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Post by fixit on Nov 21, 2024 11:41:45 GMT -5
I have heard two sermons recorded in Australia at Conventions there. Both were very much in line with encouraging people to worship the Ministry. One equated Moses and Elijah to being workers. And in another Jesus being a worker. The Takeaway is that said often enough, people start to see workers as being on the same level. And terms like Paul professed, is the icing on that cake. Idolatry and sexual immorality went together in bible days so we shouldn't be surprised that they go together in our time. Was there any sign of sackcloth and ashes? |
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Post by Pragmatic on Nov 21, 2024 14:24:30 GMT -5
I have heard two sermons recorded in Australia at Conventions there. Both were very much in line with encouraging people to worship the Ministry. One equated Moses and Elijah to being workers. And in another Jesus being a worker. The Takeaway is that said often enough, people start to see workers as being on the same level. And terms like Paul professed, is the icing on that cake. Idolatry and sexual immorality went together in bible days so we shouldn't be surprised that they go together in our time. Was there any sign of sackcloth and ashes? No.....but our own Maree Donaldson did preach about Unforgiveness being an unforgivable sin!
This seems to be a common line now in order to brainwash the laity into not pressing charges against offenders. Conventions in the US and now here seem to be following suit with this theme.
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Post by fixit on Nov 21, 2024 16:18:24 GMT -5
Idolatry and sexual immorality went together in bible days so we shouldn't be surprised that they go together in our time. Was there any sign of sackcloth and ashes? No.....but our own Maree Donaldson did preach about Unforgiveness being an unforgivable sin! This seems to be a common line now in order to brainwash the laity into not pressing charges against offenders. Conventions in the US and now here seem to be following suit with this theme.
Perhaps she doesn't realise that misplaced forgiveness doctrine has caused a lot of damage to our faith community. |
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Nov 21, 2024 16:41:07 GMT -5
No.....but our own Maree Donaldson did preach about Unforgiveness being an unforgivable sin! This seems to be a common line now in order to brainwash the laity into not pressing charges against offenders. Conventions in the US and now here seem to be following suit with this theme.
Perhaps she doesn't realise that misplaced forgiveness doctrine has caused a lot of damage to our faith community. The requirement to forgive has been preached so that the "good reputation" of "The Truth" can be maintained. That has lead to the current situation where rapists feel they can act with inpunity. It must be an awful shock to Bill Easton to find he is not above the law. It is probably quite a shock to others such as Alan Richardson and John Watts to name just two who thought that protecting the offender and therefore the "good reputation" was more important than believing a victim and acting in a lawful and upright manner. We know that William Irvine, the founder of this cult had trouser zip issues and many others as well. It would appear that it has never had a good reputation. |
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Post by Pragmatic on Nov 21, 2024 16:54:23 GMT -5
Perhaps she doesn't realise that misplaced forgiveness doctrine has caused a lot of damage to our faith community. The requirement to forgive has been preached so that the "good reputation" of "The Truth" can be maintained. That has lead to the current situation where rapists feel they can act with inpunity. It must be an awful shock to Bill Easton to find he is not above the law. It is probably quite a shock to others such as Alan Richardson and John Watts to name just two who thought that protecting the offender and therefore the "good reputation" was more important than believing a victim and acting in a lawful and upright manner. We know that William Irvine, the founder of this cult had trouser zip issues and many others as well. It would appear that it has never had a good reputation. For the benefit of Admin/Moderators:
Bill Easton is due for sentencing this month, and is named publicly. There is no name suppression, and the case has had wide publicity in the mainstream media.
The activities of JW in the area have been such that many friends have boycotted his missions as a result. He was booted out of the home of a victim's parent because of his attitude, and this is widely known among the Friends in that area.
I do not know enough about AR's conduct, except to say that my impression was that he listened to the loudest voices. He did stand someone down in our area, but was also known to have told one victim that "We'd rather you didn't", in response to the question of laying charges. (Told to me by the victim)
In 1915 I think it was, the workers here in NZ were so afraid that one or more of the sister workers could be pregnant after Irvine's visit here, that they held them back from going out into their respective fields. The lie was put out that it was a test to see if Sister workers were doctrinally correct.
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Post by BobWilliston on Nov 21, 2024 18:08:10 GMT -5
The requirement to forgive has been preached so that the "good reputation" of "The Truth" can be maintained. That has lead to the current situation where rapists feel they can act with inpunity. It must be an awful shock to Bill Easton to find he is not above the law. It is probably quite a shock to others such as Alan Richardson and John Watts to name just two who thought that protecting the offender and therefore the "good reputation" was more important than believing a victim and acting in a lawful and upright manner. We know that William Irvine, the founder of this cult had trouser zip issues and many others as well. It would appear that it has never had a good reputation. For the benefit of Admin/Moderators: Bill Easton is due for sentencing this month, and is named publicly. There is no name suppression, and the case has had wide publicity in the mainstream media.
The activities of JW in the area have been such that many friends have boycotted his missions as a result. He was booted out of the home of a victim's parent because of his attitude, and this is widely known among the Friends in that area.
I do not know enough about AR's conduct, except to say that my impression was that he listened to the loudest voices. He did stand someone down in our area, but was also known to have told one victim that "We'd rather you didn't", in response to the question of laying charges. (Told to me by the victim) In 2015, the workers here in NZ were so afraid that one or more of the sister workers could be pregnant after Irvine's visit here, that they held them back from going out into their respective fields. The lie was put out that it was a test to see if Sister workers were doctrinally correct.
The fine art of bul1$hitting. |
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Post by BobWilliston on Nov 21, 2024 18:29:49 GMT -5
In 2015, the workers here in NZ were so afraid that one or more of the sister workers could be pregnant after Irvine's visit here, that they held them back from going out into their respective fields. The lie was put out that it was a test to see if Sister workers were doctrinally correct. Just need to check - was that 1915 or 2015? |
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Post by Pragmatic on Nov 21, 2024 19:59:55 GMT -5
Woops, typo - was in a hurry to get to a meeting (an ordinary business meeting)
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Post by BobWilliston on Nov 21, 2024 21:05:25 GMT -5
Woops, typo - was in a hurry to get to a meeting (an ordinary business meeting) Cool!!! |
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Post by Pragmatic on Nov 21, 2024 21:38:42 GMT -5
I'll need to check, but it was certainly around that 1915 time....I had known about for about 20 years. I understand, that it is made it into Cherie Kropp's book too.
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Post by Pragmatic on Nov 21, 2024 21:43:49 GMT -5
I found this on tellingthetruth.info
The Scandal possibly concerned William Irvine's attendance at the New Zealand convention in 1912. Whereas the 1912 Workers list included ten Sister Workers, the 1913 List had none. It seems the Brother Workers had become concerned that women preaching was not scriptural. They had, therefore, decided to continue the Work in New Zealand without the Sister Workers.
Rumor had it that after the convention, all the Sister Workers were sent away until they determined if any were pregnant. The author found no evidence any of them produced a child. Since the Brother Workers' missions produced no converts that year, they recalled the Sister Workers; the following year, 1914, six Sister Workers' names were on the Workers List.
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Post by Admin on Nov 21, 2024 22:56:32 GMT -5
In 2015, the workers here in NZ were so afraid that one or more of the sister workers could be pregnant after Irvine's visit here, that they held them back from going out into their respective fields. The lie was put out that it was a test to see if Sister workers were doctrinally correct. Just need to check - was that 1915 or 2015? Phew, for a moment I wondered had WI been reincarnated - maybe to wander again the streets of Jerusalem  I see Pragmatic has found the correct diary! |
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Post by BobWilliston on Nov 21, 2024 23:08:38 GMT -5
Just need to check - was that 1915 or 2015? Phew, for a moment I wondered had WI been reincarnated - maybe to wander again the streets of Jerusalem I see Pragmatic has found the correct diary! Some people have reported being visited by ghosts late at night. |
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Post by Pragmatic on Nov 24, 2024 2:41:33 GMT -5
It was 1912 that Irvine turned up, and then in 1913, no sister workers went out.
In 1910 there were 10 sister workers. In 1913 there were none. In 1914 there were 7, including the wife of the overseer, Wilson McClung.
I quote from Cherie Kropp's book:
The Scandal possibly concerned William Irvine's attendance at the New Zealand convention in 1912. Whereas the 1912 Workers list included ten Sister Workers, the 1913 List had none. It seems the Brother Workers had become concerned that women preaching was not scriptural. They had, therefore, decided to continue the Work in New Zealand without the Sister Workers.
Rumor had it that after the convention, all the Sister Workers were sent away until they determined if any were pregnant. The author found no evidence any of them produced a child. Since the Brother Workers' missions produced no converts that year, they recalled the Sister Workers; the following year, 1914, six Sister Workers' names were on the Workers List.
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