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Post by cacoon on Aug 10, 2007 12:52:18 GMT -5
You guys say there is nothing positive here. Life isn't always positive. When you break out of your sheltered environment, you see that. You may wish everyone on TMB was speaking about how much they enjoy meetings or conventions and their thankfulness that the Servants ever crossed their way in the beginning. But people have legitamate gripes.
It is wrong to ignore errors of any group. Exposing wrongs is one way to correct them. And then you have a positive fellowship.
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savedbyblood
Junior Member
Eventually we'll figure it all out!
Posts: 57
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Post by savedbyblood on Aug 10, 2007 19:22:38 GMT -5
I have learned much in my few weeks on this board. Many things positive; many things negative.
Each of us are positive that our beliefs are the correct beliefs and that everyone else is wrong.
Each of us are positive that we disagree with some of the others here to some degree.
Some are positive that we are saved by the Blood of Jesus Christ from the Cross and this sacrifice gives us a sure eternity.
Some are positive that the Blood of Jesus Christ is just a starting place from which we work ourselves into a peaceful eternity with God - if we're good enough.
Some are positive that we come to Christ by His spoken and written Word (the Holy Bible).
Some are positive that we come to Christ by His spoken and written Word through His Holy men (the Workers) only.
Some believe that we are saved by believing that Christ is the Son of God and He died to redeem us of our sins, as Jesus is recorded as saying.
Some believe that we are saved by believing that Christ is the son of God and He died to show us a Way of Service led and judged by the Workers while still on this earth and if we do not meet the Workers standards we are doomed to eternity in outer darkness.
Some believe that the word of God is the same yesterday, today and forever.
Some believe (the Workers) that this word (way) must be changed to deal with the times as they change.
Some believe that Christians the world over are living and dying for Christ as Martyrs and living in persecution as the Word foretells.
Some believe (the Workers) that if this is not happening to them in the 2x2 way then the are of a false Christ and dying for nothing.
Sometimes it may take glaring examples of the negative things to be made aware of the truth of matters so that the few positive things do not overshadow the reality of the hidden agenda.
Cacoon, you wrote of our "sheltered environment." You are very correct about this and the fact that I have been in the Truth for well over 30 years is testimony to the very good job they do at sheltering us and indoctrinating us to believe that which we hear with very little question. Questions are met with stern opposition rather than answers. I have discovered this of late but am among the few who have decided to stay the course until the very end (excommunication) in order to gather information to prove my "newfound" discovery. There are many here in the Truth who need my subtle help and example as a martyr for Christ (if need be) to show them that there is a better way.
Professing folks do feed on positive things. There is much that is positive in the Truth because this is all the 2x2's hear in their meetings. They seldom hear of prophecy and how what is happening in the world in general (politically and with wars and disasters) is spoken of in prophecy in the Holy Bible. They seldom hear of just how close we might be to the End Times but are given many warnings to be ready at all times. Professing folks do speak of these things amongst themselves when Workers are not around (for fear of overstepping their place in the Church) and do have a good grasp of the reality of prophecy.
The only negative they hear leads to death and destruction and most of this has to do with supporting the "Truth Ministry" rather than Christ. The Truth Ministry centers mostly around dress, hair, no TV's, attending meetings regularly, etc, you know, the outward look, and being "Judged" by the Workers as to weather you have the "right spirit" or not. I've found that if you question a Worker you suddenly do not have "the right Spirit."
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Post by déjà vu on Aug 10, 2007 19:57:36 GMT -5
saved by blood I enjoyed your post and how true this quote, "I've found that if you question a Worker you suddenly do not have "the right Spirit." and also whosoever questions the workers looses all credibility ( that is our experience)
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Post by withopeneyes (Mandy) on Aug 10, 2007 20:42:59 GMT -5
I think it's important that we talk to others about their beliefs and our beliefs. Often, God has brought something to my attention through someone else... and I greatly appreciate it.
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Post by freespirit on Aug 10, 2007 22:36:11 GMT -5
saved by blood, I really enjoyed that post. I'm another one who's decided to stick it out until they excommunicate me. Who knows if that will be sooner or later, tomorrow or never. I'm not worried about it--God will take care of that in His own good time.
I honestly love the friends--actually I just love people, all kinds and varieties 2x2s, exs and those who have never heard of this nutty church of ours--I love opinionated people and quiet people and those in the middle, they all have interesting things to say IMO and something to teach me.
The meetings in our area are generally very helpful and encouraging to me; it's the rules and general b.s. that gets on my nerves. I'm also aware that pretty much any group or organization or family has rules and general b.s., so... *shrug* I don't have any particular reason to leave this one.
I've expected one of those "talks" for year because I don't abide by the dress code or any other rule that I consider to be just too wacko to make sense. I'm not staying around to try to change any body else's opinion about those things--just trying to do what God gives me to do and leave it at that. I don't make a big deal about stuff, but I don't hide it either--so if anybody wants to find some fault of mine or something to criticize about me, my flaws are pretty much all out there in the open. I'm neither as bad as my critics say, nor as good as my fans believe. I'm just me, and that's how I go to God.
One or two hours a week in meetings is a very small part of my relationship with God anyway. I'm a huge believer in prayer and just feeling God's personal touch. I love praise music and listen to other church's ministry. I read a lot. I meditate. I take classes. I sometimes go to other services. I just want to stay in touch with Him, because He is our Rock.
I'm glad you're here.
peace to all, freespirit
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Post by jh62 on Aug 10, 2007 22:57:54 GMT -5
I wish I could have had the same attitude as you do, Freespirit, when I was still going to meetings! I think you have a very healthy outlook. I think I worried too much about what other people thought, and...I had problems listening to some of the testimonies and sermons. I felt like if I stayed I was "condoning" it in some way. I think it's great there are people like you in the 2x2's.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2007 0:15:10 GMT -5
I wish I could have had the same attitude as you do, Freespirit, when I was still going to meetings! I think you have a very healthy outlook. I think I worried too much about what other people thought, and...I had problems listening to some of the testimonies and sermons. I felt like if I stayed I was "condoning" it in some way. I think it's great there are people like you in the 2x2's. It is possible to be at complete liberty with God and in the meetings at the same time. I like freespirit's attitude as well, savedbyblood's too. The secret to liberty I have found is to live "God only", and mean it. Once you achieve that, it really doesn't matter what people think or whether you get excommunicated because God is infinitely greater than all that stuff. I suppose it is natural to seek the approval of others but often doing the right thing brings the opposite, but a clear conscience.
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Post by freespirit on Aug 11, 2007 8:11:15 GMT -5
I wish I could have had the same attitude as you do, Freespirit, when I was still going to meetings! I think you have a very healthy outlook. I think I worried too much about what other people thought, and...I had problems listening to some of the testimonies and sermons. I felt like if I stayed I was "condoning" it in some way. I think it's great there are people like you in the 2x2's. I keep thinking about this and I think overcoming the hurdle of "what other people think" is a huge one in most women's lives--inside or outside this particular dysfunctional family. For one, many women are naturally nurturers and we tend to want to "fix up" what's broken. We want to heal, smooth things over. While this is a very good trait--Check out Abigail in the bible when David came to kill them; and we certainly need it to raise children--BUT, there is a point where we are trying to please the un-pleasable. We're doing every thing we can to bring about cooperation and trying to take care of everyone else's emotions and not nurturing ourselves too. There is a lot of this stuff we need to pray about so we know where to bend and where to stay strong, when to fight and when to run. And, yes, when we stop going along just for the sake of going along sometimes it makes waves. Well. So be it. Jesus has already proven he can calm the waves. People will get over themselves or they won't. But we don't have to cater to their personal dramas and issues about what THEY think WE should wear or do. We don't have to be offensive OR defensive, we just have to be strong. Second is that girls are taught to be "ladies"and to fit in (conforming) while boys are more taught to be good sports (competitive). Some of that is just natural, but society certainly goes along with it many times. We're taught to feel embarrassed and bad about our bodies--don't dance, don't play sports, don't do anything if you have to wear pants, and, by the way, cover up with ugly clothing and box toed shoes and pantyhose. The other thing we discover (usually on our own with no guidance), is that we ARE powerful--and we swing to the opposite direction--wearing clothing that is too revealing or becoming promiscuous--we disrespect ourselves because we don't know what to do with our own innate female power. And THEN if we are sexually abused, we are told that somehow it's our own fault. Blame the victim mentality. What we often are not taught is how to be both sexual and spiritual. That we don't have to pick one or the other. We can be both attractive--hairstyle, clothing--without having to run from God. This is a lot of stuff to write in a very short block so it may not make sense the way I intend. I have been in a lot of women's groups and this is a theme that is played over and over. It's not just a 2x2 thing--although certainly it's exacerbated with the dress code--but something as women we circle around over and over again trying to find that balance between fitting in and standing out. It helps to read. And read a lot so not just one person's viewpoint is given. That gives a better base to decide what to accept and what to reject as regurgitated vomit. And prayer. I believe in prayer. I believe that God can make a way where there is no way. That He can help us and guide us and heal us in every situation. He's there for us--He wants to bless us, wipe away our tears. Some of us have been beat down pretty hard, and I think we all need a little balm. peace to all, freespirit PS thank you for your kind words.
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dont think so much obey God
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Post by dont think so much obey God on Aug 12, 2007 1:21:59 GMT -5
You guys say there is nothing positive here. Life isn't always positive. When you break out of your sheltered environment, you see that. You may wish everyone on TMB was speaking about how much they enjoy meetings or conventions and their thankfulness that the Servants ever crossed their way in the beginning. But people have legitamate gripes. It is wrong to ignore errors of any group. Exposing wrongs is one way to correct them. And then you have a positive fellowship. Ecc 11:1 Cast thy bread upon the waters: for thou shalt find it after many days. Ecc 11:2 Give a portion to seven, and also to eight; for thou knowest not what evil shall be upon the earth. Ecc 11:3 If the clouds be full of rain, they empty themselves upon the earth: and if the tree fall toward the south, or toward the north, in the place where the tree falleth, there it shall be. Ecc 11:4 He that observeth the wind shall not sow; and he that regardeth the clouds shall not reap. Ecc 11:5 As thou knowest not what is the way of the spirit, nor how the bones do grow in the womb of her that is with child: even so thou knowest not the works of God who maketh all. Ecc 11:6 In the morning sow thy seed, and in the evening withhold not thine hand: for thou knowest not whether shall prosper, either this or that, or whether they both shall be alike good. Ecc 11:7 Truly the light is sweet, and a pleasant thing it is for the eyes to behold the sun: Ecc 11:8 But if a man live many years, and rejoice in them all; yet let him remember the days of darkness; for they shall be many. All that cometh is vanity. Ecc 11:9 Rejoice, O young man, in thy youth; and let thy heart cheer thee in the days of thy youth, and walk in the ways of thine heart, and in the sight of thine eyes: but know thou, that for all these things God will bring thee into judgment. Ecc 11:10 Therefore remove sorrow from thy heart, and put away evil from thy flesh: for childhood and youth are vanity.
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