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Post by mountain on Dec 9, 2021 18:50:16 GMT -5
According to the following Wiki article, house conventicles can be traced all the way back to Jesus and his disciples, who initiated the first house conventicle at the Last Supper. I am particularly interested in Nathan's response to the Conventicles Acts in 1664 in England and Scotland which forbad house conventicles for a period of time, in particular how the act itself forced many ministers and preachers to become homeless and itinerant, going from house to house, sometimes two x two, holding meetings in homes of their followers, also in fields and caves, etc. This was long before Nathan's oft proclaimed Faith Mission or Irvinism. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conventicle
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Post by nathan02 on Dec 11, 2021 1:12:29 GMT -5
According to the following Wiki article, house conventicles can be traced all the way back to Jesus and his disciples, who initiated the first house conventicle at the Last Supper. I am particularly interested in Nathan's response to the Conventicles Acts in 1664 in England and Scotland which forbad house conventicles for a period of time, in particular how the act itself forced many ministers and preachers to become homeless and itinerant, going from house to house, sometimes two x two, holding meetings in homes of their followers, also in fields and caves, etc. This was long before Nathan's oft proclaimed Faith Mission or Irvinism. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conventicle** I told you folks for over 20 years! the Vaudois/Waldense had homes/worship in the homes of believers for 1800 years before the Faith Missions and the 2x2 workers. It goes all the way back to Paul and Jesus Luke 22 Christ Passover.
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Post by Dan on Dec 11, 2021 1:35:49 GMT -5
According to the following Wiki article, house conventicles can be traced all the way back to Jesus and his disciples, who initiated the first house conventicle at the Last Supper. I am particularly interested in Nathan's response to the Conventicles Acts in 1664 in England and Scotland which forbad house conventicles for a period of time, in particular how the act itself forced many ministers and preachers to become homeless and itinerant, going from house to house, sometimes two x two, holding meetings in homes of their followers, also in fields and caves, etc. This was long before Nathan's oft proclaimed Faith Mission or Irvinism. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conventicle** I told you folks for over 20 years! the Vaudois/Waldense had homes/worship in the homes of believers for 1800 years before the Faith Missions and the 2x2 workers. It goes all the way back to Paul and Jesus Luke 22 Christ Passover.
I'm guessing that they almost had to worship in secret. They couldn't very well build a church under Roman rule or with religious zealots hounding them. So they met in homes, and I read somewhere that the fish symbol was
used to mark a house where they gathered.
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Post by chuck on Dec 11, 2021 1:52:09 GMT -5
** I told you folks for over 20 years! the Vaudois/Waldense had homes/worship in the homes of believers for 1800 years before the Faith Missions and the 2x2 workers. It goes all the way back to Paul and Jesus Luke 22 Christ Passover.
I'm guessing that they almost had to worship in secret. They couldn't very well build a church under Roman rule or with religious zealots hounding them. So they met in homes, and I read somewhere that the fish symbol was
used to mark a house where they gathered.
So once again Nathan has taken something out of orginal context to bolster his story......
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Post by chuck on Dec 11, 2021 1:54:09 GMT -5
According to the following Wiki article, house conventicles can be traced all the way back to Jesus and his disciples, who initiated the first house conventicle at the Last Supper. I am particularly interested in Nathan's response to the Conventicles Acts in 1664 in England and Scotland which forbad house conventicles for a period of time, in particular how the act itself forced many ministers and preachers to become homeless and itinerant, going from house to house, sometimes two x two, holding meetings in homes of their followers, also in fields and caves, etc. This was long before Nathan's oft proclaimed Faith Mission or Irvinism. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conventicle** I told you folks for over 20 years! the Vaudois/Waldense had homes/worship in the homes of believers for 1800 years before the Faith Missions and the 2x2 workers. It goes all the way back to Paul and Jesus Luke 22 Christ Passover. It actually means nothing Nathan, you just use it to try and mean something out of its original context. Does this mean meeting in the home is a bad thing, absolutely not, but in the context you use it has become a idol!.
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Post by nathan02 on Dec 11, 2021 17:20:18 GMT -5
** I told you folks for over 20 years! the Vaudois/Waldense had homes/worship in the homes of believers for 1800 years before the Faith Missions and the 2x2 workers. It goes all the way back to Paul and Jesus Luke 22 Christ Passover. It actually means nothing Nathan, you just use it to try and mean something out of its original context. Does this mean meeting in the home is a bad thing, absolutely not, but in the context you use it has become a idol!. *** And you claim to be a 2x2 and don't understand these simple basic teaching of Jesus Christ? Christ's Passover in the homes goes back to Exodus 12. It was God's instruction for the children of Israel Salvation they had to follow His way exactly! Apply the blood of the lamb on the main door frame. Stay inside the home to be saved NOT wandering outside of the homes when the angel of death passing by. Christ Jesus is the Lamb of God who died for our sins to be held in the homes of appointed believers, where the emblems are to partake by the believers Luke 22. God had appointed homes! And you better follow His instruction or you get Zapped like the Egyptians and Pharaoh's eldest son was killed for NOT believing in God's instruction... You think it's idol.
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Post by mountain on Dec 11, 2021 17:43:43 GMT -5
It actually means nothing Nathan, you just use it to try and mean something out of its original context. Does this mean meeting in the home is a bad thing, absolutely not, but in the context you use it has become a idol!. *** And you claim to be a 2x2 and don't understand these simple basic teaching of Jesus Christ? Christ's Passover in the homes goes back to Exodus 12. It was God's instruction for the children of Israel Salvation they had to follow His way exactly! Apply the blood of the lamb on the main door frame. Stay inside the home to be saved NOT wandering outside of the homes when the angel of death passing by. Christ Jesus is the Lamb of God who died for our sins to be held in the homes of appointed believers, where the emblems are to partake by the believers Luke 22. God had appointed homes! And you better follow His instruction or you get Zapped like the Egyptians and Pharaoh's eldest son was killed for NOT believing in God's instruction... You think it's idol. Nathan, I understand that the 2x2s in Australia celebrate the emblems in their annual, large gathering, field conventicles on a Sunday. This seems at variance with what you have said above? Will these conventiclers be 'zapped' for not following the instructions exactly?
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Post by chuck on Dec 11, 2021 17:56:02 GMT -5
It actually means nothing Nathan, you just use it to try and mean something out of its original context. Does this mean meeting in the home is a bad thing, absolutely not, but in the context you use it has become a idol!. *** And you claim to be a 2x2 and don't understand these simple basic teaching of Jesus Christ? Christ's Passover in the homes goes back to Exodus 12. It was God's instruction for the children of Israel Salvation they had to follow His way exactly! Apply the blood of the lamb on the main door frame. Stay inside the home to be saved NOT wandering outside of the homes when the angel of death passing by. Christ Jesus is the Lamb of God who died for our sins to be held in the homes of appointed believers, where the emblems are to partake by the believers Luke 22. God had appointed homes! And you better follow His instruction or you get Zapped like the Egyptians and Pharaoh's eldest son was killed for NOT believing in God's instruction... You think it's idol. You didn't grasp what I said, and then finished with a threat, then guilt and shame..........you are a piece of work.....
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Post by Annan on Dec 11, 2021 17:59:42 GMT -5
You’re surprised, Chuck? Par for the course with Natie.
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Post by chuck on Dec 11, 2021 18:04:34 GMT -5
You’re surprised, Chuck? Par for the course with Natie. I guess you are right, as that was how he was taught 40yrs ago by that Charlatan Larry........ It's still just as disgusting then as it is now.........
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Post by nathan02 on Dec 11, 2021 18:18:13 GMT -5
*** And you claim to be a 2x2 and don't understand these simple basic teaching of Jesus Christ? Christ's Passover in the homes goes back to Exodus 12. It was God's instruction for the children of Israel Salvation they had to follow His way exactly! Apply the blood of the lamb on the main door frame. Stay inside the home to be saved NOT wandering outside of the homes when the angel of death passing by. Christ Jesus is the Lamb of God who died for our sins to be held in the homes of appointed believers, where the emblems are to partake by the believers Luke 22. God had appointed homes! And you better follow His instruction or you get Zapped like the Egyptians and Pharaoh's eldest son was killed for NOT believing in God's instruction... You think it's idol. You didn't grasp what I said, and then finished with a threat, then guilt and shame..........you are a piece of work..... ** Hardly, anyone on here can grasp what you're say most of the time with your Hebrewic atheist mind, Chuckie except a few followers of your supporters so, you don't cry yourself in your sleep.
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Post by nathan02 on Dec 11, 2021 18:26:57 GMT -5
*** And you claim to be a 2x2 and don't understand these simple basic teaching of Jesus Christ? Christ's Passover in the homes goes back to Exodus 12. It was God's instruction for the children of Israel Salvation they had to follow His way exactly! Apply the blood of the lamb on the main door frame. Stay inside the home to be saved NOT wandering outside of the homes when the angel of death passing by. Christ Jesus is the Lamb of God who died for our sins to be held in the homes of appointed believers, where the emblems are to partake by the believers Luke 22. God had appointed homes! And you better follow His instruction or you get Zapped like the Egyptians and Pharaoh's eldest son was killed for NOT believing in God's instruction... You think it's idol. Nathan, I understand that the 2x2s in Australia celebrate the emblems in their annual, large gathering, field conventicles on a Sunday. This seems at variance with what you have said above? Will these conventiclers be 'zapped' for not following the instructions exactly? *** Well, many senior workers and overseers around the world try to reasons with them about it but no avail. You can lead a horse to the water but you can't force it you drink it. All you can do it let them be! And God will deal with them.... Just like with their stubbornness on NOT dealing with CSA until 60 min. TV shows expose the overseer covered up! Then they jumped on the band wagon on CSA guide line for the ministry, the church elders and the friends to follow. They must report CSA case to the authority and NOT to the workers anymore.
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Post by xna on Dec 11, 2021 19:20:57 GMT -5
Before Christians built their churches where else would they meet, Walmart?
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Post by xna on Dec 11, 2021 19:33:39 GMT -5
According to the following Wiki article, house conventicles can be traced all the way back to Jesus and his disciples, who initiated the first house conventicle at the Last Supper. According to Wiki ....... Acts is usually dated to around 80–90 AD, although some scholars suggest 90–110 AD.So, conventicles can be traced to 80-100 AD at best from the book of Acts, and not back to Jesus. Who knows how many times the oral story changed until the story was written down in acts generations later, or if it was made up by the Roman Flavian's, or by someone else. No one knows who wrote these stories.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2021 20:06:26 GMT -5
Before Christians built their churches where else would they meet, Walmart? Homes or outdoors or the public square...
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2021 20:12:18 GMT -5
According to the following Wiki article, house conventicles can be traced all the way back to Jesus and his disciples, who initiated the first house conventicle at the Last Supper. According to Wiki ....... Acts is usually dated to around 80–90 AD, although some scholars suggest 90–110 AD.So, conventicles can be traced to 80-100 AD at best from the book of Acts, and not back to Jesus. Who knows how many times the oral story changed until the story was written down in acts generations later, or if it was made up by the Roman Flavian's, or by someone else. No one knows who wrote these stories. Acts was written about 62AD other more reliable sources than wiki can attest to that. Luke probably died about the time of Paul 64-67AD so any date for the book after that would be problematic.
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Post by xna on Dec 11, 2021 20:14:47 GMT -5
Before Christians built their churches where else would they meet, Walmart? Homes or outdoors or the public square... .... or barns, sheds, whatever. That is the normal evolution of sects, before they grew enough to build their own buildings.
BTW: I know of some workers who preached in church until the paster caught on that the workers were trying to steal his members.
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Post by nathan02 on Dec 11, 2021 21:31:43 GMT -5
Homes or outdoors or the public square... .... or barns, sheds, whatever. That is the normal evolution of sects, before they grew enough to build their own buildings.
BTW: I know of some workers who preached in church until the paster caught on that the workers were trying to steal his members. ** Jesus and the apostle Paul went to synagogue preaching/teaching and making many converts from those places. The workers just follow Jesus and the apostles to find the lost sheep.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 11, 2021 22:26:41 GMT -5
Homes or outdoors or the public square... .... or barns, sheds, whatever. That is the normal evolution of sects, before they grew enough to build their own buildings.
BTW: I know of some workers who preached in church until the paster caught on that the workers were trying to steal his members. I've been to gospel meeting in a church. Kind of fun to see a sister worker preaching from a pulpit.
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Post by fixit on Dec 12, 2021 2:12:52 GMT -5
** I told you folks for over 20 years! the Vaudois/Waldense had homes/worship in the homes of believers for 1800 years before the Faith Missions and the 2x2 workers. It goes all the way back to Paul and Jesus Luke 22 Christ Passover. I'm guessing that they almost had to worship in secret. They couldn't very well build a church under Roman rule or with religious zealots hounding them. So they met in homes, and I read somewhere that the fish symbol was
used to mark a house where they gathered. And the Roman Gestapo didn't pick up on the fish symbol? Give me a break!
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Post by fixit on Dec 12, 2021 2:16:59 GMT -5
Before Christians built their churches where else would they meet, Walmart? Homes or outdoors or the public square... ...or the Temple.
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Post by fixit on Dec 12, 2021 2:18:35 GMT -5
According to Wiki ....... Acts is usually dated to around 80–90 AD, although some scholars suggest 90–110 AD.So, conventicles can be traced to 80-100 AD at best from the book of Acts, and not back to Jesus. Who knows how many times the oral story changed until the story was written down in acts generations later, or if it was made up by the Roman Flavian's, or by someone else. No one knows who wrote these stories. Acts was written about 62AD other more reliable sources than wiki can attest to that. Luke probably died about the time of Paul 64-67AD so any date for the book after that would be problematic. It depends who wrote it.
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Post by Dan on Dec 12, 2021 2:35:22 GMT -5
I'm guessing that they almost had to worship in secret. They couldn't very well build a church under Roman rule or with religious zealots hounding them. So they met in homes, and I read somewhere that the fish symbol was
used to mark a house where they gathered. And the Roman Gestapo didn't pick up on the fish symbol? Give me a break!
Probably not at first, Rome was not filled with a lot of geniuses.. But in time they crucified a lot of Christians, even decapitated the apostle Paul. So who knows? The point was, it was a subtle way to advertise a Christian home, a crucifix would have been a dead give-a-way.
When your not amongst friends, its best to try to fit in, be inconspicuous, fly under the radar and be anonymous.
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Post by nathan on Dec 12, 2021 2:52:27 GMT -5
And the Roman Gestapo didn't pick up on the fish symbol? Give me a break!
Probably not at first, Rome was not filled with a lot of geniuses.. But in time they crucified a lot of Christians, even decapitated the apostle Paul. So who knows? The point was, it was a subtle way to advertise a Christian home, a crucifix would have been a dead give-a-way.
When your not amongst friends, its best to try to fit in, be inconspicuous, fly under the radar and be anonymous.
The apostles and the Christians in the 1st century and through down the centuries WERE much smarter than their enemies. That was how they STAY alive for centuries! God, Christ and Holy Spirit protecting them like the apples of His eyes even in our days.
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Post by mountain on Dec 12, 2021 5:07:31 GMT -5
Nathan, I understand that the 2x2s in Australia celebrate the emblems in their annual, large gathering, field conventicles on a Sunday. This seems at variance with what you have said above? Will these conventiclers be 'zapped' for not following the instructions exactly? *** Well, many senior workers and overseers around the world try to reasons with them about it but no avail. You can lead a horse to the water but you can't force it you drink it. No, but you can lead conventiclers to convention and make them partake of the emblems!
All you can do it let them be! And God will deal with them.... Just like with their stubbornness on NOT dealing with CSA until 60 min. TV shows expose the overseer covered up! Then they jumped on the band wagon on CSA guide line for the ministry, the church elders and the friends to follow. They must report CSA case to the authority and NOT to the workers anymore.
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Post by mountain on Dec 12, 2021 5:10:16 GMT -5
Before Christians built their churches where else would they meet, Walmart? The Last Supper, as it has become known, was held in a 'large' upper room in a man's house. Back then private individuals who had large house, rented out or let large apartments be used for public or large gatherings. There were no town houses, community centres, large buildings for church gatherings, etc, except for synagogues and the temple.
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Post by mountain on Dec 12, 2021 5:18:40 GMT -5
According to the following Wiki article, house conventicles can be traced all the way back to Jesus and his disciples, who initiated the first house conventicle at the Last Supper. According to Wiki ....... Acts is usually dated to around 80–90 AD, although some scholars suggest 90–110 AD.So, conventicles can be traced to 80-100 AD at best from the book of Acts, and not back to Jesus.
Who knows how many times the oral story changed until the story was written down in acts generations later, or if it was made up by the Roman Flavian's, or by someone else. No one knows who wrote these stories. the last Supper was the first conventicle. Jesus stated what constituted a conventicle and how many participants were required to make it such. Matthew 18 2o “For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.”
This was continued after Jesus rose from the dead and after his ascencion the disciples continued to meet on the first day of the week to celebrate the life and death of their master, in the homes of believers.
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Post by chuck on Dec 12, 2021 5:24:53 GMT -5
You didn't grasp what I said, and then finished with a threat, then guilt and shame..........you are a piece of work..... ** Hardly, anyone on here can grasp what you're say most of the time with your Hebrewic atheist mind, Chuckie except a few followers of your supporters so, you don't cry yourself in your sleep. you are a irrational piece of work.... why would I cry myself to sleep?.
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