|
Post by wherefromhere on Dec 12, 2023 19:40:49 GMT -5
There was a recent thread declaring Breaking News that 'a senior NZ/OZ worker bites the dust'. I looked with disbelief at the comments made. it was utter bunkum.
I want Admin to be particularly aware of this because (a) can people really post stuff like this here with impunity - particularly when making a deliberate point of making this worker identifiable? Are there any repurcussions for those stating falsehoods that produce hurt for targetted individuals? (b) does Admin keep a record of regular offenders of this sort of thing? - the poster could have easily done a quick call to anyone in the Puke area and they could have quickly established that that person was still fully involved in the work and in preps. But there was absolutely no care with breaking the Breaking News as regards accuracy - instead effort was made to make the worker identifiable throughout the region. What sort of behaviour is that? (c) Admin, can the original thread be immediately removed now please - if you have any doubts , the speakers list for Puke has just come out and the individual's name is visible for all to see there. (d) For those of you who gave a 'like' to the opening post and a 'like' for the follow-up insight of being 'very embarrassed that I was associated with such a bunch of drongos', I trust that you will also check the level of embarrassment you must surely be feeling from being completely taken in by someone posting untruths here.
Loads of stupid or subpar behaviours here I'm afraid. It's posts and posters like this that really damage the credibility of TMB and exes in the eyes of 2x2s. You guys really do not help yourselves.
|
|
|
Post by godsgrace on Dec 12, 2023 20:29:57 GMT -5
Do you have a list for speakers by any chance?
|
|
|
Post by Pragmatic on Dec 12, 2023 21:08:25 GMT -5
I have been trying to verify if this was true over the last day or so, and also heard that he was at Preps and on the Speakers list. Doesn't alter what I think of the guy, but I don't want to discuss something that may not be correct.
|
|
jwatt
Junior Member
Posts: 185
|
Post by jwatt on Dec 12, 2023 22:48:01 GMT -5
Is he still going to South Africa??
|
|
|
Post by Mary on Dec 13, 2023 0:21:48 GMT -5
And why was he sent home from Western Australia after being made head Worker there?
|
|
jwatt
Junior Member
Posts: 185
|
Post by jwatt on Dec 13, 2023 0:56:09 GMT -5
And why was he sent home from Western Australia after being made head Worker there? He's been a naughty boy, maybe ??
|
|
|
Post by Pragmatic on Dec 13, 2023 1:20:38 GMT -5
There have been a number of allegations, which are on some websites, but I know he didn't sign the overseers letter regarding CSA, and steps being taken, and that raised some eyebrows. I don't know if this was the reason or not, but it didn't sit well.
It is possible too that Graeme Thompson's letter to the oversight, which was made public, and included a reference to his sexual proclivities, might have been a tipping point.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2023 1:56:19 GMT -5
There was a recent thread declaring Breaking News that 'a senior NZ/OZ worker bites the dust'. I looked with disbelief at the comments made. it was utter bunkum. I want Admin to be particularly aware of this because (a) can people really post stuff like this here with impunity - particularly when making a deliberate point of making this worker identifiable? Are there any repurcussions for those stating falsehoods that produce hurt for targetted individuals? (b) does Admin keep a record of regular offenders of this sort of thing? - the poster could have easily done a quick call to anyone in the Puke area and they could have quickly established that that person was still fully involved in the work and in preps. But there was absolutely no care with breaking the Breaking News as regards accuracy - instead effort was made to make the worker identifiable throughout the region. What sort of behaviour is that? (c) Admin, can the original thread be immediately removed now please - if you have any doubts , the speakers list for Puke has just come out and the individual's name is visible for all to see there. (d) For those of you who gave a 'like' to the opening post and a 'like' for the follow-up insight of being 'very embarrassed that I was associated with such a bunch of drongos', I trust that you will also check the level of embarrassment you must surely be feeling from being completely taken in by someone posting untruths here. Loads of stupid or subpar behaviours here I'm afraid. It's posts and posters like this that really damage the credibility of TMB and exes in the eyes of 2x2s. You guys really do not help yourselves. With DB starting the fireworks, that ship has sailed on any rules...
|
|
janj
Senior Member
Posts: 470
|
Post by janj on Dec 13, 2023 2:42:29 GMT -5
And why was he sent home from Western Australia after being made head Worker there? As I understand it he came home of his own accord, & it was his choice to step down as overseer. Maybe that was the reason that he didn't sign the letter, or maybe he didn't agree with it? I always liked this man, but regardless of what you think of him, please have just a tiny bit of decency & leave the man alone unless you know for a FACT that what you are saying is true. Everyone has a limit to what they can tolerate.
|
|
|
Post by Mary on Dec 13, 2023 3:05:02 GMT -5
And why was he sent home from Western Australia after being made head Worker there? As I understand it he came home of his own accord, & it was his choice to step down as overseer. Maybe that was the reason that he didn't sign the letter, or maybe he didn't agree with it? I always liked this man, but regardless of what you think of him, please have just a tiny bit of decency & leave the man alone unless you know for a FACT that what you are saying is true. Everyone has a limit to what they can tolerate. I asked why was he sent home from Western Australia now you make accusations against me.
|
|
janj
Senior Member
Posts: 470
|
Post by janj on Dec 13, 2023 3:43:56 GMT -5
As I understand it he came home of his own accord, & it was his choice to step down as overseer. Maybe that was the reason that he didn't sign the letter, or maybe he didn't agree with it? I always liked this man, but regardless of what you think of him, please have just a tiny bit of decency & leave the man alone unless you know for a FACT that what you are saying is true. Everyone has a limit to what they can tolerate. I asked why was he sent home from Western Australia now you make accusations against me. Yes- sorry- I did reply to your question, but I was actually addressing everyone on this thread - not you in particular. Apologies
|
|
|
Post by wherefromhere on Dec 13, 2023 5:34:08 GMT -5
Do you have a list for speakers by any chance? Will send it to you in a personal message.
|
|
|
Post by intelchips on Dec 13, 2023 5:58:47 GMT -5
Do you have a list for speakers by any chance? Will send it to you in a personal message. I don't have a dog in this fight, but this response is typical of all that is wrong with the 2x2 system. Why should anyone need an above top-secret security clearance to see a workers list?
|
|
|
Post by wherefromhere on Dec 13, 2023 6:06:16 GMT -5
Will send it to you in a personal message. I don't have a dog in this fight, but this response is typical of all that is wrong with the 2x2 system. Why should anyone need an above top-secret security clearance to see a workers list? Your thinking is flawed. I am no longer a 2x2 (left years ago) . I simply chose to send the list by personal message. Top-secret security clearance never even crossed my mind.
|
|
|
Post by intelchips on Dec 13, 2023 6:15:40 GMT -5
I don't have a dog in this fight, but this response is typical of all that is wrong with the 2x2 system. Why should anyone need an above top-secret security clearance to see a workers list? Your thinking is flawed. I am no longer a 2x2 (left years ago) . I simply chose to send the list by personal message. Top-secret security clearance never even crossed my mind. Without knowing then I assume you can follow my reasoning. My apologies for getting it wrong.
|
|
|
Post by snow on Dec 13, 2023 15:56:55 GMT -5
Your thinking is flawed. I am no longer a 2x2 (left years ago) . I simply chose to send the list by personal message. Top-secret security clearance never even crossed my mind. Without knowing then I assume you can follow my reasoning. My apologies for getting it wrong. I think it's an ingrained thing for anyone that ever has been in the group. Workers lists were protected and many things were told to us to not share with the general population of the friends. I think that we just do it unconsciously because that's the way things were always done. That goes for other behaviors that are carried over. We were raised up as children so it stands to reason that there are things we do which are very 2x2 in nature and not even know we're doing them. So I can understand.
|
|
|
Post by Pragmatic on Dec 13, 2023 21:59:10 GMT -5
And why was he sent home from Western Australia after being made head Worker there? As I understand it he came home of his own accord, & it was his choice to step down as overseer. Maybe that was the reason that he didn't sign the letter, or maybe he didn't agree with it? I always liked this man, but regardless of what you think of him, please have just a tiny bit of decency & leave the man alone unless you know for a FACT that what you are saying is true. Everyone has a limit to what they can tolerate. From what I can recall, he said it was all his choosing. Others are saying the opposite. I don't know.
I do know of a sermon he delivered once preaching about the evil of certain morals, of which he himself is being accused of, as I was there in that meeting. I also know of his "we workers are right, and you have to obey, as we have the keys to the kingdom, and your salvation is on our shoulders. And if we're wrong, you are right to still be in subjection to us", I was one of three he said it to.
I knew an elder who used to be afraid of anything written "falling into the hands of the enemy". A bit of old WWII psyche mixed up with viewing people in a different church as "the enemy", I guess. What could be written that is harmful to the church, when compared to the harm that has recently been done to it by those who are supposedly shepherds of the sheep. The only thing I can think of is meeting timetables meaning some houses will be empty for burgling, and that happened in our town some decades ago. But this was done by someone attending the meetings.
How can secrecy over so many things be reconciled to proselytising to the whole world? No wonder Doug Parker called it, "The Secret Sect"
|
|
|
Post by wherefromhere on Dec 14, 2023 6:50:22 GMT -5
I have been trying to verify if this was true over the last day or so, and also heard that he was at Preps and on the Speakers list. Doesn't alter what I think of the guy, but I don't want to discuss something that may not be correct. Excellent. So you will now know that there has been an injustice done here. Are you prepared to call it out here that what was posted was totally unacceptable, that a poster posted something untrue about someone while at the same time taking pleasure in looking to make it known who that person was. Whether we like or don't like the targetted person is totally beside the point. It's about the principle of doing what is right. Are people here really prepared to call out others in the 2x2s (rightly) for secrecy , for not telling the truth, not dealing with wrongs etc but not be prepared to do the same when things move on to the other foot. I am seeing nobody at all here saying anything about the injustice that's been done here. There is not even an acknowledgement that IF what was posted is untrue then that is unacceptable and something needs to be done about it - particularly when taken alongside the mean stupid way in which the poster sought to expose the person's name. Any TMB partipant could do that. Is no one here appalled by this? Why do I only hear silence and see 'a looking away'? As an outsider there is a lot written here that I don't know if it is true or not. But what is different this time is that I know an injustice has been done. I am aghast at the lack of reaction by those who I look on as regular posters here and who saw that initial post come in and the concern expressed about its accuracy. As a bystander I am beginning to simply see people here as a bunch that actually exhibits the same behaviours that they readily condemn in others. I hesitate at this point to use the word 'hypocrites' because I am not sure if this is occasion is a one off , but if there is no desire to condemn an obvious injustice that hurts others I may just have to accept that word as valid. Maybe the Good Samaritan story should be brought up to date - those who walked by on the otherside should perhaps include 'TMB participants'. Yes, I am angry.
|
|
|
Post by fixit on Dec 14, 2023 22:58:24 GMT -5
I don't know what you expect to be done. I liked the post from Admin explaining the situation. Does that help? professing.proboards.com/thread/32404/moved-another-bites-dustHere's what Admin wrote: This message has been moved to Jump On Board by Admin.
I have not been able to verify the accuracy/truth of the information in this thread, yet.
Dec 14, 2023: It appears unlikely that the topic of the thread is factually correct. The thread and original post by curlywurlysammagee has now been removed from TMB. The grounds include that the thread violated the principle of common decency, among other violations of the standard expected from those with the privilege of posting here. A general warning is issued, noting the standards expected.
|
|
|
Post by guest8 on Dec 14, 2023 23:26:33 GMT -5
I believe, 'Wherefromhere' may not of noticed Admins later addition to his post. I never noticed it myself, until Fixit referred to it here. Not everybody reads posts backwards to notice additions. Its good that an administrator can ensure a certain dignity and decency is upheld on the board.
|
|
|
Post by wherefromhere on Dec 15, 2023 7:30:47 GMT -5
Excellent news.
Well done Admin. Superb stuff. I hope that the action you have taken is heartily endorsed by all posters on this board.
You asked, fixit, what I expected to be done. I expected to see a strong response from all TMB members to curly's posts. That was probably always expecting too much because right from the beginning a good number of posters were expressing 'likes' for curly's posts on his offending thread.
But just imagine this scenario. Imagine if review005 had made a post of similar ilk and spirit on this Board. TMB members (professing or non-professing) would have been jumping all over it calling for action etc (as we have seen in the past). Everyone would be chirping in. But this time there was total silence. That indicates that something is awry.
So I suspect that TMB posters (both professing and non-professing) are going to have to accept a period where people will mutter among themselves about the hypocricy and the showing of partiality that is exhibited here. And frankly, as a bystander, I'd have to say rightly so. There are other points that can be made about the hypocricy evident here but that would only lengthen this post (I have alluded to it in a previous post) - but hopefully you get the point. Sadly, this little saga has damaged the credibility of TMB posters and sadly it has been self-inflicted.
I will probably now take a break from posting on TMB.
I feel a good conclusion has been reached. Excellent work Admin.
|
|
|
Post by wherefromhere on Dec 15, 2023 7:48:37 GMT -5
Without knowing then I assume you can follow my reasoning. My apologies for getting it wrong. I think it's an ingrained thing for anyone that ever has been in the group. Workers lists were protected and many things were told to us to not share with the general population of the friends. I think that we just do it unconsciously because that's the way things were always done. That goes for other behaviors that are carried over. We were raised up as children so it stands to reason that there are things we do which are very 2x2 in nature and not even know we're doing them. So I can understand. I had missed this post previously. I am sure you are right. Another point though is that in 'divided' homes, the ex-2x2 spouse will consider their 2x2 spouse in the actions they take (particularly when the action has some link to 2x2 matters )
|
|
|
Post by SharonArnold on Dec 15, 2023 12:08:28 GMT -5
Excellent news. Well done Admin. Superb stuff. I hope that the action you have taken is heartily endorsed by all posters on this board. You asked, fixit, what I expected to be done. I expected to see a strong response from all TMB members to curly's posts. That was probably always expecting too much because right from the beginning a good number of posters were expressing 'likes' for curly's posts on his offending thread. But just imagine this scenario. Imagine if review005 had made a post of similar ilk and spirit on this Board. TMB members (professing or non-professing) would have been jumping all over it calling for action etc (as we have seen in the past). Everyone would be chirping in. But this time there was total silence. That indicates that something is awry. I wouldn't read too much into it, if I was you. I am sure there are quite a number here, who had no idea who/what Curly was referring to. I didn't. Still don't. Curly reported someone left the work? (Granted, maybe a little rudely.) They apparently didn't, and the reporting was corrected? That's my understanding. Why so much drama? (Rhetorical question, don't need an answer.) The drama is the part that strikes me as odd, and leaves me wondering what really happened here. (Rhetorical statement, don't need an answer.)
|
|
|
Post by wherefromhere on Dec 15, 2023 13:01:42 GMT -5
Hi Sharon, Admin writes: 'The grounds include that the thread violated the principle of common decency, among other violations of the standard expected from those with the privilege of writing here.' This does not equate to someone reporting something 'maybe a little rudely'. As per your own message there is no need to respond. Admin has completed a good job and it can be left there.
|
|
janj
Senior Member
Posts: 470
|
Post by janj on Dec 15, 2023 14:29:00 GMT -5
Excellent news. Well done Admin. Superb stuff. I hope that the action you have taken is heartily endorsed by all posters on this board. You asked, fixit, what I expected to be done. I expected to see a strong response from all TMB members to curly's posts. That was probably always expecting too much because right from the beginning a good number of posters were expressing 'likes' for curly's posts on his offending thread. But just imagine this scenario. Imagine if review005 had made a post of similar ilk and spirit on this Board. TMB members (professing or non-professing) would have been jumping all over it calling for action etc (as we have seen in the past). Everyone would be chirping in. But this time there was total silence. That indicates that something is awry. I wouldn't read too much into it, if I was you. I am sure there are quite a number here, who had no idea who/what Curly was referring to. I didn't. Still don't. Curly reported someone left the work? (Granted, maybe a little rudely.) They apparently didn't, and the reporting was corrected? That's my understanding. Why so much drama? (Rhetorical question, don't need an answer.) The drama is the part that strikes me as odd, and leaves me wondering what really happened here. (Rhetorical statement, don't need an answer.) Of course - just because YOU don't know who the poster was referring to we shouldn't get too excited about it? Really!! Well many many people throughout NZ & Australia did know! The poor man has been the brunt of so many rumors and false accusations that it is way beyond what anyone should have to endure. I felt sick when I read the gleeful post & the following comments. Is it any wonder some x's get labeled bitter!!
|
|
|
Post by snow on Dec 15, 2023 14:47:34 GMT -5
I think it's an ingrained thing for anyone that ever has been in the group. Workers lists were protected and many things were told to us to not share with the general population of the friends. I think that we just do it unconsciously because that's the way things were always done. That goes for other behaviors that are carried over. We were raised up as children so it stands to reason that there are things we do which are very 2x2 in nature and not even know we're doing them. So I can understand. I had missed this post previously. I am sure you are right. Another point though is that in 'divided' homes, the ex-2x2 spouse will consider their 2x2 spouse in the actions they take (particularly when the action has some link to 2x2 matters ) Yes I imagine that would be true for a divided home too. I'm curious. In a divided home, did the professing person not share things in the church with their spouse? Just some stuff maybe?
|
|
|
Post by wherefromhere on Dec 15, 2023 15:08:54 GMT -5
I had missed this post previously. I am sure you are right. Another point though is that in 'divided' homes, the ex-2x2 spouse will consider their 2x2 spouse in the actions they take (particularly when the action has some link to 2x2 matters ) Yes I imagine that would be true for a divided home too. I'm curious. In a divided home, did the professing person not share things in the church with their spouse? Just some stuff maybe? I'm sure that it varies from home to home. Hopefully both spouses understand exactly why one spouse chose to leave the fellowship, and why the other didn't and that that is respected by each spouse. That would be the ideal. I think that the spouse who leaves the meetings needs to be subsequently careful that their actions and words regarding the church don't hurt their spouse (eg in any way mock the spouse's belief or faith however gently - I think be very caring around this because faith matters can often be felt very personally and it would be easy to hurt). If care like that is shown I think it will confirm trust, allowing the sharing of things openly about the fellowship by the professing spouse. Just my 2 cents worth.
|
|
|
Post by SharonArnold on Dec 15, 2023 15:51:24 GMT -5
I wouldn't read too much into it, if I was you. I am sure there are quite a number here, who had no idea who/what Curly was referring to. I didn't. Still don't. Curly reported someone left the work? (Granted, maybe a little rudely.) They apparently didn't, and the reporting was corrected? That's my understanding. Why so much drama? (Rhetorical question, don't need an answer.) The drama is the part that strikes me as odd, and leaves me wondering what really happened here. (Rhetorical statement, don't need an answer.) Of course - just because YOU don't know who the poster was referring to we shouldn't get too excited about it? Really!! Well many many people throughout NZ & Australia did know! The poor man has been the brunt of so many rumors and false accusations that it is way beyond what anyone should have to endure. I felt sick when I read the gleeful post & the following comments. Is it any wonder some x's get labeled bitter!! Now, that is not a fair comment on my post. And, on some level, you have to know it. This has nothing to do with me personally, and what I know/do not know. I was simply providing another perspective to the question posed by wherefromhere on why there was total silence from everyone (which includes me, because I am a reader here) over this matter. It is simply because many of us did not have a clue what it was all about. There was no agenda, no ill intent. Perspective. I think wherefromhere understood what I was trying to say.
|
|