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Post by passingby on Jul 16, 2023 22:22:59 GMT -5
Was listening to SiriusXM's Bluegrass Junction while driving the other day when this rendition of Hymns Old and New #1 came along, - that classic that I think every child learns 1st from the F&W gospel mtgs, and is sometimes chosen in the Sunday morning mtgs too. I listed to (started to..) several other renditions but none were as good (imo) as this one Becky Buller, Vince Gil Ricky Skags www.youtube.com/watch?v=otWIFLy4e8kCaused an involuntary lump in my throat. I think it was something like how people feel and sometimes cry at weddings. A reminder of Hope, faith, courage, optimism, but now knowing there's going to be some tough roads, and you may not end up where you started, but there's still a chance you'll hold on to hope, faith, and optimism.
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Post by intelchips on Jul 30, 2023 9:53:34 GMT -5
Hope, faith, courage, optimism and yet none of these speak of memory.
I’ve been reading my Bible I’ve been reading with great grandma Davis I’ve been reading with grandma Stone Six years old and I’ve been reading
Twenty two years old and there’s a yellow peril The Army Air Corp seems right for me I’m off for the Pacific with my Bible in my kit Mother says it’s okay to fly the plane but not to drop the bombs
They say I got killed but there is no grave No workers to preach over my bones The Pacific is a mighty big place When the final trumpet sounds will they find my soul
From Los Angeles to San Diego there are Sunday meetings There are meetings both large and small But in the town of Jacumba only three widows met in his name Two will remember me and then it's time to wash the dishes And play dominos with the grandson
And time like a river flows
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Post by passingby on Jul 31, 2023 10:58:04 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2023 23:55:25 GMT -5
Very nice... Also, some useless trivia, somewhere over the rainbow may have the lead in being the most played childlike song during extremely violent parts of movies...
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Post by intelchips on Aug 17, 2023 16:32:26 GMT -5
Very nice... Also, some useless trivia, somewhere over the rainbow may have the lead in being the most played childlike song during extremely violent parts of movies... Speaking of trivia I thought I might off you some to pass along at your next gospel meeting: Before we can begin today's gospel meeting, we must first address the elephant in the room. And that is the other gospels not in our book. The Gnostic gospels were written by different groups of Gnostic Christians, who were considered heretical by the early Christian church. The early Christian church was dominated by the Pauline tradition, which emphasized the death and resurrection of Jesus as the central event of salvation. The Gnostic gospels, on the other hand, emphasized the spiritual knowledge (gnosis) that Jesus brought to the world. The early Christian church also had a strong hierarchical structure, with bishops and priests at the top. The Gnostics, on the other hand, believed that everyone had the potential to achieve gnosis, regardless of their social status. This led to conflict between the Gnostics and the early Christian church, and eventually the Gnostics were suppressed, and their gospels were excluded from the New Testament. There is also evidence that the Romans were involved in the suppression of Gnosticism. The Romans were concerned about the spread of Gnosticism, which they saw as a threat to their authority. They also saw the Gnostics as a potential source of political unrest. As a result, the Romans persecuted the Gnostics and destroyed their writings. Of course, there is no definitive proof that the Romans suppressed Gnosticism for control and monetary gain. However, the evidence suggests that this was a factor in their decision. It is important to note that there is a diversity of opinion among scholars on this issue. Some scholars believe that the suppression of Gnosticism was motivated primarily by theological differences, while others believe that political and economic factors were also important. Ultimately, the question of why the Gnostics were suppressed is a complex one, and there is no easy answer. Any other path but to be open with our adherents (students) would be to be false with them.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2023 18:01:12 GMT -5
Very nice... Also, some useless trivia, somewhere over the rainbow may have the lead in being the most played childlike song during extremely violent parts of movies... Speaking of trivia I thought I might off you some to pass along at your next gospel meeting: Before we can begin today's gospel meeting, we must first address the elephant in the room. And that is the other gospels not in our book. The Gnostic gospels were written by different groups of Gnostic Christians, who were considered heretical by the early Christian church. The early Christian church was dominated by the Pauline tradition, which emphasized the death and resurrection of Jesus as the central event of salvation. The Gnostic gospels, on the other hand, emphasized the spiritual knowledge (gnosis) that Jesus brought to the world. The early Christian church also had a strong hierarchical structure, with bishops and priests at the top. The Gnostics, on the other hand, believed that everyone had the potential to achieve gnosis, regardless of their social status. This led to conflict between the Gnostics and the early Christian church, and eventually the Gnostics were suppressed, and their gospels were excluded from the New Testament. There is also evidence that the Romans were involved in the suppression of Gnosticism. The Romans were concerned about the spread of Gnosticism, which they saw as a threat to their authority. They also saw the Gnostics as a potential source of political unrest. As a result, the Romans persecuted the Gnostics and destroyed their writings. Of course, there is no definitive proof that the Romans suppressed Gnosticism for control and monetary gain. However, the evidence suggests that this was a factor in their decision. It is important to note that there is a diversity of opinion among scholars on this issue. Some scholars believe that the suppression of Gnosticism was motivated primarily by theological differences, while others believe that political and economic factors were also important. Ultimately, the question of why the Gnostics were suppressed is a complex one, and there is no easy answer. Any other path but to be open with our adherents (students) would be to be false with them. Not a lot going right for Gnostics. Thankfully. Bizzaro group and belief system...Few (that's not all for those of you from rio linda) would consider their writings "gospels"...
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Post by Dan on Aug 17, 2023 20:59:08 GMT -5
Speaking of trivia I thought I might off you some to pass along at your next gospel meeting: Before we can begin today's gospel meeting, we must first address the elephant in the room. And that is the other gospels not in our book. The Gnostic gospels were written by different groups of Gnostic Christians, who were considered heretical by the early Christian church. The early Christian church was dominated by the Pauline tradition, which emphasized the death and resurrection of Jesus as the central event of salvation. The Gnostic gospels, on the other hand, emphasized the spiritual knowledge (gnosis) that Jesus brought to the world. The early Christian church also had a strong hierarchical structure, with bishops and priests at the top. The Gnostics, on the other hand, believed that everyone had the potential to achieve gnosis, regardless of their social status. This led to conflict between the Gnostics and the early Christian church, and eventually the Gnostics were suppressed, and their gospels were excluded from the New Testament. There is also evidence that the Romans were involved in the suppression of Gnosticism. The Romans were concerned about the spread of Gnosticism, which they saw as a threat to their authority. They also saw the Gnostics as a potential source of political unrest. As a result, the Romans persecuted the Gnostics and destroyed their writings. Of course, there is no definitive proof that the Romans suppressed Gnosticism for control and monetary gain. However, the evidence suggests that this was a factor in their decision. It is important to note that there is a diversity of opinion among scholars on this issue. Some scholars believe that the suppression of Gnosticism was motivated primarily by theological differences, while others believe that political and economic factors were also important. Ultimately, the question of why the Gnostics were suppressed is a complex one, and there is no easy answer. Any other path but to be open with our adherents (students) would be to be false with them.
There's nothing complex about why the Gnostic's were tossed-out as fakes.
1. There is no historical or literary evidence placing the writing of any of these other gospels before the middle of the 2nd century. This means they couldn’t have been written by eyewitnesses and their authors couldn’t even have directly interviewed eyewitnesses. Their late dates call their authenticity into question.
2. Scholars agree that none of these later Gnostic gospels were written by the people they claim to be written by. The Gospel of Thomas was not written by Thomas, the Gospel of Peter wasn’t written by Peter, etc.
3. Not only did no one know who wrote these gospels, but the Christians viewed much of their content as strange and not in harmony with the apostolic teaching at the heart of the Christian faith.
4. Gnosticism espouses multiple creators, Jesus was only a spirit, sin isn't the problem ignorance is, special knowledge brings salvation and it’s only available to a few, Jesus was only a teacher of wisdom and not a savior.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2023 2:10:50 GMT -5
Speaking of trivia I thought I might off you some to pass along at your next gospel meeting: Before we can begin today's gospel meeting, we must first address the elephant in the room. And that is the other gospels not in our book. The Gnostic gospels were written by different groups of Gnostic Christians, who were considered heretical by the early Christian church. The early Christian church was dominated by the Pauline tradition, which emphasized the death and resurrection of Jesus as the central event of salvation. The Gnostic gospels, on the other hand, emphasized the spiritual knowledge (gnosis) that Jesus brought to the world. The early Christian church also had a strong hierarchical structure, with bishops and priests at the top. The Gnostics, on the other hand, believed that everyone had the potential to achieve gnosis, regardless of their social status. This led to conflict between the Gnostics and the early Christian church, and eventually the Gnostics were suppressed, and their gospels were excluded from the New Testament. There is also evidence that the Romans were involved in the suppression of Gnosticism. The Romans were concerned about the spread of Gnosticism, which they saw as a threat to their authority. They also saw the Gnostics as a potential source of political unrest. As a result, the Romans persecuted the Gnostics and destroyed their writings. Of course, there is no definitive proof that the Romans suppressed Gnosticism for control and monetary gain. However, the evidence suggests that this was a factor in their decision. It is important to note that there is a diversity of opinion among scholars on this issue. Some scholars believe that the suppression of Gnosticism was motivated primarily by theological differences, while others believe that political and economic factors were also important. Ultimately, the question of why the Gnostics were suppressed is a complex one, and there is no easy answer. Any other path but to be open with our adherents (students) would be to be false with them.
There's nothing complex about why the Gnostic's were tossed-out as fakes.
1. There is no historical or literary evidence placing the writing of any of these other gospels before the middle of the 2nd century. This means they couldn’t have been written by eyewitnesses and their authors couldn’t even have directly interviewed eyewitnesses. Their late dates call their authenticity into question.
2. Scholars agree that none of these later Gnostic gospels were written by the people they claim to be written by. The Gospel of Thomas was not written by Thomas, the Gospel of Peter wasn’t written by Peter, etc.
3. Not only did no one know who wrote these gospels, but the Christians viewed much of their content as strange and not in harmony with the apostolic teaching at the heart of the Christian faith.
4. Gnosticism espouses multiple creators, Jesus was only a spirit, sin isn't the problem ignorance is, special knowledge brings salvation and it’s only available to a few, Jesus was only a teacher of wisdom and not a savior.
Well said brother...
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Post by snow on Aug 18, 2023 13:20:42 GMT -5
Speaking of trivia I thought I might off you some to pass along at your next gospel meeting: Before we can begin today's gospel meeting, we must first address the elephant in the room. And that is the other gospels not in our book. The Gnostic gospels were written by different groups of Gnostic Christians, who were considered heretical by the early Christian church. The early Christian church was dominated by the Pauline tradition, which emphasized the death and resurrection of Jesus as the central event of salvation. The Gnostic gospels, on the other hand, emphasized the spiritual knowledge (gnosis) that Jesus brought to the world. The early Christian church also had a strong hierarchical structure, with bishops and priests at the top. The Gnostics, on the other hand, believed that everyone had the potential to achieve gnosis, regardless of their social status. This led to conflict between the Gnostics and the early Christian church, and eventually the Gnostics were suppressed, and their gospels were excluded from the New Testament. There is also evidence that the Romans were involved in the suppression of Gnosticism. The Romans were concerned about the spread of Gnosticism, which they saw as a threat to their authority. They also saw the Gnostics as a potential source of political unrest. As a result, the Romans persecuted the Gnostics and destroyed their writings. Of course, there is no definitive proof that the Romans suppressed Gnosticism for control and monetary gain. However, the evidence suggests that this was a factor in their decision. It is important to note that there is a diversity of opinion among scholars on this issue. Some scholars believe that the suppression of Gnosticism was motivated primarily by theological differences, while others believe that political and economic factors were also important. Ultimately, the question of why the Gnostics were suppressed is a complex one, and there is no easy answer. Any other path but to be open with our adherents (students) would be to be false with them. There's nothing complex about why the Gnostic's were tossed-out as fakes.
1. There is no historical or literary evidence placing the writing of any of these other gospels before the middle of the 2nd century. This means they couldn’t have been written by eyewitnesses and their authors couldn’t even have directly interviewed eyewitnesses. Their late dates call their authenticity into question. 2. Scholars agree that none of these later Gnostic gospels were written by the people they claim to be written by. The Gospel of Thomas was not written by Thomas, the Gospel of Peter wasn’t written by Peter, etc. 3. Not only did no one know who wrote these gospels, but the Christians viewed much of their content as strange and not in harmony with the apostolic teaching at the heart of the Christian faith.
4. Gnosticism espouses multiple creators, Jesus was only a spirit, sin isn't the problem ignorance is, special knowledge brings salvation and it’s only available to a few, Jesus was only a teacher of wisdom and not a savior.
It's common knowledge among biblical scholars that none of the gospels were written by the names attributed to them, except possibly with the exception of the Gospel of John. That one they are still not sure about.
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Post by intelchips on Aug 18, 2023 15:19:42 GMT -5
Speaking of trivia I thought I might off you some to pass along at your next gospel meeting: Before we can begin today's gospel meeting, we must first address the elephant in the room. And that is the other gospels not in our book. The Gnostic gospels were written by different groups of Gnostic Christians, who were considered heretical by the early Christian church. The early Christian church was dominated by the Pauline tradition, which emphasized the death and resurrection of Jesus as the central event of salvation. The Gnostic gospels, on the other hand, emphasized the spiritual knowledge (gnosis) that Jesus brought to the world. The early Christian church also had a strong hierarchical structure, with bishops and priests at the top. The Gnostics, on the other hand, believed that everyone had the potential to achieve gnosis, regardless of their social status. This led to conflict between the Gnostics and the early Christian church, and eventually the Gnostics were suppressed, and their gospels were excluded from the New Testament. There is also evidence that the Romans were involved in the suppression of Gnosticism. The Romans were concerned about the spread of Gnosticism, which they saw as a threat to their authority. They also saw the Gnostics as a potential source of political unrest. As a result, the Romans persecuted the Gnostics and destroyed their writings. Of course, there is no definitive proof that the Romans suppressed Gnosticism for control and monetary gain. However, the evidence suggests that this was a factor in their decision. It is important to note that there is a diversity of opinion among scholars on this issue. Some scholars believe that the suppression of Gnosticism was motivated primarily by theological differences, while others believe that political and economic factors were also important. Ultimately, the question of why the Gnostics were suppressed is a complex one, and there is no easy answer. Any other path but to be open with our adherents (students) would be to be false with them.
There's nothing complex about why the Gnostic's were tossed-out as fakes.
1. There is no historical or literary evidence placing the writing of any of these other gospels before the middle of the 2nd century. This means they couldn’t have been written by eyewitnesses and their authors couldn’t even have directly interviewed eyewitnesses. Their late dates call their authenticity into question.
2. Scholars agree that none of these later Gnostic gospels were written by the people they claim to be written by. The Gospel of Thomas was not written by Thomas, the Gospel of Peter wasn’t written by Peter, etc.
3. Not only did no one know who wrote these gospels, but the Christians viewed much of their content as strange and not in harmony with the apostolic teaching at the heart of the Christian faith.
4. Gnosticism espouses multiple creators, Jesus was only a spirit, sin isn't the problem ignorance is, special knowledge brings salvation and it’s only available to a few, Jesus was only a teacher of wisdom and not a savior.
I agree with your view however, while they are not considered part of the Christian canon, the Gnostic Gospels remain a fascinating and valuable source of information about early Christianity and the diversity of beliefs and practices that existed within the early church. And yet: From The Gnostic Gospels by Elaine Pagels Vintage Books, New York: 1979 pp. xiii-xxiii "the dating of the manuscripts themselves there is little debate. Examination of the datable papyrus used to thicken the leather bindings, and of the Coptic script, place them c. A.D. 350-400. But scholars sharply disagree about the dating of the original texts. Some of them can hardly be later than c. A.D. 120-150, since Irenaeus, the orthodox Bishop of Lyons, writing C. 180, declares that heretics “boast that they possess more gospels than there really are,” and complains that in his time such writings already have won wide circulation–from Gaul through Rome, Greece, and Asia Minor. Quispel and his collaborators, who first published the Gospel of Thomas, suggested the date of c. A.D. 140 for the original. Some reasoned that since these gospels were heretical, they must have been written later than the gospels of the New Testament, which are dated c. 60-l l0. But recently Professor Helmut Koester of Harvard University has suggested that the collection of sayings in the Gospel of Thomas, although compiled c. 140, may include some traditions even older than the gospels of the New Testament, “possibly as early as the second half of the first century” (50-100)–as early as, or earlier, than Mark, Matthew, Luke, and John. Scholars investigating the Nag Hammadi find discovered that some of the texts tell the origin of the human race in terms very different from the usual reading of Genesis: the Testimony of Truth, for example, tells the story of the Garden of Eden from the viewpoint of the serpent! Here the serpent, long known to appear in Gnostic literature as the principle of divine wisdom, convinces Adam and Eve to partake of knowledge while “the Lord” threatens them with death, trying jealously to prevent them from attaining knowledge, and expelling them from Paradise when they achieve it. Another text, mysteriously entitled The Thunder, Perfect Mind, offers an extraordinary poem spoken in the voice of a feminine divine power: For I am the first and the last. I am the honored one and the scorned one. I am the lady and the holy one. I am the wife and the virgin…. I am the barren one, and many are her sons…. I am the silence that is incomprehensible…. I am the utterance of my name. These diverse texts range, then, from secret gospels, poems, and quasi-philosophic descriptions of the origin of the universe, to myths, magic, and instructions for mystical practice."
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2023 15:30:29 GMT -5
There's nothing complex about why the Gnostic's were tossed-out as fakes.
1. There is no historical or literary evidence placing the writing of any of these other gospels before the middle of the 2nd century. This means they couldn’t have been written by eyewitnesses and their authors couldn’t even have directly interviewed eyewitnesses. Their late dates call their authenticity into question. 2. Scholars agree that none of these later Gnostic gospels were written by the people they claim to be written by. The Gospel of Thomas was not written by Thomas, the Gospel of Peter wasn’t written by Peter, etc. 3. Not only did no one know who wrote these gospels, but the Christians viewed much of their content as strange and not in harmony with the apostolic teaching at the heart of the Christian faith.
4. Gnosticism espouses multiple creators, Jesus was only a spirit, sin isn't the problem ignorance is, special knowledge brings salvation and it’s only available to a few, Jesus was only a teacher of wisdom and not a savior.
It's common knowledge among biblical scholars that none of the gospels were written by the names attributed to them, except possibly with the exception of the Gospel of John. That one they are still not sure about. incorrect...others say different
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Post by snow on Aug 18, 2023 16:07:14 GMT -5
It's common knowledge among biblical scholars that none of the gospels were written by the names attributed to them, except possibly with the exception of the Gospel of John. That one they are still not sure about. incorrect...others say different A majority now say that they aren't written by the names on them. Mark they feel is the first one written and it was influenced from a document called Q. Then the gospels of Matthew and Luke copied from Mark. onlysky.media/jpearce/no-the-gospel-writers-werent-eyewitnesses/
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2023 17:28:40 GMT -5
People with a modern piece of paper saying they are qualified and good at something isn't necessarily true...
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Post by snow on Aug 19, 2023 12:21:50 GMT -5
There's nothing complex about why the Gnostic's were tossed-out as fakes.
1. There is no historical or literary evidence placing the writing of any of these other gospels before the middle of the 2nd century. This means they couldn’t have been written by eyewitnesses and their authors couldn’t even have directly interviewed eyewitnesses. Their late dates call their authenticity into question. 2. Scholars agree that none of these later Gnostic gospels were written by the people they claim to be written by. The Gospel of Thomas was not written by Thomas, the Gospel of Peter wasn’t written by Peter, etc. 3. Not only did no one know who wrote these gospels, but the Christians viewed much of their content as strange and not in harmony with the apostolic teaching at the heart of the Christian faith.
4. Gnosticism espouses multiple creators, Jesus was only a spirit, sin isn't the problem ignorance is, special knowledge brings salvation and it’s only available to a few, Jesus was only a teacher of wisdom and not a savior.
I agree with your view however, while they are not considered part of the Christian canon, the Gnostic Gospels remain a fascinating and valuable source of information about early Christianity and the diversity of beliefs and practices that existed within the early church. And yet: From The Gnostic Gospels by Elaine Pagels Vintage Books, New York: 1979 pp. xiii-xxiii "the dating of the manuscripts themselves there is little debate. Examination of the datable papyrus used to thicken the leather bindings, and of the Coptic script, place them c. A.D. 350-400. But scholars sharply disagree about the dating of the original texts. Some of them can hardly be later than c. A.D. 120-150, since Irenaeus, the orthodox Bishop of Lyons, writing C. 180, declares that heretics “boast that they possess more gospels than there really are,” and complains that in his time such writings already have won wide circulation–from Gaul through Rome, Greece, and Asia Minor. Quispel and his collaborators, who first published the Gospel of Thomas, suggested the date of c. A.D. 140 for the original. Some reasoned that since these gospels were heretical, they must have been written later than the gospels of the New Testament, which are dated c. 60-l l0. But recently Professor Helmut Koester of Harvard University has suggested that the collection of sayings in the Gospel of Thomas, although compiled c. 140, may include some traditions even older than the gospels of the New Testament, “possibly as early as the second half of the first century” (50-100)–as early as, or earlier, than Mark, Matthew, Luke, and John. Scholars investigating the Nag Hammadi find discovered that some of the texts tell the origin of the human race in terms very different from the usual reading of Genesis: the Testimony of Truth, for example, tells the story of the Garden of Eden from the viewpoint of the serpent! Here the serpent, long known to appear in Gnostic literature as the principle of divine wisdom, convinces Adam and Eve to partake of knowledge while “the Lord” threatens them with death, trying jealously to prevent them from attaining knowledge, and expelling them from Paradise when they achieve it. Another text, mysteriously entitled The Thunder, Perfect Mind, offers an extraordinary poem spoken in the voice of a feminine divine power: For I am the first and the last. I am the honored one and the scorned one. I am the lady and the holy one. I am the wife and the virgin…. I am the barren one, and many are her sons…. I am the silence that is incomprehensible…. I am the utterance of my name. These diverse texts range, then, from secret gospels, poems, and quasi-philosophic descriptions of the origin of the universe, to myths, magic, and instructions for mystical practice." Elaine Pagels is a good source. Also if anyone is interested in reading the Gnostic Gospels, here is a link to the Nag Hammadi library. gnosis.org/naghamm/nhlcodex.html
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Post by intelchips on Aug 19, 2023 15:26:00 GMT -5
I agree with your view however, while they are not considered part of the Christian canon, the Gnostic Gospels remain a fascinating and valuable source of information about early Christianity and the diversity of beliefs and practices that existed within the early church. And yet: From The Gnostic Gospels by Elaine Pagels Vintage Books, New York: 1979 pp. xiii-xxiii "the dating of the manuscripts themselves there is little debate. Examination of the datable papyrus used to thicken the leather bindings, and of the Coptic script, place them c. A.D. 350-400. But scholars sharply disagree about the dating of the original texts. Some of them can hardly be later than c. A.D. 120-150, since Irenaeus, the orthodox Bishop of Lyons, writing C. 180, declares that heretics “boast that they possess more gospels than there really are,” and complains that in his time such writings already have won wide circulation–from Gaul through Rome, Greece, and Asia Minor. Quispel and his collaborators, who first published the Gospel of Thomas, suggested the date of c. A.D. 140 for the original. Some reasoned that since these gospels were heretical, they must have been written later than the gospels of the New Testament, which are dated c. 60-l l0. But recently Professor Helmut Koester of Harvard University has suggested that the collection of sayings in the Gospel of Thomas, although compiled c. 140, may include some traditions even older than the gospels of the New Testament, “possibly as early as the second half of the first century” (50-100)–as early as, or earlier, than Mark, Matthew, Luke, and John. Scholars investigating the Nag Hammadi find discovered that some of the texts tell the origin of the human race in terms very different from the usual reading of Genesis: the Testimony of Truth, for example, tells the story of the Garden of Eden from the viewpoint of the serpent! Here the serpent, long known to appear in Gnostic literature as the principle of divine wisdom, convinces Adam and Eve to partake of knowledge while “the Lord” threatens them with death, trying jealously to prevent them from attaining knowledge, and expelling them from Paradise when they achieve it. Another text, mysteriously entitled The Thunder, Perfect Mind, offers an extraordinary poem spoken in the voice of a feminine divine power: For I am the first and the last. I am the honored one and the scorned one. I am the lady and the holy one. I am the wife and the virgin…. I am the barren one, and many are her sons…. I am the silence that is incomprehensible…. I am the utterance of my name. These diverse texts range, then, from secret gospels, poems, and quasi-philosophic descriptions of the origin of the universe, to myths, magic, and instructions for mystical practice." Elaine Pagels is a good source. Also if anyone is interested in reading the Gnostic Gospels, here is a link to the Nag Hammadi library. gnosis.org/naghamm/nhlcodex.html Here's the problem I see with the gospels. The authors of the Gospels fail to name themselves, describe their qualifications, or show any criticism with their foundational sources – which they also fail to identify. Filled with mythical and non-historical information, and heavily edited over time, the Gospels certainly should not convince critics to trust even the more mundane claims made therein. And here we have gospels that are closer to the source then the ones in the New Testament and the believers ignore them.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2023 16:51:26 GMT -5
Elaine Pagels is a good source. Also if anyone is interested in reading the Gnostic Gospels, here is a link to the Nag Hammadi library. gnosis.org/naghamm/nhlcodex.html Here's the problem I see with the gospels. The authors of the Gospels fail to name themselves, describe their qualifications, or show any criticism with their foundational sources – which they also fail to identify. Filled with mythical and non-historical information, and heavily edited over time, the Gospels certainly should not convince critics to trust even the more mundane claims made therein. And here we have gospels that are closer to the source then the ones in the New Testament and the believers ignore them. What's your definition of closer? The gnostic crap starts no earlier than 120AD, except for a couple books or so the NT is all before 65AD. Christ and the apostles or disciples at the time being the source here...
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Post by Pragmatic on Aug 19, 2023 19:39:11 GMT -5
Was listening to SiriusXM's Bluegrass Junction while driving the other day when this rendition of Hymns Old and New #1 came along, - that classic that I think every child learns 1st from the F&W gospel mtgs, and is sometimes chosen in the Sunday morning mtgs too. I listed to (started to..) several other renditions but none were as good (imo) as this one Becky Buller, Vince Gil Ricky Skags www.youtube.com/watch?v=otWIFLy4e8kCaused an involuntary lump in my throat. I think it was something like how people feel and sometimes cry at weddings. A reminder of Hope, faith, courage, optimism, but now knowing there's going to be some tough roads, and you may not end up where you started, but there's still a chance you'll hold on to hope, faith, and optimism. Here is a version by Signature Sound (Ernie Haase) that I quite like, and I love the way it builds from an interesting instrumental
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Post by intelchips on Aug 21, 2023 10:58:08 GMT -5
Here's the problem I see with the gospels. The authors of the Gospels fail to name themselves, describe their qualifications, or show any criticism with their foundational sources – which they also fail to identify. Filled with mythical and non-historical information, and heavily edited over time, the Gospels certainly should not convince critics to trust even the more mundane claims made therein. And here we have gospels that are closer to the source then the ones in the New Testament and the believers ignore them. What's your definition of closer? The gnostic crap starts no earlier than 120AD, except for a couple books or so the NT is all before 65AD. Christ and the apostles or disciples at the time being the source here... The Significance of Gnostic Gospels Introduction While willful ignorance seems at times the apologist's best defense against learning anything new or related to their chosen field I’ll offer my final appeal to the significance of the Gnostic Gospels before focusing my attention to the upcoming fall soccer season and the youth players assigned to my care. And in my opinion any preacher (worker) who fails to mention them is dishonest. The Gnostic Gospels are a collection of ancient texts that have garnered significant attention and interest in recent years. These texts, discovered in the mid-20th century, offer unique insights into early Christian thought and spirituality. While they are not included in the traditional Christian New Testament, their importance cannot be understated. In this document, we will explore why the Gnostic Gospels are important and what they reveal about the early Christian tradition. Diverse Early Christian Perspectives One of the primary reasons why the Gnostic Gospels are important is that they provide evidence of the diversity of thought and belief within early Christianity. These texts present alternative viewpoints to the mainstream Christian narratives found in the canonical New Testament. By studying the Gnostic Gospels, scholars and theologians gain a richer understanding of the theological debates and differences that characterized the early Christian community. Mystical and Spiritual Insights The Gnostic Gospels contain teachings that emphasize a more mystical and inner spiritual path to understanding the divine. Unlike some of the more structured and institutionalized aspects of early Christianity, the Gnostic texts focus on personal revelation, direct experience of the divine, and the pursuit of gnosis, or spiritual knowledge. This emphasis on inner spirituality offers a unique perspective on Christian mysticism and personal transformation. Rediscovering Lost Voices Many of the Gnostic Gospels were considered lost to history until their discovery in the 20th century. These texts were often marginalized or suppressed by orthodox Christian authorities, and as a result, the voices of early Gnostic Christians were largely forgotten. The recovery of these texts has allowed scholars and theologians to better understand the diverse range of beliefs that existed within the early Christian world and to give voice to previously marginalized communities. Ethical and Philosophical Considerations The Gnostic Gospels contain a wealth of ethical and philosophical teachings that continue to resonate with modern readers. These texts often explore profound questions about the nature of good and evil, the material and spiritual worlds, and the human condition. By studying the Gnostic Gospels, individuals can engage in meaningful philosophical and ethical reflection, drawing inspiration from ancient wisdom. Influence on Contemporary Spirituality The Gnostic Gospels have had a profound influence on contemporary spirituality, inspiring a revival of interest in Gnostic ideas and practices. Many modern spiritual seekers are drawn to the Gnostic emphasis on inner knowledge, personal transformation, and a direct connection to the divine. This revival has contributed to a broader conversation about the role of spirituality in today's world. Conclusion In conclusion, the Gnostic Gospels are important for a variety of reasons. They provide valuable insights into the diversity of early Christian thought, offer a unique perspective on spirituality and mysticism, rediscover lost voices from the past, and present ethical and philosophical teachings that continue to be relevant today. Their influence on contemporary spirituality demonstrates their enduring significance and relevance in the modern world. Studying the Gnostic Gospels enriches our understanding of the history of Christianity and the broader human quest for meaning and spiritual understanding.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2023 11:25:44 GMT -5
What's your definition of closer? The gnostic crap starts no earlier than 120AD, except for a couple books or so the NT is all before 65AD. Christ and the apostles or disciples at the time being the source here... The Significance of Gnostic Gospels Introduction While willful ignorance seems at times the apologist's best defense against learning anything new or related to their chosen field I’ll offer my final appeal to the significance of the Gnostic Gospels before focusing my attention to the upcoming fall soccer season and the youth players assigned to my care. And in my opinion any preacher (worker) who fails to mention them is dishonest. The Gnostic Gospels are a collection of ancient texts that have garnered significant attention and interest in recent years. These texts, discovered in the mid-20th century, offer unique insights into early Christian thought and spirituality. While they are not included in the traditional Christian New Testament, their importance cannot be understated. In this document, we will explore why the Gnostic Gospels are important and what they reveal about the early Christian tradition. Diverse Early Christian Perspectives One of the primary reasons why the Gnostic Gospels are important is that they provide evidence of the diversity of thought and belief within early Christianity. These texts present alternative viewpoints to the mainstream Christian narratives found in the canonical New Testament. By studying the Gnostic Gospels, scholars and theologians gain a richer understanding of the theological debates and differences that characterized the early Christian community. Mystical and Spiritual Insights The Gnostic Gospels contain teachings that emphasize a more mystical and inner spiritual path to understanding the divine. Unlike some of the more structured and institutionalized aspects of early Christianity, the Gnostic texts focus on personal revelation, direct experience of the divine, and the pursuit of gnosis, or spiritual knowledge. This emphasis on inner spirituality offers a unique perspective on Christian mysticism and personal transformation. Rediscovering Lost Voices Many of the Gnostic Gospels were considered lost to history until their discovery in the 20th century. These texts were often marginalized or suppressed by orthodox Christian authorities, and as a result, the voices of early Gnostic Christians were largely forgotten. The recovery of these texts has allowed scholars and theologians to better understand the diverse range of beliefs that existed within the early Christian world and to give voice to previously marginalized communities. Ethical and Philosophical Considerations The Gnostic Gospels contain a wealth of ethical and philosophical teachings that continue to resonate with modern readers. These texts often explore profound questions about the nature of good and evil, the material and spiritual worlds, and the human condition. By studying the Gnostic Gospels, individuals can engage in meaningful philosophical and ethical reflection, drawing inspiration from ancient wisdom. Influence on Contemporary Spirituality The Gnostic Gospels have had a profound influence on contemporary spirituality, inspiring a revival of interest in Gnostic ideas and practices. Many modern spiritual seekers are drawn to the Gnostic emphasis on inner knowledge, personal transformation, and a direct connection to the divine. This revival has contributed to a broader conversation about the role of spirituality in today's world. Conclusion In conclusion, the Gnostic Gospels are important for a variety of reasons. They provide valuable insights into the diversity of early Christian thought, offer a unique perspective on spirituality and mysticism, rediscover lost voices from the past, and present ethical and philosophical teachings that continue to be relevant today. Their influence on contemporary spirituality demonstrates their enduring significance and relevance in the modern world. Studying the Gnostic Gospels enriches our understanding of the history of Christianity and the broader human quest for meaning and spiritual understanding. Fiction like this can be very interesting but rarely important... Early church fathers thoughts on these writings? One word, Heresy... I'm sure it's caught the eye of many recently, doesn't mean it's a good thing though or even correct... 1Ti_4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils Enjoy the soccer quite fun. In my sophomore year I played at school we fell one game shy of going to play someone in England...argh!!!
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Post by Annan on Aug 21, 2023 16:20:01 GMT -5
John Lamb Lash in his book, Not In His Image, says the goddess Sophia/wisdom fell from the godhead and morphed into the living breathing earth that gave birth to all life. She err'd, which is why she fell. She sinned, not man. Interesting perspective.
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Post by intelchips on Aug 22, 2023 12:30:07 GMT -5
John Lamb Lash in his book, Not In His Image, says the goddess Sophia/wisdom fell from the godhead and morphed into the living breathing earth that gave birth to all life. She err'd, which is why she fell. She sinned, not man. Interesting perspective. Are we aware that? The last pagan emperor Julian wrote: "It is, I think, expedient to set forth to all mankind, the reasons by which I was convinced that the fabrication of the Galilean's is a fiction of men composed by wickedness. Though it has in it nothing divine, by making full use of that part of the soul which loves fable and is childish and foolish, it has induced men to believe. that the monstrous tale is truth."
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Post by snow on Aug 22, 2023 16:54:07 GMT -5
John Lamb Lash in his book, Not In His Image, says the goddess Sophia/wisdom fell from the godhead and morphed into the living breathing earth that gave birth to all life. She err'd, which is why she fell. She sinned, not man. Interesting perspective. Are we aware that? The last pagan emperor Julian wrote: "It is, I think, expedient to set forth to all mankind, the reasons by which I was convinced that the fabrication of the Galilean's is a fiction of men composed by wickedness. Though it has in it nothing divine, by making full use of that part of the soul which loves fable and is childish and foolish, it has induced men to believe. that the monstrous tale is truth." It wasn't just Emperor Julian, Pope Leo X also stated that Jesus story was a fable. godeinstein.blogspot.com/2013/07/pope-leo-x-called-christ-fable-and.html
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Post by Annan on Aug 23, 2023 8:09:49 GMT -5
The fact that there is a highway to hell but a staircase to heaven, says a lot about anticipated traffic.
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Post by snow on Aug 23, 2023 13:58:34 GMT -5
The fact that there is a highway to hell but a staircase to heaven, says a lot about anticipated traffic. Dancing in the flames... lol I hate getting cold and wet so clouds just don't appeal to me.
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