My mother says

[jungo]

I guess it's more important to please the workers than God. If the workers will cover up i lie so will I

[jungo]

Romans 8 vs 35 Who shall seperate us from the love of Christ?

Rom 8 38 For I am persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities,nor powers, nor things present nor things to come

vs 39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to seperate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.


worshiping in a home, believing in a certain ministry, might? I do not think I will place my hopes of salvation in a men again.

Acording to the beliefs of the two by twos, these men have the power to seperate us from the love of Christ. And thats Ludicrous. If we don't believe in them as being the only true servants.

Jesus is the only mediater between God and man, there is no other name under heaven by which man is to be saved.

No sweatheart no body wants to seperate you from the love of Christ, we want to help you Know the love of Christ.

Without the workers in controll of peoples salvation, I do believe we have one less chance of being seperated from the love of Jesus. They are sitting in the temple as God, thats why there is so much worker worship. They have the power to make people dishonest and follow their lieing ways.

Don't you see that hun.

They can banish you to hell by excomunication, they can make your life miserable, and lonely, they can slight you, shunn you, make others think and feel a certain way about you. They can kick you out of the ministry, for no reason, they can tell you that your not going into the ministry for no reason, they can do what ever they want, because they are acting like God.

They may not be consciuos that that is what they are doing but they are.

they may be preaching about a Jesus and a resurection and a spirit, but so are alot of different organizations or people in general.

one thing I have thought about and that is this. If Jesus came to the earth today I think there would be a lot of people coming to him and being set free from their particular set of beliefs and circumstances. Just like they did back when he was on the earth. I realy feel that people with oposing beliefs would come to know jesus and their beliefs would cahnge to a larger degree than at this present time of just being taught by the Holly spirit.

I am glad that no group of people can seperate me from the love of Jesus Christ, and I am glad that i know the power of his reserection. So how are you guys going to take that away from me now.

[Greg Lee unplugged]

nathan7 said:

Indeed..... 2x2ism Itinerant ministry HAVE EXISTED from the time of Jesus Christ, the 12 apostles, the 70 apostles and many apostles and their followers through down the ages.... 1800's.... 1900's .... 2000's TILL the DAY He comes again.

Jesus said to Peter, "... Upon this Rock! I will built MY CHURCH! and the gates of HELL shall 'NOT" prevail against it." (Matthew 16:18)

So, in reading the above one can clearly discern that "this Rock" is meant to be "a two-and-two unsalaried without-own-home mostly unmarried ministry".

[LaContessa]

I am truly sorry you felt I was being judgemental by saying you are angry. Maybe what I should have said was "your spirit of anger" because that is what I felt was coming through. I have been through more than you know and have faced some of the things you talked about. But I have always kept the spirit of the woman who was washing Jesus feet. No matter what other's felt about her sacrifice, what she was going through was between her and Christ. YOU are responsible for relationship with him. That is not selfishness.

In Matthew 11:18 Jesus warned his people about those who criticize. He referred to John the Baptist fasting and being called a demon. Jesus however, in eating and drinking, was called a glutton and a drinker by the same people. Jesus said his people would be justified by the wisdom of their lives, no answer will satisfy the critic - the particular argument was never the real issue.

What I do for others is not open for discussion.

BTW...in our meeting this morning, a man spoke from Roman 8. "And he that searches the hearts knows what [is] the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to [the will of] God. And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to [his] purpose." You may say coincidence...but it was bread to my soul. God's assurance of his holy spirit dwelling within our fellowship this morning.

I hope wherever you worshiped God this morning fed your soul.

You do not know me nor what I have been through in life. I never had time to wallow in self-pity. Do not put me in a box. I have not dealt with you unkindly. Attack me, attack my honesty all you like...that is your choice. I somehow knew you would come back and twist all I shared. Feed on whatever you want to feed on. You'll get no satisfaction here because William Irvine nor any lie is not the real question. I wish you peace. End of discussion.

[cheifsinner]

You are SO right.
If people "had known" they were listening to the Gospel of Wm Irvine they would not have followed. Thus today there would be no 2x2's
THANK YOU for clearing that up.

[Simple]

jungo said:

I understand LaContessa, what you said. I realize they arnt preaching about William irvine. You can believe what ever gospel you want to. But when someone asks if this can be traced back to a man, you guys say no. Thats a lie. So I was just wondering if you were going to correct everyone in your faith so that when an outsider asks the big question? You'll say Irvine Williams right.

I dont think there can be a true revalation with a lie. You have totaly avoided anything I asked you to do. I don't think the reason that you gave is a sound reason to lie about and cover up the history of your church. Don't you want your ministers to be honest?

Sometimes it is easier to pretend the Truth does not matter.
It may get in the way of her groove, and contentment.
Choosing to remain blind for the sake of convenience.
Keeping her head in this barrel helps her cope with
her beliefs.
Jesus did what God wanted, and if God needs a
objective servant, she is put aside, until she needs
more Truth. Until her reasoning fails her, until she is tired of putting on her happy face for the world.

[jungo]

LaContessa, who has warned you to flee from the wrath to come oh generation of vipers. You who twist the scriptures and causes a man to believe a lie. Falsely acusing me of attacking you while your sharp fangs sink their deadly poison inside my heart. How many times have you been bitten by the den of snakes in which you brood.

Thats a real nice sheepskin you have on there. Peace to you? You could care a less about the big lie as though it isn't even an issue.

So the challenge still stands to any honest two by two. To ask your people and leaders to tell the naive and ignorant new comer about the history of your church when they ask. The history which leads back to William Irvine.

Even your own people are teaching that and many have testified here and from the platform, that this can be traced back to william Irvine.

[ClayRandall]

Son said:

My mother says that we do not need to bother our selves with questions regarding the likes of Irvine or Cooney. What is important, she says, is that what we see in the modern 2x2 church, is just what one sees...that Christ established during His time....and instructed Paul & the others, to carry forth. And so it has been carried forth...unto this very day...my mother says.

She also adds, that there is a "Swiss connection", as well as a "Armenian connection", having something-or-other to do with the apostolic succession of 2x2-ism that has been handed down to us...to this very day.

So....apparently, 2x2ism DID EXIST prior to Wm. Irvine.

Well, then it is settled.

I read on the Internet about some unknown person who is quoting his mother who heard from someone else something about a Swiss and (or is it "or") Armenian connection.

It's as good as settled!

[trigger]

Thanks to all of you for your thoughts and especially for your pieces on the early days of the truth - very informative! I guess none of us can say that there is absolutely no way that the truth did not exist before Willaim Irvine, though the evidence certainly does point that way, but I suppose there is an extremely slight possibility that it could have existed prior to him. I highly doubt this myself and really have no reason to believe that the way started before Irvine, but it's not for me to rule on it for everyone else. What I see is that many many professing folks have been lied to about the existence of William Irvine, it has been denied up and down, and no evidence has been presented to prove that the way exists prior to him, so to me that is a lot of dishonesty, too much for my taste. Maybe some people can live with a lie like that, but I could not and will never again.

Trigs

[IQ]

jungo said:

LaContessa, who has warned you to flee from the wrath to come oh generation of vipers. You who twist the scriptures and causes a man to believe a lie. Falsely accusing me of attacking you while your sharp fangs sink their deadly poison inside my heart. How many times have you been bitten by the den of snakes in which you brood.

Thats a real nice sheepskin you have on there. Peace to you? You could care a less about the big lie as though it isn't even an issue.

So the challenge still stands to any honest two by two. To ask your people and leaders to tell the naive and ignorant new comer about the history of your church when they ask. The history which leads back to William Irvine.

Even your own people are teaching that and many have testified here and from the platform, that this can be traced back to William Irvine.

...is there a question that it can't be traced down thru William Irvine? ...more of question is, can it or can it not be traced further in history to Jesus, one day we can ask our Maker, in the mean time, can't we be friendly and uplifting to each other?

It also can be traced down thru Walter Jardine, Clarence Anderson, William Lewis, etc....

No matter where you look, you can find fault, you know why? ...cause man is involved, we ain't perfect....

Jungo, why the tone of self-righteousness?

[Pete]

Good post Trigs. Good to see you have the courage of your convictions. I think it was Gene (Nelson) who posted a while back : "The caribou are found at the arctic circle, not the other way round !"

This is the type of statement which helps to keep us clear-focussed ! Thanks for being so much like this with your views. It is a tremendous help.

[Gene]

Pete said:

Good post Trigs. Good to see you have the courage of your convictions. I think it was Gene (Nelson) who posted a while back : "The caribou are found at the arctic circle, not the other way round !"

This is the type of statement which helps to keep us clear-focussed ! Thanks for being so much like this with your views. It is a tremendous help.

I forget so many of my own wise sayings. Thanks for reminding us all, Pete. What was the one about the Statue of Liberty and the Brobdingnagians?

[Pete]

Gene, I do appreciate much of your wisdom is spontaneous and therefore I can understand how some of your ingenious contributions escape your mind from time to time. I cannot recall your exact wording with regard to the Statue of Liberty and the Brobdingnagians, but I have a feeling it went something like this :

" The old Mademoseille (spelling ?) holds aloft the flame of freedom, whereas the Brobdingnagians choose the yolk of cedar !"

If I remember correctly, you were addressing those who continued to play tennis and were seemingly unmoved by others less fortunate in this world who sailed about in yauchts, being unable to afford engines ? Maybe you can recall things clearer ?

[ghostwhisperer]

ANGER

Of the seven deadly sins,
Anger is possible the most fun.
To lick you wounds,
To smack your lips
Over grievances long past.
To roll over your tongue the response
Of bitter confrontations still to come,
To savor to the last toothsome
morsel both the pain you are given
And the pain you are giving back.
In many ways it is a feast fit for a king.
The chief drawback is that
What you are wolfing down
Is yourself; the skeleton that is
Left over after the feast is you.

[Moniker]

Reply to #39:

Pete, I wish you would publish a book of Gene's Profound Proverbs. I will definitely buy a copy.

[Pete]

Hi Moniker, obviously I would need Gene's permission for this. However, although a rich vein of gold runs through each and every one of his sayings, I'm not certain there is enough of them to fill a book. A booklet perhaps ? You see, these sayings are best viewed in the quality they contain, not their quantity. As I remember them, I try to publish them openly on this forum.

I would like to thank you Moniker for your support. This rightly confirms the wisdom in posting Gene's Gems whenever I get the chance !