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Post by Roselyn T on Oct 1, 2015 3:00:44 GMT -5
Still waiting for an answer I see bluejay ! Don't hold your breath !!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2015 7:54:24 GMT -5
Bert -- why didn't you ask what the definition of Christian is? How should we know how to answer your question about the pope if you don't know what you're looking for. Your question is as clear to us as this question would be to you: Do you think my next door neighbor is a Catholic? Exactly Bob. I was interested to see if Bert would answer that question. I thought that was a reasonable request, since he started this thread. Excellent point - we need a new thread "What is a Christian?" I posed this question in part to challenge people to ask the question of Christianity, not to inquire of the Pope.
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Post by Scott Ross on Oct 1, 2015 9:50:28 GMT -5
Still didn't answer did ya....
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Post by rational on Oct 1, 2015 11:52:36 GMT -5
BTW -- the Pope did not omit reference to Jesus -- in fact, many people thought he overused it. Oh, you and your facts!
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Post by rational on Oct 1, 2015 12:03:58 GMT -5
You need to define "Christian" and take it from there. Bert -- why didn't you ask what the definition of Christian is? How should we know how to answer your question about the pope if you don't know what you're looking for. Your question is as clear to us as this question would be to you: Do you think my next door neighbor is a Catholic? The problem that has come up in previous discussions is that when you mention that the record shows that a christian has said/done something the answer is that a real christian would not say/do that. The definition of a christian seems to vary depending on the requirements of the person proffering the definition.
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Post by christiansburg on Oct 1, 2015 12:06:08 GMT -5
What do you think Bert? Is the Pope a Christian? If you go back and look at the Catholic doctrine it is possible you can find some false doctrine there. So if the pope espouses that I wonder if he is a false prophet?? He may be a Christian but that doesn't mean much if your prophecy is based on false doctrine. So I wonder if that would classify the Pope as a false prophet. When you read through the Old Testament you see that the Jewish people were warned about false prophets among them even though they might be Jewish.
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Post by withlove on Oct 1, 2015 16:31:02 GMT -5
My feeling is that many leaders of corrupt entities, whether government, business, religious, or other, can be pawns dressed as figureheads. Or equals among peers, but unable to get out. How they get to power, and how much they know about the very inner workings before they get there, and their innocence and beliefs is hard to know.
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 1, 2015 20:22:31 GMT -5
Bert -- why didn't you ask what the definition of Christian is? How should we know how to answer your question about the pope if you don't know what you're looking for. Your question is as clear to us as this question would be to you: Do you think my next door neighbor is a Catholic? Exactly Bob. I was interested to see if Bert would answer that question. I thought that was a reasonable request, since he started this thread. It's a tactic used by people who are fishing for something to be critical of.
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 1, 2015 20:25:30 GMT -5
Bert -- why didn't you ask what the definition of Christian is? How should we know how to answer your question about the pope if you don't know what you're looking for. Your question is as clear to us as this question would be to you: Do you think my next door neighbor is a Catholic? The problem that has come up in previous discussions is that when you mention that the record shows that a christian has said/done something the answer is that a real christian would not say/do that. The definition of a christian seems to vary depending on the requirements of the person proffering the definition. Well, we do know now that the Apostolic Christian Church is in communion with the Roman Catholic church.
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Post by dmmichgood on Oct 1, 2015 22:14:12 GMT -5
Re Pope and gun manufacture. Can't comment on this, but... Obama is, ostensibly, a man of peace. So he withdrew all forces from Iraq in some haste - and that country fell apart.
He didn't get involved in Syria - and that country is torn apart and millions flooding into Europe.
He made it clear that America won't get involved in the Ukraine - and this encouraged Russia to expand.
So, maybe three cheers for war and guns? The fact that Obama withdrew all forces from Iraq is NOT the reason that country fell apart.
It is because Obama's predecessor, W. Bush attacked Iraq to start with without provocation from that country. Bush's reason was based on a lie and W. Bush knew it was false information
What Obama has made clear is that the US can't always solve other countries interior problems with intervention from the outside by sending in armed troops.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2015 22:26:07 GMT -5
Iraq was one country when Bush left office, and it will be three countries when Obama leaves office.
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 1, 2015 23:16:24 GMT -5
Iraq was one country when Bush left office, and it will be three countries when Obama leaves office. Sounds like a good plan to me. Should have happened long long ago.
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Post by dmmichgood on Oct 2, 2015 3:30:06 GMT -5
Iraq was one country when Bush left office, and it will be three countries when Obama leaves office. Obama didn't have anything to do with it now being three countries.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2015 17:17:21 GMT -5
Iraq was one country when Bush left office, and it will be three countries when Obama leaves office. Obama didn't have anything to do with it now being three countries.
the minute our troops left it descended into chaos i'd say that he had a partial hand in it...
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Post by snow on Oct 2, 2015 18:41:55 GMT -5
Iraq was one country when Bush left office, and it will be three countries when Obama leaves office. Sometimes countries need to come to some solutions by themselves without outside help. When someone else just imposes their rules on them it's not their choice so it's basically meaningless if the country imposing the rules pulls out. There needs to be solutions the people of that country come to themselves and are more able to make work because they understand the underlying dynamics better than an outside source. The States just can't win. People complain if they 'interfere' and then when they decide to stay out of it people complain that they aren't helping. The Middle East needs to solve their own problems because no one that isn't part of that culture understands the dynamics of their culture. Solutions need to come from within and the rest of the world needs to let them. Our interference hasn't helped so maybe it's time to try something else? That's how I see it anyway.
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Post by Gene on Oct 2, 2015 19:09:25 GMT -5
No I didn't watch his speech. I would no more watch his speech to Congress than watch Congress itself. After all, there's no difference - just political posturing. The only difference is that ** most ** Congressmen don't claim their politics is in God's name.
Do you watch the Queen's xmas message? I always watch the Queen's xmas message. It's comforting, grounding, respectful, encouraging.
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Post by rational on Oct 3, 2015 0:40:55 GMT -5
No I didn't watch his speech. I would no more watch his speech to Congress than watch Congress itself. After all, there's no difference - just political posturing. The only difference is that ** most ** Congressmen don't claim their politics is in God's name.
Do you watch the Queen's xmas message? I always watch the Queen's xmas message. It's comforting, grounding, respectful, encouraging. You do know the queen this is referring to is Queen Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God Queen of this Realm and of Her other Realms and Territories, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith, don't you?
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 3, 2015 0:53:11 GMT -5
Obama didn't have anything to do with it now being three countries.
the minute our troops left it descended into chaos i'd say that he had a partial hand in it... They were never one nation to begin with. Their colonists drew the borders for them and they've been expected to play like family ever since.
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 3, 2015 0:54:45 GMT -5
I always watch the Queen's xmas message. It's comforting, grounding, respectful, encouraging. You do know the queen this is referring to is Queen Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God Queen of this Realm and of Her other Realms and Territories, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith, don't you? And "Queen of Canada" too.
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Post by dmmichgood on Oct 3, 2015 1:10:44 GMT -5
Obama didn't have anything to do with it now being three countries. the minute our troops left it descended into chaos i'd say that he had a partial hand in it... Do you think that "our" troops should have stayed there forever policing Iraq?
We shouldn't have had our troops there to begin with. Bush took the US into that war by telling the US that the Iraqi's were close to developing a nuclear bomb.
It was not true & he knew that! Bush even snookered Colin Powell into making that statement at the UN.
When the US troops got into Iraq, there were NO enriched uranium facilities found!US intelligence knew there wasn't any evidence of enriched uranium facilities & had fully informed Bush, -but he went ahead with the invasion anyway!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2015 14:25:23 GMT -5
the minute our troops left it descended into chaos i'd say that he had a partial hand in it... Do you think that "our" troops should have stayed there forever policing Iraq?
We shouldn't have had our troops there to begin with. Bush took the US into that war by telling the US that the Iraqi's were close to developing a nuclear bomb.
It was not true & he knew that! Bush even snookered Colin Powell into making that statement at the UN.
When the US troops got into Iraq, there were NO enriched uranium facilities found!US intelligence knew there wasn't any evidence of enriched uranium facilities & had fully informed Bush, -but he went ahead with the invasion anyway!
well we were in germany and japan keeping the peace and we've had to maintain the border of s. korea for longer...
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Post by SharonArnold on Oct 3, 2015 14:29:23 GMT -5
I always watch the Queen's xmas message. It's comforting, grounding, respectful, encouraging. You do know the queen this is referring to is Queen Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God Queen of this Realm and of Her other Realms and Territories, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith, don't you? Yeah, but I don't think she takes the "Defender of the Faith" stuff all that seriously either.
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Post by Grant on Oct 3, 2015 14:41:13 GMT -5
I'm wouldn't know her mind. Couldn't judge a person's heart without knowing more of her private thoughts and life which few of us would.
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Post by SharonArnold on Oct 3, 2015 14:43:36 GMT -5
I'm wouldn't know her mind. Couldn't judge a person's heart without knowing more of her private thoughts and life which few of us would. That is true. Nor would we know how she personally interprets the "Defender of the faith" stuff. But she has shown a remarkable degree of respect towards other cultures during her reign.
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 3, 2015 23:53:12 GMT -5
Do you think that "our" troops should have stayed there forever policing Iraq?
We shouldn't have had our troops there to begin with. Bush took the US into that war by telling the US that the Iraqi's were close to developing a nuclear bomb.
It was not true & he knew that! Bush even snookered Colin Powell into making that statement at the UN.
When the US troops got into Iraq, there were NO enriched uranium facilities found!US intelligence knew there wasn't any evidence of enriched uranium facilities & had fully informed Bush, -but he went ahead with the invasion anyway!
well we were in germany and japan keeping the peace and we've had to maintain the border of s. korea for longer... Using that reasoning you can also claim that the US is keeping the peace in Canada and Australia.
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Post by BobWilliston on Oct 3, 2015 23:54:01 GMT -5
You do know the queen this is referring to is Queen Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God Queen of this Realm and of Her other Realms and Territories, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith, don't you? Yeah, but I don't think she takes the "Defender of the Faith" stuff all that seriously either. Well, she is the head of the Anglican church.
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Post by fixit on Oct 4, 2015 0:22:38 GMT -5
well we were in germany and japan keeping the peace and we've had to maintain the border of s. korea for longer... Using that reasoning you can also claim that the US is keeping the peace in Canada and Australia. Australia and New Zealand would have been Japanese colonies without US support.
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Post by fixit on Oct 4, 2015 0:55:20 GMT -5
Iraq was one country when Bush left office, and it will be three countries when Obama leaves office. Sometimes countries need to come to some solutions by themselves without outside help. When someone else just imposes their rules on them it's not their choice so it's basically meaningless if the country imposing the rules pulls out. There needs to be solutions the people of that country come to themselves and are more able to make work because they understand the underlying dynamics better than an outside source. The States just can't win. People complain if they 'interfere' and then when they decide to stay out of it people complain that they aren't helping. The Middle East needs to solve their own problems because no one that isn't part of that culture understands the dynamics of their culture. Solutions need to come from within and the rest of the world needs to let them. Our interference hasn't helped so maybe it's time to try something else? That's how I see it anyway. Obama tried something else in Syria. With a quarter million dead, twelve million refugees, and enormous damage to the country's infrastructure, his Syria policy can hardly be considered a resounding success.
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