born again criminal
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Post by born again criminal on May 20, 2006 2:00:15 GMT -5
If a criminal seeks, and asks for forgiveness, from Jesus/God for a crime that he comitted...one that he has not been brought to justice for...must he turn himself in for his crime & face human justice, before God will forgive him?
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Post by to criminal on May 20, 2006 2:27:37 GMT -5
Don't worry 'bout it. Unless it was a major felony such as murder, the statute of limitations will be on your side...at least as far as human justice. I can't speak for God.
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Post by turn yourself in on May 20, 2006 2:30:38 GMT -5
Well, if the statute of limitations has not run out...I would say that one must both ask God for forgiveness...and...turn oneself in to the authorities.
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Post by as i c it on May 20, 2006 2:52:35 GMT -5
To have a clear conscience, and to live an honest life, I think he has to confess (and ask forgiveness from those he/she's wronged) as well as God.
But yes, even without the action of turning oneself in, I think God will forgive the individual who honestly regrets his actions: and who has turned from his sin. (God will know why you don't do the rest: and will understand all the emotions/situations etc, that might be making it impossible to do the right thing regarding human justice: And, of course, He has the power to work with those things--and make it possible for you to emotionally--or whatever--face it)
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Post by selah on May 20, 2006 7:38:43 GMT -5
God forgives the moment we ask Him. That does not, however, remove our responsibility to the law of the land.
Blessings, Linda
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Post by Gene on May 20, 2006 8:39:55 GMT -5
One must look at the incremental good or harm that may be caused by turning one's self in.
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Post by Sylvestra on May 20, 2006 11:17:52 GMT -5
I believe that if our crime has harmed someone, (such as theft, destruction of property, etc.) we are not square with everyone again until restitution is completed by us! If we restore the victim(s), we do not need to turn ourselves in to the powers that be.
If the victim can't be restored, (rape, murder, etc.) we need to "do the time" with the powers that be.
It is something that
Best regards, Edy
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Post by 0000 on May 20, 2006 11:41:11 GMT -5
Did the sinner hanging on the cross, and went to Heaven, go to meeting? Jesus forgave him. So, if he didn't then we don't have to go to meeting to be saved, right?
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Post by ithascome on May 20, 2006 12:12:18 GMT -5
This is a hard one....confess or not confess. I guess it depends on the crime. I was thinking of a question... How many of us would turn ourself in after running a red light? Most likely none. We could justify it by saying it was a small crime. Is crime a sin... yes it could be... is one sin any greater sin than another in Gods eyes ... no.
I can not tell you to confess... it is between you and God.
A woman once was about to be put to death for her crime... Jesus said "cast the first stone" .... and it was over.
I think you have been punished already... should you ask for more... I don't know. If you confess I would seek a lawyers advice first. Remember we are talking about man's laws. Man is not God. They are two different things. Man is not so forgiving.
"There is no truth in a court of law." I had a lawyer friend tell me that once... I tend to believe him.
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Post by Troublemaker on May 20, 2006 13:39:37 GMT -5
This is the first thread I can think of that was started by a worker!
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Post by Gene on May 20, 2006 15:45:37 GMT -5
... is one sin any greater sin than another in Gods eyes ... no. Is that so? I find that difficult to believe.
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Post by IllinoisGal on May 20, 2006 19:04:03 GMT -5
... is one sin any greater sin than another in Gods eyes ... no. Is that so? I find that difficult to believe. I believe Id have to say the penalty for sin with God is the same no matter what it is.. However, In the worlds eyes Yes sin does vary in degree
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Post by Gene on May 20, 2006 19:29:30 GMT -5
Is that so? I find that difficult to believe. I believe Id have to say the penalty for sin with God is the same no matter what it is.. However, In the worlds eyes Yes sin does vary in degree So to 'discuss' on your terms -- Mark 3:28, 29: "Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme. But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation" Maybe blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is a more serious sin than, say, not coming to a COMPLETE stop at a stop sign?
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Post by Sylvestra on May 20, 2006 23:09:23 GMT -5
This is a hard one....confess or not confess. I guess it depends on the crime. I was thinking of a question... How many of us would turn ourself in after running a red light? Most likely none. We could justify it by saying it was a small crime. Is crime a sin... yes it could be... is one sin any greater sin than another in Gods eyes ... no. I can not tell you to confess... it is between you and God. A woman once was about to be put to death for her crime... Jesus said "cast the first stone" .... and it was over. I think you have been punished already... should you ask for more... I don't know. If you confess I would seek a lawyers advice first. Remember we are talking about man's laws. Man is not God. They are two different things. Man is not so forgiving. "There is no truth in a court of law." I had a lawyer friend tell me that once... I tend to believe him. Should one turn themselves in for running a red light if no one was harmed by having done so? I think the key is to look at the purpose of the penalties of God's Law....to restore the victims. Best, Edy
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2006 9:38:15 GMT -5
You have to believe in forgiveness for it to happen? Trying to turn the clock back is hardly a mark of faith in forgiveness!!
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Post by just me on Aug 25, 2006 23:01:27 GMT -5
... is one sin any greater sin than another in Gods eyes ... no. Is that so? I find that difficult to believe. seems pretty clear to me Romans 6:23 23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. To the original poster: I dont believe that you would have to turn yourself in to be forgiven by GOD, but wouldnt that be a pretty good indicator that you are sincerely sorry for your crime???
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Post by What about on Aug 25, 2006 23:09:03 GMT -5
Is that so? I find that difficult to believe. seems pretty clear to me Romans 6:23 23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. To the original poster: I dont believe that you would have to turn yourself in to be forgiven by GOD, but wouldnt that be a pretty good indicator that you are sincerely sorry for your crime??? What about christians (including 2x2) who have radar dectectors in their car. Are the sining in that they are trying to disobey the laws of the land? Worse yet, what kind of message about honesty are they sending to their kids?
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Post by just me on Aug 26, 2006 12:42:19 GMT -5
Well I would have to say that YES having a "fuzz buster" with he intent of breaking the law ( and what other reason is there for one??? ) wouild be a sin, and I think it send the message that if you can avoid getting caught, its OK to break the law.
My speeding and tire frying is JUST as much a sin as its breaking the law, however, when caught, and I inevitably will get caught, I will pay my fine and go on.
To those who think "mans laws" dont count. I would point you to this:
Romans 13:1
1 Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.
--------------------------------------------------------- Excerpted from Compton's Interactive Bible NIV Copyright (c) 1994, 1995, 1996 SoftKey Multimedia Inc. All Rights Reserved
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Post by MAYBE on Aug 26, 2006 17:17:03 GMT -5
"If a criminal seeks, and asks for forgiveness, from Jesus/God for a crime that he comitted...one that he has not been brought to justice for...must he turn himself in for his crime & face human justice, before God will forgive him?"
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How about doing a Bible study on this? And while we are at it maybe we could also study in a more general context....when we wrong someone how should we handle that.
And I ramble here, suppose the crime committer seeks forgiveness from the person/family or entity against whom he/she committed the crime and has been forgiven should he/she approach the law and submit to that justice?
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confessions v a dangerous mynd
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Post by confessions v a dangerous mynd on Aug 27, 2006 12:46:39 GMT -5
My thoughts on this one which I have often thought of myself. Thanks for bringing it up. Jesus said" render onto Caesar what is Caesars and onto God which is Gods" I know that Jesus wanted us to respect authority. The laws of the land are the earthly authority. I personally think that we would have to face our earthly crimes before we could be forgiven by God. If God allowed us forgiveness for crimes committed with no earthly punishment this would be endorsing deceitfulness. However, if the laws of the land do not line up with God and Jesus teachings. You might have a chance. Jesus knew the deceitfulness of lawyers too. He often mentioned then. They were always trying to justify and avoid everything.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2006 12:54:29 GMT -5
Trying to figure out what others should do (to be 'worthy' of forgiveness), is definately part of the Pharisee mindset. --- I believe that each of us as individuals are best to forgive each other unconditionally -- and leave the rest to a loving heavenly father!!
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Post by COMMENTS on Aug 27, 2006 19:08:48 GMT -5
"I personally think that we would have to face our earthly crimes before we could be forgiven by God."
I agree with the above, however face our earthly crimes where or how?
If I acknowledge my crime to GOD that's confession, and if I am truly sorry, filled with regret and remorse that's repentance.
So isn't that facing my crime?
"If God allowed us forgiveness for crimes committed with no earthly punishment this would be endorsing deceitfulness."
Again, I would tend to agree it WOULD seem that way, however earthly punishment by whom or what? I think of King David who committed murder and adultery. When confronted with his crime he was mortified, filled with remorse (Cf. Psalm 51) threw himself on GOD's mercy and yes he did have an earthly punishment ....from his own household.
I don't read of him submitting to the "earthly" authorities to mete justice.
Any comments?
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Post by Simple on Aug 27, 2006 19:23:48 GMT -5
If a criminal seeks, and asks for forgiveness, from Jesus/God for a crime that he comitted...one that he has not been brought to justice for...must he turn himself in for his crime & face human justice, before God will forgive him? My experience..........If you forgive all things done against you by all of God's creation, this case is closed, justice is served. The blood of Jesus is a powerful force. All sin is against God, he promised us forgiveness, and restoration. Have faith in his promises. Jesus said "Go forth and sin no more" The harder part for us is doing the forgiving than gettin forgived.
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Post by Simple on Aug 27, 2006 19:38:53 GMT -5
My experience..........If you forgive all things done against you by all of God's creation, this case is closed, justice is served. The blood of Jesus is a powerful force. All sin is against God, he promised us forgiveness, and restoration. Have faith in his promises. Jesus said "Go forth and sin no more" The harder part for us is doing the forgiving than gettin forgived. Simple... your post is very uplifting. Keep up the good work, bro. Whew..................I knew it was in here somewhere.....
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eurp
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Post by eurp on Aug 29, 2006 6:57:57 GMT -5
"I believe that each of us as individuals are best to forgive each other unconditionally "
except that Edgar does not apply this to any 2x2s.
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