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Post by maryhig on Apr 22, 2024 10:19:12 GMT -5
Ah so you don't believe that Mary is the mother of God, so maybe a mainstream protestant church would suit you better then? Because you believe more like them than you do the 2x2s. Most of the workers in the early days came out of Protestant churches into Following Jesus Christ 2x2 New Test. apostolic ministry, which they got it from the Faith Mission in 1897. I came out of RCC and Protestant church to 2x2 in 1978-2024. The current 2x2s have gone off the tracts with Anti-Trinity; Jesus is NOT God in 1950s to now; but there is a remnant of 2x2s believe in the Trinity; which taught by the majority of early days workers. The numbers of the Trinity believers are making a come back!👍 I agree with most of Jesus 2x2s New Test. Ministry and Sunday worship doctrines! Most of the 2x2s don’t believe Mary is the mother of God. And most of the F&Ws don't believe that Jesus is God either. And according to you that's one of the most important things people have to believe in for salvation. So why you are in a church where you believe that they are nearly all unsaved because they don't believe in the trinity is beyond me. I couldn't attend a church which was so against what I believe is right before God.
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Apr 22, 2024 10:26:26 GMT -5
Most of the workers in the early days came out of Protestant churches into Following Jesus Christ 2x2 New Test. apostolic ministry, which they got it from the Faith Mission in 1897. I came out of RCC and Protestant church to 2x2 in 1978-2024. The current 2x2s have gone off the tracts with Anti-Trinity; Jesus is NOT God in 1950s to now; but there is a remnant of 2x2s believe in the Trinity; which taught by the majority of early days workers. The numbers of the Trinity believers are making a come back!👍 I agree with most of Jesus 2x2s New Test. Ministry and Sunday worship doctrines! Most of the 2x2s don’t believe Mary is the mother of God. And most of the F&Ws don't believe that Jesus is God either. And according to you that's one of the most important things people have to believe in for salvation. So why you are in a church where you believe that they are nearly all unsaved because they don't believe in the trinity is beyond me. I couldn't attend a church which was so against what I believe is right before God. you and Most of the 2x2 don’t believe Jesus is God then why are you and 2x2 put Jesus and the Holy Spirit on the same level of God the Father in worship on Sunday morning worship gathering? Isn’t that blasphemy! If Only God the Father is to be worshipped? Then why are you and 2x2s put Jesus and the Holy Spirit with God the Father on same level as God? They are saved but they have erred for 75 years with Anti-Trinity; Jesus is NOT God, this false teachings can be changed very easy.
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Post by maryhig on Apr 22, 2024 12:03:24 GMT -5
And most of the F&Ws don't believe that Jesus is God either. And according to you that's one of the most important things people have to believe in for salvation. So why you are in a church where you believe that they are nearly all unsaved because they don't believe in the trinity is beyond me. I couldn't attend a church which was so against what I believe is right before God. you and Most of the 2x2 don’t believe Jesus is God then why are you and 2x2 put Jesus and the Holy Spirit on the same level of God the Father in worship on Sunday morning worship gathering? Isn’t that blasphemy! If Only God the Father is to be worshipped? Then why are you and 2x2s put Jesus and the Holy Spirit with God the Father on same level as God? They are saved but they have erred for 75 years with Anti-Trinity; Jesus is NOT God, this false teachings can be changed very easy. I don't put Jesus on the same level as God at all. Paul says clearly that the head of Christ is God. So God the father is above Jesus Christ and the father is also the God of Christ Jesus. Christ isn't the God of the father is he? No. So there is one head of all of us including Jesus Christ and that's God the father. There is one God, and that's the father, and Jesus himself says this too in John 17.
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Apr 22, 2024 13:01:37 GMT -5
you and Most of the 2x2 don’t believe Jesus is God then why are you and 2x2 put Jesus and the Holy Spirit on the same level of God the Father in worship on Sunday morning worship gathering? Isn’t that blasphemy! If Only God the Father is to be worshipped? Then why are you and 2x2s put Jesus and the Holy Spirit with God the Father on same level as God? They are saved but they have erred for 75 years with Anti-Trinity; Jesus is NOT God, this false teachings can be changed very easy. I don't put Jesus on the same level as God at all. Paul says clearly that the head of Christ is God. So God the father is above Jesus Christ and the father is also the God of Christ Jesus. Christ isn't the God of the father is he? No. So there is one head of all of us including Jesus Christ and that's God the father. There is one God, and that's the father, and Jesus himself says this too in John 17. You don’t put Jesus on the same level as God? You sing hymns of praise, prayers to God the Father in Jesus name, give thanks to Jesus life and death and you put the Holy Spirit of God on the same level as God the Father also! This is Blasphemy, you know that, right? Your understand of God is out of wack or NOT fully sound doctrines.
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Post by SharonArnold on Apr 22, 2024 14:41:54 GMT -5
I am so glad that the worker that attacked me for asking questions did what she did. I was done with them even though I had to go to meetings until I graduated. But I haven't attended a meeting since I left home. I wrote my final grade 12 exam and I was out of town by midnight that night. On my way to a different city in a different province. I am forever grateful that I never tried to make my children sit silent in meetings the way I was made to. That hit me today when I was at a school assembly for my older grandboys and my youngest grandboy who is 3 was having a hard time sitting still and being quiet. I remember all the spankings I received to keep me in line. Obviously it didn't work, lots of spankings... Not for the first time, I have wondered who this worker is. If it is awkward to share, for any reason, then please don't. My first guess off the top of my head would have been Mildred Stewart? She could be abrupt and abrasive, but when I got to know her more as an adult, I saw her somewhat differently. You are so lucky that you had the insight and common sense to leave when you did. I am sure your children would thank you too, if they but knew - what they avoided and what they never had to deal with... Someone posted the Rhett McLaughlin quote on another forum: "Your kids are not leaving the church because you did not train them well enough. Your kids are leaving the church because you trained them well enough to develop a sense for truth and justice. You let them read the words of Jesus - and they got it. And they've recognized that the church doesn't seem to be interested in those words. They are leaving not because they don't know the truth, but because they do." These words feel true for my situation. And I think they are equally true, whether you choose to use the Jesus terminology (or some other framing altogether) in living a meaningful and connected life. As I read the overwhelming number of people's experiences on other forums, I am floored. And what makes me angriest is that, had I any (ANY!) idea, my leaving process would have been a lot sooner and a whole lot easier, less fraught. Nevertheless, I feel lucky (and so grateful) that I have been able to live so much of my life free from it all.
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Post by Annan on Apr 22, 2024 15:14:23 GMT -5
Most of the workers in the early days came out of Protestant churches into Following Jesus Christ 2x2 New Test. apostolic ministry, which they got it from the Faith Mission in 1897. I came out of RCC and Protestant church to 2x2 in 1978-2024. The current 2x2s have gone off the tracts with Anti-Trinity; Jesus is NOT God in 1950s to now; but there is a remnant of 2x2s believe in the Trinity; which taught by the majority of early days workers. The numbers of the Trinity believers are making a come back!👍 I agree with most of Jesus 2x2s New Test. Ministry and Sunday worship doctrines! Most of the 2x2s don’t believe Mary is the mother of God. And most of the F&Ws don't believe that Jesus is God either. And according to you that's one of the most important things people have to believe in for salvation. So why you are in a church where you believe that they are nearly all unsaved because they don't believe in the trinity is beyond me. I couldn't attend a church which was so against what I believe is right before God. Because Natie believes he was chosen to save the 2x2's from false beliefs.
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Apr 22, 2024 15:31:06 GMT -5
And most of the F&Ws don't believe that Jesus is God either. And according to you that's one of the most important things people have to believe in for salvation. So why you are in a church where you believe that they are nearly all unsaved because they don't believe in the trinity is beyond me. I couldn't attend a church which was so against what I believe is right before God. Because Natie believes he was chosen to save the 2x2's from false beliefs. 🤫🤫👍
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Post by BobWilliston on Apr 23, 2024 18:42:57 GMT -5
Because Natie believes he was chosen to save the 2x2's from false beliefs. 🤫🤫👍 toot toot toot
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Apr 23, 2024 20:02:46 GMT -5
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Post by ForeverFree on Apr 24, 2024 0:37:15 GMT -5
Yes. Parents would drag little children out of meetings at convention and whip their butts. That is child abuse in my opinion. Just thinking about it boils my blood. Violence against a child is never acceptable. And before anyone quotes the spare the rod scripture, please educate yourself on what exactly the rod was referring to. Thank you. The rod is referring to the word of God. The rod of the mouth. Although I don't agree with beatings, I did smack my children. But it was like a smack on the hand but I've never really hurt them. But why did they "whip their butts?" Just for talking? And do children go to meetings? "And do children go to meetings?" What does this mean? Have you never been to a 2x2 meeting? Of course children go to meetings, that's where the brainwashing starts.
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Post by ForeverFree on Apr 24, 2024 0:51:08 GMT -5
Ah so you don't believe that Mary is the mother of God, so maybe a mainstream protestant church would suit you better then? Because you believe more like them than you do the 2x2s. Most of the workers in the early days came out of Protestant churches into Following Jesus Christ 2x2 New Test. apostolic ministry, which they got it from the Faith Mission in 1897. I came out of RCC and Protestant church to 2x2 in 1978-2024. The current 2x2s have gone off the tracts with Anti-Trinity; Jesus is NOT God in 1950s to now; but there is a remnant of 2x2s believe in the Trinity; which taught by the majority of early days workers. The numbers of the 2x2 Trinity believers are making a come back!👍 I agree with most of Jesus 2x2s New Test. Ministry and Sunday worship doctrines! Most of the 2x2s don’t believe Mary is the mother of God. The current 2x2s have gone off the tracks with A LOT of things. Too many engineers fighting to have control in driving the train and now it's headed off the tracks and the crash is happening as we speak. The number of lives affected by those on the train and those who were got off at previous stations is too many to count, but many, many people have been hurt.
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Post by maryhig on Apr 24, 2024 3:46:05 GMT -5
And most of the F&Ws don't believe that Jesus is God either. And according to you that's one of the most important things people have to believe in for salvation. So why you are in a church where you believe that they are nearly all unsaved because they don't believe in the trinity is beyond me. I couldn't attend a church which was so against what I believe is right before God. Because Natie believes he was chosen to save the 2x2's from false beliefs. Ridiculous isn't it! He's delusional!
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Post by maryhig on Apr 24, 2024 3:47:36 GMT -5
I don't put Jesus on the same level as God at all. Paul says clearly that the head of Christ is God. So God the father is above Jesus Christ and the father is also the God of Christ Jesus. Christ isn't the God of the father is he? No. So there is one head of all of us including Jesus Christ and that's God the father. There is one God, and that's the father, and Jesus himself says this too in John 17. You don’t put Jesus on the same level as God? You sing hymns of praise, prayers to God the Father in Jesus name, give thanks to Jesus life and death and you put the Holy Spirit of God on the same level as God the Father also! This is Blasphemy, you know that, right? Your understand of God is out of wack or NOT fully sound doctrines. You need to look at yourself!
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Post by maryhig on Apr 24, 2024 4:13:19 GMT -5
The rod is referring to the word of God. The rod of the mouth. Although I don't agree with beatings, I did smack my children. But it was like a smack on the hand but I've never really hurt them. But why did they "whip their butts?" Just for talking? And do children go to meetings? "And do children go to meetings?" What does this mean? Have you never been to a 2x2 meeting? Of course children go to meetings, that's where the brainwashing starts. No I've never been to a 2x2 meeting.
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Post by Pragmatic on Apr 24, 2024 4:40:07 GMT -5
Isn't this just arguing the colour of the funnels while the Titanic takes on water?
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Apr 24, 2024 9:10:53 GMT -5
Most of the workers in the early days came out of Protestant churches into Following Jesus Christ 2x2 New Test. apostolic ministry, which they got it from the Faith Mission in 1897. I came out of RCC and Protestant church to 2x2 in 1978-2024. The current 2x2s have gone off the tracts with Anti-Trinity; Jesus is NOT God in 1950s to now; but there is a remnant of 2x2s believe in the Trinity; which taught by the majority of early days workers. The numbers of the 2x2 Trinity believers are making a come back!👍 I agree with most of Jesus 2x2s New Test. Ministry and Sunday worship doctrines! Most of the 2x2s don’t believe Mary is the mother of God. The current 2x2s have gone off the tracks with A LOT of things. Too many engineers fighting to have control in driving the train and now it's headed off the tracks and the crash is happening as we speak. The number of lives affected by those on the train and those who were got off at previous stations is too many to count, but many, many people have been hurt. Yes, I know about these things you mention… it happened in the days of Peter, Paul and John also, that was why God and Christ raised up Paul, John and those like them through the centuries to keep the New Test. Ministry of Christ and His people to STAY on tracks of Jesus New Test. Teachings, build on the Rock/Jesus teachings and NOT on the sand foundation of false apostles teachings. Read Matthew 7:13-28.
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nathan2
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Post by nathan2 on Apr 24, 2024 9:16:35 GMT -5
You don’t put Jesus on the same level as God? You sing hymns of praise, prayers to God the Father in Jesus name, give thanks to Jesus life and death and you put the Holy Spirit of God on the same level as God the Father also! This is Blasphemy, you know that, right? Your understand of God is out of wack or NOT fully sound doctrines. You need to look at yourself! I do, Dan is watching me, and correcting me. 👍I always make sure what I teach are sound doctrines and it line up with Old, New Test. and the teachings of God the Father, Christ, the Holy Spirit and with the True apostles of Christ. I welcome the feed backs! Negative and positive comments…
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Post by Annan on Apr 24, 2024 10:44:43 GMT -5
You need to look at yourself! I do, Dan is watching me, and correcting me. 👍I always make sure what I teach are sound doctrines and it line up with Old, New Test. and the teachings of God the Father, Christ, the Holy Spirit and with the True apostles of Christ. I welcome the feed backs! Negative and positive comments… Then welcome this... You beliefs system is one of violence and victimhood, and your favorite, martyrdom. Get a clue.
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Post by snow on Apr 24, 2024 14:59:09 GMT -5
I am so glad that the worker that attacked me for asking questions did what she did. I was done with them even though I had to go to meetings until I graduated. But I haven't attended a meeting since I left home. I wrote my final grade 12 exam and I was out of town by midnight that night. On my way to a different city in a different province. I am forever grateful that I never tried to make my children sit silent in meetings the way I was made to. That hit me today when I was at a school assembly for my older grandboys and my youngest grandboy who is 3 was having a hard time sitting still and being quiet. I remember all the spankings I received to keep me in line. Obviously it didn't work, lots of spankings... What do you mean staying silent, and spankings? You mean you got smacked if you made a noise in the meeting as a child? Oh yes, did I ever. I remember being taken out of meetings by my dad and spanked because I couldn't sit still. Ever since I can remember that happened. To this day when I hear a kid being carried out of a restaurant screaming please Daddy, no Daddy, I just want to grab that child and run.
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Post by snow on Apr 24, 2024 15:01:51 GMT -5
Yes. Parents would drag little children out of meetings at convention and whip their butts. That is child abuse in my opinion. Just thinking about it boils my blood. Violence against a child is never acceptable. And before anyone quotes the spare the rod scripture, please educate yourself on what exactly the rod was referring to. Thank you. The rod is referring to the word of God. The rod of the mouth. Although I don't agree with beatings, I did smack my children. But it was like a smack on the hand but I've never really hurt them. But why did they "whip their butts?" Just for talking? And do children go to meetings? I didn't need to talk to get a really good spanking. All I had to do was not sit still. I remember one special meetings I was dressed in a crinkly dress material so every time I moved of course it made a noise. I was about 3 maybe. I spent most of the two meetings outside getting spanked that day!
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Post by snow on Apr 24, 2024 15:07:54 GMT -5
I am so glad that the worker that attacked me for asking questions did what she did. I was done with them even though I had to go to meetings until I graduated. But I haven't attended a meeting since I left home. I wrote my final grade 12 exam and I was out of town by midnight that night. On my way to a different city in a different province. I am forever grateful that I never tried to make my children sit silent in meetings the way I was made to. That hit me today when I was at a school assembly for my older grandboys and my youngest grandboy who is 3 was having a hard time sitting still and being quiet. I remember all the spankings I received to keep me in line. Obviously it didn't work, lots of spankings... Not for the first time, I have wondered who this worker is. If it is awkward to share, for any reason, then please don't. My first guess off the top of my head would have been Mildred Stewart? She could be abrupt and abrasive, but when I got to know her more as an adult, I saw her somewhat differently. You are so lucky that you had the insight and common sense to leave when you did. I am sure your children would thank you too, if they but knew - what they avoided and what they never had to deal with... Someone posted the Rhett McLaughlin quote on another forum: "Your kids are not leaving the church because you did not train them well enough. Your kids are leaving the church because you trained them well enough to develop a sense for truth and justice. You let them read the words of Jesus - and they got it. And they've recognized that the church doesn't seem to be interested in those words. They are leaving not because they don't know the truth, but because they do." These words feel true for my situation. And I think they are equally true, whether you choose to use the Jesus terminology (or some other framing altogether) in living a meaningful and connected life. As I read the overwhelming number of people's experiences on other forums, I am floored. And what makes me angriest is that, had I any (ANY!) idea, my leaving process would have been a lot sooner and a whole lot easier, less fraught. Nevertheless, I feel lucky (and so grateful) that I have been able to live so much of my life free from it all. I have heard she's still in the work and of course would be quite elderly now. So it's probably best I don't state who she was on a public forum. She was young and probably really early on in her worker role. Knowing what I know now about new workers and how they are treated and pushed I feel more kindly towards her now and genuinely thankful she woke me up. My kids attended one meeting with their grandparents and they never wanted to go again lol. So they are glad they never had to go.
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Post by mrdobalina on Apr 24, 2024 16:08:11 GMT -5
The rod is referring to the word of God. The rod of the mouth. Although I don't agree with beatings, I did smack my children. But it was like a smack on the hand but I've never really hurt them. But why did they "whip their butts?" Just for talking? And do children go to meetings? I didn't need to talk to get a really good spanking. All I had to do was not sit still. I remember one special meetings I was dressed in a crinkly dress material so every time I moved of course it made a noise. I was about 3 maybe. I spent most of the two meetings outside getting spanked that day! It's quite sick isint it. My brother has had a lifetime of neck problems from having the $hit shaken out of him as a toddler in meetings, week in & week out.
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Post by snow on Apr 24, 2024 17:34:07 GMT -5
I didn't need to talk to get a really good spanking. All I had to do was not sit still. I remember one special meetings I was dressed in a crinkly dress material so every time I moved of course it made a noise. I was about 3 maybe. I spent most of the two meetings outside getting spanked that day! It's quite sick isint it. My brother has had a lifetime of neck problems from having the $hit shaken out of him as a toddler in meetings, week in & week out. Hmm I got shook too. I wonder if that's why I have 4 herniated discs in my neck? I never have figured out how I did that but have had neck issues most of my life. When they did the MRI they found the herniated discs about 25 years ago.
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Post by BobWilliston on Apr 24, 2024 17:52:48 GMT -5
Apparently I was a model child. I can't ever remember being taken out of a meeting. Nut I shuddered when I heard the howling of some of the others who had been taken out.
I happen to know a man who carried a little switch into meetings with him so all four of his small sons would behave in meetings. And everyone thought it was his wife who was the mentally ill one.
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Post by BobWilliston on Apr 24, 2024 17:53:45 GMT -5
That's not cheese, you silly nut.
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Post by Pragmatic on Apr 24, 2024 20:07:41 GMT -5
It's quite sick isint it. My brother has had a lifetime of neck problems from having the $hit shaken out of him as a toddler in meetings, week in & week out. Hmm I got shook too. I wonder if that's why I have 4 herniated discs in my neck? I never have figured out how I did that but have had neck issues most of my life. When they did the MRI they found the herniated discs about 25 years ago. While I accept that times were different back then, I well recall certain brutes of fathers beating their kids mercilessly for very little reason. Often they were farmers, but one I well recall was a bad-tempered businessman in another town. Today he would be jailed.
It was very much, "The beatings will continue until morale and behaviour improve, and you profess". "Then if you come home with your own car with a radio in it, I will beat you senseless again, and then rip it out."
One has been identified as a CSA perpetrator now. Another's brother in-law was charged for CSA but died just prior to trial.
I recall two who also beat their wives that I learned later.
All in the name of Christianity....it absolutely disgusts me, and especially since they were considered to be 'pillars of the truth'.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Apr 24, 2024 20:17:33 GMT -5
Hmm I got shook too. I wonder if that's why I have 4 herniated discs in my neck? I never have figured out how I did that but have had neck issues most of my life. When they did the MRI they found the herniated discs about 25 years ago. While I accept that times were different back then, I well recall certain brutes of fathers beating their kids mercilessly for very little reason. Often they were farmers, but one I well recall was a bad-tempered businessman in another town. Today he would be jailed.
It was very much, "The beatings will continue until morale and behaviour improve, and you profess". "Then if you come home with your own car with a radio in it, I will beat you senseless again, and then rip it out."
One has been identified as a CSA perpetrator now. Another's brother in-law was charged for CSA but died just prior to trial.
I recall two who also beat their wives that I learned later.
All in the name of Christianity....it absolutely disgusts me, and especially since they were considered to be 'pillars of the truth'.
The previous posts and yours have brought back memories of how things were in the bad old days. Some women were brutes to their children as well. As you mentioned, there is an interesting correlation between beating children and sexually abusing children. I reckon it's a power trip, much the same as workers do when they rape and molest. It's good to see the noose tightening around some of these abusers necks and not before time. It's also good to see some being kicked out of fellowship. It's remarkable how they have gone from being front row ass lickers to not being wanted in the meetings. I sometimes wonder how their sanctimonious wives feel?
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help
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Post by help on Apr 24, 2024 20:34:52 GMT -5
Very sad Pragmatic and I know of many similar abuse situations that took place in Victoria. And yet those same people came with a "Holier Than Thou", attitude to meetings on Sunday. They felt their behaviour was justified by being a Sunday Christian. Just a great pretence. It is more important to live the life of a Christian every day. Christianity is a religion which places good qualities at its core, tolerance, compassion and love. It is considered a Christian duty to treat others with kindness, humanity and genuine acceptance, at all times.
Living the life is far more important than any time spent in Church. "The most important work you will ever do will be within the walls of your own home.” Harold B. Lee
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