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Post by The Word of God on May 22, 2006 3:22:16 GMT -5
Matthew 19:29 New King James Version (NKJV) And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wife or children or lands, for My name’s sake, shall receive a hundredfold, and inherit eternal life.
Footnotes: Matthew 19:29 NU-Text omits or wife.
New King James Version (NKJV) Copyright © 1982 by Thomas Nelson, Inc.
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
All who have given up home or brothers and sisters or father and mother or children or land for me will be given a hundred times as much. They will also have eternal life.
Contemporary English Version (CEV) Copyright © 1995 by American Bible Society
Darby Translation (DARBY)
And every one who has left houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive a hundredfold, and shall inherit life eternal.
Darby Translation (DARBY) Public Domain
New International Reader's Version (NIRV)
Everyone who has left houses or families or fields because of me will receive 100 times as much. They will also receive eternal life.
New International Reader's Version (NIRV) Copyright © 1996, 1998 by International Bible Society
Amplified Bible (AMP)
And anyone and everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or lands for My name's sake will receive many [even a hundred] times more and will inherit eternal life.
Footnotes: Matthew 19:29 Some manuscripts read "manifold."
Amplified Bible (AMP) Copyright © 1954, 1958, 1962, 1964, 1965, 1987 by The Lockman Foundation
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Studylearning unplugged
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Post by Studylearning unplugged on May 22, 2006 8:15:06 GMT -5
Luke 18:28-30 (King James Version) King James Version (KJV) Public Domain
28 Then Peter said, Lo, we have left all, and followed thee.
29 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or parents, or brethren, or wife, or children, for the kingdom of God's sake,
30 Who shall not receive manifold more in this present time, and in the world to come life everlasting.
The ruler hindered by his riches.
Many have a great deal in them very commendable, yet perish for lack of some one thing; so this ruler could not bear Christ's terms, which would part between him and his estate. Many who are loth to leave Christ, yet do leave him. After a long struggle between their convictions and their corruptions, their corruptions carry the day. They are very sorry that they cannot serve both; but if one must be quitted, it shall be their God, not their wordly gain. Their boasted obedience will
be found mere outside show; the love of the world in some form or other lies at the root. Men are apt to speak too much of what they have left and lost, of what they have done and suffered for Christ, as Peter did. But we should rather be ashamed that there has been any regret or difficulty in doing it. (Lu 18:31-34)
Yes it is good that a person be touch by the hand of God such that they are willing to serve him in the fullest. However, on the other side of the coin many take this walk because they want to be seen as righteous. There heart is false since they speak so much of the sacrifice. The true servants are those who remain quiet for there sacrifice but be very vocal for the Kingdom of God.
Jesus speaks about both yours (original scriptures posted) and also the latter for which he show the hypocrisy. It is a misguided service in which one speaks of things left behind or what hardships they have endured for his name's sake. Rather there should be rejoicing in him only.
I met a missionary from another fellowship who just came back from Africa. This young man with others volunteered to go there and help set up some wells for water pumping. They also helped setting up a little church building. This young man spoke not one thing about the hardship that he might have endured even though the are is known for many killings, death and suffering. This young man spoke nothing of leaving the comfort of home behind. He only spoke of how God helped so much in their work in that Country. He spoke only of how he witnessed people who felt lost change in attitude because of just the "HELPS" the were offered by him and their companions. He spoke how just a little bit of love by Gods hand can change so much.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2006 8:18:04 GMT -5
Workers often try to lay claim to these verses as if they fill these conditions differently than anyone else -- But really, even a quick look into worker life style, quickly reveals that most workers haven't left "houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or lands" any more than any of the rest of us. -- Can anyone name a single worker that has left a wife behind? Honestly, how have they left their mothers and fathers and brothers and sisters behind in even the slightest way, any different than everyone else in our cultural lifestyle? Do workers spend more time without a roof over their head than anyone else?
As usual for the group, fitting cult doctrine and teaching into the scripture requires selfishly distorting the content and spirit of what the verses really say!!
And another dishonest 2x2 twist is that these verses only apply to institutional workers -- not to any other Christians. Where do they get this from?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2006 10:09:01 GMT -5
Nathan, how does deciding not to marry qualify for leaving a wife behind?? I know that it is 2x2 logic? -- but think about it!!. How do workers honestly qualify any differently than any other person for leaving mother and father and brother and sister?? How do they deny themselves buildings to live in?? Why do they think they fullfill these verses superior to other christian people?? Why do they think these verses were meant exclusivley for their particular type of club membership?
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Post by ilylo on May 22, 2006 10:12:00 GMT -5
Nathan,
Regarding leaving a wife behind: lead by example.
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Post by Cherie Kropp on May 22, 2006 12:10:00 GMT -5
RE Nathan9: Here is one name for you. Willliam Irivne was married, he had a son before he becamce a Faith Mission worker then eventually a 2x2 worker.
NB: If you meant to type Wm "Irvine", --then you made an incorrect statement. The founder of the 2x2 movement, Wm Irvine, NEVER married. You are correct--he had a son, who was illegimate, named Archibald Irvine, who was a Christian minister in New Zealand---BTW, Archie was not a 2x2, nor a 2x2 worker.
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Post by Ragde on May 22, 2006 12:47:19 GMT -5
"As usual for the group, fitting cult doctrine and teaching into the scripture requires selfishly distorting the content and spirit of what the verses really say!!"
As usual, Edgar spoils a valid and worthwhile post with a sideswipe to the 2x2s using emotive inflamatory language.
Its a pity that credibility is reduced by this unnecessary technique.
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Post by been there on May 22, 2006 15:37:18 GMT -5
???Question for Nathan9 ? Were you in the work with Jay Wicks in Oregan 1988 or 1989 ?
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Post by nateismyhero on May 22, 2006 16:43:47 GMT -5
Nathan : I don't want to leave my wife and family.
God:Luk 14:16 But he said to him, "A man once gave a great banquet and invited many. Luk 14:17 And at the time for the banquet he sent his servant to say to those who had been invited, 'Come, for everything is now ready.' Luk 14:18 But they all alike began to make excuses. The first said to him, 'I have bought a field, and I must go out and see it. Please have me excused.' Luk 14:19 And another said, 'I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I go to examine them. Please have me excused.'
Luk 14:20 And another said, 'I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come.'
Luk 14:21 So the servant came and reported these things to his master. Then the master of the house became angry and said to his servant, 'Go out quickly to the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in the poor and crippled and blind and lame.' Luk 14:22 And the servant said, 'Sir, what you commanded has been done, and still there is room.' Luk 14:23 And the master said to the servant, 'Go out to the highways and hedges and compel people to come in, that my house may be filled. Luk 14:24 For I tell you, none of those men who were invited shall taste my banquet.'" Luk 14:25 Now great crowds accompanied him, and he turned and said to them, Luk 14:26 "If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple.
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Post by nateismyhero on May 22, 2006 17:33:38 GMT -5
Does the clay tell the potter what to make of it?
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Post by nateismyhero on May 22, 2006 19:19:15 GMT -5
Does the clay tell the potter what to make of it? What are you talking about? I can believe that you don't understand- never mind...
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Post by ithascome on May 22, 2006 20:28:12 GMT -5
I noticed something about those verses. "receive a hundredfold, and inherit eternal life"
Can anyone tell me why they think the two are seperated with the word "and"? Could it be one is the result of a work and the other is a result of faith?
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Post by Rob O on May 22, 2006 20:40:00 GMT -5
Ithascome,
Those who put these verses forward as somehow proving that ministers should leave all are missing the entire point of the passage. These verses cannot be interpreted in isolation from the whole passage.
A man comes to Jesus and asks what he should do to inherit eternal life. Jesus meets him at his level and shows him if he wants to do something then he must be perfect. The man realises his faults and goes away reluctant to address them. The disciples, ask who can be saved then? Jesus replies, "With man this is impossible. But with God all things are possible." Peter, still missing the point, then asks what they will receive for what they have done. Jesus says they will sit on 12 thrones and that anyone else who leaves all will also be rewarded one hundredfold. And they will inherit eternal life (but not because of what they have done because man can never do enough. Salvation is possible only with God. Reward is based on action.)
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Post by ithascome on May 22, 2006 20:51:37 GMT -5
Thanks Rob... I sort of had the right idea. this makes it more clear to me now.
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