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Post by curlywurlysammagee on May 30, 2021 21:46:25 GMT -5
It is obvious they have never studied anything other than the talking donkey account. The reality of what really occurred in the beginning of time is far removed from the biblical account. The reality of the end of life of on this earth is also far removed from what the wishful thinkers would like to believe.
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Post by nathan02 on May 30, 2021 21:47:53 GMT -5
That answer does not answer the question I asked of you, Can you even answer it honestly? Once again. If we wind back the expansion, what point do we arrive at? ** There is NO going BACK! It's only going forward, Once God has created a soul it goes on forever and it will NEVER DIE. Jesus gives us the understanding and REVELATION the mystery of ETERNAL life through believing in God/Christ and Death forever to those who rejected Him as their Savior Luke 16.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2021 21:56:25 GMT -5
It is obvious they have never studied anything other than the talking donkey account. The reality of what really occurred in the beginning of time is far removed from the biblical account. The reality of the end of life of on this earth is also far removed from what the wishful thinkers would like to believe. that is not true by any measure nor reality.... www.famousscientists.org/great-scientists-christians/
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on May 30, 2021 22:01:39 GMT -5
Your post confirms the truth of my statement. Take Georges Lemaitre for instance.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2021 22:11:22 GMT -5
Your post confirms the truth of my statement. Take Georges Lemaitre for instance. ummm no it doesn't according to you he would have never studied anything but a talking donkey book...good try though
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on May 30, 2021 22:44:33 GMT -5
Your post confirms the truth of my statement. Take Georges Lemaitre for instance. ummm no it doesn't according to you he would have never studied anything but a talking donkey book...good try though Did you read what he discovered?
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2021 22:46:58 GMT -5
ummm no it doesn't according to you he would have never studied anything but a talking donkey book...good try though Did you read what he discovered? yep, for him one can't be right all of the time...
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Post by dmmichgood on May 30, 2021 22:47:31 GMT -5
Your post confirms the truth of my statement. Take Georges Lemaitre for instance. ummm no it doesn't according to you he would have never studied anything but a talking donkey book...good try though Actually, most of that list that you posted were men who lived so for the past that even had they doubted the god of the bible it would have been dangerous to their very lives to say so outright.
An excellent example was Galileo Galilei the Italian astronomer.
The few scientists of today are just that; very few and far between amongst the huge number of scientists we have today.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2021 22:51:53 GMT -5
ummm no it doesn't according to you he would have never studied anything but a talking donkey book...good try though
The few scientists of today are just that; very few and far between amongst the huge number of scientists we have today.that wasn't the curlytroll point the point was believers don't study anything but the bible....i proved that wrong...and you are on the cusp of argumentum ad populum....
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on May 30, 2021 22:55:01 GMT -5
ummm no it doesn't according to you he would have never studied anything but a talking donkey book...good try though Actually, most of that list that you posted were men who lived so for the past that even had they doubted the god of the bible it would have been dangerous to their very lives to say so outright.
An excellent example was Galileo Galilei the Italian astronomer.
The few scientists of today are just that; very few and far between amongst the huge number of scientists we have today.It;s a very interesting list. Take LeMaitre for instance that I chose randomly. While nominally a priest he was also the scientist who first discovered that v=Hr That's impressive. It is known today as Hubbles law. He never asked any talking donkey for guidance on this.
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Post by sunshine on May 30, 2021 23:00:10 GMT -5
There's a big difference between cartoons and an expedition with filmed footage of an archeological find.
Speaking of cartoons, depictions of Jesus show him as a tall long haired white man, have a think about where he came from, and the likleyhood of that being the case. Also consider the names of the 12 disciples, and how likely it would be to find even one person with a name from half a world away even now, let alone 12 of them 2000 years ago. They had translated names "Simon was Shimon. James was Yakov (that is, Jacob). John was Yochanan. Bartholomew was Bar-Talmai (son of Ptolemy). Matthew was Mattityahu, meaning, “gift from God.” Thomas was Tau’ma, an Aramaic name. Thaddaeus was a variant of Theudas, which was a Grecian version of Judas or Yehuda. Andrew and Philip are interesting because those are clearly Greek names—Andreas and Filippos; there are no Hebrew equivalents. Thus, we may surmise that Andrew and Philip were either Grecian-Jews or Grecian-Gentiles. In all probability, we may discount the theory that they were Gentiles: Jesus was a Jew who saw his mission as teaching and healing his fellow Jews. “I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” Matthew 15:24. It would be hard to imagine preaching to Jews while having Gentile Apostles. Judas Iscariot was Yehuda."
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Post by dmmichgood on May 30, 2021 23:05:41 GMT -5
ummm no it doesn't according to you he would have never studied anything but a talking donkey book...good try though Did you read what he discovered? I wonder if Wally did read everything about Lemaître.
Georges Henri Joseph Édouard Lemaître, (17 July 1894 – 20 June 1966) was a Belgian Catholic priest, mathematician, astronomer, and professor of physics at the Catholic University of Louvain.
He was the first to theorize that the recession of nearby galaxies can be explained by an expanding universe, which was observationally confirmed soon afterwards by Edwin Hubble.
He first derived "Hubble's law", now called the Hubble–Lemaître law by the IAU, and published the first estimation of the Hubble constant in 1927, two years before Hubble's article.
Lemaître also proposed the "Big Bang theory" of the origin of the universe, calling it the "hypothesis of the primeval atom", and later calling it "the beginning of the world".
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georges_Lema%C3%AEtre
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Post by mrdobalina on May 30, 2021 23:08:31 GMT -5
Speaking of cartoons, depictions of Jesus show him as a tall long haired white man, have a think about where he came from, and the likleyhood of that being the case. Also consider the names of the 12 disciples, and how likely it would be to find even one person with a name from half a world away even now, let alone 12 of them 2000 years ago. They had translated names "Simon was Shimon. James was Yakov (that is, Jacob). John was Yochanan. Bartholomew was Bar-Talmai (son of Ptolemy). Matthew was Mattityahu, meaning, “gift from God.” Thomas was Tau’ma, an Aramaic name. Thaddaeus was a variant of Theudas, which was a Grecian version of Judas or Yehuda. Andrew and Philip are interesting because those are clearly Greek names—Andreas and Filippos; there are no Hebrew equivalents. Thus, we may surmise that Andrew and Philip were either Grecian-Jews or Grecian-Gentiles. In all probability, we may discount the theory that they were Gentiles: Jesus was a Jew who saw his mission as teaching and healing his fellow Jews. “I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” Matthew 15:24. It would be hard to imagine preaching to Jews while having Gentile Apostles. Judas Iscariot was Yehuda." Great explination. But you can probably understand why some of us get confused & throw the book down in a huff.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on May 30, 2021 23:14:38 GMT -5
Did you read what he discovered? I wonder if Wally did read everything about Lemaître.
Georges Henri Joseph Édouard Lemaître, (17 July 1894 – 20 June 1966) was a Belgian Catholic priest, mathematician, astronomer, and professor of physics at the Catholic University of Louvain.
He was the first to theorize that the recession of nearby galaxies can be explained by an expanding universe, which was observationally confirmed soon afterwards by Edwin Hubble.
He first derived "Hubble's law", now called the Hubble–Lemaître law by the IAU, and published the first estimation of the Hubble constant in 1927, two years before Hubble's article.
Lemaître also proposed the "Big Bang theory" of the origin of the universe, calling it the "hypothesis of the primeval atom", and later calling it "the beginning of the world".
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georges_Lema%C3%AEtre
Then there is Isaac Newton. Also on Wallies list. Newton directed sunlight through two prisms. The first broke up the light into its individual wave lengths. The second returned it to its white wavelength. Now in the bible it says that god caused the sun to shine in the first chapter of genesis. After the flood it is said he caused a rainbow to appear as a promise of no more floods. However the rainbow was already present as even in the gentle mist that is supposed to have watered the earth, any light entering that mist would be reflected or refracted to cause a rainbow. Thanks to the rainbow we also understand redshift. Or at least the scientists do.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2021 23:15:30 GMT -5
Did you read what he discovered? I wonder if Wally did read everything about Lemaître.
Georges Henri Joseph Édouard Lemaître, (17 July 1894 – 20 June 1966) was a Belgian Catholic priest, mathematician, astronomer, and professor of physics at the Catholic University of Louvain.
He was the first to theorize that the recession of nearby galaxies can be explained by an expanding universe, which was observationally confirmed soon afterwards by Edwin Hubble.
He first derived "Hubble's law", now called the Hubble–Lemaître law by the IAU, and published the first estimation of the Hubble constant in 1927, two years before Hubble's article.
Lemaître also proposed the "Big Bang theory" of the origin of the universe, calling it the "hypothesis of the primeval atom", and later calling it "the beginning of the world".
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georges_Lema%C3%AEtre
i read everything on my link i usually do....doesn't change that i proved curlytrolls point to be wrong...
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Post by dmmichgood on May 30, 2021 23:24:50 GMT -5
The few scientists of today are just that; very few and far between amongst the huge number of scientists we have today.that wasn't the curlytroll point the point was believers don't study anything but the bible....i proved that wrong...and you are on the cusp of argumentum ad populum.... You should review the definition of argumentum ad populum.... Argumentum ad populum is a type of informal fallacy, specifically a fallacy of relevance, and is similar to an argument from authority ( argumentum ad verecundiam ).It uses an appeal to the beliefs, tastes, or values of a group of people, stating that because a certain opinion or attitude is held by a majority, it is therefore correct.
We aren't discussing "beliefs, tastes, or values" & "opinions or attitudes" but rather the use the scientific method is an empirical method of acquiring knowledge.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2021 23:44:10 GMT -5
that wasn't the curlytroll point the point was believers don't study anything but the bible....i proved that wrong...and you are on the cusp of argumentum ad populum.... You should review the definition of argumentum ad populum.... Argumentum ad populum is a type of informal fallacy, specifically a fallacy of relevance, and is similar to an argument from authority ( argumentum ad verecundiam ).It uses an appeal to the beliefs, tastes, or values of a group of people, stating that because a certain opinion or attitude is held by a majority, it is therefore correct.
We aren't discussing "beliefs, tastes, or values" & "opinions or attitudes" but rather the use the scientific method is an empirical method of acquiring knowledge. we were NOT discussing the scientific method we were talking about whether or not believers have studied anything more than the bible...religion is belief and science is little more than education opinion at times. you implied that believers were few and far between in science and unbelievers were the large majority that is about belief not science. like i said you are on the cusp of argumentum ad populum...good try though
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on May 30, 2021 23:46:02 GMT -5
They refers to the likes of Wallies and Nathans. Not scientists.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2021 23:50:19 GMT -5
They refers to the likes of Wallies and Nathans. Not scientists. nice try at a back track...not buying it though...
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Post by Dan on May 30, 2021 23:59:34 GMT -5
God has made that way! Just like life or our souls goes on After death, it doesn't end at the grave. Really, so if we wind back the expansion, what point do we arrive at?
We arrive at the beginning when God created the heavens and the earth. There's no biblical contradiction in regards to an expanding universe;
Isaiah 42:5 – “This is what God the LORD says—the Creator of the heavens, who stretches them out . . .” Isaiah 44:24 – “ . . . I am the LORD, the Maker of all things, who stretches out the heavens . . .” Isaiah 45:12 – “My own hands stretched out the heavens; I marshaled their starry hosts.” Jeremiah 10:12 – “God . . . stretched out the heavens by his understanding.” Jeremiah 51:15 – “He founded the world by his wisdom and stretched out the heavens by his understanding.”
So science figured out 100 years ago what the bible inferred 3000 years ago.
God created tree's, a tree is not stagnant, but continues to grow. Consider that the creative force used to create the universe is also an ongoing process set in motion by God.
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Post by nathan on May 31, 2021 0:08:05 GMT -5
Really, so if we wind back the expansion, what point do we arrive at?
We arrive at the beginning when God created the heavens and the earth. There's no biblical contradiction in regards to an expanding universe;
Isaiah 42:5 – “This is what God the LORD says—the Creator of the heavens, who stretches them out . . .” Isaiah 44:24 – “ . . . I am the LORD, the Maker of all things, who stretches out the heavens . . .” Isaiah 45:12 – “My own hands stretched out the heavens; I marshaled their starry hosts.” Jeremiah 10:12 – “God . . . stretched out the heavens by his understanding.” Jeremiah 51:15 – “He founded the world by his wisdom and stretched out the heavens by his understanding.”
So science figured out 100 years ago what the bible inferred 3000 years ago.
God created tree's, a tree is not stagnant, but continues to grow. Consider that the creative force used to create the universe is also an ongoing process set in motion by God.
Right on.
God the Father and Christ/God are the Creators of the Universe, the angels, the heavens, earth and all living beings. Hebrews 1:1-12
In the past God spoke to our ancestors through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe. 3 The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven. 4 So he became as much superior to the angels as the name he has inherited is superior to theirs. The Son Superior to Angels
For to which of the angels did God ever say, “You are my Son; today I have become your Father”? Or again, “I will be his Father, and he will be my Son?" And again, when God brings his firstborn into the world, he says,“Let all God’s angels worship him.” In speaking of the angels he says, “He makes his angels spirits and his servants flames of fire.” But about the Son he says, “Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever; a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions by anointing you with the oil of joy.” He also says, “In the beginning, Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the work of your hands. They will perish, but you remain; they will all wear out like a garment. You will roll them up like a robe; like a garment they will be changed. But you remain the same, and your years will never end.”
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on May 31, 2021 0:08:40 GMT -5
Really, so if we wind back the expansion, what point do we arrive at?
We arrive at the beginning when God created the heavens and the earth. There's no biblical contradiction in regards to an expanding universe;
Isaiah 42:5 – “This is what God the LORD says—the Creator of the heavens, who stretches them out . . .” Isaiah 44:24 – “ . . . I am the LORD, the Maker of all things, who stretches out the heavens . . .” Isaiah 45:12 – “My own hands stretched out the heavens; I marshaled their starry hosts.” Jeremiah 10:12 – “God . . . stretched out the heavens by his understanding.” Jeremiah 51:15 – “He founded the world by his wisdom and stretched out the heavens by his understanding.”
So science figured out 100 years ago what the bible inferred 3000 years ago.
God created tree's, a tree is not stagnant, but continues to grow. Consider that the creative force used to create the universe is also an ongoing process set in motion by God.
You would need a lot of faith to believe that a god was involved in the singularity.
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Post by Dan on May 31, 2021 0:19:06 GMT -5
We arrive at the beginning when God created the heavens and the earth. There's no biblical contradiction in regards to an expanding universe;
Isaiah 42:5 – “This is what God the LORD says—the Creator of the heavens, who stretches them out . . .” Isaiah 44:24 – “ . . . I am the LORD, the Maker of all things, who stretches out the heavens . . .” Isaiah 45:12 – “My own hands stretched out the heavens; I marshaled their starry hosts.” Jeremiah 10:12 – “God . . . stretched out the heavens by his understanding.” Jeremiah 51:15 – “He founded the world by his wisdom and stretched out the heavens by his understanding.”
So science figured out 100 years ago what the bible inferred 3000 years ago.
God created tree's, a tree is not stagnant, but continues to grow. Consider that the creative force used to create the universe is also an ongoing process set in motion by God.
You would need a lot of faith to believe that a god was involved in the singularity.
Not really, its a core value of Christianity.... "God is the cosmological singularity, out of which the universe sprang. God created the universe, he will guide the universe, and until finally the universe will recollapse into him. The final singularity which is the same as the initial singularity."
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2021 0:21:37 GMT -5
They won't answer questions, don't know how. They will just throw a few more verses of scripture at you that were written thousands of years ago, when people knew nothing else, using fictitious imagination. just because you can't understand an answer doesn't mean it wasn't given... Yes I know 2x2 speak is a language of its own. You forget it after 50 years, replaced by a more positive one.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on May 31, 2021 0:27:17 GMT -5
You would need a lot of faith to believe that a god was involved in the singularity.
Not really, its a core value of Christianity.... "God is the cosmological singularity, out of which the universe sprang. God created the universe, he will guide the universe, and until finally the universe will recollapse into him. The final singularity which is the same as the initial singularity."
That's amazing explanation. Tell us please. How did your god handle the several major extinction events. Including several prior to the trees you mention coming on the scene?
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Post by dmmichgood on May 31, 2021 0:29:32 GMT -5
You should review the definition of argumentum ad populum.... Argumentum ad populum is a type of informal fallacy, specifically a fallacy of relevance, and is similar to an argument from authority ( argumentum ad verecundiam ).It uses an appeal to the beliefs, tastes, or values of a group of people, stating that because a certain opinion or attitude is held by a majority, it is therefore correct.
We aren't discussing "beliefs, tastes, or values" & "opinions or attitudes" but rather the use the scientific method is an empirical method of acquiring knowledge. we were NOT discussing the scientific method we were talking about whether or not believers have studied anything more than the bible...religion is belief and science is little more than education opinion at times. you implied that believers were few and far between in science and unbelievers were the large majority that is about belief not science. like i said you are on the cusp of argumentum ad populum...good try though Let me repeat what I said then you read it s.l.o.w.l.y... -maybe you will get it this time.
argumentum ad populum..
It uses an appeal to the beliefs, tastes, or values of a group of people, stating that because a certain opinion or attitude is held by a majority, it is therefore correct.
But we aren't discussing "beliefs, tastes, or values" & "opinions or attitudes" -but rather talking about "knowledge" (NOT just what you want to believe) -"knowledge" that is gained through the use of the "scientific method."
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Post by dmmichgood on May 31, 2021 0:37:29 GMT -5
You would need a lot of faith to believe that a god was involved in the singularity. Not really, its a core value of Christianity.... "God is the cosmological singularity, out of which the universe sprang. God created the universe, he will guide the universe, and until finally the universe will recollapse into him. The final singularity which is the same as the initial singularity."
But don't you limit that "god or cosmological singularity," -to the account in the bible and the people of the Levant and you don't accept the multitude of accounts of other peoples of the world?
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Post by Dan on May 31, 2021 0:43:43 GMT -5
Not really, its a core value of Christianity.... "God is the cosmological singularity, out of which the universe sprang. God created the universe, he will guide the universe, and until finally the universe will recollapse into him. The final singularity which is the same as the initial singularity."
That's amazing explanation. Tell us please. How did your god handle the several major extinction events. Including several prior to the trees you mention coming on the scene?
That would require a long sermon ... In short, I believe there was an earth age prior to the one we're in. The rebellion of Satan brought about the destruction of that first world age, a complete katabole.
"..the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters." (Genesis 1:1). This was the start of the re-creation of the second world age, where the old earth was still cover with water from the prior destruction, where everything went extinct.
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