|
Post by What Hat on Jul 15, 2010 22:40:10 GMT -5
The Gate Seldom Found by Raymond Reid is quite an interesting and unusual book. I would readily recommend the book not only to anyone interested in the friends & workers fellowship, but anyone concerned with the future possibility of the Christian church in this day and age. Raymond Reid himself views the book as a waypoint in his personal spiritual odyssey and it's clear in some ways he has moved on. But to me that doesn't take all that much away from the book's value. The book was written when Reid was fully committed to the friends and workers fellowship, frequently bringing interested parties to gospel meetings, leading groups of individuals to work on convention grounds in other countries, and assisting the fellowship in many different ways. I see the book in a way as a dialogue between the fellowship and Reid's inner muse at that time. Generally, the conversation is harmonious, but there are marked points of departure. It would be wholly incorrect to critique the book as an apologia for fellowship doctrine and practices. While the narrative is influenced by Reid's upbringing and background, the differences are marked. The book follows the lives of a number of individuals in the early 20th century, who have become dissuaded with organized church worship of the day, and rather spontaneously begin to worship in their homes using only the New Testament Bible as their guide. The point is rather clearly made that almost anyone could do this. This contrasts markedly with the friend and worker fellowship which initiates all new meetings, believes itself to be the only true church, and has taught that its historical origins go back to the time of Christ. This discrepancy has led critics to accuse Mr. Reid of obfuscating significant features of his own church. In Reid's defence, the book was never intended as a realistic history of the church to which he belonged. Reid has stated that his ideal reader would be a non-Christian or disaffected mainline Christian, who might find this story to be an inspiration and sourcebook of ideas for worship in the modern age. The author takes some pleasure from the fact that readers who have read the book have begun home meetings in various parts of the world. The book strikes me as quite idealistic and still located fairly heavily within the belief structure of the friends and workers fellowship. The writing is competent, and the story is dramatic and enjoyable; but the reader who may be most interested in this book would be anyone involved in an inner dialogue with the organized church to which they belong. The friends and workers fellowship sits well outside orthodoxy, and Reid pushes the envelope even further. For example, in their nascent home church, the main characters come to the question of who should baptize new Christians? The answer is anyone "who was mature in the faith, and spent part of their time teaching and preaching" (108). In the friends and workers fellowship, these duties are handled entirely and only by a full-time, itinerant, celibate ministry. The characters also believe visitors should be able to freely attend their worship meetings. In spite of these differences from the friends and workers fellowship, the book is at its strongest and most moving when Reid recounts the struggles and adventures of the itinerant ministry who moved through Canada and the US in the early 20th century. Apparently, many of these stories are based on actual events that are part of the oral history of the friends and workers' fellowship. Recently, I had a chance to meet with Mr. Reid and discuss the book and his life since its publication. Unfortunately, a number of workers and friends felt threatened by Ray's book, and this created some distance between Reid and the fellowship. Reid has not been an active member of the fellowship for some years now, but respects his many friends and family who still are. Today Reid would distance himself from the more exclusivist aspects of fellowship worship, and I would guess, even from some of the ideas in his own book. But any book of this nature is bound to have flaws in its philosophical or spiritual conception. Readers with an interest in a more genuine, and less formal and pedantic form of Christian worship practice will nevertheless find this work to be unique, engaging and incisive. The book can be purchased by sending shipping details to: woodcreekfarm@sympatico.ca. The price of the book is $18.00 plus $7.00 for shipping and handling. The full proceeds of the sale will be used to benefit people in the Third World.
|
|
|
Post by Rob Sargison on Jul 16, 2010 4:57:19 GMT -5
Interesting review there thanks what.
I read the book, or part thereof, two or three years ago when I was rather busy, and at my deepest point of disillusionment with the 2x2 system. I consequently got half way through and dismissed it as a book written by an f&w for f&w's, glorifying an idealist view of the 2x2 fellowship. Really just how I saw things at the time. Now that I've built up a little tolerance I might have to retrace and reread it. Interesting comments about the author. I wondered what his movements may have been from that point.
|
|
|
Post by ScholarGal on Jul 16, 2010 7:07:02 GMT -5
When I read the book a few years ago, it reminded me of some other books in the Christian inspirational fiction genre. ( Janette Oke is the first author that came to mind.) At the end of the book, there is a short note about the author. I was disappointed that the note didn't disclose that the author attended a home church with an itinerant ministry that actually started in Europe instead of Canada. Overall, great inspirational fiction that presents a reasonable story about how a home church could start. The details will resonate more with friends and workers, but the book will also speak to individuals who are concerned about spiritual complacency.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2010 7:30:49 GMT -5
Since when, What? You must be thinking of the Catholic Church?
|
|
|
Post by What Hat on Jul 16, 2010 9:01:43 GMT -5
Interesting review there thanks what. I read the book, or part thereof, two or three years ago when I was rather busy, and at my deepest point of disillusionment with the 2x2 system. I consequently got half way through and dismissed it as a book written by an f&w for f&w's, glorifying an idealist view of the 2x2 fellowship. Really just how I saw things at the time. Now that I've built up a little tolerance I might have to retrace and reread it. Interesting comments about the author. I wondered what his movements may have been from that point. The book is idealistic, no question about that. But I wouldn't see it as presenting the friends and workers, but perhaps as an "ideal" version of the f&w movement. Apparently, some people who have no connection with the f&w whatsoever have set up home churches after reading this book. Raymond has mentioned that his audience was never intended to be f&w, but disaffected Christians of any stripe.
|
|
|
Post by What Hat on Jul 16, 2010 9:04:29 GMT -5
Interesting review there thanks what. I read the book, or part thereof, two or three years ago when I was rather busy, and at my deepest point of disillusionment with the 2x2 system. I consequently got half way through and dismissed it as a book written by an f&w for f&w's, glorifying an idealist view of the 2x2 fellowship. Really just how I saw things at the time. Now that I've built up a little tolerance I might have to retrace and reread it. Interesting comments about the author. I wondered what his movements may have been from that point. I read it about 5 years ago and I had the same response. I got about half way through and gave up. It eventually got recycled, although I did keep the bookmark! Well, it's a very long book, and the author shifts gears (into new characters) a couple of times. I think I never did get to the very end, pulling up short by 50-100 pages.
|
|
|
Post by What Hat on Jul 16, 2010 9:05:43 GMT -5
Since when, What? You must be thinking of the Catholic Church? People in the fellowship must have gotten the idea somewhere.
|
|
|
Post by sharonw on Jul 16, 2010 20:10:01 GMT -5
Since when, What? You must be thinking of the Catholic Church? People in the fellowship must have gotten the idea somewhere. That or they're even dating it farther back then that...as in since before time began!
|
|
|
Post by What Hat on Jul 17, 2010 11:33:41 GMT -5
People in the fellowship must have gotten the idea somewhere. That or they're even dating it farther back then that...as in since before time began! How long before time began?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2010 13:58:53 GMT -5
That or they're even dating it farther back then that...as in since before time began! How long before time began? I'm assuming you're wondering how anyone could quantify "before time began" if there weren't any time-related measurements to use. Or at least that's what popped into my head....
|
|
|
Post by What Hat on Jul 17, 2010 14:35:14 GMT -5
How long before time began? I'm assuming you're wondering how anyone could quantify "before time began" if there weren't any time-related measurements to use. Or at least that's what popped into my head.... You got it ... without me using a smiley!!! That's my sense of humour, or appalling lack of it, on display once again.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2010 14:37:48 GMT -5
I'm assuming you're wondering how anyone could quantify "before time began" if there weren't any time-related measurements to use. Or at least that's what popped into my head.... You got it ... without me using a smiley!!! That's my sense of humour, or appalling lack of it, on display once again. The sunglasses were a dead giveaway.
|
|
|
Post by What Hat on Jul 17, 2010 14:40:23 GMT -5
You got it ... without me using a smiley!!! That's my sense of humour, or appalling lack of it, on display once again. The sunglasses were a dead giveaway. Oh yeah, I guess I did use them. I've always wondered what those sunglasses are supposed to mean, exactly.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2010 14:55:10 GMT -5
The sunglasses were a dead giveaway. Oh yeah, I guess I did use them. I've always wondered what those sunglasses are supposed to mean, exactly. I've no idea, but the song "I wear my sunglasses at night" always comes to mind. My humor tends to get me in trouble on these boards, so I've started to "smiley" my comments--but I really object to doing so. It seems so obvious.
|
|
|
Post by kiwi on Jul 17, 2010 20:57:04 GMT -5
That or they're even dating it farther back then that...as in since before time began! How long before time began? You maybe closer than you think
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2010 7:32:15 GMT -5
When I read this book, I assumed it was an idealized version of the F&W church with the hope that current F&Ws would use it to inspire a return to the original ideals and away from today's excesses.
|
|
|
Post by What Hat on Jul 19, 2010 9:40:55 GMT -5
When I read this book, I assumed it was an idealized version of the F&W church with the hope that current F&Ws would use it to inspire a return to the original ideals and away from today's excesses. It could certainly be read in that way. However, the author states very clearly that "I never wrote this for the friends". Initially he may have seen its function as an outreach effort for the fellowship. I doubt he was very conscious at the time he wrote it of any discrepancy between his own vision and that of fellowship practices. I think the best way to look at the book is on its own merits. I am thinking it may be worth a re-evaluation on that basis. In other words, taken as it stands, which ideas are good and which ones are not?
|
|
|
Post by emy on Jul 19, 2010 18:36:46 GMT -5
I understand there is a first and second version. Does anyone know which one s/he has read?
|
|
|
Post by What Hat on Jul 19, 2010 18:47:02 GMT -5
I understand there is a first and second version. Does anyone know which one s/he has read? There are three versions. I happen to have all three. 1) A gray unillustrated cover fastbound self-published version. 2) A more professional self-published version with an illustrated cover. 3) A major re-write in co-operation with Harvest House publishing and an editor, pictured in the lead post.
|
|
|
Post by ScholarGal on Jul 19, 2010 21:14:02 GMT -5
I read the version (#3) with the illustrated cover shown in the first post.
|
|
|
Post by déjà vu on Jul 19, 2010 22:49:23 GMT -5
I am in possession of the preliminary draft manuscript ( Jan 10. 2000 if someone wants it please let me know.
|
|
|
Post by CherieKropp on Apr 30, 2019 22:09:48 GMT -5
Does anyone know where Ray is with his faith now? Heard Ray no longer goes to meeting, and wife and dtr do some time.
|
|