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Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2006 14:57:24 GMT -5
I have seen situations where a professing couple divorces and one of the parties continues on in the "truth". The one who remains "true" is seen as the victim while the one who "loses out" is seen as the one at fault. Makes no sense except that those in the truth way often cannot see outside the box.
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Post by box on Aug 2, 2006 15:06:51 GMT -5
No the F&W's cannot see outside the box nobody would remain a 2x2 if they could would they(aware of the history)
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Post by Terry on Aug 2, 2006 16:01:28 GMT -5
I have seen situations where a professing couple divorces and one of the parties continues on in the "truth". The one who remains "true" is seen as the victim while the one who "loses out" is seen as the one at fault. Makes no sense except that those in the truth way often cannot see outside the box. When I was faced with a custody fight--I was professing, my ex left me and a 2 year old---she's slept with any male she could get to take off his pants during our marriage--and and given up custody at the time of the divorce, but 18 months later filed for custody--the elder of my meeting told me not to expect any support from him because he valued the friendship of my ex's father more than the proper custody of my child.
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Post by oh ya on Aug 2, 2006 17:30:47 GMT -5
I have seen situations where a professing couple divorces and one of the parties continues on in the "truth". The one who remains "true" is seen as the victim while the one who "loses out" is seen as the one at fault. Makes no sense except that those in the truth way often cannot see outside the box. When I was faced with a custody fight--I was professing, my ex left me and a 2 year old---she's slept with any male she could get to take off his pants during our marriage--and and given up custody at the time of the divorce, but 18 months later filed for custody--the elder of my meeting told me not to expect any support from him because he valued the friendship of my ex's father more than the proper custody of my child. whats your name? whats the elders name? i dont believe you. in fact, i am calling you a liar. prove me wrong.
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Post by mrtindrucvionging on Aug 2, 2006 17:38:47 GMT -5
I think one could take the word "professing" in the title of this thread and insert active church member and it would still apply. Tell ya a little story.;; There was this married couple in this very large 'modern' Christian church who had three children. Both were very active in the church; regular attendees and all that; and both were seen as being of strong faith. Well, they split up for various reasons and she was blamed for doing the splittin', he kept going to that church and she was shunned by the church members , so she stopped going to that church and I think soon moved on with her life; new church, new relationship, etc. She is what I would call a 'gung-ho' Christian, too. But, I did find it interesting that she was blamed and he was seen as the 'victim'.
So, this is not just a 2x2 issue or problem. You would also find it in many circles and groups of people. When any couple splits there will be those who do stay neutral, which makes it hard to maintain friendships, and there will be those who takes sides, and label one as victim; when they do not know all the private facts within the relationship.
I think it is needful for people to realise that there is no perfect "group" of people to hang with....., , the 'friends' are not perfect, because they are human. When a person can see past that need to have others be perfect and not feel that they have to be perfect to conform, a better relationship with God can then ensue...and as a better relationship developes, it serves to enrich whomever we come into contact with!
Amen, and amen. !!
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Bitterness here is awful
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Post by Bitterness here is awful on Aug 10, 2006 20:38:40 GMT -5
No one knows what goes on in a marriage except the people in it. Same for a divorce. Therefore, judgement by anyone, whoever they are, is wrong. If a person gets caught up in someone elses ignorance in the form of an opinion (and that's all it would be) then they are in for rough waters. Thankful God isn't interested in people's opinions about others lives. I think he calls it meddling and gossip. Been divorced for quite a few years and am very glad for the meetings and even people's concern for my ex. Also glad to know opinions don't count.
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Post by Kathy Braun on Aug 10, 2006 23:22:27 GMT -5
I think one could take the word "professing" in the title of this thread and insert active church member and it would still apply. Tell ya a little story.;; There was this married couple in this very large 'modern' Christian church who had three children. Both were very active in the church; regular attendees and all that; and both were seen as being of strong faith. Well, they split up for various reasons and she was blamed for doing the splittin', he kept going to that church and she was shunned by the church members , so she stopped going to that church and I think soon moved on with her life; new church, new relationship, etc. She is what I would call a 'gung-ho' Christian, too. But, I did find it interesting that she was blamed and he was seen as the 'victim'.
So, this is not just a 2x2 issue or problem. You would also find it in many circles and groups of people. When any couple splits there will be those who do stay neutral, which makes it hard to maintain friendships, and there will be those who takes sides, and label one as victim; when they do not know all the private facts within the relationship.
I think it is needful for people to realise that there is no perfect "group" of people to hang with....., , the 'friends' are not perfect, because they are human. When a person can see past that need to have others be perfect and not feel that they have to be perfect to conform, a better relationship with God can then ensue...and as a better relationship developes, it serves to enrich whomever we come into contact with!
Amen, and amen. !! Finally an unbias view, thank you.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2006 2:06:16 GMT -5
re the issue of blame. If a church couple split and one continues, then it is not up to that church to lay blame (assuming some is due) on the partner no longer in that church. That partner could have become alienated both from the spouse and their church, yet done no wrong.
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Post by NO BLAME on Aug 11, 2006 10:29:55 GMT -5
And you are going to tell me that there is no one at fault in most divorces?
More than 70% of the time, I think both are at fault. But one makes an issue of their side of the story. That makes the other one look bad.
Just remember.... there is always two sides to every story.
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Post by muddy waters on Aug 11, 2006 11:06:10 GMT -5
Just remember.... there is always two sides to every story.
no, 3 yours, mine, and the truth
each side has their own perception somewhere inbetween is the truth of the matters
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Post by You are clueless on Aug 11, 2006 19:22:42 GMT -5
No Blame, Have you ever been through a divorce? If you haven't, you are clueless and merely spouting outsiders' (as in not one of the divorcing people) guesses at appearances. 70% of the time someone is to blame? What kind of non sense is that?. How in the world could anyone possibly know anything like that? Are you privy to 100% of all divorces and then conclude by acertaining the nuances and facts of each one that 70% have fault involved? Give me a break.
Divorce is a heart wrenching, far reaching life shattering ordeal . Just because it is becoming more prevalent doesn't lessen the pain of watching the hearts and souls one holds most dear ripped apart, regardless of your own. To hear people chat about it like they could possibly know what they are talking about (70% are at fault) is too ridiculous to warrant any further comment.
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Post by mrtindrucvionging on Aug 11, 2006 22:47:13 GMT -5
I think one could take the word "professing" in the title of this thread and insert active church member and it would still apply. Tell ya a little story.;; There was this married couple in this very large 'modern' Christian church who had three children. Both were very active in the church; regular attendees and all that; and both were seen as being of strong faith. Well, they split up for various reasons and she was blamed for doing the splittin', he kept going to that church and she was shunned by the church members , so she stopped going to that church and I think soon moved on with her life; new church, new relationship, etc. She is what I would call a 'gung-ho' Christian, too. But, I did find it interesting that she was blamed and he was seen as the 'victim'.
So, this is not just a 2x2 issue or problem. You would also find it in many circles and groups of people. When any couple splits there will be those who do stay neutral, which makes it hard to maintain friendships, and there will be those who takes sides, and label one as victim; when they do not know all the private facts within the relationship.
I think it is needful for people to realise that there is no perfect "group" of people to hang with....., , the 'friends' are not perfect, because they are human. When a person can see past that need to have others be perfect and not feel that they have to be perfect to conform, a better relationship with God can then ensue...and as a better relationship developes, it serves to enrich whomever we come into contact with!
Amen, and amen. !! Finally an unbias view, thank you. And thank - you for your nice comment....finally,....someone who wrote something nice about my posts!
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Post by mrtindrucvionging on Aug 11, 2006 22:54:09 GMT -5
I remember what one of my co-workers said once about when her husband left her and they divorced: "He left me for another woman and as soon as he did, I hauled my but-t off to the psychologist as fact as I could."
Point being, , help is there and I think it great when people do not hesitate to seek help. There are many support groups for divorcing people also. It's an extremely painful thing to go through, but just think of the pain that people go through before they reach the point of divorcing.
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Post by pro help is good on Aug 12, 2006 1:00:33 GMT -5
I know the workers in my area would encourage people to get professional help when they need it. They may be told to be cautious as to who they chose but I think that is advice anyone would give to anyone they cared about.
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Post by last post here on Aug 12, 2006 1:10:52 GMT -5
Mrtn, I don't get the point of your post. Obviously the pain preceeding a divorce would be immense. Why else would there be a divorce? I don't think the two can be separated. It's like the pain of cancer as it kills the patient. The two things, pre-death cancer pain and the death are all part of the same thing. Divorce is painful but think of the pain before the divorce? Oh please, what's the point? If you know the pain of divorce you obviously know the pain preceeding the divorce.
I do think divorce is a very real answer to some horrible situations and the only Godly choice.
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Post by Kathy Braun on Aug 12, 2006 8:36:01 GMT -5
Finally an unbias view, thank you. And thank - you for your nice comment....finally,....someone who wrote something nice about my posts! You are so welcome, finally a posting that has real meaning!
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Post by freedomrings on Aug 12, 2006 20:47:11 GMT -5
As being a divorced person and I left the 2x2 way, and the ex stayed, in I know very well how those that are 2x2 beleive that the one who is staying in as a 2x2 is all good. I have seen it happen with a dear friend of mine too. Since we have left the 2x2 way we are blasted as the trouble maker even though there were abuse issues in the marriage that noone had knowledge of because it was done in private and so the exes are seen as the ones done wrong. I am finally excepting it and relizing how gullible people are and if they want to keep their heads in the sand let them!!! I feel that God has fainally shown me that it does not matter what they think. I am so glad that I have the comfort of trully knowing that God is in my life and that I am saved, and I don't have to have others tell me I am good to think I am saved!
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Post by withopeneyes (Mandy) on Aug 14, 2006 15:07:42 GMT -5
When my husband were going through a tough time and contemplating divorce (we were separated for a bit as well) there were some very supporting people who loved BOTH of us and tried to encourage BOTH of us (not really pushing us to stay together, but pushing us to each work on ourselves and seek personal counseling). There were also those who jumped to conclusions, those who began to exclude me from groups, and those who decided to use me as the topic of conversation when they gathered together.
I was very disappointed and hurt when I found out that one of my so-called-good-friends had failed to invite me to the regular mommy gathering. I was later told it was because I was no longer "like them".... and one of the mothers later called me and told me about the gossiping.
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Post by mrtindrucvionging on Aug 14, 2006 15:40:55 GMT -5
Mrtn, I don't get the point of your post. Obviously the pain preceeding a divorce would be immense. Why else would there be a divorce? I don't think the two can be separated. It's like the pain of cancer as it kills the patient. The two things, pre-death cancer pain and the death are all part of the same thing. Divorce is painful but think of the pain before the divorce? Oh please, what's the point? If you know the pain of divorce you obviously know the pain preceeding the divorce. I do think divorce is a very real answer to some horrible situations and the only Godly choice. Excuse me? What is your point? I have seen much pain in marriages; too much pain for too long, that when a the couple finally arrived at divorcing each other, it was a RELIEF. Divorce doesn't kill marriages like cancer kills people. Unfit analogy. Divorce is many times freeing and life enhancing to those who are in very bad marriages. When they divorce, it actually can improve their life, not kill it. Divorce is an option; not a disease that kills the body. P.S. Is this really your last post?
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Post by freedomrings on Aug 22, 2006 7:45:57 GMT -5
Martindrucvioing
I really want to say thanks for your analogy or example about divorce being a relief when it is over. I am one of those who is very relieved to be out of my marriage. I can truly say that it was a very freeing experience!!! I am glad to be able to fianlly be me and to let my true self show. I feel that God showed me it was time to get me and my children out of a very bad relationship so we could all heal and now start to grow again. GOod things can come out of divorce!!!
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Post by mrtindrucvionging on Aug 23, 2006 13:47:28 GMT -5
MartindrucvioingI really want to say thanks for your analogy or example about divorce being a relief when it is over. I am one of those who is very relieved to be out of my marriage. I can truly say that it was a very freeing experience!!! I am glad to be able to fianlly be me and to let my true self show. I feel that God showed me it was time to get me and my children out of a very bad relationship so we could all heal and now start to grow again. GOod things can come out of divorce!!! Let freedom ring......let it ring. I am happy for you and yours, and that you are now happier and out of a bad relationship. God allowed for divorce in the Old Testiment. I just try to remember that.
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Sometimes changes are needed
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Post by Sometimes changes are needed on Aug 24, 2006 12:13:28 GMT -5
First of all, a marriage is between the two who are married. Both people go into the relationship hoping neither will change, or that they can "change" the "things" that they don't like about each other through time.
With life in its ever changing cycles, both partners will and do change, over and over. The relationship must also change in order for the marriage to be successful. This is the difficult part of the partnership as Man and Wife. This is where more couples fall apart. You must go into this understanding the honeymoon ends, the fairy tale twists, yet the romance, friendship and closeness doesn't have too. These things take Work. From both of you.
One must really know who they are prior to marriage, and also know what they expect from a partner for life. If you know who you are, what your goals are (although goals will also change) and that you also understand you will have to make changes and or adjustments in the relationship yourself to have it be lasting. Perhaps this is another good point to not marry too young. Gain some life experience and enjoy your own life before trying to blend yours with another's. This is not a one way street. It is a 3 way street. Yours, Theirs, and The Two of You Together as a Couple.
You should always maintain your separate identity. You will also be seen as a couple and as the spouse. The roles are often played differently and should always be viewed as such.
A husband should understand as should a wife, that life will deal out many changes and force differences upon a couple that they may never see coming. This is where communication, honesty and integrity come into play. You must always be willing to communicate, even if there may be cause to inflict emotional harm to you or to your partner. The honesty portion is perhaps the most difficult for all of us. No one wants to hurt another. Talking to each other while the changes of life swirl around you can and will help each of you to grow - as individuals as well as partners.
I have been in a situation where I had to make some choices and some changes during a very long marriage. I had to renew some personal commitments and some were renewed to me. Remember your vows? You may have to examine them again from time to time to check that you both are being true to them as well as true to each other and to yourselves as individuals.
God bless and keep true to each other, if it is in your hearts to do so. We did. And I am glad for the hard things we went through along the way to show that we have the right grounding, support and trust in each other that have been strong throughout the 20 plus years we have been married.
Hurt can heal, unpleasant memories can be replaced by happy ones. It is up to the both of you. Marriage is like a bathtub. It isn't as hot once you are in it and are used to it. It is up to you both to keep it warm and bubbly.
PS I am from a divorced family myself. One parent is remarried and professing, one is not married and not attending meetings. I love them both.
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Post by quote on Aug 24, 2006 14:19:25 GMT -5
First of all, a marriage is between the two who are married. Both people go into the relationship hoping neither will change, or that they can "change" the "things" that they don't like about each other through time. "Women who marry men hoping to mend their ways soon find out they are not worth a darn." - Ann Landers
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