeply saddened. The ministry was established from heaven even before fellowship and it is something that we cannot change. We absolutely know there are individuals that horribly abused place and power in the ministry and in the fellowship and have caused great harm. We cannot remove the ministry nor fellowship that God established, but rather the individuals that commit horrible abuse. You cannot have the fellowship without the ministry. We feel each one of you should know about this and have the opportunity to declare your choice, whether to continue attending meetings at Eric and Marsha's home or move to a meeting that believes and follows the doctrine that was established, not by individuals, but by the God of heaven through Jesus, to the ministry. There is room in the other Sunday meetings, so please feel free to contact us IF you are wanting moved from the Fendler meeting. There will also be a new Wednesday morning meeting home, and we are in the process right now of sorting this out. Thank you for your patience with us as we seek God’s guidance and help. We are not in the field, but after input and advice from Doyle and Tom we felt this shouldn’t wait till we are back in the field. I have phone service in Canada and will visit with anyone that needs/wants to visit via email, text or phone. These are truly difficult times, but God in his infinite wisdom and time makes things very clear... There has to be a separation if we do not believe in what God established. We need your prayers so desperately. With care, Doyle, Tom Tammy, Heidi & Alexis Two statements stand out: "You cannot have the fellowship without the ministry." Doyle & co. see "ministry" as 2x2 workers (who they seem to imagine stand in-between God and the common 2x2 church fellowship laity). Others of us believe in the truth that is in Jesus' recorded words in the scriptures, and consistent throughout the whole of the bible, which convicts us of a "ministry of all believers". Whose only head is Jesus. In other words, the fellowship is the ministry. Those men and women, Doyle, Tom, Tammy, Heidi and Alexis are nothing more nor less is status and importance to God than the smallest most humble member of our fellowship (the one crying out "God be merciful to me a sinner"). The second statement, "There has to be a separation if we do not believe in what God established." Perhaps it's time for Doyle & co. to examine closely and prayerfully and honestly the stand they've taken, the pedestal they seem to imagine themselves on. And if they continue with their scriptural error, to practice what they preach and separate themselves from our fellowship of bible-believing Christians. The friends & workers are obsessed with the method ( 2x2 homeless ministry and church in the home) and not concerned at all with preaching the true gospel that offers hope and salvation. The workers have built themselves little empires all over the world where they can exercise control over the friends leading to fear and abuse. They interpret the Bible through their own subjective views (eisegesis) leading to a false gospel devoid of any power to save. They have not been taught (or have any desire) to interpret the whole Bible in a critical and holistic fashion (exegesis). They attempt to preach their own version of the gospel from selective parts of scripture taken out of context. They do not believe in justification by faith alone apart from works. The group is starting to split as more and more people realise that the workers way is not the only way leading to salvation (or is even a way) It is a false gospel preached by false teachers that Paul warns about in Galatians “I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.” Galatians 1:6-9 ESV The workers need to repent and turn from their false ways and preach the true gospel or suffer the consequences. Jesus 2x2 apostolic ministry and Sunday morning worship gathering are established by God the Father, Christ/God Jesus, and the Holy Spirit! There is NOTHING evil about it, the people in it are humans and they make horrible mistakes but don’t blame God for it. Don’t throw the baby out with dirty bath water! what God had set up is perfect! It works in every generation, under any types of governments. Just cut off the dead, bad branches ( CSA, false teachings Jesus is NOT God/Divine, the Trinity is the devil doctrines) from the vine! It will produce more fruits 🍎
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Post by mountain on Jul 10, 2024 9:51:40 GMT -5
This letter from overseers and their worker colleagues in America (Montana/Wyoming/Oregon/South Idaho staff) to meeting friends (laity): July 3, 2024 Dear Friends in the Fendler Meeting, We feel we need to be in touch with each of you in Eric and Marsha's Sunday and Wednesday meeting. Eric & Marsha have been in touch by email. They said, “We have been moved, without any doubt in our hearts, to step aside from the purview of the ministry at this time.” They did clarify this by saying, “The Spirit of God no longer moves us to associate with, and support a ministry who is not willing for serious self-examination and genuine repentance.” Our hearts are deeply saddened. The ministry was established from heaven even before fellowship and it is something that we cannot change. We absolutely know there are individuals that horribly abused place and power in the ministry and in the fellowship and have caused great harm. We cannot remove the ministry nor fellowship that God established, but rather the individuals that commit horrible abuse. You cannot have the fellowship without the ministry. We feel each one of you should know about this and have the opportunity to declare your choice, whether to continue attending meetings at Eric and Marsha's home or move to a meeting that believes and follows the doctrine that was established, not by individuals, but by the God of heaven through Jesus, to the ministry. There is room in the other Sunday meetings, so please feel free to contact us IF you are wanting moved from the Fendler meeting. There will also be a new Wednesday morning meeting home, and we are in the process right now of sorting this out. Thank you for your patience with us as we seek God’s guidance and help. We are not in the field, but after input and advice from Doyle and Tom we felt this shouldn’t wait till we are back in the field. I have phone service in Canada and will visit with anyone that needs/wants to visit via email, text or phone. These are truly difficult times, but God in his infinite wisdom and time makes things very clear... There has to be a separation if we do not believe in what God established. We need your prayers so desperately. With care, Doyle, Tom Tammy, Heidi & Alexis Two statements stand out: "You cannot have the fellowship without the ministry." Doyle & co. see "ministry" as 2x2 workers (who they seem to imagine stand in-between God and the common 2x2 church fellowship laity). Others of us believe in the truth that is in Jesus' recorded words in the scriptures, and consistent throughout the whole of the bible, which convicts us of a "ministry of all believers". Whose only head is Jesus. In other words, the fellowship is the ministry. Those men and women, Doyle, Tom, Tammy, Heidi and Alexis are nothing more nor less is status and importance to God than the smallest most humble member of our fellowship (the one crying out "God be merciful to me a sinner"). The second statement, "There has to be a separation if we do not believe in what God established." Perhaps it's time for Doyle & co. to examine closely and prayerfully and honestly the stand they've taken, the pedestal they seem to imagine themselves on. And if they continue with their scriptural error, to practice what they preach and separate themselves from our fellowship of bible-believing Christians. The friends & workers are obsessed with the method ( 2x2 homeless ministry and church in the home) and not concerned at all with preaching the true gospel that offers hope and salvation. The workers have built themselves little empires all over the world where they can exercise control over the friends leading to fear and abuse. They interpret the Bible through their own subjective views (eisegesis) leading to a false gospel devoid of any power to save. They have not been taught (or have any desire) to interpret the whole Bible in a critical and holistic fashion (exegesis). They attempt to preach their own version of the gospel from selective parts of scripture taken out of context. They do not believe in justification by faith alone apart from works. The group is starting to split as more and more people realise that the workers way is not the only way leading to salvation (or is even a way) It is a false gospel preached by false teachers that Paul warns about in Galatians “I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.” Galatians 1:6-9 ESV The workers need to repent and turn from their false ways and preach the true gospel or suffer the consequences.
And this is where our problem begins. A simple enough statement to make but virtually impossible to get a true explanation of what the true gospel actually is. There can only be one true way, not necessarily these days attached to a particular denomination or sect. You can scrub Catholicism and the reformed Catholics (Protestants of whatever ilk) due to their abundant falsehoods, teachings and practices, but you are only narrowing down the possibilities!
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Post by maryhig on Jul 10, 2024 10:43:33 GMT -5
The friends & workers are obsessed with the method ( 2x2 homeless ministry and church in the home) and not concerned at all with preaching the true gospel that offers hope and salvation. The workers have built themselves little empires all over the world where they can exercise control over the friends leading to fear and abuse. They interpret the Bible through their own subjective views (eisegesis) leading to a false gospel devoid of any power to save. They have not been taught (or have any desire) to interpret the whole Bible in a critical and holistic fashion (exegesis). They attempt to preach their own version of the gospel from selective parts of scripture taken out of context. They do not believe in justification by faith alone apart from works. The group is starting to split as more and more people realise that the workers way is not the only way leading to salvation (or is even a way) It is a false gospel preached by false teachers that Paul warns about in Galatians “I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.” Galatians 1:6-9 ESV The workers need to repent and turn from their false ways and preach the true gospel or suffer the consequences.
And this is where our problem begins. A simple enough statement to make but virtually impossible to get a true explanation of what the true gospel actually is. There can only be one true way, not necessarily these days attached to a particular denomination or sect. You can scrub Catholicism and the reformed Catholics (Protestants of whatever ilk) due to their abundant falsehoods, teachings and practices, but you are only narrowing down the possibilities! They are all false, there is only one way to follow, and that's the way Jesus himself taught and lived by, without all the add ons of the various denominations.
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Post by help on Jul 10, 2024 12:06:30 GMT -5
What is the problem with religion? | Faith Forum Rajan Zed
Although lot of literature has been produced highlighting the strengths and benefits of religion, many have associated the following problems with religion: conflict with science, curtailing freedoms, delusion, claims of having the exclusive truth, fear of punishment, feeling guilt, immutability, instilling fear, internal conflicts, irrationality, justification of violence, limitation on the rights of women, outdatedness, perpetuation of division, persecution, prejudice, rebuffing of broader perspective, social constructs, strange customs, strained relationships for partners of different faiths, the structure, the suppression of curiosity, its use as a tool for control, unsophisticatedness, etc.
Some complain that religion is used as a reward for "us," and a punishment for "others." Some critics sum up the problem by saying religion is a noun, not a verb — adherents are more interested in the status of their faith, rather than acting on it.
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Post by help on Jul 10, 2024 12:27:59 GMT -5
If the 2x2's split a new name will have to be found for them. I thought maybe the original one, "Minus 2x2" and the new one, "Plus 2x2". Or maybe in line with the hymn book, "Old 2x2" and "New 2x2". Perhaps we could run a competition on TMB.
I well remember the big split in Victoria, Australia back in the 1950's. Many said goodbye at the time, but eventually a Mr.Fixit in the person of Willie Donaldson was brought in to put the remnants back together again. I dare say the powers that be are already looking for a Mr. Fixit. Maybe because it is a World problem this time a Miss Fixit might do a better job than the "Boys Club".
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jul 10, 2024 14:38:32 GMT -5
No way was the Catholic church founded by Christ, Their foundation is nothing like Christ. The Catholic church was founded my Constantine. Historically that's pretty correct, Constantine from about 313-325 AD laid the foundations for the RCC. Although he wouldn't have seen it as such at the time. Perhaps the one true church from the Ascension of Christ until now is best described as the "invisible church". Which is a far cry from the institutional church in all its guises and denominations, including the RCC and the 2x2 church fellowship. The Roman Empire lives on in the RCC.
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Post by Mary on Jul 10, 2024 14:56:25 GMT -5
Pure evil! Kind of like, workers sexually abusing young children who they purport to be leading to Jesus? The workers and the friends who committed CSA are evil and they must face the consequences that come to them. If they repent of their sins, God will forgive them but they must pay the penalty and consequences of their sin. NOT all workers are evil, who do such things to the children. Many of the workers and the friends are good, and godly people in their own community. The tares will be among us! Jesus will uproot the tares for us one by one, One way or another to keep His ministry healthy and pure. Not to be all religious but.....the devil or was it God laid the spikes out and the 2x2s ran right over them deflated their tyres / egos and caught them in the act. The faithful and honest people have left and found true life away from the corruption of the 2x2s which was a man made way not God ordained. The proof is in the pudding. Come out from among them and be ye separate. You can't put new wine into old bottles.
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Post by Mary on Jul 10, 2024 15:12:11 GMT -5
The friends & workers are obsessed with the method ( 2x2 homeless ministry and church in the home) and not concerned at all with preaching the true gospel that offers hope and salvation. The workers have built themselves little empires all over the world where they can exercise control over the friends leading to fear and abuse. They interpret the Bible through their own subjective views (eisegesis) leading to a false gospel devoid of any power to save. They have not been taught (or have any desire) to interpret the whole Bible in a critical and holistic fashion (exegesis). They attempt to preach their own version of the gospel from selective parts of scripture taken out of context. They do not believe in justification by faith alone apart from works. The group is starting to split as more and more people realise that the workers way is not the only way leading to salvation (or is even a way) It is a false gospel preached by false teachers that Paul warns about in Galatians “I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.” Galatians 1:6-9 ESV The workers need to repent and turn from their false ways and preach the true gospel or suffer the consequences.
And this is where our problem begins. A simple enough statement to make but virtually impossible to get a true explanation of what the true gospel actually is. There can only be one true way, not necessarily these days attached to a particular denomination or sect. You can scrub Catholicism and the reformed Catholics (Protestants of whatever ilk) due to their abundant falsehoods, teachings and practices, but you are only narrowing down the possibilities! There is one way, one church, one body. According to the Bible the way is Jesus, the church and body is made up of believing Christians regardless of the church you attend. Any church which says they are the only true way is false because Jesus said He was the way and the church are those who believe in him. A particular church is not his church but his church is regardless of what group you attend. It's made up of people regardless of denomination you choose to attend.
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nathan2
Royal Member
Nathan again
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Post by nathan2 on Jul 10, 2024 15:17:44 GMT -5
The workers and the friends who committed CSA are evil and they must face the consequences that come to them. If they repent of their sins, God will forgive them but they must pay the penalty and consequences of their sin. NOT all workers are evil, who do such things to the children. Many of the workers and the friends are good, and godly people in their own community. The tares will be among us! Jesus will uproot the tares for us one by one, One way or another to keep His ministry healthy and pure. Not to be all religious but.....the devil or was it God laid the spikes out and the 2x2s ran right over them deflated their tyres / egos and caught them in the act. The faithful and honest people have left and found true life away from the corruption of the 2x2s which was a man made way not God ordained. The proof is in the pudding. Come out from among them and be ye separate. You can't put new wine into old bottles. My opinion… It was the 2x2 CSA weak flesh let their pit bulls ran wild, the overseers didn’t want the ministry and the church to get a BAD reputation for the whole group! So, they covered it up, buried the skeletons in the closets, hoping it would disappear forever! Well, finally too many skeletons in closets got too full and it fell out for the world to see. When many of the disciples left Jesus because he was a false teacher in John 6 did the 12 apostles join them? Heck! No. Peter said to Jesus “To whom shall we go? Thou has the words of Eternal life. We believe and KNOW you are the Holy ONE of God.” Many of workers and friends KNOW Jesus 2x2 apostolic ministry and Sunday morning worship gathering/Christ Passover established by God the Father, Christ and Holy Spirit so, we will stay in the Ark! Jesus said I am the Way, the Truth, and Life no man come to the Father but through me! If the 2x2s want to jump ship 🛳️ that is their choice. Just to think many of the disciples of Jesus who left from following him are regretting the choice they made in the day of judgment! They wish they had asked Jesus to explain what he meant to eat his flesh and drinking his blood to be SAVED! He would have told them the answered they jumped the gun and LEFT following Him.
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nathan2
Royal Member
Nathan again
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Posts: 4,263
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Post by nathan2 on Jul 10, 2024 15:36:54 GMT -5
And this is where our problem begins. A simple enough statement to make but virtually impossible to get a true explanation of what the true gospel actually is. There can only be one true way, not necessarily these days attached to a particular denomination or sect. You can scrub Catholicism and the reformed Catholics (Protestants of whatever ilk) due to their abundant falsehoods, teachings and practices, but you are only narrowing down the possibilities! There is one way, one church, one body. According to the Bible the way is Jesus, the church and body is made up of believing Christians regardless of the church you attend. Any church which says they are the only true way is false because Jesus said He was the way and the church are those who believe in him. A particular church is not his church but his church is regardless of what group you attend. It's made up of people regardless of denomination you choose to attend. You take One body, one church, is made up of believing Christians out of context! That is your belief and millions Christians RCC and 50,000 plus Protestant denominations in the world for nearly 500 years! That is NOT according to Jesus New Test. Teachings READ Matthew 7:21-28 “NOT everyone says Lord, Lord we preach in your name, working miracles, doing all kinds of good deeds for charity shall NOT ENTER the kingdom of God, but he that does the Will of my Heavenly Father in heaven! God the Father reject them all because they say His 2x2 apostolic ministry, Jesus saves method is NOT for today! Outdated, too old fashion, it doesn’t work. No preachers can live like Jesus, no this and no that! God say to them all depart from me ye evil workers! You are NOT Mine workers. You didn’t follow mine and my son instructions. You did it your own way, own ministry, own thoughts and do whatever which method you like. There is ONLY ONE body of Christ, which God the Father had set up through Jesus 2x2 apostolic ministry and New Testament fellowship by the end of the century! False apostles, bishops/church elders and false brethren began to depart from God and Christ New Test. Ministry and fellowship. They started their own kinds of ministry like the RCC in the 3rd century then in the 16th many RCC Monks left and started their own Protestant Reformation churches married pastors, now it has grown over 50,000 plus denominations and it keeps growing more and more in greater denominations every day.
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Post by Mary on Jul 10, 2024 15:45:20 GMT -5
There is one way, one church, one body. According to the Bible the way is Jesus, the church and body is made up of believing Christians regardless of the church you attend. Any church which says they are the only true way is false because Jesus said He was the way and the church are those who believe in him. A particular church is not his church but his church is regardless of what group you attend. It's made up of people regardless of denomination you choose to attend. You take One body, one church, is made up of believing Christians out of context! That is your belief and millions Christians RCC and 50,000 plus Protestant denominations in the world for nearly 500 years! That is NOT according to Jesus New Test. Teachings READ Matthew 7:21-28 “NOT everyone says Lord, Lord we preach in your name, working miracles, doing all kinds of good deeds for charity shall NOT ENTER the kingdom of God, but he that does the Will of my Heavenly Father in heaven! God the Father reject them all because they say His 2x2 apostolic ministry, Jesus saves method is NOT for today! Outdated, too old fashion, it doesn’t work. No preachers can live like Jesus, no this and no that! God say to them all depart from me ye evil workers! You are NOT Mine workers. You didn’t follow mine and my son instructions. You did it your own way, own ministry, own thoughts and do whatever which method you like. There is ONLY ONE body of Christ, which God the Father had set up through Jesus 2x2 apostolic ministry and New Testament fellowship by the end of the century! False apostles, bishops/church elders and false brethren began to depart from God and Christ New Test. Ministry and fellowship and started their own kind of ministry like the RCC in the 3rd century then in the 16th many RCC Monks left and started their own Protestant Reformation churches now it has grown over 50,000 plus denominations and it keeps growing more and more every day. A method does not save, Jesus saves. Not of our own works lest any man should boast.
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Post by mountain on Jul 10, 2024 16:18:49 GMT -5
And this is where our problem begins. A simple enough statement to make but virtually impossible to get a true explanation of what the true gospel actually is. There can only be one true way, not necessarily these days attached to a particular denomination or sect. You can scrub Catholicism and the reformed Catholics (Protestants of whatever ilk) due to their abundant falsehoods, teachings and practices, but you are only narrowing down the possibilities! There is one way, one church, one body. According to the Bible the way is Jesus, the church and body is made up of believing Christians regardless of the church you attend. Any church which says they are the only true way is false because Jesus said He was the way and the church are those who believe in him. A particular church is not his church but his church is regardless of what group you attend. It's made up of people regardless of denomination you choose to attend. Jesus referred to those that truly followed him as 'his church.' This implies a single united body of believers following the same doctrine and practices, NOT the pick of the bunch from a diversity of denominations and sects. Jesus also told us that there would be few that would find it. The many are the broad way or 'other' Christians or people who claimed to follow Christ. The Matthew 24 lot!
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