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Post by mof on Jan 12, 2007 16:41:24 GMT -5
I should say though while I agree with the environment view I think some of the later stuff maud wrote is very political and we shouldn't go there on this board- people have sacrificed their lives for freedom etc and I sincerely think we should steer clear of stuff that to some will be offensive and inflammatory.
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Post by Maud on Jan 12, 2007 16:53:02 GMT -5
Point taken MOF but at the the core of Christianity is peace.
This peace is not simply referring to avoiding discussing anything contentious - it is about peace on a global scale and any discussion that might look to broaden horizons in this respect can only be good.
My post was not meant to inflame - it was merely asking a series of questions. If people are taking offence then that might suggest they have something on thier conscience?
Just like the weight debate - it is not inflammatory, it is simply putting questions to people who I presume to be open minded and intelligent.
A question - was Jesus ever inflammatory?
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Post by Margarita on Jan 12, 2007 17:32:27 GMT -5
Maud, sounds like you love the subject of obesity,. Does that mean you are a person that believes in, 'Moderation in all things and never given to extreme.' Have you ever enjoyed a binge on chocolate, if you are female and alcohol if you are a male? One can self indulge in many things, whether it is calories, drink,caffeine, material gain,money, gambling, Lottery tickets, etc. The list is inexhaustable and we have to remain balanced and not lean to heavily to one side or the other.Moderation is not given to extreme in either direction. Is it not narrow mindedness to concentrate on the one theme of indulgence- OBESITY?
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Post by another lurker on Jan 12, 2007 17:43:45 GMT -5
maud, intelligent debate? then address my comment and i'll give you intelligent debate - what is your reasoning and why are other peoples' personal problems such a concern to you? or is it easier to talk about other peoples' problems than your own? just wondering
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Post by exercise on Jan 12, 2007 17:51:53 GMT -5
I wonder how many overweight people exercise? I notice that since I have been working sitting at the computer a lot that I am putting on weight. It can be any one or more combination of things. My diet is he same, but I am sitting a lot more than I did in the past.
Interesting thought, I have 2 friends who are extremely obese and they need to exercise, but because of pains in their legs the doctor advised them to keep off their legs. My thinking is that it is exercise that they need to do not stop doing. Also going out with these friends, they eat twice as much as a normal person. They are also more likely to eat thins with cream in and deserts.
I wonder those of you who are over weight, how much exercise do you do?
So from reading here and my observation is there are a number of things that case a person to put on weight, food and exercise are big ones, medication can contribute but i notice those that I know who use the medication argument also do little exercise.
Can you honestly say Dennis that you get a lot of exercise or has that slipped also over the years. I think as we get older we tend to sit around more than when we were young an active with the children.
I agree we do use or cars for most things today where as int eh past people walked more,
I don't see where anyone told anyone that they should not have 3 cars, they were merely making an observation about how people have cars these days which could contribute to obesity.
Addiction for certain foods and overeating is the same as alcoholism. Lack of exercise could be seen as plain lazy....so people even have an excuse for not exercising. So I would say life style cases obesity. Having to be on medication is also often the case of bad lifestyle, eating in our earlier yeas.
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Post by challenged on Jan 12, 2007 17:57:15 GMT -5
Maud, you have obviously chosen a topic that is of interest to others with 34 posts today already.
Easy to see those who are stirred up by it. That is often a sign that they are feeling challenged and don't like to be faced with it.
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Post by Margerita on Jan 12, 2007 18:18:17 GMT -5
Indulgence. You will find, an 'excess of something, in everyone's life'. Problem of obesity is, it is obvious to all, and for another, their excess maybe less obvious or even hidden e.g. caffeine consumption, or love of opposite sex, or stock market, or even working for a big fat bonus. Greed does not have to be consumed as calories. Is greed, lust and lust greed? What is lust? Maud, any answers?
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Post by another lurker on Jan 12, 2007 19:05:08 GMT -5
Maud, I am still waiting for your so-called intelligent debate. You still haven't addressed my comment. What is your reasoning in taking the liberty to point out other people's personal problems and figure out how to fix them? Am I missing something? You have mentioned many issues like KYOTO and global warming. Please excuse us un-intellectual and un-enlightened dumb ol' Americans and explain intelligently and logically how obesity relates to global warming or anything you mentioned. Maybe fat people are farting too much contributing unfairly to greenhouse gases?
Maybe you meant obesity is like homosexuality and we should all be concerned. If so, we certainly shouldn't be discussing how to make fat people thin, we should be organizing marches to make airlines accomodate fat people, and trying new drugs so obese people can still be obese but not have to worry about their joints and blood pressure etc.
Maybe you think obesity is related to the humanitarian atrocities taking place in Africa? True, besides terrorism, genetic cleansing, and arbitrary amputations, starvation is an alarming issue there. But check out the internet or TV or library and learn about the situation. The atrocities are happening because of evil dictators and wars and humanitarian organizations being hihacked and a plethera of governmental problems. There is more than enough food in the USA alone to feed the entire world. Take a ride thru farm country sometime and see how many farmers are paid by the goverment to leave their fields to grass. Delivery and dispersion of food and resources to Africans is the problem, not supply.
Hmmm what else do you mention - Iraq? That one is really a challenge for my poor pea brain to figure out. As far as I knew, we needed oil from them, not food.
I could go on, but maybe I should wait for you to respond as I'm sure there is a simple link between obesity and your other issues of political concern.
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Post by webster on Jan 12, 2007 19:23:08 GMT -5
Right back at ya, Star: “I am overweight and choose to be by the both the types and quantities of food I eat I could cut back and exercise more but I choose not to do so.” Perhaps I should have said ‘I have not met an obese person who likes to be obese’. Please don’t tell me you get off on obesity! In my experience of weight loss, merely staying away from calories and exercising more has not led to favorable results. It is only as I have addressed and treated a dynsfunction brought about by my diet choice (mega carbs/no protein as advised by my internist) and remedied vitamin & mineral defiencies through nutritional therapy combined with good food choices and moderate exercise have I began to see the numbers on the scale drop. The harm of aspartame? View www.sweetpoison.com/aspartame-side-effects.html, www.mercola.com/article/aspartame/hidden_dangers.htm, www.holisticmed.com/aspartame/, etc. ‘Yet so does cranberry juice and that is touted as a health drink. Caffeine in coffee, while exhibiting some diuretic effects, could hardly e called a health problem (Hey- stay away from my morning drug of choice!). ‘ Who touts fruit drinks as a health drink?! Fruit drinks contain way too much fructose to be touted as a health drink. They will do a number on anyone with blood sugar issues. ‘Lie or distort the truth? It's called marketing. Car manufactures do it. Clothing, shoes, hair loss tonics, etc. Will I really be able to date more women if I use XYZ Toothpaste (Well using anything would be a step up!)?’ There is a new TV commercial advertising frosted mini wheats. I think they might even be coated with yogurt (extra healthy. Hee hee) The advertisement claims that if you feed your child FMW in the a.m., they will not be hungry before lunch, will have better concentration, etc. That’s a crock! If the child eats FMW by itself, w/o a source of good fat and protein, he will likely ‘crash’ within the hour – feeling hunger pangs, weak, perhaps a slight headache. You might call is distortion of truth, I call it ‘telling a falsehood’. But you are right. It is called marketing. ’These things come and go. Over and over. We are just getting off the high protein/fat diet to return to carbs. Unfortunately, these random diets do come and go and the masses buy into them. As far as less protein,more carbs as long as they are complex carbs like veggies then that’s a good thing. Our bodies need good sources of protein, too. Some addictive additives are placed intentionally by the food giants so we will not be able to eat only 3 oreos from the pkg but ½ the pkg then have to run to the store and buy more! These are: MSG (did you know that hydrolyzed vegetable protein is another name for MSG? many people know MSG is a bad additive. Most don’t know it’s nicknames but the food giants do) see www.organicconsumers.org/foodsafety/msg091405.cfm, sugar by its many names, trans fats, caffeine. To learn more see www.cspinet.org/reports/chemcuisine.htm, opposingdigits.com/additives/ Yes, we can all eat less and exercise more. We need to eat whole foods rather than packaged, processed foods. Try this approach: when grocery shopping only shop the 4 perimeter walls of the store. There you will find your produce, dairy, meat & bread departments. The isles contain the bad stuff so stay away from them! IF YOU CHOOSE.
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Post by Gene on Jan 12, 2007 19:36:07 GMT -5
Interesting topic. Gluttony is one of the SEVEN DEADLIES, folks. But here's a question: what is gluttony, really? Is obesity really tied to gluttony? Perhaps some of those who have studied the original greek could help us out here?
But if obesity IS tied to gluttony (other than for reasons of medical issues, etc.), then I think this should be an issue of real concern to those who believe the bible is inspired and infallible.
But again, is obesity necessarily an indication of gluttony?
Questions, questions, questions.
Gene
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Post by juliette on Jan 12, 2007 20:27:19 GMT -5
Maud - glad you're here... your topic is very interesting.
I think it's interesting to look at a "sin" that's overlooked, enabled and even encouraged in the 2x2 religion, and other religious groups. Gluttony and greed are things that are mentioned in the bible. One could argue that being obese only affects the obese person... but I think that's true of another "sin" that's been discussed and over-discussed on this board and in the world at large. It's easier to point fingers at the "sin" you know you'll never commit, and ignore the "sin" that is in reach of us all.
Also, it's interesting to think of gluttony as beyond food and obesity. Taking anything more than we need could be gluttony. If every country in the world consumed like this country did, this planet could not sustain it for even a week.
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star
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Post by star on Jan 12, 2007 20:43:48 GMT -5
Right back at ya, Star: “I am overweight and choose to be by the both the types and quantities of food I eat I could cut back and exercise more but I choose not to do so.” Perhaps I should have said ‘I have not met an obese person who likes to be obese’. Please don’t tell me you get off on obesity! In my experience of weight loss, merely staying away from calories and exercising more has not led to favorable results. It is only as I have addressed and treated a dynsfunction brought about by my diet choice (mega carbs/no protein as advised by my internist) and remedied vitamin & mineral defiencies through nutritional therapy combined with good food choices and moderate exercise have I began to see the numbers on the scale drop. The harm of aspartame? View www.sweetpoison.com/aspartame-side-effects.html, www.mercola.com/article/aspartame/hidden_dangers.htm, www.holisticmed.com/aspartame/, etc.
Those are nice sites. But I don't see any sience and peer review. Try these: www.acsh.org/healthissues/newsID.265/healthissue_detail.aspAs reported in American Journal of Clinical Nutrition: web.mit.edu/newsoffice/1998/aspartame-0916.htmlFrom the FDA: www.fda.gov/bbs/topics/ANSWERS/ANS00772.htmlEven Time magazine: www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,990167,00.html Remember this headline: The headline of the article reads, "WORLD ENVIRONMENTAL CONFERENCE and the MULTIPLE SCLEROSIS FOUNDATION IS SUING F.D.A. FOR COLLUSION WITH MONSANTO Article written by Nancy Markle (1120197)."
Bogus, totally bogus. Sweetened fruit drinks do have added fructose. But cranberry juice, not cranberry juice co cktail drink. Are you saying fruit juice is not healthy? There is a new TV commercial advertising frosted mini wheats. I think they might even be coated with yogurt (extra healthy. Hee hee) The advertisement claims that if you feed your child FMW in the a.m., they will not be hungry before lunch, will have better concentration, etc. That’s a crock! If the child eats FMW by itself, w/o a source of good fat and protein, he will likely ‘crash’ within the hour – feeling hunger pangs, weak, perhaps a slight headache. You might call is distortion of truth, I call it ‘telling a falsehood’. But you are right. It is called marketing.
But is the food bad? Nutritional Analysis Good points: Very low in saturated fat No cholesterol Very low in sodium High in dietary fiber Very high in iron Very high in manganese High in niacin High in riboflavin High in thiamin High in vitamin B6 High in vitamin B12 Bad points High in sugar Maybe they did push it's staying power a little but I don't see them as evil! Unfortunately, these random diets do come and go and the masses buy into them. As far as less protein,more carbs as long as they are complex carbs like veggies then that’s a good thing. Our bodies need good sources of protein, too.
Explain why complex carbs are better than simple carbs - other than the time it takes to digest. Some addictive additives are placed intentionally by the food giants so we will not be able to eat only 3 oreos from the pkg but ½ the pkg then have to run to the store and buy more! These are: MSG (did you know that hydrolyzed vegetable protein is another name for MSG? many people know MSG is a bad additive. Most don’t know it’s nicknames but the food giants do) see www.organicconsumers.org/foodsafety/msg091405.cfm, sugar by its many names, trans fats, caffeine. To learn more see www.cspinet.org/reports/chemcuisine.htm, opposingdigits.com/additives/
I have no doubt that large quantities of these things are bad. The issue is that they put 12 oreos in a package, mark the serving size as 3 and list the nutritional analysis for the serving. And people eat all 12. How is that the manufacturer's fault? People would cmplain is they packaged 3 and raised the price. People need to step up and take responsibility for their actions. MSG - it has been the subject of a lot of bad press but in test after test it has been clean. It is found naturally in seaweed, soy products (soy sauce), yeast extracts, tomatoes, mushrooms, and Parmesan cheese. Can you find a study where it has been linked to any problems? I believe some people will have negative reactions to MSG but the tests during the hysteria in the 80's showed no links. Try this approach: when grocery shopping only shop the 4 perimeter walls of the store. There you will find your produce, dairy, meat & bread departments. The isles contain the bad stuff so stay away from them! IF YOU CHOOSE.
I buy brown rice and barley. They are found in the middle. You buy mushrooms and tomatoes in the produce area that contain MSG. These blanket statements do not serve a purpose. Thanks for your response. I'll bet you could to that speaking extemporaneously!
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Post by nitro on Jan 12, 2007 21:39:13 GMT -5
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Post by over on Jan 12, 2007 22:49:09 GMT -5
Moderation in ALL things. I admit to being obese - yes, it is a fault and not an easy one to correct. Maud, do you live in a home that fits your family or do you have lots of extra rooms? Would your home intimidate someone of modest means? Do you discuss others freely with all of your friends? Are you one of the first to help a needy neighbor? Obviously you look at others features critically. Somehow I just can't picture you as being compassionate over another's problem. Ever notice that the coffeepot at convention is always full - caffeine. There are so many faults to look at - enjoy the view!
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Post by webster on Jan 12, 2007 23:13:05 GMT -5
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Post by ali on Jan 12, 2007 23:51:22 GMT -5
I think Jesus knew food would be important to us...he did call himself the Bread of life. Also, doesn't it say somewhere at the back of the book...they will HUNGER and thirst no more... Seems like food or the lack of it might be something to think about...literal food or spiritual food-we all need it. Food for thought.
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terry
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Post by terry on Jan 13, 2007 0:05:20 GMT -5
Maud & others: I've had much the same thought: "Don't smoke, don't drink, don't wear makeup b/c all these dishonour the 'temple' but don't concern yourself when siding up to the buffet table for a second serving at a carbohydrate loaded potluck! Being fat doesn't dishonour the 'temple'."Seems a bit topsy turvy, doesn't it? I must jump on my soap box because health and nutrition is one of my passions and I'm about 40 lbs overweight. I have not met one overweight person who chooses to be so and/or loves being overweight. Yes, that obese friend may make poor food choices but we have been manipulated and lied to by the food giants for so long (and intentionally made addicted to bad foods by the food giants as well) that most folks are just plain confused about what is good nutrition and what is bad. Do you know that most obese folks are actually malnourished? Do you know that aspartame, nutri-sweet, and just about every other artificial sweetner on the market is POISON to the body and does terrible harm? Do you know that for every 8 oz cup of coffee (or any caffienated drink) one needs to drink twice the amount of water because caffeine dehydrates? Do you know that the food giants, Nabisco, General Mills, etc. lie to us every second of every day by attempting to convince us that their new product on the market is healthy or will promote weight loss or....... Remember the carb craze in the 80's where simple carbs were promoted from newstands, from TV's, from doctors and dieticians as being the healthy way to eat? Do you know what eating more carbs/less protein did to the bodies of those who embraced that wisdom? So, obesity isn't all about eating too much. It's about trusting our health to doctors, friends, the media without doing some behind the scenes investigating on our own, educating ourselves about how the body works. It is alarming to see an obese person order an supersized meal when he would be better off eating a good source of protein and a plate of veggies. But the obese person eats that kind of food because the food giants have intentionally addicted him to their food by certain ingredients. I spent 3 weeks in Europe and noted how, in many cities, folks walked, biked and took mass transit because they do not own cars. In Italy, I saw women bicycling home from market with baguettes sticking out of the bicycle basket! Most of us do not/can not ( I live out in the country with no bus service) choose that kind of lifestyle here in the states and it would behoove us to. You quote a lot of junk science claims--the artificial sweetners have been extensively tested and they are NOT poisons nor do they do damage to the body. Any source of water is sufficient--the need for "pure" water is totally false. No food is "adictive" in the true sense--it might taste good and therefore you want more, but they aren't addictive. As for blaming the "food giants"--that's become the mantra of society--someone MADE me do it--it isn't my fault. I'm overweight from where I'd like to be--it's my fault because I don't have the will power not to snack in the evening--not the fault of commercials, or food giants or anyone else. No one has ever held me down and forced food into my mouth!
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Post by webster on Jan 13, 2007 0:30:04 GMT -5
We could argue the aspects of healthy vs. non healthy foods, additivies, etc. 'til the cows come home'.
There is the psychology of food that enters into the equation as well and it is obviously a touchy subject.
As numbers go, I've lived 1/2 my life and have a couple of niggling health concerns that I believe are life style related.
My body isn't hardwired to process chemicals so why would I want to ingest them? Therefore I am choosing whole foods vs. chemically added/altered, packaged and proceeds foods, within reason.
Hey, my uncle died an old man having smoked like a chimney and eating a 1/2 gallon of ice cream in one sitting for years. Other than dementia, he didn't have an ailment....
I'm not holding a gun to your head. Eat all the twinkies and drink all the diet sodas you want and have a great life!
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terry
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Post by terry on Jan 13, 2007 0:44:58 GMT -5
We could argue the aspects of healthy vs. non healthy foods, additivies, etc. 'til the cows come home'. There is the psychology of food that enters into the equation as well and it is obviously a touchy subject. As numbers go, I've lived 1/2 my life and have a couple of niggling health concerns that I believe are life style related. My body isn't hardwired to process chemicals so why would I want to ingest them? Therefore I am choosing whole foods vs. chemically added/altered, packaged and proceeds foods, within reason. Hey, my uncle died an old man having smoked like a chimney and eating a 1/2 gallon of ice cream in one sitting for years. Other than dementia, he didn't have an ailment.... I'm not holding a gun to your head. Eat all the twinkies and drink all the diet sodas you want and have a great life! What's your definition of "chemicals"? Your entire body is made of chemicals. The most potent carcinagins are "natural". If peanuts aren't fumigated with a "chemical" they WILL contain toxins (of the aflo variety) that are among the most potent carcinogens known. Choosing "organic" produce is especially interesting. Even after being harvested if a fungus takes hold, the biochemistry of the produce begins to produce antifungals to combat the infestation. We have no idea what many of these are, nor do we have any idea of their tox profile. I'd much rather take my chances with a small residue of a chemical that has been extensively tested, than with a "natural product" which I know nothing about.
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star
Junior Member
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Post by star on Jan 13, 2007 1:24:05 GMT -5
is fruit juice healthy? Not all fruit juices are created equal - many only have a small % of actual fruit juice in them instead mainly consist of artificial flavors. Fruit juice is just that - the juice of fruits. In fact, that is the law. To be labeled as a fruit juice, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) mandates that a product be 100% fruit juice. For juices reconstituted from concentrate, the label must state that the product is reconstituted from concentrate. Any beverage that is less than 100% fruit juice must list the percentage of the product that is fruit juice, and the beverage must include a descriptive term, such as "drink," "beverage," or "cocktail." In general, juice drinks contain between 10% and 99% juice and added sweeteners, flavors, and sometimes fortifiers, such as vitamin C or calcium. These ingredients must be listed on the label, according to FDA regulations.So when I say fruit juice, I am going by the FDA's definition. The problem with fruit juice of any kind is that its high sugar content throws one's insulin balance way off which then begins a domino affect of other hormonal reactions in the body.
So you are saying that fruit contains too much sugar? The studies do not support this. For example: www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=59111From the bodies standpoint, how does the body deal differently with a disaccharide as compared to a monosaccharide . Our bodies are extremely resilient. So, the grim reaper isn't going to show up on your doorstep if you drink fruit juice! However, abuse after abuse - many donuts later -eventually breakdowns occur as we overwhelm our system with crisis.
How does this happen? You are correct. The health food section in my grocery store of choice is located in the middle of the store. I'm not a purist! I do shop the asiles, as well. My posts on nutrition/diet/obesity are all generalizations. YOU are splitting hairs. jusl looking for accuracy.
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Post by Maud on Jan 13, 2007 6:08:37 GMT -5
Lurker!
Your question appears to be 'what is my reasoning'. You also ask why I am delving into other peoples personal problems.
All I am doing is raising a topic for discussion. I am not without my own problems as appears to be suggested and I am a very open person and I certainly do not take offence when people question me over matters relating to my own life.
So what's the big problem with discussing the weight issue. It is a strand/ by product of gluttony which is a 'wide' topic (no pun intended!).
As I said earlier, there have been many points of debate on these boards, many of them potentially offensive to others. There has been free discussion around methods of worship, interpretation of scripture, dress code, sexual orientation to name but a few.
Gluttony is a big, big problem and the powerful nations of this world seem to reflect a very 'devil may care' attitude. We all have a responsibility - individually and collectively, as citizens and as Governments to do something about it. Whether that means signing up for the Kyoto agreement, sending aid to Africa, easing up on the pie eating, challenging the manipulative food conglomerates, keeping our hands out of the Iraqi oil pot...or the millions of other things we can do on either an individual or global level - it is a topic that christians should take seriously!
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Post by oh man on Jan 13, 2007 9:26:49 GMT -5
Main Entry: glut•tony Pronunciation: 'gl&t-nE, 'gl&-t&-nE Function: noun Inflected Form(s): plural -ton•ies 1 : excess in eating or drinking 2 : greedy or excessive indulgence
Main Entry: in•dulge Pronunciation: in-'d&lj Function: verb Inflected Form(s): in•dulged; in•dulg•ing Etymology: Latin indulgEre to be complaisant transitive verb 1 a : to give free rein to b : to take unrestrained pleasure in : GRATIFY 2 a : to yield to the desire of : HUMOR <please indulge me for a moment> b : to treat with excessive leniency, generosity, or consideration intransitive verb : to indulge oneself
Well, Maud, you've opened a can of worms...you applied gluttony to weight but you can't stop there! It's not limited to food. I would bet that there isn't anyone who isn't a glutton for something. But it is "food" for thought.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2007 12:12:37 GMT -5
Personally, I find great error in the "gluttony argument" presented here. Surely this is a case of ill defined words to this point as proven by the most recent poster who has tried to help others get a handle on meanings. Additionally, judging others by appearances and personal opinions results in unrighteous judgment according to the words in the Bible attributed to My Lord and Master. People, we can't have it both ways.
My own situation screams out at me. Increasingly crippled due to accidents and conditions over which I had absolutely no control except for "living," I find myself frequently shut in or barely able to get about. My vision is worse some days than others as it slowly deteriorates. Nor is my condition even close to being one of the worst humanity has to bear!
Now, being overweight, one must read here of accusations of gluttony, eating unhealthful foods, etc. by someone who likely thinks Donald Trump has a valid point about an overweight woman he is publicly feuding with over this very issue. Like other threads too filled with unrighteous judgmental comments (for me anyway, even as likely some of mine are for others) I will no longer be reading or following this one.
Sincerely,
Dennis
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Post by Kindness on Jan 13, 2007 12:24:35 GMT -5
Thank you, Dennis, for your tireless kindness. We need more people like you in the world. I would like to add that even when people do make mistakes that it was within their power to prevent, that does not make it OK to judge them. Nobody is perfect, and shouldn't we put a higher priority on remembering that than on applying standards to people? Regards.
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Post by quick question on Jan 13, 2007 13:08:43 GMT -5
Personally, I find great error in the "gluttony argument" presented here.
Sincerely,
Dennis Dennis, I am very sorry for the accidents you have endured and the health issues you have now. Let me ask you a simple question though. If you had prioritized daily exercise and healthy eating throughout your life, do you still think you would struggle with your weight like you do? And the same question for your wife as well. Or do you believe that a lot of it has to do with the fact that you never carved out an hour a day for some vigorous appetite and replacing carbohydrates with healthy fruits and vegetables?
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Post by Maud on Jan 13, 2007 13:10:24 GMT -5
There is no agenda in this thread that is 'judging' people"!
For years of my life I have battled against other forms of gluttony, notably too much alcohol. I have had frank and open discussions with many people around this very subject. These were people who were aware of my 'addiction'. I did not regard people as offensive in this respect. If somebody suggested that I should lay off the booze then I was glad for the feedback and was/ am happy to lay the subject matter out in the open....
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Post by quick question on Jan 13, 2007 13:10:39 GMT -5
Personally, I find great error in the "gluttony argument" presented here.
Sincerely,
Dennis Dennis, I am very sorry for the accidents you have endured and the health issues you have now. Let me ask you a simple question though. If you had prioritized daily exercise and healthy eating throughout your life, do you still think you would struggle with your weight like you do? And the same question for your wife as well. Or do you believe that a lot of it has to do with the fact that you never carved out an hour a day for some vigorous appetite and replacing carbohydrates with healthy fruits and vegetables? Whoops, that was suposed to say "vigorous exercise" rather than "vigorous appetite." Although I would say that most overweight people have much more vigor for their appetite than their exercise. ;D
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Post by mrleo on Jan 13, 2007 13:11:32 GMT -5
I don't know if this topic has ever come up specifically in its own thread, but if someone with greater knowledge of translations and word origins would be willing, I think it would be profitable to have a discussion about the scriptural difference (if there is one?) between judging (discerning one thing from another) and being judgmental (condemning).
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