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Post by BobWilliston on Sept 30, 2018 1:34:59 GMT -5
Some times I think that you have it right about how Trump thinks.
He is, after all, a business man, (not always successful but ..) and no doubt he has honed his ability i how to know manipulate people.
A large part of his success is down to his ego. He also has very little pretense. The result is a narcissistic jerk who usually wins a game of chicken because giving him his way is easier than going down with him. For any politician, their image is all important. An ugly battle through the mud brings their reputation down. People elected Trump when his reputation was lousy from the onset. When you can mock a disabled reporter, speak of grabbing women by the..., and the "moral majority(ish)" STILL elect you, you start the game on house money. He'll win regardless with Kavanagh. What people don't remember is that he's not a social conservative by a long shot. He couldn't care less whether he leaves a lasting legacy of conservatism on the Supreme Court. Where his base is worried about Roe v. Wade, he has to worry about keeping the Marjory after midterms, for his agenda. So, wasn't it brilliant to nominate an embodiment of a social conservative judge before midterms? If he goes through, he gets a boost from his base, who will see him as boosting his "true conservative" principles. If there's a fight and a scandal, he can cry 'obstructionist!'. If there's a full on FBI investigation, and the Dems manage to get everything they can reasonably want (majority in house, Kavanaugh filibustered/withdrawn) Trump will still win. He'll nominate a judge more moderate, blame dens for the need to comprise, and it will motivate his base worth fear. Precisely.
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Post by dmmichgood on Sept 30, 2018 2:16:12 GMT -5
and your side is just as desperate to stop the confirmation because of its nefarious plans.. What would make the plans of either side wicked or criminal? The underlying issues here seem to be regarding a woman's right to choose what happens to her body, possibly disenfranchising segments of society, and seek redress to discrimination. And then there is a possibility that the question of whether sitting presidents can be investigated or indicted might also reach the supreme court. The rights of the sitting president has risen higher and higher into what the GOP is looking for. The simple solution is to nominate another candidate. And there are many available people but getting a person on the right (yes, extremely right) side of presidential rights is more difficult This question is what bothers me as much as anything.
Kavanaugh has expressed an opinion that sitting presidents should not be indicted.
Makes one wonder if that is the reason that Trump nominated him. in the first place.
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Post by dmmichgood on Sept 30, 2018 2:39:03 GMT -5
Some times I think that you have it right about how Trump thinks.
He is, after all, a business man, (not always successful but ..) and no doubt he has honed his ability i how to know manipulate people.
A large part of his success is down to his ego. He also has very little pretense. The result is a narcissistic jerk who usually wins a game of chicken because giving him his way is easier than going down with him. For any politician, their image is all important . An ugly battle through the mud brings their reputation down. People elected Trump when his reputation was lousy from the onset. When you can mock a disabled reporter, speak of grabbing women by the..., and the "moral majority(ish)" STILL elect you, you start the game on house money. He'll win regardless with Kavanagh. What people don't remember is that he's not a social conservative by a long shot. He couldn't care less whether he leaves a lasting legacy of conservatism on the Supreme Court. Where his base is worried about Roe v. Wade, he has to worry about keeping the Marjory after midterms, for his agenda. So, wasn't it brilliant to nominate an embodiment of a social conservative judge before midterms? If he goes through, he gets a boost from his base, who will see him as boosting his "true conservative" principles. If there's a fight and a scandal, he can cry 'obstructionist!'. If there's a full on FBI investigation, and the Dems manage to get everything they can reasonably want (majority in house, Kavanaugh filibustered/withdrawn) Trump will still win. He'll nominate a judge more moderate, blame dens for the need to comprise, and it will motivate his base worth fear. I know.
As much as being disappointed by the election of a person who seemed to have such little respect for anyone, I was equally, -if not more so, -disappointed (that's really too mild a word for it) to realize that there still must be so many people in the country that apparently also had such a lack of respect for others.
I had thought that we had matured as a society and had come such a long way from those attitudes. What a disappointment!
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Post by dmmichgood on Sept 30, 2018 3:14:28 GMT -5
Well , as I have said before, wally -I know a lot of "quality men", -as you call them, -and they aren't "afraid to deal with women on the chance they are going to be accused of rape" as you claim .
They are more concerned about the women in their own family as well as all women in general .
I am sorry wally, -but from what I have seen from your posts is that you don't seem to understand the definition of what you refer to as "quality men."
I have taken self-defense classes, I carry two small defense weapons on my key ring. I also bought them as gifts this past Christmas for EVERYONE, -my sons included.
I figure that my sons , -even though may not need them for themselves, -may find themselves in a situation that they could help someone else.
i quite sure from your posts that you don't either.... i appreciate that you have taken self dense classes but that doesn't have anything to do with quality men... Yes, -it does have a lot to do with the topic we were discussing which was:
"The difference in how differently men and women think about what to do to feel "safe." This was snow's post."One I know of the guy first draws a line down the middle of a chalk board and puts a male symbol on one side and a female symbol on the other. Then he asks the men what they did today to make sure they would be safe from sexual assault.
The room remains silent. One man says 'stay out of prison'. But another is more honest and says, "I don't really think about it'.
Then he asks the women's side and they tell all the things they do.
Have a dog, carry mace, don't jog at night , carry their keys defensively etc.
It's so natural for a woman and a man doesn't have a clue that they do this all the time
It's something women are aware of all the time.
So until there is the same level of problem in both genders, the one gender that doesn't have to worry about these things, really can't know. Women should not have to do all these things just to be save from men, but we do and it's pretty much business as usual. Would things change if men were in this position every day?"
And the sad part is that the difference between men & women feeling safe is that women are thinking of having to be safe FROM men!
I remember when I worked 3-11 shift at the hospital and coming home at midnight. I was just automatically conscious of who might be in the area.
One night I had just got out of the car at home when I heard this MALE voice holler from the alley, -I just froze.
But it was just my son. I hadn't yet recognized just how much his voice had changed. It also was the first time I realized just how scary a man's voice could be.
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Post by Dennis J on Sept 30, 2018 4:03:26 GMT -5
And I had shame heaped upon me for expressing I could not FULLY empathize with abused women! DMG, can you believe I would give my life to protect you, or any woman? I have heard it said that blood is thicker than water, genuine love is thicker than blood.
Both Ylva and Katie have repeatedly told me that was/is a quality of mine that caused/causes them to love me, when I have told them I know I am NOT a good person, and cannot figure out why they love(d) me. I have loved people all my life, people who portray it is not mutual. Why AM I still alive, so many brushes with death, when so many men better than me died, or are dead... This past couple of weeks have been particularly stressful.
Judge Brett Kavanaugh, I CAN fully empathize with your stress. I feel I have walked that mile in your shoes. When people in this forum and the world view you as only evil, I certainly do not. May the remainder of your life contain much blessing.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2018 6:23:13 GMT -5
i quite sure from your posts that you don't either.... i appreciate that you have taken self dense classes but that doesn't have anything to do with quality men... Yes, -it does have a lot to do with the topic we were discussing which was:
"The difference in how differently men and women think about what to do to feel "safe." This was snow's post."One I know of the guy first draws a line down the middle of a chalk board and puts a male symbol on one side and a female symbol on the other. Then he asks the men what they did today to make sure they would be safe from sexual assault.
The room remains silent. One man says 'stay out of prison'. But another is more honest and says, "I don't really think about it'.
Then he asks the women's side and they tell all the things they do.
Have a dog, carry mace, don't jog at night , carry their keys defensively etc.
It's so natural for a woman and a man doesn't have a clue that they do this all the time
It's something women are aware of all the time.
So until there is the same level of problem in both genders, the one gender that doesn't have to worry about these things, really can't know. Women should not have to do all these things just to be save from men, but we do and it's pretty much business as usual. Would things change if men were in this position every day?"
And the sad part is that the difference between men & women feeling safe is that women are thinking of having to be safe FROM men!
I remember when I worked 3-11 shift at the hospital and coming home at midnight. I was just automatically conscious of who might be in the area.
One night I had just got out of the car at home when I heard this MALE voice holler from the alley, -I just froze.
But it was just my son. I hadn't yet recognized just how much his voice had changed. It also was the first time I realized just how scary a man's voice could be.
wrong again...the difference between how men and women think has nothing to do with quality men...good try though
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2018 7:05:13 GMT -5
Some times I think that you have it right about how Trump thinks.
He is, after all, a business man, (not always successful but ..) and no doubt he has honed his ability i how to know manipulate people.
A large part of his success is down to his ego. He also has very little pretense. The result is a narcissistic jerk who usually wins a game of chicken because giving him his way is easier than going down with him. For any politician, their image is all important. An ugly battle through the mud brings their reputation down. People elected Trump when his reputation was lousy from the onset. When you can mock a disabled reporter, speak of grabbing women by the..., and the "moral majority(ish)" STILL elect you, you start the game on house money. He'll win regardless with Kavanagh. What people don't remember is that he's not a social conservative by a long shot. He couldn't care less whether he leaves a lasting legacy of conservatism on the Supreme Court. Where his base is worried about Roe v. Wade, he has to worry about keeping the Marjory after midterms, for his agenda. So, wasn't it brilliant to nominate an embodiment of a social conservative judge before midterms? If he goes through, he gets a boost from his base, who will see him as boosting his "true conservative" principles. If there's a fight and a scandal, he can cry 'obstructionist!'. If there's a full on FBI investigation, and the Dems manage to get everything they can reasonably want (majority in house, Kavanaugh filibustered/withdrawn) Trump will still win. He'll nominate a judge more moderate, blame dens for the need to comprise, and it will motivate his base worth fear. just curious...if he is trying to get conservatives on the courts doesn't that indicate that he wants a conservative court?
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Post by matisse on Sept 30, 2018 7:59:06 GMT -5
Saturday Night Live: Kavanaugh Cold Open:
"If you think I'm mad now, just wait'll I get on the Supreme Court!"
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Post by rational on Sept 30, 2018 8:12:31 GMT -5
And I had shame heaped upon me for expressing I could not FULLY empathize with abused women! DMG, can you believe I would give my life to protect you, or any woman? I have heard it said that blood is thicker than water, genuine love is thicker than blood.
Both Ylva and Katie have repeatedly told me that was/is a quality of mine that caused/causes them to love me, when I have told them I know I am NOT a good person, and cannot figure out why they love(d) me. I have loved people all my life, people who portray it is not mutual. Why AM I still alive, so many brushes with death, when so many men better than me died, or are dead... This past couple of weeks have been particularly stressful.
Judge Brett Kavanaugh, I CAN fully empathize with your stress. I feel I have walked that mile in your shoes. When people in this forum and the world view you as only evil, I certainly do not. May the remainder of your life contain much blessing. I wonder who on this forum view him as evil? He is just a person looking for a position where his decisions can bring about change that I believe is not good for the country of its citizens. A president that is above the law is certainly one of them. I would like for my grandchildren to have some say regarding their bodies. I do not share the values that Kavanaugh expresses. I believed he did drink to excess and does have memory lapses. The is not a reflection on him but the fact that he has been unable to answer specific questions a number of times leads me to believe that he is withholding the truth. It was unfortunate for him that he lost some bit of control and revealed his true partisan beliefs during the hearing. Do we really want a judge who, when pressed, turns the question back on the questioner instead of responding?
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Post by Dennis J on Sept 30, 2018 9:50:19 GMT -5
Rather a royal “we.” Yes, you have made your position clear. I certainly do not agree with you on this issue and this man. So, if you prefer to identify anonymously with your professed belief, try sayin, “I and those like me.”
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Post by rational on Sept 30, 2018 11:44:07 GMT -5
We, as in the citizens of this country. Based on you past posts, I am sure you do not agree with the positions I expressed. Your claim to protect women seems a bit nuanced. Thanks for the tip!
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Post by snow on Sept 30, 2018 12:38:46 GMT -5
well as time progresses quality men are going to become afraid to deal with women on the chance they are going to be accused of rape which will screw relations for decades or longer...good luck finding a quality man ladies... Well , as I have said before, wally -I know a lot of "quality men", -as you call them, -and they aren't "afraid to deal with women on the chance they are going to be accused of rape" as you claim .
They are more concerned about the women in their own family as well as all women in general .
I am sorry wally, -but from what I have seen from your posts is that you don't seem to understand the definition of what you refer to as "quality men."
I have taken self-defense classes, I carry two small defense weapons on my key ring. I also bought them as gifts this past Christmas for EVERYONE, -my sons included.
I figure that my sons , -even though may not need them for themselves, -may find themselves in a situation that they could help someone else.
I don't think there are too many women out there that don't do something to try and not be a target. I believe every woman should read Gavin De Becker's 'The gift of fear'. It's an amazing book and he does workshops for women to teach them how to go with their gut and protect themselves. I had to take self defense training in the work I did with Forensic and Corrections Canada. It made me feel like I did have some ways of protecting myself, which for obvious reasons, appealed to me. I was paired with a pretty big guy and I found with the right moves I could take him down and incapacitate him. He used to always tease about it in line ups in the cafeteria, pretending to be afraid of me and letting me go first. But I highly recommend women get self defense training, and if they can't do that, at least have some form of defense. It happens when you least expect it, this I know well.
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Post by BobWilliston on Sept 30, 2018 15:25:50 GMT -5
What would make the plans of either side wicked or criminal? The underlying issues here seem to be regarding a woman's right to choose what happens to her body, possibly disenfranchising segments of society, and seek redress to discrimination. And then there is a possibility that the question of whether sitting presidents can be investigated or indicted might also reach the supreme court. The rights of the sitting president has risen higher and higher into what the GOP is looking for. The simple solution is to nominate another candidate. And there are many available people but getting a person on the right (yes, extremely right) side of presidential rights is more difficult This question is what bothers me as much as anything.
Kavanaugh has expressed an opinion that sitting presidents should not be indicted.
Makes one wonder if that is the reason that Trump nominated him. in the first place.
No wonder. He promised his base during his campaign that he would give them the supreme court judge they wanted --- and there was never a question of what he meant by that.
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Post by BobWilliston on Sept 30, 2018 15:33:25 GMT -5
A large part of his success is down to his ego. He also has very little pretense. The result is a narcissistic jerk who usually wins a game of chicken because giving him his way is easier than going down with him. For any politician, their image is all important. An ugly battle through the mud brings their reputation down. People elected Trump when his reputation was lousy from the onset. When you can mock a disabled reporter, speak of grabbing women by the..., and the "moral majority(ish)" STILL elect you, you start the game on house money. He'll win regardless with Kavanagh. What people don't remember is that he's not a social conservative by a long shot. He couldn't care less whether he leaves a lasting legacy of conservatism on the Supreme Court. Where his base is worried about Roe v. Wade, he has to worry about keeping the Marjory after midterms, for his agenda. So, wasn't it brilliant to nominate an embodiment of a social conservative judge before midterms? If he goes through, he gets a boost from his base, who will see him as boosting his "true conservative" principles. If there's a fight and a scandal, he can cry 'obstructionist!'. If there's a full on FBI investigation, and the Dems manage to get everything they can reasonably want (majority in house, Kavanaugh filibustered/withdrawn) Trump will still win. He'll nominate a judge more moderate, blame dens for the need to comprise, and it will motivate his base worth fear. just curious...if he is trying to get conservatives on the courts doesn't that indicate that he wants a conservative court? No. He wants what he wants -- power, and money, of course. He doesn't care where it comes from, and he's doing a superb job of accomplishing that. It's not time yet for him to ask for a constitutional change in his authority, but all indications are that if he is in the WH long enough he will get there. Like Erdogan, he has to be sure his base can deliver on it before he dares "ask" for it.
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Post by BobWilliston on Sept 30, 2018 15:35:00 GMT -5
Saturday Night Live: Kavanaugh Cold Open: "If you think I'm mad now, just wait'll I get on the Supreme Court!" He's the kind of judge that keeps an Uzi under his desk. I know a judge like that.
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Post by matisse on Sept 30, 2018 19:10:41 GMT -5
“Yes, the alleged incident occurred 36 years ago. But F.B.I. agents know time has very little to do with memory...They know every married person remembers the weather on their wedding day, no matter how long ago. Significance drives memory. They also know that little lies point to bigger lies. They know that obvious lies by the nominee about the meaning of words in a yearbook are a flashing signal to dig deeper.”
-James Comey on on Brett Kavanaugh’s testimony Thursday
Sounds like Comey had the same impression of that part of Cavanaugh's testimony as I did.
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Post by matisse on Sept 30, 2018 19:35:07 GMT -5
More from James Comey on the newly-opened FBI investigation: Once they start interviewing, every witness knows the consequences. It is one thing to have your lawyer submit a statement on your behalf. It is a very different thing to sit across from two F.B.I. special agents and answer their relentless questions. Of course, the bureau won’t have subpoena power, only the ability to knock on doors and ask questions. But most people will speak to them. Refusal to do so is its own kind of statement. link
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Post by BobWilliston on Sept 30, 2018 21:52:18 GMT -5
And it is the intention of this administration to set aside routine investigation of complaints of sexual assault. Vestal Betsy has said it's a waste of time. Bottom line, secure white male privilege. www.yahoo.com/news/kavanaugh-case-unfolds-devos-readies-sexual-assault-rule-124037667--politics.htmlI've been musing on the fact that if Ms. Ford had put on the same kind of show as Mr. Kavanaugh put on, she'd promptly been labeled hysterical. Of course, that's half the fun for guys who rough up women. Sick bullies.
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kavanaugh
Sept 30, 2018 22:00:51 GMT -5
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Post by Lee on Sept 30, 2018 22:00:51 GMT -5
Clinton too. Demies certainly loved Clinton during his tribulation. Demies love Clinton today. Even many Republicans. Time heals all wounds? Or politicians do not politic upon integrity in general, let alone their own.
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kavanaugh
Sept 30, 2018 22:02:29 GMT -5
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Post by Lee on Sept 30, 2018 22:02:29 GMT -5
Why do you have to ask the government for a drivers license but not an abortion.
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kavanaugh
Sept 30, 2018 22:05:07 GMT -5
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Post by Lee on Sept 30, 2018 22:05:07 GMT -5
Where I recycle some apparent minimum wage paid Catholic kid wears a shirt depicting abortion saying, "You're killing the smalls".
A real man, I think to myself.
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Post by BobWilliston on Sept 30, 2018 22:28:01 GMT -5
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Post by rational on Sept 30, 2018 23:38:51 GMT -5
Why do you have to ask the government for a drivers license but not an abortion. A license is needed to drive a car and a license is needed to preform an abortion. FWIW - you don't need a license to ride in a car. The radiologist who I went to had a license but I climbed into the machine license free.
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Post by rational on Sept 30, 2018 23:46:13 GMT -5
And it is the intention of this administration to set aside routine investigation of complaints of sexual assault. Vestal Betsy has said it's a waste of time. Bottom line, secure white male privilege. www.yahoo.com/news/kavanaugh-case-unfolds-devos-readies-sexual-assault-rule-124037667--politics.htmlI've been musing on the fact that if Ms. Ford had put on the same kind of show as Mr. Kavanaugh put on, she'd promptly been labeled hysterical. Of course, that's half the fun for guys who rough up women. Sick bullies. Looks like the WH has put some investigation limits in place: On Saturday afternoon, NBC News reported that the White House was limiting the scope of the probe to cover only Ford and Ramirez.Looks like Kavanaugh is also off limits.
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kavanaugh
Oct 1, 2018 0:09:58 GMT -5
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Post by Lee on Oct 1, 2018 0:09:58 GMT -5
Why do you have to ask the government for a drivers license but not an abortion. A license is needed to drive a car and a license is needed to preform an abortion. FWIW - you don't need a license to ride in a car. The radiologist who I went to had a license but I climbed into the machine license free. Exactly. Murdering your fetus is government license. I wonder why government approved population centers over 50000. Anyone with any connection to the 2x2 knows piety flourishes in small or smaller communities. Communities, where you're not anonymous..... The sargeants escorting our tour of the prison praised susanville for it's family friendly community. Great place to raise kids. "Well right, it's not a ghetto off which you make you living", I think to myself. What is the role of government? Persons like Bob Williston who believe it should be limited to protecting minoities are deceived. It's to protect majorities, even from themselves. Thank God for religion. Wasps recognize three spheres of authority: Family government religion. The Family, as Jeff Sharlet illuminated that cult, didn't cause me to confess this.
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 1, 2018 0:17:58 GMT -5
And it is the intention of this administration to set aside routine investigation of complaints of sexual assault. Vestal Betsy has said it's a waste of time. Bottom line, secure white male privilege. www.yahoo.com/news/kavanaugh-case-unfolds-devos-readies-sexual-assault-rule-124037667--politics.htmlI've been musing on the fact that if Ms. Ford had put on the same kind of show as Mr. Kavanaugh put on, she'd promptly been labeled hysterical. Of course, that's half the fun for guys who rough up women. Sick bullies. Looks like the WH has put some investigation limits in place: On Saturday afternoon, NBC News reported that the White House was limiting the scope of the probe to cover only Ford and Ramirez.Looks like Kavanaugh is also off limits. Trump is obviously panicking and trying to impress his base. On the other hand, he doesn't really know how things work, either. The FBI is not about to take advice from Trump on how to do an investigation. There are plenty of guidelines in established law and precedent that make it so they don't have to "find" what he wants them to find. In fact, any unanticipated and unrelated crimes that are detected during their legitimate investigation may be referred to law enforcement anyway. My bet is that this is what terrifies Trump -- otherwise he'd probably just want to throw Kavanaugh under the bus like he does everyone else that makes him look bad.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2018 0:50:19 GMT -5
And it is the intention of this administration to set aside routine investigation of complaints of sexual assault. Vestal Betsy has said it's a waste of time. Bottom line, secure white male privilege. www.yahoo.com/news/kavanaugh-case-unfolds-devos-readies-sexual-assault-rule-124037667--politics.htmlI've been musing on the fact that if Ms. Ford had put on the same kind of show as Mr. Kavanaugh put on, she'd promptly been labeled hysterical. Of course, that's half the fun for guys who rough up women. Sick bullies. i applaud devos for trying to find better middle grounds here...
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 1, 2018 1:24:37 GMT -5
And it is the intention of this administration to set aside routine investigation of complaints of sexual assault. Vestal Betsy has said it's a waste of time. Bottom line, secure white male privilege. www.yahoo.com/news/kavanaugh-case-unfolds-devos-readies-sexual-assault-rule-124037667--politics.htmlI've been musing on the fact that if Ms. Ford had put on the same kind of show as Mr. Kavanaugh put on, she'd promptly been labeled hysterical. Of course, that's half the fun for guys who rough up women. Sick bullies. i applaud devos for trying to find better middle grounds here... So what quota would you set on the number of rapes to investigate in a semester?
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