|
Post by Calvin on Jul 31, 2007 10:59:41 GMT -5
Can someone tell me what the purpose of the TMB is?
I come here as a non 2x2 who was B&R and dragged to meetings until I was old enough to make my own decision.
I was hoping to read about other's experiences and see if they were like mine. I was also hoping to discuss 2x2 doctrine and how it is lacking in some areas. In my opinion, there are good things and bad things about the 2x2 religion and I'd like to see how others feel (both in and out).
I expected to find ex's here as well as current 2x2's. What I did not expect to find here was the attacks and the anger. It has shocked me and surprised me. Why can't we just discuss (and even debate) without all the rudeness, name-calling, attacks and criticisms? Don't posters know that once they resort to things like that, their entire argument gets lost in the garbage? What is the point of starting a thread that is just to insult someone?
This board could help a lot of people sort through some things but instead, it is 80% revolting. Has it always been like this?
|
|
|
Post by it is on Jul 31, 2007 11:17:24 GMT -5
It is that way on this board because the admin refuses to monitor it. he claims he doesn't have time. By his inaction, he allowed this place to become the mosh pit of 2x2 discussion. There is another forum that is far better than this. The tone is much quieter there, and the moderators even pop in on occassion to say hello. 2x2doctrine.proboards104.com
|
|
|
Post by CherieKropp on Jul 31, 2007 11:19:29 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Calvin on Jul 31, 2007 13:40:51 GMT -5
Cherie, With all due respect, the title of that website (thelyingtruth) already gives me a bad taste. I want to read dissenting opinions, but that word "lying" just turns me off already.
|
|
|
Post by Says it all on Jul 31, 2007 13:49:15 GMT -5
It is that way on this board because the admin refuses to monitor it. he claims he doesn't have time. By his inaction, he allowed this place to become the mosh pit of 2x2 discussion. There is another forum that is far better than this. The tone is much quieter there, and the moderators even pop in on occassion to say hello. 2x2doctrine.proboards104.comPeople complain and whine but they like the lively talk and even the potshots taken by the drive by shooters. Let the people vote with their fingers: From 2x2doctrine.proboards104.comThere have been 1 users online in the past 24 hours. Makes it tough to have a discussion without posters!
|
|
|
Post by agreed on Jul 31, 2007 13:52:10 GMT -5
Cherie, With all due respect, the title of that website (thelyingtruth) already gives me a bad taste. I want to read dissenting opinions, but that word "lying" just turns me off already. I agree. When I found out that I had been lied to by the workers, I also got a really bad taste. And here they call their group the "truth." Contradiction in terms, obviously. Just like their group...just one big lying group of truthers.
|
|
|
Post by Calvin on Jul 31, 2007 16:37:55 GMT -5
Cherie, With all due respect, the title of that website (thelyingtruth) already gives me a bad taste. I want to read dissenting opinions, but that word "lying" just turns me off already. I agree. When I found out that I had been lied to by the workers, I also got a really bad taste. And here they call their group the "truth." Contradiction in terms, obviously. Just like their group...just one big lying group of truthers. This is pretty much what I was talking about. Instead of talking about specific experiences or doctrine, people use phrases like "one big lying group of truthers." Thanks but no thanks on conversing with people who can't debate in a civil and intelligent way.
|
|
|
Post by good n evil on Jul 31, 2007 17:18:36 GMT -5
Welcome to the real world.
In this world there is good and evil.
People who are evil hate others.
People who are God's own, testify to the truth.
You will always have name-calling , "Calvin"
Because names describe people.
-Welcome
|
|
|
Post by The on Jul 31, 2007 17:22:15 GMT -5
Welcome to the real world. In this world there is good and evil. People who are evil hate others. People who are God's own, testify to the truth. You will always have name-calling , "Calvin" Because names describe people. -Welcome The problem is that you can't tell which one is which
|
|
|
Post by To Calvinn on Jul 31, 2007 17:32:56 GMT -5
I agree. When I found out that I had been lied to by the workers, I also got a really bad taste. And here they call their group the "truth." Contradiction in terms, obviously. Just like their group...just one big lying group of truthers. This is pretty much what I was talking about. Instead of talking about specific experiences or doctrine, people use phrases like "one big lying group of truthers." Thanks but no thanks on conversing with people who can't debate in a civil and intelligent way. Thanks for your brilliant observations about this board. Please feel free to go continue your brilliant observations elsewhere. How about going to the beach and seeing the ocean and saying to the others on the beach that they are next to the ocean? Or look up and point to the sky and say to everyone you meet "look, the sky is blue". Your lips move but nothing comes out but noise.
|
|
|
Post by Poor on Jul 31, 2007 17:37:58 GMT -5
This is pretty much what I was talking about. Instead of talking about specific experiences or doctrine, people use phrases like "one big lying group of truthers." Thanks but no thanks on conversing with people who can't debate in a civil and intelligent way. Thanks for your brilliant observations about this board. Please feel free to go continue your brilliant observations elsewhere. How about going to the beach and seeing the ocean and saying to the others on the beach that they are next to the ocean? Or look up and point to the sky and say to everyone you meet "look, the sky is blue". Your lips move but nothing comes out but noise. Saint, Is your mirror broken or what?
|
|
|
Post by I agree on Jul 31, 2007 17:48:53 GMT -5
I agree. When I found out that I had been lied to by the workers, I also got a really bad taste. And here they call their group the "truth." Contradiction in terms, obviously. Just like their group...just one big lying group of truthers. This is pretty much what I was talking about. Instead of talking about specific experiences or doctrine, people use phrases like "one big lying group of truthers." Thanks but no thanks on conversing with people who can't debate in a civil and intelligent way. 2x2s call themselves "the truth." Yet they do not debate with civility or intelligence. Then there is calvin...
|
|
|
Post by gloryintruth on Jul 31, 2007 18:29:43 GMT -5
[Calvin Wrote] I was hoping to read about other's experiences and see if they were like mine. I was also hoping to discuss 2x2 doctrine and how it is lacking in some areas. In my opinion, there are good things and bad things about the 2x2 religion and I'd like to see how others feel (both in and out).
Friend, I enjoy objective and courteous discussion. I have experienced this kind only about three or four times on this board over the course of the year. Firstly, when I debated the issue of the men of Sodom and whether they were destroyed for the sin of homosexuality (which was excellent; I was forced to go back to the original Hebrew of the Bible, to research the Old Testament law, to synthesise different passages together - I learned much from that one discussion). Both myself, and the liberal I discussed this issue with did so without insult; and even Gene Nelson contributed some valuable insights.
Secondly, when we debated the validity of the Gnostic Gospels. This was also fantastic, forcing me to research the Gospel of Thomas, Judas and so on, looking at textual variants in order to maintain the completion of the biblical canon. Sadly, halfway through that debate, someone posted a photograph of a man with a large bulge in his pants and the comment, "Hey GIT, this is you", or words to that effect.
Thirdly, my debate on the sub-board regarding the biblical basis of Purgatory.
For a classic example of how discussion goes here, consider the thread "cult?". I have posted my three objections to using this term in reference to the fellowship, and so far no one has been able to respond to my points. I have been called a lot of names; my spiritual condition has been judged, weighed in the balances and found wanting (Jessi tells me I am going to hell), but no one can actually meaningfully engage in the topic.
I too would like to discuss points of doctrine. But it is difficult because participants on the TMB have little interest (or knowledge of) what constitutes real debate and how to "do" debate in such a way that does not include ad hominem insult. The vast majority of posters here do little more than rant, unfortunately. The intellectual quality of this forum is low.
[Calvin Wrote] Don't posters know that once they resort to things like that, their entire argument gets lost in the garbage? What is the point of starting a thread that is just to insult someone?
People do not understand, friend. As I have often said, when someone resorts to ad hominem strategies, it is a sign of a failed argument. But generally few understand what an argument is.
[Calvin Wrote] This board could help a lot of people sort through some things but instead, it is 80% revolting. Has it always been like this?
It has always been thus. As I have said previously, I hate being here. It is like sucking from the sump-pump of spiritual toxins, and soul-destroying poison every time. Previously, it was so bad that I had to leave due to depression and mild nervous illness brought on by being called "a waste of space", "idiot", etc, etc, etc. There is only so much nervous strain one can take.
|
|
3
Senior Member
Posts: 206
|
Post by 3 on Jul 31, 2007 18:46:37 GMT -5
GIT:
you wrote, "I too would like to discuss points of doctrine. But it is difficult because participants on the TMB have little interest (or knowledge of) what constitutes real debate and how to "do" debate in such a way that does not include ad hominem insult. The vast majority of posters here do little more than rant, unfortunately. The intellectual quality of this forum is low."
I agree with your above statement. However, please be aware that those of us who were raised in an environment that did not promote critical thinking skills, but rather encouraged simply adhering to the 'party line', are in the process of learning how to debate, how to think critically, & how to question (even learning that it is safe to question).
I'll be the first to admit that I have a long ways to go in my learning curve and you've shot me down many times (some of which I deserved - grin).
So, be patient with at least some of us.
Calvin: I find very little here that grabs my attention and each & every day I tell myself that I'm going to take a break from the TMB. But, I keep thinking that maybe a new thread will be introduced that is worthy of my time & interest. An example - the recent thread titled 'tolerance'. It's these kinds of threads I wish we had more of; dissenting viewpoints with virtually no disrespect.
|
|
|
Post by Bible read it on Jul 31, 2007 23:14:56 GMT -5
Welcome to the real world. In this world there is good and evil. People who are evil hate others. People who are God's own, testify to the truth. You will always have name-calling , "Calvin" Because names describe people. -Welcome The problem is that you can't tell which one is which The Bible, read it Bible - read it Read about sin, love in Bible Bible - read it Read it, Bible
|
|
|
Post by lilmissred on Aug 4, 2007 11:11:54 GMT -5
I agree with Calvin i was born and raised, i came on here for the same time of discussions, i tried to talk about somethings and i immediatly got back those revolting comments too, i also felt very depressed like glory...... i also didnt come here for a long long time
|
|
|
Post by Peacemaker on Aug 4, 2007 14:05:09 GMT -5
This is pretty much what I was talking about. Instead of talking about specific experiences or doctrine, people use phrases like "one big lying group of truthers." Thanks but no thanks on conversing with people who can't debate in a civil and intelligent way. 2x2s call themselves "the truth." Yet they do not debate with civility or intelligence. Then there is calvin... I tend to agree with Calvin's observations on this one. I believe that many outsiders visiting this board would be appalled at the behaviour of some posters on here, 2x2's and exers alike; more like rabble rousers, pardon the expression. It is too much to ask for posters to show respect for each other's opinions or views even if you do not agree with what is written? There is nothing wrong with stating that you disagee and then give a contrary opinion, but never be insulting or personal, please for goodness sake, you people. After all we are supposed to be followers of Christ. MODERATE. May God continue to forgive and bless each and everyone.
|
|
|
Post by 2003 Reader on Aug 4, 2007 14:20:28 GMT -5
Over this time span I can without a doubt say that I have observed much much more deception and hurtful posts from so called 2x2 friends than any of those that have left the group. There was a whole crew of unregistered posters at the beginning who just ripped into every post made by someone who was hurt or treated badly while in the 2x2's. Among them was the good ol Nathan. Nathan was found out in short time by his methods and style of post. There a many others whose names I will mention now. Perhaps later. Let the Truth Be Really Known. Cracker but not Black Hat
|
|
2x2 not exempt but worse
Guest
|
Post by 2x2 not exempt but worse on Aug 4, 2007 14:38:57 GMT -5
Welcome to the real world. In this world there is good and evil. People who are evil hate others. People who are God's own, testify to the truth. You will always have name-calling , "Calvin" Because names describe people. -Welcome People who are evil hate others.So then all the 2x2's who hate all other relegions because they call them False and all the people who have left the 2x2's because they call them fallen away evil and lost out, Must BE EVIL.
|
|
|
Post by Trenton on Aug 4, 2007 14:53:31 GMT -5
Over this time span I can without a doubt say that I have observed much much more deception and hurtful posts from so called 2x2 friends than any of those that have left the group. There was a whole crew of unregistered posters at the beginning who just ripped into every post made by someone who was hurt or treated badly while in the 2x2's. Among them was the good ol Nathan. Nathan was found out in short time by his methods and style of post. There a many others whose names I will mention now. Perhaps later. Let the Truth Be Really Known. Cracker but not Black Hat I have seen the opposite to be true, lately anyway. The few 2x2's on here try to defend their faiths without resorting to personal attacks. While their beliefs may be contrary to what most of us ex's believe, I have never felt personally insulted by them. Rather than debating beliefs, some of the ex's (Brad and Janet come to mind first and foremost) criticize and belittle. It is sad to see.
|
|
|
Post by Other Coins on Aug 4, 2007 15:53:54 GMT -5
Over this time span I can without a doubt say that I have observed much much more deception and hurtful posts from so called 2x2 friends than any of those that have left the group. There was a whole crew of unregistered posters at the beginning who just ripped into every post made by someone who was hurt or treated badly while in the 2x2's. Among them was the good ol Nathan. Nathan was found out in short time by his methods and style of post. There a many others whose names I will mention now. Perhaps later. Let the Truth Be Really Known. Cracker but not Black Hat I have seen the opposite to be true, lately anyway. The few 2x2's on here try to defend their faiths without resorting to personal attacks. While their beliefs may be contrary to what most of us ex's believe, I have never felt personally insulted by them. Rather than debating beliefs, some of the ex's (Brad and Janet come to mind first and foremost) criticize and belittle. It is sad to see. I thought that that Janet said she was still professing. At least I don't remember her saying she was an ex. And as far as Brad, after review of his posts for some time I find that he says nother any worse then those in the F&W say about x's like him. And your statement of the few 2x2's is not accurate. I happen to know for a fact that many 2x2's come here and post with anons and say all sorts of nasty things. Many of them pretend to be ex 2x2s when in fact they are not. How do I know this . Well being a member of the standingtrue and other professing groups, I have many discussion Emails about and with with those that come and post. They tell me all sorts of things.
|
|
|
Post by ranman77007 on Aug 4, 2007 16:22:47 GMT -5
gee i wonder who wrote that... other coin...hmmmm who do i know on yahoo named other coin? ummmmm. horsewoman nah, she said she was off the boards for good.
|
|
|
Post by are you sure on Aug 4, 2007 18:19:16 GMT -5
I have seen the opposite to be true, lately anyway. The few 2x2's on here try to defend their faiths without resorting to personal attacks. While their beliefs may be contrary to what most of us ex's believe, I have never felt personally insulted by them. Rather than debating beliefs, some of the ex's (Brad and Janet come to mind first and foremost) criticize and belittle. It is sad to see. I thought that that Janet said she was still professing. At least I don't remember her saying she was an ex. And as far as Brad, after review of his posts for some time I find that he says nother any worse then those in the F&W say about x's like him. And your statement of the few 2x2's is not accurate. I happen to know for a fact that many 2x2's come here and post with anons and say all sorts of nasty things. Many of them pretend to be ex 2x2s when in fact they are not. How do I know this . Well being a member of the standingtrue and other professing groups, I have many discussion Emails about and with with those that come and post. They tell me all sorts of things. I have been a member of the Standingtrue discussion group for almost a year and I do not recall any discussions about the TMB - neither good or bad.
|
|
|
Post by No That on Aug 4, 2007 18:35:21 GMT -5
I thought that that Janet said she was still professing. At least I don't remember her saying she was an ex. And as far as Brad, after review of his posts for some time I find that he says nother any worse then those in the F&W say about x's like him. And your statement of the few 2x2's is not accurate. I happen to know for a fact that many 2x2's come here and post with anons and say all sorts of nasty things. Many of them pretend to be ex 2x2s when in fact they are not. How do I know this . Well being a member of the standingtrue and other professing groups, I have many discussion Emails about and with with those that come and post. They tell me all sorts of things. I have been a member of the Standingtrue discussion group for almost a year and I do not recall any discussions about the TMB - neither good or bad. Is because it was a personal discussion of members who are on the ST group but discuss things via PM. Humm there was a number who did that and are still doing it AKA most posts ever on here and the collective. They are all a bunch of BORGS
|
|
|
Post by GuestS on Aug 4, 2007 20:36:46 GMT -5
Calvin, You might want to read the books "Reflections" and Reflected Truth." Both are compilations of former 2 x 2's stories. Both were a big help to me.
|
|