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Post by dmmichgood on Jan 12, 2019 22:57:25 GMT -5
Nathan!
Dennis is right!
The 2x2s have a hierarchy of power right from the top overseer down through all the other workers and no one, -NO ONE, -dares to question the one who is power above them!
You should know this! You were once in the work yourself!
There is absolutely NO recourse for anyone to be able to go to for justice when one has been wronged by someone in power over them! That hierarchy of power with absolutely NO recourse for anyone to be able to go to for justice is the worst wrong with the group.
No matter what else they believe or do is nothing comparable to that wrong!
Don't believe me? Wait 'til they come for YOU, Nathan!
I dealt with the overseers bullies myself, TWICE! and they almost RUINED my LIFE and health.
Alright. Then you should understand what Dennis went though!
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Post by nathan on Jan 12, 2019 23:08:16 GMT -5
I dealt with the overseers bullies myself, TWICE! and they almost RUINED my LIFE and health.
Alright. The you should understand what Dennis went though! Yes, off course I understand. Dennis and I had the same overseer, Tharold S.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jan 13, 2019 2:38:12 GMT -5
Nathan!
Dennis is right!
The 2x2s have a hierarchy of power right from the top overseer down through all the other workers and no one, -NO ONE, -dares to question the one who is power above them!
You should know this! You were once in the work yourself!
There is absolutely NO recourse for anyone to be able to go to for justice when one has been wronged by someone in power over them! That hierarchy of power with absolutely NO recourse for anyone to be able to go to for justice is the worst wrong with the group.
No matter what else they believe or do is nothing comparable to that wrong!
Don't believe me? Wait 'til they come for YOU, Nathan!
I dealt with the overseers bullies myself, TWICE! and they almost RUINED my LIFE and health. Tharold S. gave me the green light to go in the work in 1984 and told me to go to Preps at Miltown. I quit my job, sold everything spoke in the last gospel meeting with the field workers. I went to preps and Tharold changed his mind and told the Senior worker at Preps my name is NOT on the Preps list.
I talked to Tharold S. to see what happened and he was sorry for the mixed up! He asked me to wait for another year. I went back to work at my old job with NOTHING! I waited 1 yrs and NO phone call from Tharold, and another 6 months no letter or phone call either.
These guys can be pains in the Butts and make your LIFE a living HELL and show no mercy about it, I put my trust in God and NOT in man/Tharold.
God had called and chosen me for the ministry so, He will open the door for me. I prayed to God what I should do and in my dream One night, the Voice of God said to me, "Go to, Oregon." I left Washington State and offered for the work in Oregon to Howard M. in 1986. I told Howard what happened in Washington State with Tharold and he told me, "My boy, there is a place for you in the work here in Oregon."
I moved to Portland, Oregon and I started in the work 6 months later in 1986-93.
Then why are being so critical of Dennis when you know that he is telling the truth?
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Post by speak on Jan 13, 2019 3:01:55 GMT -5
I wonder how people will feel about a convention at a fair grounds? Why should they feel anything? We have our special meetings in a auditorium we used to have them in a school hall, we feel no different about that. We go to hear Gods word the place has no bearing.
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Post by slowtosee on Jan 13, 2019 9:51:07 GMT -5
Nathan!
Dennis is right!
The 2x2s have a hierarchy of power right from the top overseer down through all the other workers and no one, -NO ONE, -dares to question the one who is power above them!
You should know this! You were once in the work yourself!
There is absolutely NO recourse for anyone to be able to go to for justice when one has been wronged by someone in power over them! That hierarchy of power with absolutely NO recourse for anyone to be able to go to for justice is the worst wrong with the group.
No matter what else they believe or do is nothing comparable to that wrong!
Don't believe me? Wait 'til they come for YOU, Nathan!
I dealt with the overseers bullies myself, TWICE! and they almost RUINED my LIFE and health. Tharold S. gave me the green light to go in the work in 1984 and told me to go to Preps at Miltown. I quit my job, sold everything spoke in the last gospel meeting with the field workers. I went to preps and Tharold changed his mind and told the Senior worker at Preps my name is NOT on the Preps list.
I talked to Tharold S. to see what happened and he was sorry for the mixed up! He asked me to wait for another year. I went back to work at my old job with NOTHING! I waited 1 yrs and NO phone call from Tharold, and another 6 months no letter or phone call either.
These guys can be pains in the Butts and make your LIFE a living HELL and show no mercy about it, I put my trust in God and NOT in man/Tharold.
God had called and chosen me for the ministry so, He will open the door for me. I prayed to God what I should do and in my dream One night, the Voice of God said to me, "Go to, Oregon." I left Washington State and offered for the work in Oregon to Howard M. in 1986. I told Howard what happened in Washington State with Tharold and he told me, "My boy, there is a place for you in the work here in Oregon."
I moved to Portland, Oregon and I started in the work 6 months later in 1986-93.
Horrible ,for lives , to be used as pawns in some power brokers games. Horrible . All is well , until some play doesn’t pan out , and you , a human being , will be sacrificed with no recourse or defense. Not such nice playmates you playing with , Nathan , and although you kinda outfoxed them temporarily , the game obviously is not over . There are no winners , really , when it’s over . I observed a very good senior worker , play the same game , for years , lots of strategy plays back and forth , but hard to recognize anybody as a “winner” . Just lots of playing , with lots of cornering and defense and more moving pawns around the game . Most onlookers wouldn’t have a clue what’s really happening , and view the new workers lists , who is resting or going to be over there or moved here etc etc , and it’s just a conversation piece , not understanding , precious lives are being allowed to besacrificed , and used at mans behest and disposal . Not good Alvin
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Post by nathan on Jan 13, 2019 10:15:26 GMT -5
I dealt with the overseers bullies myself, TWICE! and they almost RUINED my LIFE and health. Tharold S. gave me the green light to go in the work in 1984 and told me to go to Preps at Miltown. I quit my job, sold everything spoke in the last gospel meeting with the field workers. I went to preps and Tharold changed his mind and told the Senior worker at Preps my name is NOT on the Preps list.
I talked to Tharold S. to see what happened and he was sorry for the mixed up! He asked me to wait for another year. I went back to work at my old job with NOTHING! I waited 1 yrs and NO phone call from Tharold, and another 6 months no letter or phone call either.
These guys can be pains in the Butts and make your LIFE a living HELL and show no mercy about it, I put my trust in God and NOT in man/Tharold.
God had called and chosen me for the ministry so, He will open the door for me. I prayed to God what I should do and in my dream One night, the Voice of God said to me, "Go to, Oregon." I left Washington State and offered for the work in Oregon to Howard M. in 1986. I told Howard what happened in Washington State with Tharold and he told me, "My boy, there is a place for you in the work here in Oregon."
I moved to Portland, Oregon and I started in the work 6 months later in 1986-93.
Then why are being so critical of Dennis when you know that he is telling the truth? Because there are only few of the workers are like Tharold S. but MOST of the Overseers and workers are NOT acting like him. Dennis J. CAN'T lump all workers are sycophants and the 2x2s is a CULT in the means way.
Some on here have called Dennis J. the drama queen.
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Post by nathan on Jan 13, 2019 10:24:23 GMT -5
I dealt with the overseers bullies myself, TWICE! and they almost RUINED my LIFE and health. Tharold S. gave me the green light to go in the work in 1984 and told me to go to Preps at Miltown. I quit my job, sold everything spoke in the last gospel meeting with the field workers. I went to preps and Tharold changed his mind and told the Senior worker at Preps my name is NOT on the Preps list.
I talked to Tharold S. to see what happened and he was sorry for the mixed up! He asked me to wait for another year. I went back to work at my old job with NOTHING! I waited 1 yrs and NO phone call from Tharold, and another 6 months no letter or phone call either.
These guys can be pains in the Butts and make your LIFE a living HELL and show no mercy about it, I put my trust in God and NOT in man/Tharold.
God had called and chosen me for the ministry so, He will open the door for me. I prayed to God what I should do and in my dream One night, the Voice of God said to me, "Go to, Oregon." I left Washington State and offered for the work in Oregon to Howard M. in 1986. I told Howard what happened in Washington State with Tharold and he told me, "My boy, there is a place for you in the work here in Oregon."
I moved to Portland, Oregon and I started in the work 6 months later in 1986-93.
Horrible ,for lives , to be used as pawns in some power brokers games. Horrible . All is well , until some play doesn’t pan out , and you , a human being , will be sacrificed with no recourse or defense. Not such nice playmates you playing with , Nathan , and although you kinda outfoxed them temporarily , the game obviously is not over . There are no winners , really , when it’s over . I observed a very good senior worker , play the same game , for years , lots of strategy plays back and forth , but hard to recognize anybody as a “winner” . Just lots of playing , with lots of cornering and defense and more moving pawns around the game . Most onlookers wouldn’t have a clue what’s really happening , and view the new workers lists , who is resting or going to be over there or moved here etc etc , and it’s just a conversation piece , not understanding , precious lives are being allowed to besacrificed , and used at mans behest and disposal . Not good Alvin Through my own personal experiences with them, and the experiences of others that I have read has helped me to understand God is in control over men and HE SEES and KNOWS all things. These bad experiences, tests, and trials are good for us to SHOW us what we are made of and God is trying to make us into the Image of Jesus to how we react to these experiences... learn how to forgive, be patience for God's timing, go extra mile in kindness, turn the other cheek and so on.Peter wrote in I Peter 1:3-7 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you, who by God's power are being guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. In this you rejoice, though now for a little while, if necessary, you have been grieved by various trials, so that the tested genuineness of your faith—more precious than gold that perishes though it is tested by fire—may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ.
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Post by slowtosee on Jan 13, 2019 10:31:05 GMT -5
Then why are being so critical of Dennis when you know that he is telling the truth? Because there are only few of the workers are like Tharold S. but MOST of the Overseers and workers are NOT acting like him. Dennis J. CAN'T lump all workers are sycophants and the 2x2s is a CULT in the means way.
Some on here have called Dennis J. the drama queen.
How to recognize a sycophant . Hmmmmmmmmm www.google.ca/amp/s/www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/sucking/201802/how-recognize-sycophant%3famp
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Post by nathan on Jan 13, 2019 10:35:27 GMT -5
The Sycophants are found in ALL walks of life, work places, entertainment/Hollywood, in most religions and including in your church NOT just the 2x2s.
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Post by slowtosee on Jan 13, 2019 10:46:02 GMT -5
HUMANS , anyhow . Lol
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Post by colleenpercy on Jan 13, 2019 10:55:39 GMT -5
The Sycophants are found in ALL walks of life, work places, entertainment/Hollywood, in most religions and including in your church NOT just the 2x2s.
Yes, but cults are almost 100% comprised of sycophants. And you are in a cult Nathan. A very sick cult.
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Post by colleenpercy on Jan 13, 2019 10:58:05 GMT -5
I wonder how people will feel about a convention at a fair grounds? Why should they feel anything? We have our special meetings in a auditorium we used to have them in a school hall, we feel no different about that. We go to hear Gods word the place has no bearing.
Why don't you go to hear the Gospel from people who actually have learned something about it, rather than untrained 2x2 'ministers'. Is it perhaps because you don't want to hear about God, you just want to hear about how special you are for being in this cult? ?
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Post by Get off of TMB on Jan 13, 2019 14:52:45 GMT -5
I never knew Uncle Tharold. He must have been pretty hard lined.
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Post by Get off of TMB on Jan 13, 2019 14:55:00 GMT -5
Tharold Sylvester, Eldon Tenniswood, Willis Propp, Paul Sharp and others ran a tight ship in the Pacific NW US/SW Canada during the 1970s, 80s and 1990s. In the internet age, overseers can't have the same influence today.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2019 14:56:50 GMT -5
I never knew Uncle Tharold. He must have been pretty hard lined. sylvester? he was a tough old bird for sure, blunt, straight forward, very smart.....if i remember correctly in my discussion with him he didn't believe in the 1000 year reign(could be wrong)....
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Post by Get off of TMB on Jan 13, 2019 15:01:27 GMT -5
You Tube comments: A beautiful place! I have been there many years, and there is nothing like the solitude and peacefulness when you come onto those grounds! We all will miss Apopka annually. So many positive things have happened to me there! 2 2 months ago (edited) Thanks, Aaron. Nicely done. 2 4140 Plymouth Sorrento Road! My first convention here was when I was just a baby,before my remembrance of it. I went here yearly throughout my childhood and school years----remember waiting tables in the dining tent, lunch with cookies, egg sandwiches, and so many goodies in the evenings between the shed and the dining tent. I will never forget some of the wonderful conversations that I had with some of the older ones while helping to peel potatoes and carrots and cut up broccoli for salads. The place changed my life for the better. One evening in the service, Randy S. was there and asked us if we really truly knew why we had been born. That cause a lot of introspection. What I wouldn't give to go there again! But there are similar places nearer to me now; it's just that I have this wave of nostalgia. 1 Looks like one of those dodgy cult places. 1 3 weeks ago It's not that bad. But they are a sect that keeps to itself. And their ministers run the show so to speak, excommunicating people that rock the boat. It started as a movement in the early 20th century. Why has the convention been discontinued? This looks like a bit of hardship for attendees at the new location. Imminent domain took the land to make an interchange for the new four-lane highway. www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDh1lNnyUFw&fbclid=IwAR3sENnu7DSzT-GaUU27GrPez1NL491YjN7c-k0xRBKvBwIIDdOq-Qtv8-Y
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Post by speak on Jan 13, 2019 19:41:52 GMT -5
Why should they feel anything? We have our special meetings in a auditorium we used to have them in a school hall, we feel no different about that. We go to hear Gods word the place has no bearing.
Why don't you go to hear the Gospel from people who actually have learned something about it, rather than untrained 2x2 'ministers'. Is it perhaps because you don't want to hear about God, you just want to hear about how special you are for being in this cult? ? Learned it from whom?
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Post by colleenpercy on Jan 14, 2019 1:55:34 GMT -5
Why don't you go to hear the Gospel from people who actually have learned something about it, rather than untrained 2x2 'ministers'. Is it perhaps because you don't want to hear about God, you just want to hear about how special you are for being in this cult? ? Learned it from whom?
Roman Catholic priests are trained in seminaries by older RCC theologians, who in turn were trained by old theologians, and so forth all the way back to the original apostles, and to Jesus. That's what the term 'apostolic succession' means. Visit the cathedral of Siena, where there are marble busts of all the popes in succession all the way back to Saint Peter.
Your 2x2 'ministers' have been trained by older 2x2s who in turn were trained by William Irvine - a certifiable nut who has no apostolic succession. What's even funnier is that your 2x2 'ministers' claim that they are the only true way that fits with the Bible yet it was the Roman Catholic Church which compiled the Bible, translated the Bible, copied the Bible by hand for 1500 years so that it would even be possible for it to exist today.
It's a complete joke that 2x2s even exist. I laugh out loud every time I think about them.
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Post by speak on Jan 14, 2019 2:09:47 GMT -5
Roman Catholic priests are trained in seminaries by older RCC theologians, who in turn were trained by old theologians, and so forth all the way back to the original apostles, and to Jesus. That's what the term 'apostolic succession' means. Visit the cathedral of Siena, where there are marble busts of all the popes in succession all the way back to Saint Peter.
Your 2x2 'ministers' have been trained by older 2x2s who in turn were trained by William Irvine - a certifiable nut who has no apostolic succession. What's even funnier is that your 2x2 'ministers' claim that they are the only true way that fits with the Bible yet it was the Roman Catholic Church which compiled the Bible, translated the Bible, copied the Bible by hand for 1500 years so that it would even be possible for it to exist today.
It's a complete joke that 2x2s even exist. I laugh out loud every time I think about them.
Don't you think Christ is still able to teach today? Laugh till your hearts content.
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Post by colleenpercy on Jan 14, 2019 2:44:51 GMT -5
Roman Catholic priests are trained in seminaries by older RCC theologians, who in turn were trained by old theologians, and so forth all the way back to the original apostles, and to Jesus. That's what the term 'apostolic succession' means. Visit the cathedral of Siena, where there are marble busts of all the popes in succession all the way back to Saint Peter.
Your 2x2 'ministers' have been trained by older 2x2s who in turn were trained by William Irvine - a certifiable nut who has no apostolic succession. What's even funnier is that your 2x2 'ministers' claim that they are the only true way that fits with the Bible yet it was the Roman Catholic Church which compiled the Bible, translated the Bible, copied the Bible by hand for 1500 years so that it would even be possible for it to exist today.
It's a complete joke that 2x2s even exist. I laugh out loud every time I think about them.
Don't you think Christ is still able to teach today? Laugh till your hearts content.
What did you learn from Christ directly? Very curious.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jan 14, 2019 3:24:57 GMT -5
Roman Catholic priests are trained in seminaries by older RCC theologians, who in turn were trained by old theologians, and so forth all the way back to the original apostles, and to Jesus. That's what the term 'apostolic succession' means. Visit the cathedral of Siena, where there are marble busts of all the popes in succession all the way back to Saint Peter.
Your 2x2 'ministers' have been trained by older 2x2s who in turn were trained by William Irvine - a certifiable nut who has no apostolic succession. What's even funnier is that your 2x2 'ministers' claim that they are the only true way that fits with the Bible yet it was the Roman Catholic Church which compiled the Bible, translated the Bible, copied the Bible by hand for 1500 years so that it would even be possible for it to exist today.
It's a complete joke that 2x2s even exist. I laugh out loud every time I think about them.
If you "laugh out loud every time I think about 2x2s" -why do you spend so much time denouncing them?
I believe that you ask someone on TMB if they were getting "paid" to post.
Are you?
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Post by snow on Jan 14, 2019 13:22:20 GMT -5
Don't you think Christ is still able to teach today? Laugh till your hearts content. What did you learn from Christ directly? Very curious.
When I was a Christian I learned that we should treat each other with respect and loving kindness. I learned that compassion was important. I learned that to judge others said more about me than them because we can't know what life is like for them. I learned that forgiveness was important, not for the person being forgiven, but for myself. When I studied Buddhism I saw that they believed a lot of the same things as Jesus taught. As an atheist I have taken those things and kept them as they seem to be what matters in life. Love is what matters. If you have that then you see manifestations of caring, kindness and compassion. Religions teach a lot of good things. So does the Golden Rule. These things are the good side of religions. The bad sides is the constant bickering over who is worshiping the right God the right way. That imo, divides and makes loving your neighbor a lot harder to do. For me it's not about belonging to the RCC or the 2x2, but how much these organizations teach the only thing that matters. Love.
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Post by speak on Jan 14, 2019 21:21:59 GMT -5
Don't you think Christ is still able to teach today? Laugh till your hearts content.
What did you learn from Christ directly? Very curious.
You don't know? Well now that is very curious. How about the Spirit of His Father? He doesn't laugh at His children and nor do His children laugh at His children and nor does He expect His children to laugh at anyone. Your spirit shows you don't love your neighbour but it shows contempt which is the spirit of the evil one.
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Post by speak on Jan 14, 2019 21:24:14 GMT -5
What did you learn from Christ directly? Very curious.
When I was a Christian I learned that we should treat each other with respect and loving kindness. I learned that compassion was important. I learned that to judge others said more about me than them because we can't know what life is like for them. I learned that forgiveness was important, not for the person being forgiven, but for myself. When I studied Buddhism I saw that they believed a lot of the same things as Jesus taught. As an atheist I have taken those things and kept them as they seem to be what matters in life. Love is what matters. If you have that then you see manifestations of caring, kindness and compassion. Religions teach a lot of good things. So does the Golden Rule. These things are the good side of religions. The bad sides is the constant bickering over who is worshiping the right God the right way. That imo, divides and makes loving your neighbor a lot harder to do. For me it's not about belonging to the RCC or the 2x2, but how much these organizations teach the only thing that matters. Love. That's very nice snow, thanks very much.
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Post by openingact34 on Jan 14, 2019 21:26:01 GMT -5
What did you learn from Christ directly? Very curious.
You don't know? Well now that is very curious. How about the Spirit of His Father? He doesn't laugh at His children and nor do His children laugh at His children and nor does He expect His children to laugh at anyone. Your spirit shows you don't love your neighbour but it shows contempt which is the spirit of the evil one. "I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your fear cometh; When your fear cometh as desolation, and your destruction cometh as a whirlwind; when distress and anguish cometh upon you." - Proverbs 1:26-7
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Post by speak on Jan 14, 2019 23:04:41 GMT -5
You don't know? Well now that is very curious. How about the Spirit of His Father? He doesn't laugh at His children and nor do His children laugh at His children and nor does He expect His children to laugh at anyone. Your spirit shows you don't love your neighbour but it shows contempt which is the spirit of the evil one. "I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your fear cometh; When your fear cometh as desolation, and your destruction cometh as a whirlwind; when distress and anguish cometh upon you." - Proverbs 1:26-7 That is not a teaching of Jesus.
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Post by Dennis J on Jan 17, 2019 14:15:07 GMT -5
For the record! Not once, not ever have I referred to workers as sycophants, only those who blindly follow them. Nor do I think of the entire group as a cult, rather the workers themselves as th cult portion. PLEASE PEOPLE! Do not let me nor anyone follow the example here of such a fallacy of logic! It is untrue, unjust, even vicious.
Falsely Restating what someone said, thinks and then attacking it has an informal fallacy of logic lable. Doesn’t everyone KNOW what it is, and how to recognize it? Watching it happen in this forum over and over raises serious question.
Never once have I faulted a homeless ministry by anyone willing to attempt to follow Yahu’shuah! It is the belief that those who do so are his only disciples to which I now object, that anyone else is inferior to them on one way or another simply cannot belong to our Lord’s teaching. Had the two and two ministry actually been what I had been taught to believe it was, likely I would still BE such a one!
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Post by Get off of TMB on Jan 17, 2019 18:00:47 GMT -5
Falsely Restating what someone said, thinks and then attacking it has an informal fallacy of logic label ***** Amen. I get it from 2 individuals on the Jump On Board all the time. They want to start stuff, misrepresent what you state and then label you or call you a name. I know the feeling. Certain topics can really get some worked up and they want to claim moral superiority by taking something out of context...so they can apply a label.
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