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Post by Disgusted on Nov 6, 2004 15:29:30 GMT -5
I am fed up with Bertine running down America. I know you resent the size, wealth and military might of the US. But i don't give a damn how Europeans feel about us. If we are being hated, maybe we are doing something right. Ditto to the Muslim world. You guys are moved with envy!
I wonder if the Dutch lady amongst us has ever been to America? If so, what region? Otherwise how can you have the right to know anything about America. America is a greatest nation. Now that the voters have rejected a liberal Yankee from Boston, I am SO PROUD TO BE AN AMERICAN. No more US troops being run by the evil Divided Nations! UN sucks.
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Post by Bertine Louise on Nov 6, 2004 17:12:16 GMT -5
My, my, my, K, if you dont give a damn what Europeans think, why do you get so worked up about an insignificant little dutch girl? lol. Usually when people don't care, they don't pay attention... I am fed up with Bertine running down America. I know you resent the size, wealth and military might of the US. But i don't give a damn how Europeans feel about us. I'm not running down America. I'm just very critical. Much like you are very critical about Liberals, the UN, moslims etc. I don't resent the size, wealth or military might of the US. They can do many great things and also easily cause a lot of damage, even if they don't mean to. With great power comes great responsibility, and as we say in dutch: high trees catch a lot of wind. Just think about that. America is like a big strong elephant and it needs to watch its steps. There's also this saying about smoke and fire?? Muslims dislike America much like you dislike Liberals. Infidels with no morals! Which is all relative of course. And except for America's natural beauty, I am not envious of it. We are a fairly wealthy country too, very generous for our citizens and the less fortunate in the world (we're one of the top donors relatively speaking), we have a lot of freedoms (some think toomuch so) and our military currently does its modest part in stabilizing Iraq and Afghanistan. No I've never been to America yet (plan to go sometime), but there's something you don't seem to realise: we live in a global village today. Yes, my knowledge is limited indeed, but I do get a fair amount of info thanks to Internet, TV, other media, and Americans I meet in Europe and online. I think it's obvious that I know a bit more about the USA than you seem to know about Europe and the UN, yet you feel free to slam both. Yet I'm not trying to shut you up! The Divided Nations? Lol that's funny, seriously:) Btw, the UN is an organisation of *sovereign*nations. When it comes to self defense, sovereign nations don't need anyone's permission. When self defense is questionable it becomes a different story. You know it's fine to be proud of America, but it's all relative. I'm proud of my homecountry too, to a certain extent. For a small country we've done some great things. We're relatively doing very good, but all you hear is complaints and self criticism. Anyways, the Dutch are pretty down to earth folks, not inclined to glorify themselves, sometimes to a fault according to outsiders. As for the Liberal Yankee from Boston, funnily enough listening to his speeches about America, caused my heart to get warm again for your country, after all the anti-Americanism George Bush inspired! Especially after his concession speech, that not only inspired Americans to be proud of America, but me too! You ARE the 'can do- country', and we will watch that you will do it right!
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Post by no name on Nov 6, 2004 22:46:25 GMT -5
I guess you can watch all you want -- the U.S. will do what's right based on our own core, not necessarily whether other countries agree with what's right for us. And that's what ticks many of those other countries off -- that they can't always "tell us" (or advise us) what to do. And I suppose that's why the "world" wanted Kerry to win -- he showed himself to be a person without a solid core, easily swayed to different sides on every issue.
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Post by HA on Nov 7, 2004 4:38:32 GMT -5
No name wrote No name meant «the USA will blood bath the world whenever they see fit»
US ready to put weapons in space Defence expert says America is likely to ignore treaty ban
Mark Townsend
Sunday November 7, 2004
The Observer
America has begun preparing its next military objective - space. Documents reveal that the US Air Force has for the first time adopted a doctrine to establish 'space superiority'. The new doctrine means that pre-emptive strikes against enemy satellites would become 'crucial steps in any military operation'. This week defence experts will attend a conference in London amid warnings that President Bush's re-election will pave the way to the arming of space.
Internal USAF documents reveal that seizing control of the 'final frontier' is deemed essential for modern warfare. Counterspace Operations reveals that destroying enemy satellites would improve the chance of victory. It states: 'Space superiority provides freedom to attack as well as freedom from attack. Space and air superiority are crucial first steps in any military operation.'
Theresa Hitchens, vice-president of a Washington-based independent think-tank, the Centre for Defence Information, said: 'These documents show that they are taking space control seriously.'
This week's meeting, held by the British-American Security Information Council (Basic), will also discuss whether Britain can restrain a US administration intent on strategic control of space.
Next year's budget for the US Missile Defence Agency includes funding for research into the development of 'space-based interceptors'. Although the funding allocated to develop lightweight ballistic missile parts is only £7.5m, further details have emerged of a more ambitious programme to site weapons in space.
Plans for a 'thin constellation of three to six spacecraft' in orbit, which would target enemy missiles as they took off or landed, are planned, according to Hitchens. The document, said Hitchens, signals that the 1967 Outer Space Treaty, which outlaws the use of weapons in orbit, will be ignored.
Of equal concern to some UK defence experts is Britain's agreement in principle to station US interceptor missiles at RAF Fylingdales, North Yorkshire. Participation in the missile defence programme means that Britain is already 'locked into' a programme that could ultimately include space warfare, say those who are monitoring developments.
'If the UK government tries to argue that it is participating in missile defence, but not in the weaponisation of space, either officials have been duped or they are being disingenuous,' said Hitchens.
Suggestions of a deepening relationship between Britain and America over missile defence surfaced again last week. A parliamentary statement from Defence Secretary Geoff Hoon to Labour MP Llew Smith conceded that the MoD has sent two experts to work at the US Missile Defence Agency. Another two will be sent next year.
In a separate debate last week, defence minister Lord Bach admitted that the US was encouraging Britain to become involved in its missile programme. 'The US has offered to extend coverage and make missile defence capabilities available to the UK and other allies, should we require them,' he said.
Guardian Unlimited © Guardian Newspapers Limited 2004
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Post by Bertine Louise on Nov 7, 2004 9:51:37 GMT -5
I guess you can watch all you want -- the U.S. will do what's right based on our own core, not necessarily whether other countries agree with what's right for us. And that's what ticks many of those other countries off -- that they can't always "tell us" (or advise us) what to do. And I suppose that's why the "world" wanted Kerry to win -- he showed himself to be a person without a solid core, easily swayed to different sides on every issue. What ticks many people off is that the US think they can do what they want outside their borders too. Some seem to think that since they are the economic and military superpower, they are the moral superpower too and can force their will on other countries. No, no one can tell the USA what to do, but the USA as self appointed world police sure can tell how other countries should be run! When it comes to the US foreign policy, you bet the world community will be vocal about it, and rightly so. This is our world too you know. I think it would be wise for any country to take some constructive critcism to heart. But I guess this is hard when there's this mindset of: USA=right - rest of the world=wrong
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Post by botany on Nov 7, 2004 13:36:48 GMT -5
The arrogant American pric(k)s (overriding the board's auto-censor) need to leave the rest of the world alone. andy
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Post by BJ not logged in on Nov 7, 2004 14:51:44 GMT -5
whatever differences we all feel politically-- I think it is rude to make a post just to call someone out--
although I dont agree with Bertine views personally--she does have the right to have her own opinions
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Post by Disgusted on Nov 8, 2004 19:41:49 GMT -5
Dammit, I have a right to my opinions also. When you don't even live in the country (never been here) and then say ugly things about our country, I don't appreciate it.
As Merle Haggard sang "when you're running down my country, you're walking on the fighting side of me". I won't allow ANYONE to run down our great nation! Never!
She has run down our country time and time again. I finally got tired of the cheap shots. Enjoy those wooden shoes, d1kes and windmills. But I am an AMERICAN. America is the best!
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Brenda
Senior Member
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Post by Brenda on Nov 8, 2004 20:18:42 GMT -5
I believe in my country also-- but part of our countries phililsophy is to allow people to have their own opinions
honestley it sound like you are just trying to incite an argument-- so I will be done with this thread
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Post by Just Here on Nov 8, 2004 20:26:28 GMT -5
I guess you can watch all you want -- the U.S. will do what's right based on our own core, not necessarily whether other countries agree with what's right for us. This is just BS. The US has activly supported the assination of several world leaders. That is wrong any way you look at it. A directive from the President was to "make the economy scream" in Chile causing untold distress to the citizens. The US does not always do the right thing. Be realiatic. A bull in a China shop cannot always do the right thing.
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Post by Bertine Louise on Nov 9, 2004 4:26:31 GMT -5
Ohhh is that how you say it! Thanks, I've been breaking my head over it. We say: an elephant in a cupboard with China. Dammit, I have a right to my opinions also. Sure that 's why I am not telling you to shut up Did you read my post?? Global village! I don't care if you run down my small nation if you have the right arguments. If I'm walking on the fighting side of you then be a man and fight! Stop whining about me stepping on your big toes and enter the debate! Cheap shots? Yelling America is the best and then think that ends the debate is what I'd call a cheap shot.
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Post by Just Here on Nov 9, 2004 8:47:40 GMT -5
As Merle Haggard sang "when you're running down my country, you're walking on the fighting side of me". I won't allow ANYONE to run down our great nation! Never! Merle Haggard seems to be having second thoughts about supporting Bush. In "That's the News," he slams Mr. Bush as a leader who does "all the talking while soldiers pay the dues" In an interview with The Associated Press he said of Bush "But I'm not really all that happy with him." He noted the administration's flip flop on National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice 's requested testimony to the Sept. 11 panel as another example of poor leadership. Haggard now sings: "Suddenly it's over, the war is finally done Soldiers in the desert sand still clinging to a gun No one is the winner and everyone must lose Suddenly the war's over, that's the news." The song ends with the lines quoted above: "Politicians do all the talking, soldiers pay the dues Suddenly the war is over, that's the news." Speaking out against evil deeds is a right we all have and one that Haggard supports. He even supports these rights for people he does not agree with. Try to at least rise to the level of the people you are quoting.
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Post by Cindi on Nov 10, 2004 12:57:53 GMT -5
I like the wooden shoes.
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Post by happy on Nov 10, 2004 17:33:42 GMT -5
I don't agree with Bertine's opinions neither,But I don't have the energy to argue it. The banter can get very humorous when I do read it. Bertine, you do need to come over and visit sometime. Things always look different up close.
By the way, I read a story in the classroom today about the pilgrims and it talked about Holland and the kids learning dutch. We might all be related to Bertine! ;D (my blood is primarily of german and irish decent).
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Post by Bertine Louise on Nov 10, 2004 18:04:19 GMT -5
You do? The city folks (like me) think they're a bit silly lol Theyre supposed to be very practical though. I don't agree with Bertine's opinions neither,But I don't have the energy to argue it. The banter can get very humorous when I do read it. Bertine, you do need to come over and visit sometime. Things always look different up close. I will. I actually expect to find a very diverse country. Lol! Actually I only have 1/8 Dutch/German blood. My family is from Indonesia, but i was born here. So no blond pigtails, blue eyes or wooden shoes! Sorry!
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Post by happy on Nov 10, 2004 22:47:35 GMT -5
Bertine, We might even LOOK alike! ;D
Come visit!
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Post by HA on Nov 14, 2004 3:44:40 GMT -5
US to deploy hyper-missilesAnywhere on Earth could be targeted 'within two hours' Robin McKie and David Smith Sunday November 14, 2004 American scientists are developing hypersonic cruise missiles that will fly 10 times faster than current rockets, penetrate concrete armouring and could be launched from any site in the world. The missiles would have a range of 9,000 miles, more than a third of Earth's circumference and be able to reach their targets within two hours. First prototypes are expected to be tested next year, though the missile is not expected to be deployed until the end of the decade. 'If someone is messing with us - or Britain - from far away, we could whack them straight away,' said Preston Carter, an aerospace engineer at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory, in California. The new missiles will exploit supersonic combustion ramjet - or scramjet - technology. Nasa engineers will tomorrow attempt to fly a robot X-43A scramjet over the Pacific at speeds around 7,200 mph, 10 times the speed of sound. The flight will be crucial in demonstrating the feasibility of hypersonic travel. Most media attention has focused on its commercial exploitation for jets that could travel from London to Sydney in two hours. The prime aim is to create hypersonic rockets that would replace current cruise missiles. 'The new missiles could strike pretty much anywhere within a couple of hours,' said Graham Warwick, Americas editor of Flight International . 'Current cruise missile have to be carried on a B52 bomber. That involves planning and takes at least 24 hours. The military want a quick solution, so if they knew bin Laden was sipping coffee at a cafe they could get a bomb on target in two hours.' Scramjets work on the same principle as all jets, by igniting fuel in compressed air and using the expanding gases to propel the aircraft. Standard turbojets use fans to compress the air: scramjets use a plane's forward motion alone to bring air into the combustion chamber and require an initial boost from a rocket. The entire aircraft then becomes an enormous scoop that receives air which is compressed and injected - and ignited - with a chemical called silane before hydrogen fuel is added. The feat compares to 'lighting a match in a hurricane', says Nasa. 'We'll see a military application initially as a "bunker buster" that would hit its target and bore into the ground before exploding,' said Carter.' 'We are talking about the ability to strike more cost-effectively. If the US has to deploy troops to the other side of the world, it is expensive. This may keep enemies in check and act as a deterrent.' From www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,3858,5062748-110878,00.html
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2004 0:21:41 GMT -5
when I was in Holland ,my parents who are diplomats there for the United States had a small get together with many of the dutch friends... I can only say that I was honored by the love and the concern the dutch have for my parents there in Den Hague and I was disturbed by the blantant redneck hostility displayed towards the Europeans who CANNOT help but be concerned by the political actions of the United States and yes its Arrogance. Like I said my parents are Diplomats and "rub shoulders with those in the know" and the picture isnt as pretty looking back to what we as Americans take for granted. In the end nothing really matters but salvation... and in the end I dont think God draws geopolitical lines on a map to determine whos more loved........So to the Dutch woman.... thank you if your one of those that knows my parents in The Hague if not......join me as I run into the North Sea at Sheviniegan on New Years!
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Post by Bertine Louise on Nov 16, 2004 8:10:13 GMT -5
Hey Freddy, yes I do know your parents! Lovely people! I was there for dinner one time last year with some other friends (one from Philipines and one from South Africa too) and they served us an American meal which was great! I was invited to come over too when their children would come over (you i suppose) but didn't make it. So i almost did meet you:)
Are you really going for the New Years dive at Scheveningen? That is one of our crazy traditions! brrrrrr...cold..
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Post by Freddywink on Nov 17, 2004 15:29:47 GMT -5
yes indeed I ran into the north sea last year...At Shevinegen. it was a fun experience and it was very very cold but i had a great time with the Dutch laughing and singing and dancing before we all ran into the the sea. I have never seen so many naked people in a snowstorm before!!!! I had to laugh at the Dutch referance to holding out thier finger and thumb a centimeter apart and saying "it was this cold"........ because it was!!!!! I will be there this Christmas break and New years also. I take my name from an old Scottish worker named Freddy Bryington who was a major influence on me as a child. My mom and pop are good people and i think they have had the time of thier lives with the Dutch people. I love the Dutch...... feel at home with them. Now that they are scheduled to go to Africa I fear for them and laugh for them at the same time because thier truest friends are the Dutch Friends........ so thank you....... write back soon....
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Post by Bertine Louise on Nov 18, 2004 6:03:13 GMT -5
Wow Freddy, Ive never heard someone talking so affectionately about the Dutch lol. Thanks anyway.
Hey thats too bad your parents going to Africa (too bad for us I mean) When are the scheduled to go?
Glad you felt at home here, maybe I'll see you at Christmas!
Greetings from Holland, Bertine
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Sky
Junior Member
7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.
Posts: 67
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Post by Sky on Nov 20, 2004 10:50:18 GMT -5
I guess you can watch all you want -- the U.S. will do what's right based on our own core, not necessarily whether other countries agree with what's right for us. And that's what ticks many of those other countries off -- that they can't always "tell us" (or advise us) what to do. And I suppose that's why the "world" wanted Kerry to win -- he showed himself to be a person without a solid core, easily swayed to different sides on every issue. Good one !!
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Post by ChugwaterWy on Nov 20, 2004 15:13:17 GMT -5
Good one !! Duh Duh... anybuddy knw what channel wraslins on...... Um where is Holland again.... is that in Michigan?<<< what do those godless dutch think they are... for christ sakes they 'owe us" ......and other psuedo conservative/liberal manipulative ideals.... what ever you need to identify with group of American machismo thinking.....but hey "we won" no more counteridealism to our market forces... Yea team America!!! On behalf of thinking sentient Americans who are truely conservative I apologize for butthead thinking like that and beg you not to jusdge the wonderful people of this land by partyline rhetoric like the above messages... chances are these people have probably never been outside of thier own states much less The United States.Since the history of the United States is selectively taught it should come as no suprise to the peoples of this world that criticle thought is not taught either......and this next generation will make it very very apparent. again another example of a typical american trait... the complete inability to empathize,understand or consider a different opinion thought or ideal.....good little sheep c the old our way or the highway way of thinking........
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