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Post by piggy on Nov 2, 2007 23:16:29 GMT -5
Reading GIT and Nate Barker's posts made me think over and over and to read between the lines how unhappy they sound. They try hard to convince themselves they are right and in the only true way. The two of them really opened my eyes to see I wanted out. I want to thank both of them for opening my eyes.
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Post by gem on Nov 3, 2007 9:58:21 GMT -5
To ithascome...I just bookmarked your website..very very interesting!
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juju
Senior Member
Posts: 263
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Post by juju on Nov 3, 2007 10:15:07 GMT -5
One of my AHA moments came when I realized that I didn't feel i could speak honestly in testimony time. "They" wouldn't have accepted what I had to say. At the time I quit I had 4 very small children and alot of my testimonies were about parenting, and the spiritual aspects of raising kids.............I would have absolute clarity while meditating on my testimony at home, then be afraid to share once I got there.......
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Post by Kathy Lewis on Nov 3, 2007 10:56:54 GMT -5
It is not surprising that the Catholics and the 2x2s share the same quandary. ....Are they Christian? They have so many of the same problems. They worship something other than God. They uphold an unmarried ministry which creates all kinds of sexual problems for them. They rule with legalism and tradition. The church is more powerful and overrides scripture. Scripture is not taught.
Look at Italy, Europe, Ireland and South America. Catholicism destroys families, law and social structures because the people depend on the Pope and the church to dictate their lives. They can't and don't take responsibility for their behavior....they blame others.
They have extreme anger problems which leads to bloodshed.
2x2s also have many of the same problems. The group as a whole does not have enough power in society to lead to bloodshed but if they were as populous as the Catholics they probably would.
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Brenda
Senior Member
Posts: 652
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Post by Brenda on Nov 3, 2007 13:03:39 GMT -5
Lots of Ahha moments last few years going to meetings--
My final straw was realizing I did not want my children to be raised the way I was-- and they were getting old and it was time to get out-- why would I do something that I wanted to get my kids as far away from as possible.
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Post by recentarriver on Nov 3, 2007 16:06:16 GMT -5
Reading through this thread I can only say (in response to the last straw issue) that many of the experiences that others have recorded here have been my experience too.
My leaving the fellowship has taken place just in the past month but in my heart this has been an ongoing process.
Perhaps the heaviest "straw" is that of the exclusivism. A couple workers told me just before my formal exit that I was drifting from God and in a few short years I would be far, far away from Him. Their reason? Because I remarked to them about experiencing/recognizing a Christ-like spirit in "outsiders" that I have become friends with. These 2 workers told me my thoughts were the works of the Deceiver. IMHO this borders on blasphemy.
I have recognized the legalistic and traditional controls within the fellowship for several years but when the situation involves something serious like Blasphemy I am outa here! RA
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Post by Peacemaker on Nov 3, 2007 19:17:35 GMT -5
Ah! this thread is designed to make you feel and look like a camel - it gives you the hump.
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Post by tell us on Nov 3, 2007 20:13:00 GMT -5
To ithascome...I just bookmarked your website..very very interesting! where can we find ithascome's website? thanks
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Post by gem on Nov 3, 2007 20:22:54 GMT -5
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Post by thanks gem on Nov 3, 2007 20:50:08 GMT -5
thanks you are a gem (and you didn't goof up!) But, it says: The GeoCities web site you were trying to view has temporarily exceeded its data transfer limit. Please try again later.You have made it very popular it seems
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Post by Hmmmmmm on Nov 3, 2007 22:29:54 GMT -5
ST,
After I left, not one worker inquired of me why I left. They asked my husband but never me. I don't think my leaving was such a big deal to anyone of them as long as my children still attended. And when William Irvine became public it was just extra nails in the coffin.
How long did your children go to meetings after you quite? When did you learn of WI?
I am still amazed that there is an issue over this WI thing... it is strange to have known of it for over 40 years and some still say that it was hid.. and I grew up in the midwest.
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Post by juliette on Nov 3, 2007 22:38:36 GMT -5
ST, After I left, not one worker inquired of me why I left. They asked my husband but never me. I don't think my leaving was such a big deal to anyone of them as long as my children still attended. And when William Irvine became public it was just extra nails in the coffin. How long did your children go to meetings after you quite? When did you learn of WI? I am still amazed that there is an issue over this WI thing... it is strange to have known of it for over 40 years and some still say that it was hid.. and I grew up in the midwest. I live in Minnesota. My mother still believes that "there have always been workers" and does not know of the history with William Irvine, etc. I mentioned it to her once, but she did not want to know more.
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ecarg
New Member
Posts: 9
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Post by ecarg on Nov 4, 2007 7:03:52 GMT -5
;D Ah! this thread is designed to make you feel and look like a camel - it gives you the hump.
I agree...........makes me want to spit! ;D ;D ;D
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Post by recentarriver on Nov 4, 2007 8:23:52 GMT -5
hmmmmmmm guest said:
"I am still amazed that there is an issue over this WI thing... it is strange to have known of it for over 40 years and some still say that it was hid.. and I grew up in the midwest. " I have lived in the midwest USA nearly 40 years and it is less then 2 years ago that I found out about WI. This was the switch that turned on the light for me. I think there are a LOT of people still in the dark about WI. Apparently it is a regional thing. There are a lot of folks in the fellowship around here who do not know. I have talked with some of them and this is how I base my observation. RA
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Post by Sojourner Truth on Nov 4, 2007 20:42:18 GMT -5
Dear Hmmmmm,
My spouse, who was angry and frustrated with me for leaving The Truth, continued to go to meetings with our children for a number of years. Ironically, when he was told of the sites on the internet by one of the friends, a good ten years after I left, he then decided the Truth was a lie and also left; much more vehemently than I ever was against the Truth.
Well, you must have been one of the lucky few to know about William Irvine. In the great northeast, where I am from, it wasn't known at large until it was put in the newspaper at the same time the issue of the Altamont Convention not being up to safety code was publicized. I called my mother the morning I read of it and she emphatically told me it was all a lie and whoever gave the newspaper that information didn't know what they were talking about. She hadn't read the paper herself. She happened to be working for one of the friends in their home taking care of their elderly parent for them at that time. And though the article wouldn't be in her local paper, these friends subscribed to the larger city paper where the article was published. Mom asked to see the paper and they reluctantly brought it out (they had hidden it). This was very hard for my mother to accept (which she believed only after she was told it was true by other friends), as we were taught that one of the signs of a false church was that its beginning began with a man. She has now readjusted her thinking and has chosen to forget what we were taught so there is no reconciliation needed and she doesn't need to think too hard about it. Needless to say I had already left The Truth and that's why I say it was just "extra nails" in an already sealed coffin.
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Post by gem on Nov 4, 2007 20:56:40 GMT -5
To ST..I am also from the northeast and didn't know about WI until a couple (?) years ago...it was never brought up.... I do remember hearing about a stir caused by something in a newspaper but I was married and gone by then...
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Post by ithascome on Nov 5, 2007 22:56:58 GMT -5
Thanks I am glad you are enjoying it. It was a labor of love. I have put many long hours on it. If you would like a copy of Dad's book just e-mail me and I will send you a transcript.
tchers2@earthlink.net
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Post by eyedeetentee on Nov 5, 2007 23:24:47 GMT -5
We learned about WI back in elementary. We even learned capitols. Is it Racine? Elementary was a long time ago. I do not get what Wisconsin has to do with anything anyway.
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Post by a believer on Nov 6, 2007 4:45:24 GMT -5
ST, After I left, not one worker inquired of me why I left. They asked my husband but never me. I don't think my leaving was such a big deal to anyone of them as long as my children still attended. And when William Irvine became public it was just extra nails in the coffin. How long did your children go to meetings after you quite? When did you learn of WI? I am still amazed that there is an issue over this WI thing... it is strange to have known of it for over 40 years and some still say that it was hid.. and I grew up in the midwest. I live in Minnesota. My mother still believes that "there have always been workers" and does not know of the history with William Irvine, etc. I mentioned it to her once, but she did not want to know more. I would say there are about 3 in my family that know about meetings being started by someone, while the other 15 or so think it goes right back to Jesus. There are several that have heard about William Irvine but say it is a lie made up by enemies of the truth. I was told by a couple of people that they had always known about WI but were told not to say anything. I am wondering about the people who say that they have always known about WI or having been started by a man, how they could sit thought meetings with the workers preaching that they have no earthly founder, and that it was not started by men like other churches. How could they sit thought meetings hearing that if they knew otherwise?
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Post by recentarriver on Nov 6, 2007 6:14:27 GMT -5
a believer guest said: "I am wondering about the people who say that they have always known about WI or having been started by a man, how they could sit thought meetings with the workers preaching that they have no earthly founder, and that it was not started by men like other churches. How could they sit thought meetings hearing that if they knew otherwise? "
This is one of the main reasons I stopped going to Gospel Mtgs right after learning of Wm Irvine.
Learning of the existence of an earthly founder explained for me why my previous understanding of "only-one-wayism" and other Biblical doctrines I had been raised to believe were not correct. RA
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Post by kencoolidge on Nov 6, 2007 18:42:50 GMT -5
For us it was a combination of things all touched on in other posts but the real litmus test was LOVE and the lack of it and the criticism of those showing LOVE in the world.
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Post by jh62 on Nov 6, 2007 20:59:12 GMT -5
Just like everyone else, it was a multitude of straws for me, one upon another. I think maybe the last straw though was when one person in meeting told of how there is no such thing as unconditional love. They said the bible never mentions unconditional love, and God does not possess unconditional love. Their point was that there are conditions we need to meet to gain God's love. That was the last straw.
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Post by theophilus on Nov 6, 2007 21:56:36 GMT -5
I think starting tonight I am going to sit down and start a Bible study on the word "Christians." Any suggestions for where to start in my Bible?TIA John 3:16 and following verses.
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Post by gem on Nov 7, 2007 15:33:41 GMT -5
Thanks theophilus for the suggestion!
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Post by rational on Nov 7, 2007 15:54:51 GMT -5
While you are at it also make a study of the word Bible in the Bible. You will find the same resultants. Not quite, if you use the KJV. Christians - 1 Bible - 0
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Post by the scriptures on Nov 7, 2007 16:00:50 GMT -5
While you are at it also make a study of the word Bible in the Bible. You will find the same resultants. Not quite, if you use the KJV. Christians - 1 Bible - 0 References to ' 'scripture'' might be considered equivilent to the word symbol 'bible' as the word 'bible' did not exist, when the bible was scribed. Of course , the New Testament was a work in progress as it was produced as it was lived.
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Post by ithascome on Nov 7, 2007 21:12:53 GMT -5
Yes you are right...
Act 11:26 disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.
.... had not seen that before. Thanks!
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Post by rational on Nov 7, 2007 21:22:26 GMT -5
Yes you are right... Act 11:26 disciples were called Christians first in Antioch. .... had not seen that before. Thanks! You're welcome John. It's not like you have never taught me anything!
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