magpies39plus
Senior Member
WHY? Does quoting relevant scripture send the 2x2;s into sometimes a nasty response??
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Post by magpies39plus on Jan 9, 2024 21:48:32 GMT -5
The words of the original creed from Nicaea was written in 325 AD. This was 265 years prior the founding of the "Roman" Catholic Church'and 1570 years prior to William Irving's founding of the 2x2 doctrine. The term Catholic used in the original Creed was meaning Universal,as that is it's meaning. It is still so relevant to today and the Teaching/Preaching of the Gospel,when you think of the era it was written. "NOW" The singers yes from a very large Pentecostal group who also have had very recent exposed terrible cover ups of Paedophelia against it's founder ministry and also Leadership for not allowing it brought to light? So it is the words of the song that are so strong and relevant"NOT" the singers,so don't judge them,very good,I knew you wouldn't? The words of the 4th Century Creed absorb them with joy in your heart. "THIS I BELIEVE" (The Creed) www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtUNQpu2b7Q www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNiYUPsHgls Blessings from listening from "god the Father","God the Son" and "God the Holy Ghost" (Spirit) Love Magpie |
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Post by xna on Jan 9, 2024 22:03:25 GMT -5
The words of the original creed from Nicaea was written in 325 AD. This was 265 years prior the founding of the "Roman" Catholic Church'325+ 265 = 590 List of popes of the Roman Catholic Church up to the year 590 AD, along with their approximate dates of reign: St. Peter (32-67) St. Linus (67-76) St. Anacletus (Cletus) (76-88) St. Clement I (88-97) St. Evaristus (97-105) St. Alexander I (105-115) St. Sixtus I (115-125) St. Telesphorus (125-136) St. Hyginus (136-140) St. Pius I (140-155) St. Anicetus (155-166) St. Soter (166-175) St. Eleutherius (175-189) St. Victor I (189-199) St. Zephyrinus (199-217) St. Callixtus I (217-222) St. Urban I (222-230) St. Pontian (230-235) St. Anterus (235-236) St. Fabian (236-250) St. Cornelius (251-253) St. Lucius I (253-254) St. Stephen I (254-257) St. Sixtus II (257-258) St. Dionysius (260-268) St. Felix I (269-274) St. Eutychian (275-283) St. Gaius (Caius) (283-296) St. Marcellinus (296-304) St. Marcellus I (308-309) St. Eusebius (309 or 310) St. Miltiades (311-314) St. Sylvester I (314-335) St. Marcus (336) St. Julius I (337-352) Liberius (352-366) St. Damasus I (366-384) St. Siricius (384-399) St. Anastasius I (399-401) St. Innocent I (401-417) St. Zosimus (417-418) St. Boniface I (418-422) St. Celestine I (422-432) St. Sixtus III (432-440) St. Leo I (the Great) (440-461) St. Hilarius (461-468) St. Simplicius (468-483) St. Felix III (II) (483-492) St. Gelasius I (492-496) Anastasius II (496-498) St. Symmachus (498-514) St. Hormisdas (514-523) St. John I (523-526) St. Felix IV (III) (526-530) Boniface II (530-532) John II (533-535) St. Agapetus I (535-536) St. Silverius (536-537) Vigilius (537-555) Pelagius I (556-561) John III (561-574) Benedict I (575-579) Pelagius II (579-590) |
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Post by Admin on Jan 10, 2024 20:38:31 GMT -5
The words of the original creed from Nicaea was written in 325 AD. Thanks (again!), magpies39plusI tend to think of the Nicene Creed and the start of what we would recognize as the RCC as occurring more or less same time. But the RCC could argue rather convincingly that they of all churches, really do go back "to the shores of Galilee". It's a salutary lesson that for all organizations, once man-made ideas and form become codified and rigorously enforced for membership, "error grows in bypath ways". I feel a strong connection with those early (1st & 2nd century) Christian brothers and sisters of ours, since visiting the catacombs on the Appian Way in Rome. The inscriptions and paintings on those tombs expressed strongly and clearly the similar faith we share with them, 2000+ years later. Whatever human-devised form and rules that have survived or been superseded between then and now are essentially irrelevant. But the Nicene Creed stands like a beacon. And great music, by the way  |
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Post by chuck on Jan 17, 2024 3:04:54 GMT -5
The Nicene Creed is part of the foundation of what we know as Christianity today, it has nothing to do with the Christ Character that's talked about in scripture in the first century. It was a way to control people therfore its absent the Christ Character, The Christ Character does not require religion, denominations, race ect.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2024 9:20:52 GMT -5
The Nicene Creed is part of the foundation of what we know as Christianity today, it has nothing to do with the Christ Character that's talked about in scripture in the first century. It was a way to control people therfore its absent the Christ Character, The Christ Character does not require religion, denominations, race ect. Wrong as usual... |
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Post by chuck on Jan 17, 2024 21:07:58 GMT -5
The Nicene Creed is part of the foundation of what we know as Christianity today, it has nothing to do with the Christ Character that's talked about in scripture in the first century. It was a way to control people therfore its absent the Christ Character, The Christ Character does not require religion, denominations, race ect. Wrong as usual... It's amazing how many "Christians" dont know where and when their "beliefs" originated and how foreign it is to the Hebrew people actually represented in the scripture that has inappropriately and ignorantly been commandeered by religious nutters and control freaks and people who are addicted to being right!. |
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Post by fixit on Jan 18, 2024 14:21:20 GMT -5
The words of the original creed from Nicaea was written in 325 AD. This was 265 years prior the founding of the "Roman" Catholic Church'325+ 265 = 590 List of popes of the Roman Catholic Church up to the year 590 AD, along with their approximate dates of reign: |
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Post by maryhig on Jan 19, 2024 7:19:43 GMT -5
We don't need any Nicene creed, we have the Bible and that's all we need.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jan 19, 2024 13:50:14 GMT -5
Hillsong's record is one of scandal. Nice people.....not.
Frank Houston was accused of sexual abuse — and Brian Houston was charged with covering it up
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Post by chuck on Jan 19, 2024 23:52:56 GMT -5
We don't need any Nicene creed, we have the Bible and that's all we need. Which rendition Mary?. Like I said, it's amazing the amount of "Christians" that have absolutely no idea about the foundation of their beliefs but rather think "the bible" dropped from heaven leather bound in basic terms... |
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Post by Pragmatic on Jan 20, 2024 19:25:37 GMT -5
Could it be classed as a meteorite? Maybe the first one? I always say, know who you worship and why, and part of this is understanding how it all came about. |
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Post by chuck on Jan 20, 2024 23:45:02 GMT -5
I always say, know who you worship and why, and part of this is understanding how it all came about. Great advice. |
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Post by maryhig on Jan 21, 2024 0:45:24 GMT -5
We don't need any Nicene creed, we have the Bible and that's all we need. Which rendition Mary?. Like I said, it's amazing the amount of "Christians" that have absolutely no idea about the foundation of their beliefs but rather think "the bible" dropped from heaven leather bound in basic terms... God has exactly what he wants in the Bible. I read the KJV but I also look up the Greek/Hebrew and the Pesh-ta versions at times too, translated to English. And the scriptures did drop from heaven, into the hearts of those inspired of God. |
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Post by chuck on Jan 21, 2024 4:08:19 GMT -5
Which rendition Mary?. Like I said, it's amazing the amount of "Christians" that have absolutely no idea about the foundation of their beliefs but rather think "the bible" dropped from heaven leather bound in basic terms... God has exactly what he wants in the Bible. I read the KJV but I also look up the Greek/Hebrew and the Pesh-ta versions at times too, translated to English. And the scriptures did drop from heaven, into the hearts of those inspired of God. Which Bible Mary?. It's pointless translating words into english unless you understand the Hebrew or Greek concepts and philosophy behind them. For example, In the old testement the word Sheol has been retranslared to fit a bias, or it has been translated multiple times to fit a theology, and guess what, its not what 1st century Hebrews thought I can tell you that. Sheol has conveniently been retranslated a few times, at one stage they had good people going to hell and bad people just going to the grave, they couldn't have that so they translated again and to convieniently fit the theology of bad people going to Hell and good people going to the grave...what a coincidence to fit their theology and ignore the Hebrew concepts and philosophy. Inspired by which God?, the Hebrew God was the L O R D, and that is a set of characteristics, or perhaps the God the greeks created know as the Christian God, this is the man up stairs so to speak.... There is too much information out there now Mary to just keep throwing out overused phrases, understand where they come from. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2024 9:04:47 GMT -5
God has exactly what he wants in the Bible. I read the KJV but I also look up the Greek/Hebrew and the Pesh-ta versions at times too, translated to English. And the scriptures did drop from heaven, into the hearts of those inspired of God. Which Bible Mary?. It's pointless translating words into english unless you understand the Hebrew or Greek concepts and philosophy behind them. For example, In the old testement the word Sheol has been retranslared to fit a bias, or it has been translated multiple times to fit a theology, and guess what, its not what 1st century Hebrews thought I can tell you that. Sheol has conveniently been retranslated a few times, at one stage they had good people going to hell and bad people just going to the grave, they couldn't have that so they translated again and to convieniently fit the theology of bad people going to Hell and good people going to the grave...what a coincidence to fit their theology and ignore the Hebrew concepts and philosophy. Inspired by which God?, the Hebrew God was the L O R D, and that is a set of characteristics, or perhaps the God the greeks created know as the Christian God, this is the man up stairs so to speak.... There is too much information out there now Mary to just keep throwing out overused phrases, understand where they come from. You are neither a Greek or Hebrew expert, I doubt you know more than 100 words in either...how would you know what they thought...shyster... |
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Post by fixit on Jan 21, 2024 13:18:38 GMT -5
You are neither a Greek or Hebrew expert, I doubt you know more than 100 words in either...how would you know what they thought...shyster... Do we have to have the name calling? 100 words in Greek or Hebrew is probably more than you understand. |
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Post by chuck on Jan 21, 2024 17:28:55 GMT -5
You are neither a Greek or Hebrew expert, I doubt you know more than 100 words in either...how would you know what they thought...shyster... Do we have to have the name calling? 100 words in Greek or Hebrew is probably more than you understand. Being able to read Greek or Hebrew isn't the issue, Understanding the concepts and philosophy in context to the time is the key. The issue is we have been conditioned to subconsciously apply our western ideas back onto the words pre and post translation. Some people just cant grasp this hence the name calling. The hieroglyphics were like comic strips, they told a story, each symbol had its own concept, we have dumbed that story down to one word and applied our own image to that word with no knowledge of the original comic strip whatsoever. The result is a literal reading of the text in our own theology and philosophy absent original intent. What could go wrong really....... |
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Post by SharonArnold on Jan 21, 2024 17:46:18 GMT -5
Do we have to have the name calling? 100 words in Greek or Hebrew is probably more than you understand. Being able to read Greek or Hebrew isn't the issue, Understanding the concepts and philosophy in context to the time is the key. The issue is we have been conditioned to subconsciously apply our western ideas back onto the words pre and post translation. Some people just cant grasp this hence the name calling. The hieroglyphics were like comic strips, they told a story, each symbol had its own concept, we have dumbed that story down to one word and applied our own image to that word with no knowledge of the original comic strip whatsoever. The result is a literal reading of the text in our own theology and philosophy absent original intent. What could go wrong really....... I think you are completely correct. But it is a very hard concept to explain... Sometimes you have to let people find their own way - and it might not be through words. You have to trust the wisdom of a life being lived. (Not always our choice of direction.) |
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Post by Pragmatic on Jan 21, 2024 19:15:28 GMT -5
A case in point is exploring the Napoli underground, and viewing the graffiti.It's not until you understand the context of why they drew, what they drew, that it takes on a whole different meaning to what how the modern mind would interpret.
I understand exactly what Chuck is saying, and Sharon is also right. It's not about whether you know the language. Experts can translate that, but getting a grip on the context, the culture and happenings at the time. For example in the aqueduct under Napoli, there is a depiction of a man, and an X over him. The people were hiding in the defunct aqueducts from the Allied bombings, and the man is Mussolini who they were blaming for their plight. Another part shows what looks like a square net. It was the the beginnings of someone doing a football match, but never completed it. It was probably an expression of what they were missing.
Understanding what was going on at the time for what now makes up the Bible, and was later written, is key to having a better and clearer understanding of it. It's not rocket science, but I fail to see why people cannot understand that.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2024 1:15:01 GMT -5
You are neither a Greek or Hebrew expert, I doubt you know more than 100 words in either...how would you know what they thought...shyster... Do we have to have the name calling? 100 words in Greek or Hebrew is probably more than you understand. You new here? You've done a bit now and then hypocrite... I don't make that claim, your chuckite leader does though... |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2024 1:21:25 GMT -5
Context aye?
The Jews of the NT Mark, Matthew, John, Luke, Paul, James, Jude, Peter and others saw fit to either translate to Greek or wrote in Greek the Jewish concepts then and from the past. They had no problem with it conveying whatever it was they were trying to say. Neither did God.
Sad how easy some are fooled...shysters are everywhere...
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Post by Pragmatic on Jan 22, 2024 1:33:15 GMT -5
As an example, does not the context of a woman shaving her head, as Paul referenced (1 Cor 11 5-6), have any significance? Or does the erotic art in Pompeii have no importance in understanding some of the events of that time. Either way, this is an example of something happening back in Paul's day, that is different to today.
Context is not be all and end all, but it is unfortunately ignored by the workers in many instances, because it would dilute the message of control they're trying to impose.
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Post by haggard on Jan 22, 2024 3:46:03 GMT -5
As in any fairy tale...anything is possible...and of course..Wally has his version ..
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Post by maryhig on Jan 22, 2024 5:30:12 GMT -5
I always say, know who you worship and why, and part of this is understanding how it all came about. I worship the father, the living God, because I love him, and I know he's there. |
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Post by maryhig on Jan 22, 2024 5:53:49 GMT -5
God has exactly what he wants in the Bible. I read the KJV but I also look up the Greek/Hebrew and the Pesh-ta versions at times too, translated to English. And the scriptures did drop from heaven, into the hearts of those inspired of God. Which Bible Mary?. It's pointless translating words into english unless you understand the Hebrew or Greek concepts and philosophy behind them. For example, In the old testement the word Sheol has been retranslared to fit a bias, or it has been translated multiple times to fit a theology, and guess what, its not what 1st century Hebrews thought I can tell you that. Sheol has conveniently been retranslated a few times, at one stage they had good people going to hell and bad people just going to the grave, they couldn't have that so they translated again and to convieniently fit the theology of bad people going to Hell and good people going to the grave...what a coincidence to fit their theology and ignore the Hebrew concepts and philosophy. Inspired by which God?, the Hebrew God was the L O R D, and that is a set of characteristics, or perhaps the God the greeks created know as the Christian God, this is the man up stairs so to speak.... There is too much information out there now Mary to just keep throwing out overused phrases, understand where they come from. Ah you see, I don't see the Bible as many do. I see the grave as hell and it's not the literal grave either, it's hell in the here and now! Sheol is the abode of the dead, and we can be dead and our spirits separated from God in this lifetime. We are already in the grave when we are separated from God and dead to him. We need to be brought from death to life in the here and now to know God. Jesus spoke of this when he said that the pharasees were as white washed sepulchers (graves), full of dead mens bones. White washed graves, looking right on the outside, but full of the dead on the inside not having the living Spirit, and knowing the way of God but not living by it thus they are dead to him. I don't believe that we sleep in any literal grave when we die, I believe that or body goes to back to the earth and our Spirit goes to God. Jesus himself said, "father into your hands I commend my Spirit" and Stephen also called on God and asked Christ Jesus to receive his Spirit And I don't believe in any rapture, the resurrection is in the here and now, when we are raised from death to life through Christ by the Spirit. And God isn't any man upstairs, God is Spirit and he lives in the hearts of those who love him. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2024 8:07:17 GMT -5
As an example, does not the context of a woman shaving her head, as Paul referenced (1 Cor 11 5-6), have any significance? Or does the erotic art in Pompeii have no importance in understanding some of the events of that time. Either way, this is an example of something happening back in Paul's day, that is different to today. Context is not be all and end all, but it is unfortunately ignored by the workers in many instances, because it would dilute the message of control they're trying to impose. No one said they didn't do things differently back then to today, the chuckite says we don't/can't understand it since it was Hebrew and in Hebrew and of those times...would it be that difficult for the Holy Spirit to reveal those things also? |
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Post by snow on Jan 22, 2024 14:22:26 GMT -5
Which Bible Mary?. It's pointless translating words into english unless you understand the Hebrew or Greek concepts and philosophy behind them. For example, In the old testement the word Sheol has been retranslared to fit a bias, or it has been translated multiple times to fit a theology, and guess what, its not what 1st century Hebrews thought I can tell you that. Sheol has conveniently been retranslated a few times, at one stage they had good people going to hell and bad people just going to the grave, they couldn't have that so they translated again and to convieniently fit the theology of bad people going to Hell and good people going to the grave...what a coincidence to fit their theology and ignore the Hebrew concepts and philosophy. Inspired by which God?, the Hebrew God was the L O R D, and that is a set of characteristics, or perhaps the God the greeks created know as the Christian God, this is the man up stairs so to speak.... There is too much information out there now Mary to just keep throwing out overused phrases, understand where they come from. Ah you see, I don't see the Bible as many do. I see the grave as hell and it's not the literal grave either, it's hell in the here and now! Sheol is the abode of the dead, and we can be dead and our spirits separated from God in this lifetime. We are already in the grave when we are separated from God and dead to him. We need to be brought from death to life in the here and now to know God. Jesus spoke of this when he said that the pharasees were as white washed sepulchers (graves), full of dead mens bones. White washed graves, looking right on the outside, but full of the dead on the inside not having the living Spirit, and knowing the way of God but not living by it thus they are dead to him. I don't believe that we sleep in any literal grave when we die, I believe that or body goes to back to the earth and our Spirit goes to God. Jesus himself said, "father into your hands I commend my Spirit" and Stephen also called on God and asked Christ Jesus to receive his Spirit And I don't believe in any rapture, the resurrection is in the here and now, when we are raised from death to life through Christ by the Spirit. And God isn't any man upstairs, God is Spirit and he lives in the hearts of those who love him. What happens to non believers then in your belief? Do they also go to God? Or do they just die and become one with the earth again like I believe all people do when they die? |
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Post by snow on Jan 22, 2024 14:23:46 GMT -5
As an example, does not the context of a woman shaving her head, as Paul referenced (1 Cor 11 5-6), have any significance? Or does the erotic art in Pompeii have no importance in understanding some of the events of that time. Either way, this is an example of something happening back in Paul's day, that is different to today. Context is not be all and end all, but it is unfortunately ignored by the workers in many instances, because it would dilute the message of control they're trying to impose. No one said they didn't do things differently back then to today, the chuckite says we don't/can't understand it since it was Hebrew and in Hebrew and of those times...would it be that difficult for the Holy Spirit to reveal those things also? Well we've recently found out that the HS wasn't able to reveal to the workers that it was bad to rape a child, so apparently the HS has it's limitations? |
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