|
Post by HowsThis on May 18, 2006 13:09:08 GMT -5
For many B&R's the matter of William Irvine is enough to get the ball rolling. That's what did it for me. Once I learned of him, I did some research with the intent of disproving what I'd heard. Instead, I ended up discovering it was true. Additionally, I learned much more as well. With this in mind; how's this for a brief email to friends... **************************************** I found this in an online encyclopedia and thought I'd get your take on it. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Conventions**************************************** The first paragraph is 3 sentences long and very informative. Opinions?
|
|
|
Post by to Selah and all on May 18, 2006 13:32:18 GMT -5
I agree, Linda. I'm in an unstable state of mind thru all of this. It is quite a big ordeal...more so than I ever imagined. I will help any I can in any way possible. I just don't feel confident in where/who I am just yet. I'm sure you understand. Happy unlogged
|
|
|
Post by selah on May 18, 2006 18:58:48 GMT -5
Of course Happy...I DO understand. I guess I just needed that clarification from you. Thanks.
There is a lot of stuff to work through, but God is with you and me as we continue to grow in Him.
And, it's comforting to know that He finishes what He starts!
Thinking of you...
Blessings, Linda
|
|
|
Post by IllinoisGal on May 18, 2006 21:21:26 GMT -5
Happy. Have I not been paying attention ? I thought you were a 2x2.
Have you not been one for a long time or have you just recently left?
|
|
|
Post by happy on May 18, 2006 22:09:24 GMT -5
I didn't make any major announcements.
I'm a member of the Lord's family.
|
|
|
Post by ithascome on May 18, 2006 22:51:51 GMT -5
amazed... So I guess you do not believe you are chosen.. but rather it is something you do or did.
Is faith a human achievement and/or a gift of God?
IMO salvation is God's business, a matter of God's love and grace, not a matter of human merit or achievement.
If I am the captain of my soul, master of my fate I am sure to mess it up... but if God is captain of my soul, master of my fate there is no other way but His.
Did Jonah have a choice?
Jonah hoped he would escape God – talk about misguided faith.
|
|
if it makes you feel good
Guest
|
Post by if it makes you feel good on May 19, 2006 0:55:46 GMT -5
"How do you discern when God is actually wanting you to do something?"
only do those things that make your heart feel good.... then you know you are doing the right thing. Ya gotta be at peace with yourself before you can be at peace with God.
|
|
|
Post by jxr on May 19, 2006 7:28:15 GMT -5
"How do you discern when God is actually wanting you to do something?" only do those things that make your heart feel good.... then you know you are doing the right thing. Ya gotta be at peace with yourself before you can be at peace with God. I have to comment on this: If you only do things that make your heart feel good, then that implies you have to try something before you know whether it was of God's prompting or not. Does that mean we have to sin before we discover that our actions were contrary to God's will? (Call it experience, perhaps?) This "method" seems to me to be totally reactive, and does not at all help with discerning whether an urge to do something is of God or of our own intuition.
|
|
|
Post by Brick on May 19, 2006 7:48:59 GMT -5
I'll try to retell a story that I recently heard from a non 2x2 pastor: He had a problem with a relationship he was having with another person and wanted to just clear the air, set the record straight, etc. His daily Bible reading kept showing him verses that were contrary to his chosen course of action--day after day. He talked to a couple of friends about the right thing to do. Both told him to back off, forgive, give grace instead of confrontation.
In the end, he felt that God was moving him--actually restraining him from his intended course of action. If he had talked to a counselor (non-Christian), I'm sure the advice would have been an emphatic COMMUNICATE! Let others know how their actions are impacting you. Get it out of your system, off your mind, vent the spleen. God's will often runs contrary to human practicality.
|
|
|
Post by happy unplugged on May 19, 2006 8:00:50 GMT -5
Godly conscience is the filter, isn't it?
Happy unplugged
|
|
|
Post by amazed on May 19, 2006 14:00:32 GMT -5
amazed... So I guess you do not believe you are chosen.. but rather it is something you do or did. Is faith a human achievement and/or a gift of God? IMO salvation is God's business, a matter of God's love and grace, not a matter of human merit or achievement. If I am the captain of my soul, master of my fate I am sure to mess it up... but if God is captain of my soul, master of my fate there is no other way but His. Did Jonah have a choice? Jonah hoped he would escape God – talk about misguided faith. God, being God, can do anything he wants. He wants his people to love him, however he does not force us to love him. He wants us to come to him willingly, trusting in him. Grace is available for all who desire salvation. If it was not our choice, then what would be the point? Are you saying God has certain people he doesn't want saved?
|
|
|
Post by 963852 on May 19, 2006 14:09:34 GMT -5
God, being God, can do anything he wants. He wants his people to love him, however he does not force us to love him. He wants us to come to him willingly, trusting in him. Grace is available for all who desire salvation. If it was not our choice, then what would be the point? Are you saying God has certain people he doesn't want saved? Which of these statements is true? 1. Christ died for some of the sins of all men. 2. Christ died for all the sins of some men. 3. Christ died for all the sins of all men. No one says that the first is true, for then all would be lost because of the sins that Christ did not die for. The only way to be saved from sin is for Christ to cover it with his blood. The third statement is what the Arminians would say. Christ died for all the sins of all men. But then why are not all saved? They answer, Because some do not believe. But is this unbelief not one of the sins for which Christ died? If they say yes, then why is it not covered by the blood of Jesus and all unbelievers saved? If they say no (unbelief is not a sin that Christ has died for) then they must say that men can be saved without having all their sins atoned for by Jesus, or they must join us in affirming statement number two: Christ died for all the sins of some men. That is, he died for the unbelief of the elect so that God's punitive wrath is appeased toward them and his grace is free to draw them irresistibly out of darkness into his marvelous light.
If all of us are so depraved that we cannot come to God without being born again by the irresistible grace of God, and if this particular grace is purchased by Christ on the cross, then it is clear that the salvation of any of us is owing to God's election. Election refers to God's choosing whom to save. It is unconditional in that there is no condition man must meet before God chooses to save him. Man is dead in trespasses and sins. So there is no condition he can meet before God chooses to save him from his deadness. We are not saying that final salvation is unconditional. It is not. We must meet the condition of faith in Christ in order to inherit eternal life. But faith is not a condition for election. Just the reverse. Election is a condition for faith. It is because God chose us before the foundation of the world that he purchases our redemption at the cross and quickens us with irresistible grace and brings us to faith.
|
|
|
Post by amazed on May 19, 2006 18:01:49 GMT -5
John 3:16-18
16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. 17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
It doesn't say that he sent his son to save a chosen few, he sent his son to save the world, that whoever believes might have everlasting life. Those who don't believe are condemned.
We have the choice and opportunity to be forgiven. God knows what we will choose before we do, but he leaves it up to us to choose. What would be the point in repenting if we are already chosen?
|
|
|
Post by 963852 on May 19, 2006 18:19:06 GMT -5
This is something you will have to look into.
If you do not believe in election then you do not believe the Holy Scriptures.
Simple as that.
|
|
|
Post by Troublemaker on May 19, 2006 18:31:23 GMT -5
Last year I was at a convention that had those old wooden conjoined theatre style seats.
I carved "William Irvine was here" into the seat in front of me.
Just my odd sense of humor I guess.
|
|
|
Post by lol on May 19, 2006 22:00:10 GMT -5
LOL...Troublemaker. I wonder what percentage of readers of your witty carving, know who William Irvine was?
|
|
|
Post by sitting on May 19, 2006 22:35:40 GMT -5
skirts and buns were here/
|
|
|
Post by TiredAsh on May 19, 2006 22:52:19 GMT -5
Preparation H was here
|
|
|
Post by bluubler on May 19, 2006 22:57:43 GMT -5
stinky butts sat here
|
|
|
Post by Elevator on May 19, 2006 23:00:23 GMT -5
Ohhhhhhhhhh...
This thread is goooooiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnngggg dooowwwnnnn
|
|
|
Post by sit sat on May 19, 2006 23:01:19 GMT -5
then think of something else that sat there
|
|
forest
Junior Member
Posts: 143
|
Post by forest on May 20, 2006 1:55:37 GMT -5
it seems the title of this thread is lost.
I asked for possibilities to help anyone to open their eyes to see that real ministry.
|
|
|
Post by Mr Man on May 20, 2006 2:38:08 GMT -5
Stinky butts need to know.
|
|
|
Post by ThinkTank on May 20, 2006 11:19:34 GMT -5
Some of these posts are a bit tongue in cheek, but they still have some relevance to the threads title.
Helping someone discover the truth about the Truth religious system can be done in a number of ways.
Some people respond to long, detailed, and meticulously contrived letters. Some people respond to a friend asking a simple question; "Do you believe Truth is the only way?" And then there are those that will see that carving on the chair in front of them at convention and wonder "Who is William Irvine?"
The relevant questions here are these:
What is the most effective way to get the ball rolling; to show people the truth about "Truth"?
Is it right to show people the truth about "Truth" or is it up to God to get that ball rolling?
|
|
|
Post by ithascome on May 20, 2006 11:26:11 GMT -5
yes I think you are right. I will start a new thread.
|
|