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Post by jetmech on Oct 8, 2020 11:19:48 GMT -5
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Post by dmmichgood on Oct 8, 2020 12:16:06 GMT -5
Please read this, jet.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Wyatt
Ron Wyatt From Wikipedia, Donald Eldon Wyatt (2 June 1933 – August 4, 1999) was an adventurer noted for advocating the Durupınar site as the site of Noah's Ark, along with almost 100 other Bible-related alleged discoveries. He has been criticized by scientists, historians, biblical scholars, as well as some creationists.
Wyatt was working as a nurse anesthetist in a hospital in Madison, Tennessee,[1] when in 1960, he saw a picture in Life of the Durupınar site, a boat-like shape on a mountain near Mount Ararat. The resulting widespread speculation in evangelical Christian circles that this might be Noah's Ark started Wyatt on his career as an amateur archaeologist. From 1977 until his death in 1999 he made over one hundred trips to the Middle East, his interests widening to take in a wide variety of references from the Old and New Testaments.
The Durupınar site in 2007 By the time of his death in 1999, Wyatt claimed to have discovered several sites and artifacts related to the Bible and biblical archaeology.
Wyatt was not considered credible by professional archaeologists and biblical scholars. The Garden Tomb Association of Jerusalem state in a letter they issue to visitors on request:
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2020 13:08:58 GMT -5
i myself am more interested in the object upon mt. ararat itself...i am not discrediting this find by wyatt though...
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Post by chuck on Oct 8, 2020 19:24:14 GMT -5
The site is 2000m above sea level. Do you realise how much rain would have had to fall every day for 40 days to reach this level alone. Like 50000mm(2000 inches) of rain every day. This may not even be accurate given the earths surface is constantly rising and falling over time but puts into perspective the level of rain required.
How hight was Mount Everest at this supposed time period?.
How long does it take to petrify wood?.
IMO I think there was a man with a boat and a flood and a embellished story to make it memorable with a meaning being the key. The story is the vehicle to carry a message, the better the story........
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Post by Roselyn T on Oct 8, 2020 19:41:41 GMT -5
Do some research about Ron Wyatt jetmech!!!
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Post by xna on Oct 8, 2020 19:57:10 GMT -5
I think people who continue to search for the ark remnants, or are desperate for other physical biblical evidence to show the bible is true, is a sign of weak faith.
Conversely if your faith is strong ie blind faith, and you were shown evidence why the bible can not be true, this would not diminish your faith.
JMT
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Post by chuck on Oct 8, 2020 20:39:21 GMT -5
I think people who continue to search for the ark remnants, or are desperate for other physical biblical evidence to show the bible is true, is a sign of weak faith. Conversely if your faith is strong ie blind faith, and you were shown evidence why the bible can not be true, this would not diminish your faith. JMT I agree with the first statement. Re the second one. Are you saying strong faith is just blind faith? Faith is shown by action, if one's faith is strong it shows. Yes I know religious faith requires action by way ritual and tradition. But I would argue that's not what the narrative of scripture is. As I just pointed out to Nathan which he ran a mile from. The scripture meantions generosity more than heaven, hell, prayer and faith combined. Could it be faith in God would be living a generous life. Why does faith have to do with a belief in ones mind of a supernatural puppeteer interjecting at random? Maybe God is generosity?.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2020 21:04:24 GMT -5
The site is 2000m above sea level. Do you realise how much rain would have had to fall every day for 40 days to reach this level alone. Like 50000mm(2000 inches) of rain every day. This may not even be accurate given the earths surface is constantly rising and falling over time but puts into perspective the level of rain required. How hight was Mount Everest at this supposed time period?. How long does it take to petrify wood?. IMO I think there was a man with a boat and a flood and a embellished story to make it memorable with a meaning being the key. The story is the vehicle to carry a message, the better the story........ it was raining 40 days and 40 nights, the fountains of the deep broke open and the windows of heaven opened up...oh yea of little faith...JW
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2020 21:06:48 GMT -5
I think people who continue to search for the ark remnants, or are desperate for other physical biblical evidence to show the bible is true, is a sign of weak faith. Conversely if your faith is strong ie blind faith, and you were shown evidence why the bible can not be true, this would not diminish your faith. JMT when the unbelieving stop asking for proof then maybe we'll stop looking for it...
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Post by xna on Oct 8, 2020 21:09:04 GMT -5
I think people who continue to search for the ark remnants, or are desperate for other physical biblical evidence to show the bible is true, is a sign of weak faith. Conversely if your faith is strong ie blind faith, and you were shown evidence why the bible can not be true, this would not diminish your faith. JMT I agree with the first statement. Re the second one. Are you saying strong faith is just blind faith? Faith is shown by action, if one's faith is strong it shows. Yes I know religious faith requires action by way ritual and tradition. But I would argue that's not what the narrative of scripture is. As I just pointed out to Nathan which he ran a mile from. The scripture meantions generosity more than heaven, hell, prayer and faith combined. Could it be faith in God would be living a generous life. Why does faith have to do with a belief in ones mind of a supernatural puppeteer interjecting at random? Maybe God is generosity?. One specific example of blind faith in the bible is; young Earth creationist believe the age of the Earth is 6,000 to 10,000 years. This conflicts with the age of of the earth being 4.54 billion years measured using independently cross-validated geochronological methods including radiometric dating.
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Post by xna on Oct 8, 2020 21:14:45 GMT -5
I think people who continue to search for the ark remnants, or are desperate for other physical biblical evidence to show the bible is true, is a sign of weak faith. Conversely if your faith is strong ie blind faith, and you were shown evidence why the bible can not be true, this would not diminish your faith. JMT when the unbelieving stop asking for proof then maybe we'll stop looking for it... Many are happy living in a delusion, and don't want to be confused by all those facts.
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Post by Lee on Oct 8, 2020 21:22:49 GMT -5
God tweaked the evolution of the Jews and you don't have any evidence he didn't.
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Post by xna on Oct 8, 2020 21:25:27 GMT -5
God tweaked the evolution of the Jews and you don't have any evidence he didn't. God tweaked the evolution of the Nathan’s lizard people and you don’t have any evidence he didn’t.
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Post by Lee on Oct 8, 2020 21:32:09 GMT -5
Those aren't equal statements. But if you tracked evolution fairly you'd agree with my conclusion.
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Post by xna on Oct 8, 2020 21:42:06 GMT -5
Those aren't equal statements. But if you tracked evolution fairly you'd agree with my conclusion. In all of my college biology classes, god was never needed to explain the facts of evolution. The Middle East Bronze Age Christian creation myth needs to stay in the history books and stay out of science.
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Post by Lee on Oct 8, 2020 22:06:17 GMT -5
That would delete history. That would delete the relationship between middle age curiosity with God and middle age curiosity with science.
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Post by nathan on Oct 8, 2020 22:13:48 GMT -5
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Post by Roselyn T on Oct 8, 2020 22:54:24 GMT -5
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Post by chuck on Oct 8, 2020 22:57:05 GMT -5
I agree with the first statement. Re the second one. Are you saying strong faith is just blind faith? Faith is shown by action, if one's faith is strong it shows. Yes I know religious faith requires action by way ritual and tradition. But I would argue that's not what the narrative of scripture is. As I just pointed out to Nathan which he ran a mile from. The scripture meantions generosity more than heaven, hell, prayer and faith combined. Could it be faith in God would be living a generous life. Why does faith have to do with a belief in ones mind of a supernatural puppeteer interjecting at random? Maybe God is generosity?. One specific example of blind faith in the bible is; young Earth creationist believe the age of the Earth is 6,000 to 10,000 years. This conflicts with the age of of the earth being 4.54 billion years measured using independently cross-validated geochronological methods including radiometric dating. Were do the scriptures state the age of the earth being 6-10k years old?. I see no problem with what ever the age of earth may be. What you are describing is blind faith. But the question is what is it derived from.
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Post by Pragmatic on Oct 9, 2020 3:02:52 GMT -5
I don’t take the flood story as literal. Like many of the OT stories, there can be life lessons learned from them, but that does not mean they necessarily happened. However that does not mean that I would so arrogant to say they could not have happened either. In the case of the flood, I suspect it was localised, and there is some science to suggest that. Other places and culture report floods in their history too, but that does not confirm a worldwide single flood, with two Kiwis from NZ, two Crocs and Tasmanian Devils, two Arctic Polar bears etc, all in the same boat."...how would they get there?
The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. But I do apply a healthy dose of skepticism, and don’t get tied up in knots over it.
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Post by chuck on Oct 9, 2020 3:26:22 GMT -5
The site is 2000m above sea level. Do you realise how much rain would have had to fall every day for 40 days to reach this level alone. Like 50000mm(2000 inches) of rain every day. This may not even be accurate given the earths surface is constantly rising and falling over time but puts into perspective the level of rain required. How hight was Mount Everest at this supposed time period?. How long does it take to petrify wood?. IMO I think there was a man with a boat and a flood and a embellished story to make it memorable with a meaning being the key. The story is the vehicle to carry a message, the better the story........ it was raining 40 days and 40 nights, the fountains of the deep broke open and the windows of heaven opened up...oh yea of little faith...JW Why 40 wally?. 40 is only mentioned another 100 odd times. Perhaps it means something else. How much water do you think came out of the ground specifically?. And you would want to be picky in which translation you read because some almost sound like the flood depth was only 15 cubits. The NLT version is probably the one I would suggest you use to bolster your case. I am JustWitnessing some religious nut jobbery.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2020 5:27:02 GMT -5
I don’t take the flood story as literal. Like many of the OT stories, there can be life lessons learned from them, but that does not mean they necessarily happened. However that does not mean that I would so arrogant to say they could not have happened either. In the case of the flood, I suspect it was localised, and there is some science to suggest that. Other places and culture report floods in their history too, but that does not confirm a worldwide single flood, with two Kiwis from NZ, two Crocs and Tasmanian Devils, two Arctic Polar bears etc, all in the same boat."...how would they get there? The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. But I do apply a healthy dose of skepticism, and don’t get tied up in knots over it. the animals had over 100 years to get there before the flood started...
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2020 5:35:49 GMT -5
it was raining 40 days and 40 nights, the fountains of the deep broke open and the windows of heaven opened up...oh yea of little faith...JW Why 40 wally?. 40 is only mentioned another 100 odd times. Perhaps it means something else. How much water do you think came out of the ground specifically?. And you would want to be picky in which translation you read because some almost sound like the flood depth was only 15 cubits. The NLT version is probably the one I would suggest you use to bolster your case. I am JustWitnessing some religious nut jobbery. God is mentioned 3800+ times in the bible does that dismiss any single usage of it? it doesn't say how much nor could i say how much but enough to help cover the earth it also says it covered the highest mountain by 20 cubits... i only read the KJV not any other bastardized version although i have seen the friends use the NIV...
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Post by xna on Oct 9, 2020 8:31:28 GMT -5
Many are happy living in a delusion, and don't want to be confused by all those facts. It's NO Delusion! about the Ark of Noah rested on Mt. Ararat/Turkey
When you become aware of your delusion, you are no longer under its' control. You can then see it for what it was, or continue with it as a hypocrite.
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Post by xna on Oct 9, 2020 8:34:36 GMT -5
One specific example of blind faith in the bible is; young Earth creationist believe the age of the Earth is 6,000 to 10,000 years. This conflicts with the age of of the earth being 4.54 billion years measured using independently cross-validated geochronological methods including radiometric dating. Were do the scriptures state the age of the earth being 6-10k years old?. I see no problem with what ever the age of earth may be. What you are describing is blind faith. But the question is what is it derived from. About 1 in 10 Americans are young-earth creationists. There are some here. They should explain why they belive in a young-earth. ncse.ngo/just-how-many-young-earth-creationists-are-there-us
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Post by nathan on Oct 9, 2020 14:33:47 GMT -5
It's NO Delusion! about the Ark of Noah rested on Mt. Ararat/Turkey
When you become aware of your delusion, you are no longer under its' control. You can then see it for what it was, or continue with it as a hypocrite. ** The world wide flood was foretold by God to Enoch in great details hundred of years before it happened. Enoch was the great grand father of Noah, he told us in the book of Enoch he wrote during his father Jare that 200 fallen angels mate with the women= the Nephilim/giants of this earth and all kinds of animals, reptiles, fish and birds= Reptilians, Mermaids, half man and half beasts to corrupt the earth with their EVILNESS. They were destroying the humans races God had to wipe them out by drowning them in water but many of them hid under ground caverns and many survived the flood but most of them were killed. They came out after the flood and many of the Nephlim/giants lived in the promised land when Moses and the children of Israel arrived there. God gave them the Children of Israel the land of the Nephilim gaints as their home, where the Messiah/Christ God came down from heaven to be born in Bethlehem and lived in the human person Jesus to die for our sins. God told the children of Israel to drive out the Nephilim off the land and possessed the land for themselves. 2000 years ago, Jesus foretold His second coming like in the days of Noah's flood came upon mankind suddendly. It would be foolish of Jesus to compare his spectacular 2nd coming with a world wide Myth flood like in the days of Noah. The people in Jesus days read and believed the actual event of Noah world wide flood had taken place so will His 2nd coming event will happen unexpect and Suddendly.
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Post by xna on Oct 9, 2020 14:48:09 GMT -5
When you become aware of your delusion, you are no longer under its' control. You can then see it for what it was, or continue with it as a hypocrite. ** The world wide flood was foretold by God to Enoch in great details hundred of years before it happened. Enoch was the great grand father of Noah, he told us in the book of Enoch he wrote during his father Jare that 200 fallen angels mate with the women= the Nephilim/giants of this earth and all kinds of animals, reptiles, fish and birds= Reptilians, Mermaids, half man and half beasts to corrupt the earth with their EVILNESS. They were destroying the humans races God had to wipe them out by drowning them in water but many of them hid under ground caverns and many survived the flood but most of them were killed. They came out after the flood and many of the Nephlim/giants lived in the promised land when Moses and the children of Israel arrived there. God gave them the Children of Israel the land of the Nephilim gaints as their home, where the Messiah/Christ God came down from heaven to be born in Bethlehem and lived in the human person Jesus to die for our sins. God told the children of Israel to drive out the Nephilim off the land and possessed the land for themselves. 2000 years ago, Jesus foretold His second coming like in the days of Noah's flood came upon mankind suddendly. It would be foolish of Jesus to compare his spectacular 2nd coming with a world wide Myth flood like in the days of Noah. The people in Jesus days read and believed the actual event of Noah world wide flood had taken place so will His 2nd coming event will happen unexpect and Suddendly. - You were a Buddhist, then you saw it was a delusion - You were a Pentecostal, then you saw it was a delusion You have been wrong before...... Could you be wrong now?
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Post by nathan on Oct 9, 2020 16:15:42 GMT -5
** The world wide flood was foretold by God to Enoch in great details hundred of years before it happened. Enoch was the great grand father of Noah, he told us in the book of Enoch he wrote during his father Jare that 200 fallen angels mate with the women= the Nephilim/giants of this earth and all kinds of animals, reptiles, fish and birds= Reptilians, Mermaids, half man and half beasts to corrupt the earth with their EVILNESS. They were destroying the humans races God had to wipe them out by drowning them in water but many of them hid under ground caverns and many survived the flood but most of them were killed. They came out after the flood and many of the Nephlim/giants lived in the promised land when Moses and the children of Israel arrived there. God gave them the Children of Israel the land of the Nephilim gaints as their home, where the Messiah/Christ God came down from heaven to be born in Bethlehem and lived in the human person Jesus to die for our sins. God told the children of Israel to drive out the Nephilim off the land and possessed the land for themselves. 2000 years ago, Jesus foretold His second coming like in the days of Noah's flood came upon mankind suddendly. It would be foolish of Jesus to compare his spectacular 2nd coming with a world wide Myth flood like in the days of Noah. The people in Jesus days read and believed the actual event of Noah world wide flood had taken place so will His 2nd coming event will happen unexpect and Suddendly. - You were a Buddhist, then you saw it was a delusion - You were a Pentecostal, then you saw it was a delusion You have been wrong before...... Could you be wrong now again? *** Buddha appeared in my dream and told me to follow Jesus when I was a his follower. Buddha said to me, " What Christ has offered/eternal life is BETTER then what I can give you." When I became a Pentecostal believer I asked God to give me a sign who should I trust and follow? My Pentecostal preacher or the Two workers. The answered was the Two workers! I have been a 2x2 for over 40 yrs and I had been a worker about 9 yrs in Washington, Oregon, Idaho, and Montana... Traveled to B.C. Alberta, and other states... I get know how the 2x2 ministry operates, the inner working, their teachings, belief, and history... Their goodness, warts and all. So far so good, they have a few things need to change but an over all picture they are on the right tracks.
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