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Post by tulip2 on May 26, 2024 17:36:11 GMT -5
Situation in NZ: i see Kerikeri, Tauranga and Auckland are affected. I am wondering if the venues saw the publicity, joined the dots and became gun-shy. Or has an indemnity policy not been taken out, or has someone been emailing them? Given that Wayne Dean seems to not allowing even alleged perpetrators to attend, it seems to be over-reach, in my opinion, unless someone has more information. Not sure how the cancelations have come about. But there must be a good enough reason for it. As you said reap what they sow and it's about safety especially for children That being said, even if it is over-reach, the church is reaping the reward of seeds it has been sowing for decades. There's reputational and legal risk for organisations and councils in Australia renting out premises to a church group under FBI investigation over CSA. For instance the implications for the owners of premises rented out to a 3rd party for an alternative "health retreat" in which a mushroom drink was suspected of causing the death of a participant.
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Post by Pragmatic on May 26, 2024 18:17:50 GMT -5
Situation in NZ: Not sure how the cancelations have come about. But there must be a good enough reason for it. As you said reap what they sow and it's about safety especially for children That being said, even if it is over-reach, the church is reaping the reward of seeds it has been sowing for decades. There's reputational and legal risk for organisations and councils in Australia renting out premises to a church group under FBI investigation over CSA. For instance the implications for the owners of premises rented out to a 3rd party for an alternative "health retreat" in which a mushroom drink was suspected of causing the death of a participant. Yes, we heard about that here. Having had an Anaphylactic reaction to a certain Mushroom type, myself, I understand. I thought I was going to die.
I am trying to take a Pragmatic approach to the cancellations, hoping it just isn't a bitter and twisted person with mental health issues, emailing the venues to take revenge against the church. (And we know of one who has already been to the media) It would be sad if that was the case, and keeping children safe was not the motive. That would be destroying the fundamental right to freedom of worship and gathering, for a false pretence.
I feel sorry for the genuine, sincere, and particularly older generation who love their Special Meetings, and opportunity to mix and mingle, have the hot flask full of soup etc. It's not my scene, but I feel sorry for those in that situation.
I also assume that no alleged perpetrators would be allowed to attend, so their would be no triggering for any victims, and the opportunity for a crime to be committed is extremely low. (Unlike a convention) Given that people bring their own lunch, there would be no comeback if someone got sick.
But as I said, the ministry and the church is reaping the seeds of what it has been sowing for decades.
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Post by tulip2 on May 26, 2024 18:44:54 GMT -5
I feel sorry for the genuine, sincere, and particularly older generation who love their Special Meetings, and opportunity to mix and mingle, have the hot flask full of soup etc. It's not my scene, but I feel sorry for those in that situation. I also assume that no alleged perpetrators would be allowed to attend, so their would be no triggering for any victims, and the opportunity for a crime to be committed is extremely low. (Unlike a convention) Given that people bring their own lunch, there would be no comeback if someone got sick. But as I said, the ministry and the church is reaping the seeds of what it has been sowing for decades.
I don't think any genuine Christian belonging to the 2x2 fellowship and who appreciates its good aspects would wish to cause reputational or legal problems for any organisation that they hired halls from. Fairly safe bet that there won't be any mushroom soup in those lunch flasks in Victoria!
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Post by elizabethcoleman on Jun 5, 2024 21:07:38 GMT -5
I don't think any genuine Christian belonging to the 2x2 fellowship and who appreciates its good aspects would wish to cause reputational or legal problems for any organisation that they hired halls from. Fairly safe bet that there won't be any mushroom soup in those lunch flasks in Victoria! That last line made me laugh. The Mushroom Cook - I'm already into the PODCAST and will be following this trial with great interest. There are actually a lot of the Friends in that corner of the world, but it was the poor baptists who died by the hands of this woman. I too am uneasy about contacting any halls / venues. I do believe in the right to freedom of worship. On the other hand, I am also uneasy about the workers hiring venues while simultaneously being deceitful about who they really are, and with no identifying information that connects them to their worldwide established system. Sometimes accountability has to be forced before anything will change. As Pragmatic said, reaping what they have sown for many years.
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Post by Pragmatic on Jun 7, 2024 4:03:52 GMT -5
Quote "On the other hand, I am also uneasy about the workers hiring venues while simultaneously being deceitful about who they really are, and with no identifying information that connects them to their worldwide established system. Sometimes accountability has to be forced before anything will change."
Well said Elizabeth
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