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Post by Gene on Dec 4, 2015 17:25:23 GMT -5
Yep, that's how I figure it. The probability of rolling the same number n times in a row is (1/6)^n for a six sided "fair die". Each roll is unaffected by the other rolls. A fair die has the same odds on each roll. However, no "perfectly fair die" has every been made. That's why god doesn't play dice. A "perfectly fair die" is usually generated by using a random source such as radioactive decay or atmospheric noise. In rethinking the idea that there have to be 'sacrificial' events in order to have events with a low probability happen it would mean that it would be impossible to to throw, for example, 3 '6's in a row. I thought about seeing if I could order a pair of those radioactive dice on Amazon along with a lead suit, but I thought better of it. I really don't need a Homeland Security S.W.A.T team storming my house. We have a noise ordinance in my neighborhood.
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Post by rational on Dec 5, 2015 0:37:12 GMT -5
A "perfectly fair die" is usually generated by using a random source such as radioactive decay or atmospheric noise. In rethinking the idea that there have to be 'sacrificial' events in order to have events with a low probability happen it would mean that it would be impossible to to throw, for example, 3 '6's in a row. I thought about seeing if I could order a pair of those radioactive dice on Amazon along with a lead suit, but I thought better of it. I really don't need a Homeland Security S.W.A.T team storming my house. We have a noise ordinance in my neighborhood. No problem Gene. The newest dice are made of californium-251 and have a mass of about 2.5 Kg. In this case it is very important that you follow the rules and roll each die individually and do not store them in close proximity of each other.
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Post by Lee on Dec 6, 2015 9:05:58 GMT -5
There is static probability and there is dynamic probability, the predictable outcome of multiple attempts over time. Chance describes certain experiential aspects of life. Providence is the purview of God.
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Post by rational on Dec 6, 2015 13:49:01 GMT -5
There is static probability and there is dynamic probability, the predictable outcome of multiple attempts over time. Chance describes certain experiential aspects of life. Providence is the purview of God. I think what you are hinting at is the fact that a single event has a fixed (static) probability. A table/equation that links the individual outcomes of a statistical experiment is the probability distribution. The graphical display was posted in a YouTube video.
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Post by Lee on Dec 8, 2015 10:55:35 GMT -5
According to evolution, everything owes its existence to everything that was. This is true for dead ends, because every dead end owes its existence to what preceded, and all was's can be traced back to a single 'was'.
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Post by rational on Dec 8, 2015 11:44:57 GMT -5
According to evolution, everything owes its existence to everything that was. This is true for dead ends, because every dead end owes its existence to what preceded, and all was's can be traced back to a single 'was'. This is simply not correct. What is owes its existence to the DNA that was passed down. The definition of a specie is a group of organisms that can exchange DNA - sexual reproduction. An on going species passes its DNA forward. Should there be a DNA change it is possible that a new species will develop and, if it is successful, it will pass DNA forward to future species. However, should a species become extinct there are no longer individuals with whom it can exchange DNA. Should Homo sapiens become extinct, the passing forward of DNA would cease. Whatever organisms might continur developing will not be using any DNA from Homo sapiens - none of the surviving organisms owe their existence to DNA from Homo sapiens. Tracing backwards is one thing but tracing forward is another. If you start at the tip of a branch of a tree you can follow it to the trunk/root. But if you start at thr root/trunk amd move upward and end up at a dead end you will never get to the tip of the tallest branch. Somethings only work in one direction. Like the old riddle: What can go up the chimney down but cannot go down the chimney up?
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Post by Lee on Dec 8, 2015 12:03:24 GMT -5
I think its obvious that 'what is' is a greater study than a dna progression
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Post by rational on Dec 8, 2015 12:41:41 GMT -5
I think its obvious that 'what is' is a greater study than a dna progression Not when you remember that the original topic of this discussion was your erroneous claim regarding evolution of organisms. Are you claiming that biological evolution happens without DNA being passed from generation to generation?
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Post by Lee on Dec 8, 2015 13:11:56 GMT -5
No, but biological evolution doesn't occur separately from ideological evolution. Ideological evolution would be the study of who we are as it relates to our predecessors.
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Post by rational on Dec 8, 2015 16:05:52 GMT -5
No, but biological evolution doesn't occur separately from ideological evolution. No, it doesn't. But the discussion and the comment you made were about the evolution of organisms and the traits they inherited.
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Post by Lee on Dec 9, 2015 11:37:18 GMT -5
I introduced the idea of evolution in connection with Judaeo-Christianity. I was primarily concerned with the ideological aspects of evolution.
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Post by rational on Dec 9, 2015 15:38:55 GMT -5
I introduced the idea of evolution in connection with Judaeo-Christianity. I was primarily concerned with the ideological aspects of evolution. I see. When you posted: Useful? According to evolution everything that is owes its existence to everything that was. The word 'existence' did not seem to point to the ideological aspects of evolution. Can you explain the relationship?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2015 2:09:34 GMT -5
Quote - "Watch the video of the balls. Forget the financial stuff he's talking about. Just notice that the balls have the greatest probability (predictably) to fall in the center, then a predictable less probability of falling in the outer columns. This is a great example of probability working perfectly and predictably over the long term, and upon many tries. This is what I've been trying to communicate."
This probability graph is largely credited for the rise of Japan as a manufacturing nation. If I recall from uni, a guy called Demings went to Japan in the 1950's and showed them how to use these bell-curves to monitor quality. "Made in Japan" meant "junk" till then - the rest, as USA Manufacturing soon found out - was History.
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Post by Lee on Dec 11, 2015 6:24:11 GMT -5
"The word 'existence' did not seem to point to the ideological aspects of evolution. Can you explain the relationship?"
Do you think there isn't one?
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Post by rational on Dec 11, 2015 8:09:57 GMT -5
"The word 'existence' did not seem to point to the ideological aspects of evolution. Can you explain the relationship?" Do you think there isn't one? You would have to make the case showing how the ideological aspects of evolution relate to the evolution of bacteria.
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Post by Lee on Dec 11, 2015 21:10:25 GMT -5
Why?
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Post by rational on Dec 11, 2015 23:18:10 GMT -5
Because what you have claimed does not ring true.
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Post by Lee on Dec 12, 2015 21:47:53 GMT -5
What doesn't ring true?
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Post by rational on Dec 13, 2015 0:25:26 GMT -5
Your statement: No, but biological evolution doesn't occur separately from ideological evolution. How would that apply to the evolution of, for example, Planaria torva.
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Post by Lee on Dec 15, 2015 22:45:49 GMT -5
With regard to the influence of ideology, how is the evolution of Planaria torva similar to the evolution of Homo sapiens?
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Post by rational on Dec 16, 2015 21:50:38 GMT -5
With regard to the influence of ideology, how is the evolution of Planaria torva similar to the evolution of Homo sapiens? As much as you would like to bring in ideology I don't think the planaria were concerned or influenced in any way. Humans and planaria replicate via sexual reproduction. As such, it enhances the survival of the species by increasing the level of genetic diversity. Biological evolution is much the same for all living things.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 16, 2015 23:30:09 GMT -5
With regard to the influence of ideology, how is the evolution of Planaria torva similar to the evolution of Homo sapiens? Lee, do you think that a Planaria torva has the ability to form an ideology?
definition of ideology: a system of ideas and ideals, especially one that forms the basis of economic or political theory and policy. the "beliefs, ideas, ideals, principles, ethics, morals; a doctrine, creed, credo, faith, teaching, theory, philosophy; tenets, canon(s);conviction(s), persuasion Do you think that a group of Planaria torva have the ability to form the ideas and manner of thinking characteristic of a group, social class, or individual.
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Post by Lee on Dec 17, 2015 11:34:38 GMT -5
I thought ideology might have an affect on the evolution of homo sapiens. Maybe not
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Post by Lee on Dec 17, 2015 11:37:04 GMT -5
"Humans and planaria replicate via sexual reproduction. As such, it enhances the survival of the species by increasing the level of genetic diversity. Biological evolution is much the same for all living things."
You get too diverse and you lose your species, it evolves on to something else. There is no preservation of any species within the theory of evolution, per se.
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Post by rational on Dec 17, 2015 12:30:50 GMT -5
"Humans and planaria replicate via sexual reproduction. As such, it enhances the survival of the species by increasing the level of genetic diversity. Biological evolution is much the same for all living things." You get too diverse and you lose your species, it evolves on to something else. There is no preservation of any species within the theory of evolution, per se. Odd you would think that. Sometimes evolution does not produce a new species but but individuals with inheritable traits. Sometimes that are good and sometimes they are bad. It is generally thought that hemophilia is not a desired trait but some have evolved to carry it. Polydactyly is a genetic trait that has been present in humans throughout history. In Spain there is a small village where a large number of people are polydactyl.
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Post by Gene on Dec 17, 2015 19:11:45 GMT -5
"Humans and planaria replicate via sexual reproduction. As such, it enhances the survival of the species by increasing the level of genetic diversity. Biological evolution is much the same for all living things." You get too diverse and you lose your species, it evolves on to something else. There is no preservation of any species within the theory of evolution, per se. Odd you would think that. Sometimes evolution does not produce a new species but but individuals with inheritable traits. Sometimes that are good and sometimes they are bad. It is generally thought that hemophilia is not a desired trait but some have evolved to carry it. Polydactyly is a genetic trait that has been present in humans throughout history. In Spain there is a small village where a large number of people are polydactyl. If they had more Republicans in that community, they would make polydactyly illegal in the interest of promoting family values and the traditional family.
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Post by Lee on Dec 17, 2015 22:20:12 GMT -5
Which republicans? Some aren't "progressive" like you're supposing. Does that make them bad evolutionists? Guess so.
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Post by Lee on Dec 17, 2015 22:32:58 GMT -5
Obviously ideology has always impacted the evolution of the human race, today more than ever.
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