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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 14:38:51 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by 1chinesewhispers on Mar 30, 2023 14:38:51 GMT -5
New letter
Site logo image Wings for Truth Lyle Shober letter to Texas friends March 2023
wingsfortruth2 Mar 30 March 28. 2023
Dear Friends.
It is with a heavy heart that we share with you the disheartening news concerning our coworker, Dean Bruer. He has been accused of living an immoral double life, and there seems to be ample evidence to support these claims. Dean has never labored in our state, but he was a member of our ministry, therefore his error affects each of us in this ministry. In our current generation of social media, we are sure that most of you are already aware of this issue.
The integrity of our ministry is called into question when one amongst us betrays the holy trust shown to us by our friends. Our purpose as Christians and as messengers sent with the gospel, is to manifest our belief by our life and behavior among all people.
One part of the armor of God is to have our feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace. This indicates that the influence of our life testifies of the peace we have because of the gospel we have accepted. It is meant to be a living sermon of invitation to others who are searching for peace. When a messenger of the gospel betrays that testimony, the repercussions are felt throughout the fellowship.
It is with reverent godly fear that we apologize for this misconduct. We hope and pray to be worthy of the trust you have shown to us in the ministry.
We believe in boundaries. The Lord promised us a hundred-fold of homes, family, and children. However, it is with the awareness that these things are given to us for the gospel's sake. What we receive is given to us because of the message we carry, and we carry that message with professional responsibility.
We purpose to maintain professional boundaries while in your homes and with your children. We ask that you help us with this. Please teach your children cues for avoiding questionable behavior. Children do not have the maturity to understand the complexity of human behavior, but they can be taught simple cues for safety.
For example:
1. Do not be alone in a bedroom with an adult other than a parent or assigned caretaker 2. How to appropriately embrace an adult 3. Topics of conversation that are inappropriate.
It grieves our heart to have to say these things, but if we work together, we can facilitate a safe environment that will promote a spiritual fellowship that edifies faith.
As members of this ministry, we want to assure you of how much we love and care for you. We are heartbroken by the disgrace of human failure, but our faith in the Lord's ministry is unchanged. This is the ministry that our Lord established in the earth. Human failure can compromise its testimony, but it cannot undermine its validity. Judas Iscariot was also a part of this ministry, but in the wake of his betrayal the Holy Spirit still impelled this same ministry forward.
We want to assure you that we will do what we can to assist those who are victims of this abuse. We encourage you to visit with the workers in your field or with us if you have concerns or questions. We will be confidential in-as-much as we can. It is our legal responsibility in the case of underage victims to report abuse to the proper authorities. We understand that this is a very difficult journey for everyone. We remind all that by bringing to light this horrible behavior, we may be saving others from being victims of the same abuse.
As workers in Texas and New Mexico we have taken, and continue to take, instruction from a course recognized by the state of Texas regarding proper boundaries with minors. We have also asked our staff to read the book "Boundaries." We are also looking into other materials about the eradication of abuse and steps that can be taken to defend from and detect inappropriate behavior.
We are reminded of the statement of Paul in 2 Timothy 2:19 "Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal. The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let everyone that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity."
Your brothers in Christ,
Lyle Schober and Westin Price
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Post by snow on Mar 30, 2023 14:47:21 GMT -5
I feel such compassion for those who were in his family and those who left glowing remarks on his memorial page. How they must feel now that this has been revealed to them. Such a shock to their initial feelings and beliefs about the man. Those close to him that really did not see what he was doing must also feel a lot of self chastisement for 'not seeing it'. It's human nature to blame ourselves for being betrayed and not seeing something we feel should have been obvious. So anyone that didn't see it and feels they should have, be kind to yourself. These people are very good at what they do. Especially when they can cover it up for as many decades as he did. I also feel so much compassion for those that were his victims that never said anything. They are probably blaming themselves for not speaking out and maybe stopping him earlier. You are not to blame. Do not take this on. Sexual assault is one of the most traumatizing things anyone can have happen to them. I know because I was a survivor of rape at 17 and never reported it or talked about it for years. I was ashamed, scared and I felt I must have done something wrong to have brought this onto myself. I have had therapy and I now understand better how that is a very common place we go when we've been abused. Please do not blame yourself and if you can talk to someone to process the harm done to you, please reach out to those you trust. One of the things that makes it so much easier for sexual assault to happen in these kinds of groups is because from a very young child we were taught that the workers were always right. At least that was how I was raised in the 50's and 60's. It might not be so much that way in the last few decades so I can't speak to that. But I'm sure there is still a very high level of respect for the workers that makes us trust them. When that trust is broken it's hard to handle it and there is a fear that we might be not believed. Unfortunately, I have read about many who were abused that did not get believed and were told to forgive and pray. I sincerely hope this last example of what is possible behavior of a worker, a person of higher responsibility like an elder etc. will cause the group to rethink how to reform some of the practices that makes it so easy for predators to get away with this in the group. My heartfelt hope is that this latest betrayal will bring needed changes so that those who love the format of the church in the home, conventions etc. can feel safer. Awareness is always a good thing and not believing in hero worship will help people be more alert to what can happen. Thanks Snow. New here and my registration to this site collides with the “Dean” news. The two workers in our OR field met first with the elders early last week then our workers read The Letter aloud with all later in the week in several separate small group meetings. I appreciated that format as it gave everyone ample time to share their immediate feelings; nothing was rushed. There was a lot of tears and for a while we all sat in stunned silence with the only sounds being the occasional sob. The array of inner emotions I feel are broad: betrayal, anger, disappointment, disgust, hurt, etc. Overwhelmingly what was expressed by each was deep compassion and concern for the victims and disgust with Deans actions. We were all very emotional and upset. My wife became a victim in her early teens some 50 years ago. (Not worker or friend, wasn’t raised ‘fessing) So we’ve been especially moved by these revelations. Because of her CSA experience we have always been extremely careful not to let our children do sleep overs or be alone with any workers or any friends in/out of the fellowship. My wife and I are also very careful not to put ourselves in any potentially compromising situations. The workers & friends we have had around were equally careful and respectful in this manner. My wife and I have always been of the mind that we would report CSA to law enforcement first and if necessary, mention it to the workers later. People need to be held accountable for these horrific crimes; I don’t care who they are. CSA isn’t something that a victim just “deals with”. You don’t “just get over it”. It’s more like sort out-block out-manage -overcome - REPEAT. Therapy is a tremendous help. Finally, I have only speculation of the “who knew what, when and how much” aspects of this tragedy but I’m confident that the authorities will drill down and separate the facts from speculation. I’m comforted that God see’s us in our need and will deal with us as dear children. My feelings of compassion for the many victims are immense and I hope they receive the comfort, love, and support they need. And they need justice. Welcome to TMB bigtrax. I'm sorry it coincides with the Dean Bruer news. It sounds as though you are well aware and have known to take reasonable precautions and that is a good thing. It was possible because you were aware and that's part of the problem in the Truth. The friends weren't made aware it could happen and workers are in a position of trust so it's not expected from them. That makes it so that they might not have reasonable precautions with them like they might have with the outside world. I was SA when I was 17 but not by anyone professing. I was 'touched' by an elder when I was around 14 while swimming so I was aware as a teenager that it could happen and being aware is a step towards being able to protect yourself by not being in compromising situations if it can be helped. You are so right that being sexually assaulted is not something you 'just get over'. I had to be in therapy when I was younger and while I am a lot better, I will never be 'right'. I am triggered by this and I am 67 years old. Long time since I was 17. Like you I hope that this finally drives home the need for absolute transparency between the workers and the friends. Not talking about it just makes it easier to happen over and over. I can only hope that all of those that have suffered CSA and SA find a way to talk to someone, be in therapy (it does help), and with a more transparent environment finally feel safer in the Friends and Workers group. I know many people have left because of how things were handled before. I imagine that many more will now do the same thing. That is sad if they truly love to be in the church system of meetings in the home. With changes it can be as safe as anywhere is these days. There is no way to eliminate it completely as abusers are very good at hiding. But things like background checks, training the workers to recognize warning signs etc. will help not only make it safer, but also restore some of the trust that is now very challenged. If the friends know the workers are doing everything they can to keep them safer that will build bridges.
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
Posts: 662
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Post by peggysullivan on Mar 30, 2023 15:24:56 GMT -5
At no point did I call you unhinged Vinny . You do whatever you do and I will proceed with my doctors and counseling sessions . I would NEVER speak down to anyone that way . As you have read I am fully aware of unhinged . As in my husband who took his life at a very young age . I raised my girls with the support of my parents . At no point did I call my husband unhinged . Psychiatric disorders are all different , I learnt as best as I could to help him . I will move forward with my mandatory reporting and the last night I spoke to my husband I was expecting a grocery list . Which I would buy and he would pick it up from my dad . I had heard the phrase ,this is the last time you will speak with me , it’s forever in my head , This is going to be the last I engage with you !. So I went about my evening and police knocked on my door at 3:28 AM . Here is a little more information . In 2021 I was put in a seniors abuse shelter . . I had been sexually assaulted by a man . Live it , learn it and above all BE KIND ! Until you walk our paths . Go for it , whatever it is you are doing and hopefully it will help the victims !!!!! Battery on one with mental health is not very nice . I will stick with psychologists and psychiatric doctors and the effects . it not right professing or not to utter such words . That is a 30 second glimpse of my life . Not sure if you could endure so much trauma . So I have shared some facts and I am done sharing people who don’t understand mental health issues or unwilling to learn that some are born with those conditions . They just wanna pounce ! When we conduct safe dosing sites for addicts we never call them unhinged . We are there to prevent them from dying . Not to pass judgment ! Thanks for bringing up you were in a senior abuse center. Seniors can be abused too and society either is not very aware of that or they forget! The elderly are vulnerable and can easily be taken advantage of and many are naive and easily manipulated. They have suffered all kinds of abuse and many are unable to defend themselves. Too many people in this world everywhere just look the other way. Many of us are technically mandated reporters…. But shouldn’t we all as a civilized people have the mindset of being a mandated reporter on behalf of others who are vulnerable or feel powerless…. Whether that be a neighbor, a co-worker, a friend or associate… we are supposed to care for all… that is what the Bible teaches and “God’s people” should lead the way. So, the more these are brought to the authorities rather than the workers the better. The only way to root this out is via exposure, I’m afraid. The quiet secret way of dealing with it has simply failed. I’m sorry for what you have endured and glad you are under good treatment. Hang in there one day at a time.
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Post by jennyfromtheblock on Mar 30, 2023 15:31:25 GMT -5
At no point did I call you unhinged Vinny . You do whatever you do and I will proceed with my doctors and counseling sessions . I would NEVER speak down to anyone that way . As you have read I am fully aware of unhinged . As in my husband who took his life at a very young age . I raised my girls with the support of my parents . At no point did I call my husband unhinged . Psychiatric disorders are all different , I learnt as best as I could to help him . I will move forward with my mandatory reporting and the last night I spoke to my husband I was expecting a grocery list . Which I would buy and he would pick it up from my dad . I had heard the phrase ,this is the last time you will speak with me , it’s forever in my head , This is going to be the last I engage with you !. So I went about my evening and police knocked on my door at 3:28 AM . Here is a little more information . In 2021 I was put in a seniors abuse shelter . . I had been sexually assaulted by a man . Live it , learn it and above all BE KIND ! Until you walk our paths . Go for it , whatever it is you are doing and hopefully it will help the victims !!!!! Battery on one with mental health is not very nice . I will stick with psychologists and psychiatric doctors and the effects . it not right professing or not to utter such words . That is a 30 second glimpse of my life . Not sure if you could endure so much trauma . So I have shared some facts and I am done sharing people who don’t understand mental health issues or unwilling to learn that some are born with those conditions . They just wanna pounce ! When we conduct safe dosing sites for addicts we never call them unhinged . We are there to prevent them from dying . Not to pass judgment ! Vinny didn’t call you unhinged. I did. You ripped him a new A-hole for providing additional investigation information, as if you are on some sort of moral high ground where you’re the only one allowed to provide information. You don’t own all the information. I didn’t appreciate the attack on him. He’s sharing from an American perspective, and by the looks of things you’re based out of Calgary. I have a child that utilizes the recovery treatment centres, so I apologize for my unkind language but when you said you speak at these centres I was concerned. Glad you’re receiving treatment and have a lot of support.
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
Posts: 662
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Post by peggysullivan on Mar 30, 2023 15:48:39 GMT -5
When I first read the unsigned letter on page one, I initially thought it was a prank and didn't respond, because it seemed unfair to attack a guy who's no longer around to defend himself. I went from being naive to being flabbergasted. I reckon there was a reason Jesus sent his disciples out in pairs, a lone wolf can be dangerous. Maybe they should assign all Overseer positions to women? DB was well traveled, I wonder if it was to protect him from other allegations? Lots of good, sincere, and trustworthy Workers in the Truth, I'm sure this egregious episode has knocked their socks off too.
This has happened too many times to be swept under a rug, I sincerely hope they take some steps to make sure it doesn't happen again. There's no way to screen for hidden perverts, but surely they could have questioned a Worker who spent so much time in motels for no apparent reason. I hope no sister Workers or professing women willingly engaged in fornication with him. I don't know how he could have raped women in a motel? Surely someone would have heard cries for help? And how he could have lured anyone under-aged there? Maybe those were different incidences committed in homes? Very sad and depressing non-the-less.
Rape comes in many forms, not all are violent. He had power and he could have threatened them in order to coerce them into having sex with him. Predators use any and all means to get what they want. Sister workers may have been told they would be kicked out of the work. Children may have been told that their parents wanted them to be with him because he was a worker and therefore could be trusted not to hurt them. Married women could be told that he would tell their husbands they were having an affair with someone and because he was a trusted overseer with a lot of power, do you think the husband would not believe him? I'm sure some wouldn't and call him on it, but the women may have thought it was a valid threat that they couldn't disprove and felt helpless. Many different scenarios. I worked as a volunteer in a woman's sexual assault clinic and the stories I heard make me understand that rape is rape when there is an imbalance of power and the woman is threatened. Thanks for pointing these things out. There is also mental and emotional rape and blackmail that are used to manipulate people.
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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 15:49:31 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by 1chinesewhispers on Mar 30, 2023 15:49:31 GMT -5
Thx 💞💗💘 they can bash all they want but when they end up in a seniors abuse shelter , as you said people don’t realize that elderly can be easy manipulated . After my consultation and testing by my psychologist/neurologist said to ME …………………… You are now below average for your age group and it is due to the Valium given to me at about age for . I have lost a significant part of my short term memory . My oldest daughter figured that out when I didn’t return from my denturist . She lived in Saskatoon . But she couldn’t get ahold of me and alerted my youngest daughter . However it was my deceased daughter that called Calgary Police and alerted them to my memory problems . 48 hours till I showed up . I wondered into Willow Park mall and sat in a handicapped stall . Concerned they called police ….. Police were looking for me . I had my transit id thank goodness because I didn’t remember anything . This was 2018 . I was transported to hospital because I was beaten to a pulp and raped over those hours . They have a tracking device on my phone now . I alert when going out . Abuse on elderly is horrible in so many ways . Many elderly in the truth have signed letters presented by WORKERS and then when they pass , the workers get it all . So we spoke with the workers about mom and said no more envelopes ! Certainly no documentation signing . Bob can attest to this practice . So from age 2 to 62 I have endured many sex assaults . The last one being in my home . I have so many police friends that KNOW WHAT HAPPENED SO WE ARE IN COURT !! Stopped temporarily after this bombshell . I have spoken with some non professing people with elderly parents and we have discussed this and measures are in place One dear soul is 94 and we message daily . I have not spoken a word to her about this situation and won’t unless she ask . Unhinged not she has known me all my life . When someone finally spoke up and asked me I verified it . Then they replied we always wondered if that was happening to you ! No one said a peep . WHY ? My dear parents begged for forgiveness , I said dad I didn’t tell so you didn’t know till the final rape . It seems I am being moved again as I forget to lock me door on a regular basis . So that is coming next . As long as I can have my kittens I will follow doctors orders . Keep an eye on the elderly people please !
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
Posts: 662
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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 16:00:12 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by peggysullivan on Mar 30, 2023 16:00:12 GMT -5
Thx 💞💗💘 they can bash all they want but when they end up in a seniors abuse shelter , as you said people don’t realize that elderly can be easy manipulated . After my consultation and testing by my psychologist/neurologist said to ME …………………… You are now below average for your age group and it is due to the Valium given to me at about age for . I have lost a significant part of my short term memory . My oldest daughter figured that out when I didn’t return from my denturist . She lived in Saskatoon . But she couldn’t get ahold of me and alerted my youngest daughter . However it was my deceased daughter that called Calgary Police and alerted them to my memory problems . 48 hours till I showed up . I wondered into Willow Park mall and sat in a handicapped stall . Concerned they called police ….. Police were looking for me . I had my transit id thank goodness because I didn’t remember anything . This was 2018 . I was transported to hospital because I was beaten to a pulp and raped over those hours . They have a tracking device on my phone now . I alert when going out . Abuse on elderly is horrible in so many ways . Many elderly in the truth have signed letters presented by WORKERS and then when they pass , the workers get it all . So we spoke with the workers about mom and said no more envelopes ! Certainly no documentation signing . Bob can attest to this practice . So from age 2 to 62 I have endured many sex assaults . The last one being in my home . I have so many police friends that KNOW WHAT HAPPENED SO WE ARE IN COURT !! Stopped temporarily after this bombshell . I have spoken with some non professing people with elderly parents and we have discussed this and measures are in place One dear soul is 94 and we message daily . I have not spoken a word to her about this situation and won’t unless she ask . Unhinged not she has known me all my life . When someone finally spoke up and asked me I verified it . Then they replied we always wondered if that was happening to you ! No one said a peep . WHY ? My dear parents begged for forgiveness , I said dad I didn’t tell so you didn’t know till the final rape . It seems I am being moved again as I forget to lock me door on a regular basis . So that is coming next . As long as I can have my kittens I will follow doctors orders . Keep an eye on the elderly people please ! Well, many of the elderly are in the unfortunate position of being from the generation that was sort of against speaking out about abuse… so I think that adds to their vulnerability. Predators will sometimes choose their victims based upon who is more likely to keep the secret. So, married women are targeted too because they don’t want their husbands and families to find out. We need to walk in the Light, however, and fight against the darkness. It’s a fight worthy of fighting. Honesty is not always pretty…
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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 16:04:30 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by 1chinesewhispers on Mar 30, 2023 16:04:30 GMT -5
At no point did I call you unhinged Vinny . You do whatever you do and I will proceed with my doctors and counseling sessions . I would NEVER speak down to anyone that way . As you have read I am fully aware of unhinged . As in my husband who took his life at a very young age . I raised my girls with the support of my parents . At no point did I call my husband unhinged . Psychiatric disorders are all different , I learnt as best as I could to help him . I will move forward with my mandatory reporting and the last night I spoke to my husband I was expecting a grocery list . Which I would buy and he would pick it up from my dad . I had heard the phrase ,this is the last time you will speak with me , it’s forever in my head , This is going to be the last I engage with you !. So I went about my evening and police knocked on my door at 3:28 AM . Here is a little more information . In 2021 I was put in a seniors abuse shelter . . I had been sexually assaulted by a man . Live it , learn it and above all BE KIND ! Until you walk our paths . Go for it , whatever it is you are doing and hopefully it will help the victims !!!!! Battery on one with mental health is not very nice . I will stick with psychologists and psychiatric doctors and the effects . it not right professing or not to utter such words . That is a 30 second glimpse of my life . Not sure if you could endure so much trauma . So I have shared some facts and I am done sharing people who don’t understand mental health issues or unwilling to learn that some are born with those conditions . They just wanna pounce ! When we conduct safe dosing sites for addicts we never call them unhinged . We are there to prevent them from dying . Not to pass judgment ! Vinny didn’t call you unhinged. I did. You ripped him a new A-hole for providing additional investigation information, as if you are on some sort of moral high ground where you’re the only one allowed to provide information. You don’t own all the information. I didn’t appreciate the attack on him. He’s sharing from an American perspective, and by the looks of things you’re based out of Calgary. I have a child that utilizes the recovery treatment centres, so I apologize for my unkind language but when you said you speak at these centres I was concerned. Glad you’re receiving treatment and have a lot of support. When Vinny speaks about my meds and tells me I should stop them is not responsible . I take direction from my doctors . We have tried many times . Unfortunately I will be on the medication for the rest of my life . Thx for your apology . Did we want to discuss me having to wrestle knives out of my youngest daughter’s hands 4 times because of her trauma . I work with AARC AND MOTHERS STOP THE HARM GROUP . To be in the group you either have to had a child od or be in active addiction . No mom signs up for that !!! My last child , my daughter I no longer speak with . No I don’t know everything about this however this abuse has been a constant in my life . I have been working with police since 2016 . I also speak with opiate doctors . I am not stupid . The fact my girls were sexually abused doesn’t help either Have a great day ! It’s all good in my little world right now !
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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 16:09:35 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by 1chinesewhispers on Mar 30, 2023 16:09:35 GMT -5
Never said I was on higher level or better than anyone . We are pointing out problems so they don’t endure CSA and SA There are some on here older than me who have suffered the same things . I don’t want anymore children hurt . I have learnt the hard way . Including my son-in-law who had aids . That is also in the trail of tears on here . We not to recently had a worker die of AIDS . So I may a little touchy ! Unhinged not , pushy and abrasive , and brash absolutely . I thank me father for teaching me to stand . He actually barred some worker’s from our home . My offending worker was barred and even my grandparents never spoke to him again . We had a family member in our lives who has passed , he too had a secret . We heard why he made the decision to step down and only once did he speak about !!!
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Post by Vinny T. on Mar 30, 2023 16:17:44 GMT -5
At no point did I call you unhinged Vinny . You do whatever you do and I will proceed with my doctors and counseling sessions . I would NEVER speak down to anyone that way . As you have read I am fully aware of unhinged . As in my husband who took his life at a very young age . I raised my girls with the support of my parents . At no point did I call my husband unhinged . Psychiatric disorders are all different , I learnt as best as I could to help him . I will move forward with my mandatory reporting and the last night I spoke to my husband I was expecting a grocery list . Which I would buy and he would pick it up from my dad . I had heard the phrase ,this is the last time you will speak with me , it’s forever in my head , This is going to be the last I engage with you !. So I went about my evening and police knocked on my door at 3:28 AM . Here is a little more information . In 2021 I was put in a seniors abuse shelter . . I had been sexually assaulted by a man . Live it , learn it and above all BE KIND ! Until you walk our paths . Go for it , whatever it is you are doing and hopefully it will help the victims !!!!! Battery on one with mental health is not very nice . I will stick with psychologists and psychiatric doctors and the effects . it not right professing or not to utter such words . That is a 30 second glimpse of my life . Not sure if you could endure so much trauma . So I have shared some facts and I am done sharing people who don’t understand mental health issues or unwilling to learn that some are born with those conditions . They just wanna pounce ! When we conduct safe dosing sites for addicts we never call them unhinged . We are there to prevent them from dying . Not to pass judgment ! Vinny didn’t call you unhinged. I did. You ripped him a new A-hole for providing additional investigation information, as if you are on some sort of moral high ground where you’re the only one allowed to provide information. You don’t own all the information. I didn’t appreciate the attack on him. He’s sharing from an American perspective, and by the looks of things you’re based out of Calgary. I have a child that utilizes the recovery treatment centres, so I apologize for my unkind language but when you said you speak at these centres I was concerned. Glad you’re receiving treatment and have a lot of support. Thank you very much, your kind words are much appreciated. I am just wanting to provide information and help give a better understanding of what the procedures are to clarify things. Most do t know how it works and after reading some it seemed to be very confusing for many people. I wanted to help giver a clearer picture so people can know what to expect and not be confused. Being I know someone who procured info I was able to share it hopefully made things easier to understand. I will share more when I am allowed and I will be more specific. Currently this is a huge case and involves dozens of perpetrators in almost a dozen States this far. I am only privy to the United States aspect. That's why currently I believe there are 10 States with letters and many people being investigated. The sexual crimes is only one aspect as there are numerous financial crimes and other crimes being investigated. This will take time to unravel I am sure. I am very familiar with how the judicial system and how law enforcement works. If anyone has questions ease let me know. Thanks again and have a grand day.
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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 16:23:46 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by 1chinesewhispers on Mar 30, 2023 16:23:46 GMT -5
I too will also share what I know . This is a very serious problem that must be dealt with in the highest court possible in the USA . But unfortunately Dean has been in Canada and we cross checking in case there are victims here . I look forward to the AARC Gala in May . I am attending but not speaking . The man who is emcee is a graduate that was in treatment the same time as my oldest daughter she was 12 years old . Youngest client ever . I am thrilled to be able to see him again . He worked with my child a lot . I love that man and am so looking forward to that hug !
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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 17:01:30 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by 1chinesewhispers on Mar 30, 2023 17:01:30 GMT -5
The only reason I attacked Vinny was over my medication . I take directions from my doctors . If they said stop vaping I would do so then my othamologist would say go back on it for your glaucoma . At one point I was taking 3 Valium a day . I weaned myself down to one a day . I also took morphine 3 times a day . I no longer take morphine as I weaned myself off under supervision . I am allowed Percocet when in extreme pain for a car accident . So I am taking the steps required to get rid of a lot of meds given to me . I had a psychiatrist who diagnosed me over the phone . He called in a prescription . I started taking it and it made the problem worse So I weaned off that under supervision . I don’t enjoy taking meds ! All is good. , outside a little cold but the sun feels so good on my face . Perhaps I may eat food tonight if my body cooperates ! It was a leap of faith to get off the higher doses and the doctors were very happy . So I use CBD , CBN AND CGG to replace the morphine and down to one Valium a day . Plus sleeping medication . I stopped those completely . I take the issue seriously . Had I not been exposed to the Dean situation I would not have been in a place of trauma . We will never know how many people were affected by Dean and those who knew .
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2023 17:03:11 GMT -5
New letter Site logo image Wings for Truth Lyle Shober letter to Texas friends March 2023 wingsfortruth2 Mar 30 March 28. 2023 Dear Friends. It is with a heavy heart that we share with you the disheartening news concerning our coworker, Dean Bruer. He has been accused of living an immoral double life, and there seems to be ample evidence to support these claims. Dean has never labored in our state, but he was a member of our ministry, therefore his error affects each of us in this ministry. In our current generation of social media, we are sure that most of you are already aware of this issue. The integrity of our ministry is called into question when one amongst us betrays the holy trust shown to us by our friends. Our purpose as Christians and as messengers sent with the gospel, is to manifest our belief by our life and behavior among all people. One part of the armor of God is to have our feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace. This indicates that the influence of our life testifies of the peace we have because of the gospel we have accepted. It is meant to be a living sermon of invitation to others who are searching for peace. When a messenger of the gospel betrays that testimony, the repercussions are felt throughout the fellowship. It is with reverent godly fear that we apologize for this misconduct. We hope and pray to be worthy of the trust you have shown to us in the ministry. We believe in boundaries. The Lord promised us a hundred-fold of homes, family, and children. However, it is with the awareness that these things are given to us for the gospel's sake. What we receive is given to us because of the message we carry, and we carry that message with professional responsibility. We purpose to maintain professional boundaries while in your homes and with your children. We ask that you help us with this. Please teach your children cues for avoiding questionable behavior. Children do not have the maturity to understand the complexity of human behavior, but they can be taught simple cues for safety. For example: 1. Do not be alone in a bedroom with an adult other than a parent or assigned caretaker 2. How to appropriately embrace an adult 3. Topics of conversation that are inappropriate. It grieves our heart to have to say these things, but if we work together, we can facilitate a safe environment that will promote a spiritual fellowship that edifies faith. As members of this ministry, we want to assure you of how much we love and care for you. We are heartbroken by the disgrace of human failure, but our faith in the Lord's ministry is unchanged. This is the ministry that our Lord established in the earth. Human failure can compromise its testimony, but it cannot undermine its validity. Judas Iscariot was also a part of this ministry, but in the wake of his betrayal the Holy Spirit still impelled this same ministry forward. We want to assure you that we will do what we can to assist those who are victims of this abuse. We encourage you to visit with the workers in your field or with us if you have concerns or questions. We will be confidential in-as-much as we can. It is our legal responsibility in the case of underage victims to report abuse to the proper authorities. We understand that this is a very difficult journey for everyone. We remind all that by bringing to light this horrible behavior, we may be saving others from being victims of the same abuse. As workers in Texas and New Mexico we have taken, and continue to take, instruction from a course recognized by the state of Texas regarding proper boundaries with minors. We have also asked our staff to read the book "Boundaries." We are also looking into other materials about the eradication of abuse and steps that can be taken to defend from and detect inappropriate behavior. We are reminded of the statement of Paul in 2 Timothy 2:19 "Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal. The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let everyone that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity." Your brothers in Christ, Lyle Schober and Westin Price Lyle Schober is one of the letters I've seen that recognizes the need for going to the authorities when there are underage victims. AND he has been consistent with that. wingsfortruth.info/breaking-the-silence-2/letters-to-friends-and-workers/lyle-schober/Here in 2007, 16 years ago, he's telling everyone in his field that any sexually inappropriate behavior should be immediately reported to the police. Let us recognize the good as well as the bad.
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Post by 1chinesewhispers on Mar 30, 2023 17:04:48 GMT -5
Yes he was on point ! I remember that well ! It’s on TTT for anyone who wants to read it .
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
Posts: 662
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Post by peggysullivan on Mar 30, 2023 17:11:24 GMT -5
I just wanted to share some more thoughts on this whole issue. My elderly aunt called me again last night and we were able to talk some more about this. She is now aware of the letter from the brother workers in WA and the Mark Huddle allegation. This really upsets her, but I think she reached out to me because she knows I have dealt with these types of ugly issues a lot and in a sense it isn't as emotionally upsetting to me, and I take on a more pragmatic approach.
I think it is important to move away from the mentality of "protecting the Truth" and keeping secrets for the sake of the Kingdom. If the Truth is of the Lord, the Lord will protect it. We, as humans are not nearly as capable of protecting the Kingdom as God is. It's actually faulty thinking to think we would be able to "protect the Kingdom.". We are simply not that powerful.....
So, I told her: "If you have true faith in God, you will trust Him to keep you through this storm and Truth will win out in the end. So, where is your faith in God? Do you really totally trust Him to the extent that if the lid is COMPLETELY blown off all the abuse that's been allowed for years and it is totally brought into the spotlight for all to see, that your Faith will still survive?" She is a faithful woman indeed, but she has over the years put a lot of trust in the workers. Sometimes I wonder who she trusts more: the workers or God? I hope indeed it is God. But sometimes I wonder about that.
Also, any "system" you are involved in that doesn't allow free questioning of those in authority is an unhealthy system to be in; whether that be school, workplaces, a church, or a club, or our GOVERNMENT. When "the people" are not allowed to question, that is like a dictatorship. And we can see throughout history where that has taken place. It creates massive oppression and much more that isn't right. God Almighty never wanted a dictatorship type fellowship. He didn't want a "have to" service from His people. He has always wanted it to be a free will/free choice type of relationship. No coercion, no forcing, no manipulating, no guilt tripping. Spiritual leaders who use those techniques engage in spiritual abuse.
Maybe it needs to be said there are different forms of abuse, not just sexual. And they can all be used especially when there is a difference in power levels. Those forms are emotional, psychological, financial, sexual, exploitation, physical, and property, (abusing someone else's property). I have seen these forms play out over and over again and it's not pretty. We now not only have CPS, but also APS (adult protective services). In many cases one person can be abused in various forms by the same person.
I think when someone you love and/or trust and look up to or are taught to revere is the one abusing you, it is extra challenging to know what to do about it and who to turn to. In many cases, maybe MOST cases, it is best to go to a source that is not associated with the group and can be objective about the matter; (not emotionally or spiritually involved). Many of the friends are sort of afraid of getting "outside help". I can understand that, but in many cases it is better to do that because of the objectivity.
I can see how this whole issue would test the faith of many. But, again, if one's faith is in the Lord, rather than in other humans, they will weather the storm. Humans will ALWAYS disappoint. I don't say that because I want that to be other peoples' experience. And, I certainly don't think it's good to walk around feeling AFRAID of "predators" out there all the time. But it's not good to be too naive either. AWARENESS is good. And how are we made more aware? Not everyone who has knowledge is going to be open and share freely, so.... We ask questions when we need to know more.
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
Posts: 662
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Post by peggysullivan on Mar 30, 2023 17:29:07 GMT -5
Lyle Schober is one of the letters I've seen that recognizes the need for going to the authorities when there are underage victims. AND he has been consistent with that. wingsfortruth.info/breaking-the-silence-2/letters-to-friends-and-workers/lyle-schober/Here in 2007, 16 years ago, he's telling everyone in his field that any sexually inappropriate behavior should be immediately reported to the police. Let us recognize the good as well as the bad. I have always advocated that as well. Reporting to the lawful authorities. CSA is criminal activity.
Part of the problem is, many of the friends have traditionally somehow gotten the idea that they should "keep things in the Kingdom". Therefore, sometimes they are reluctant even seek out professional help from non professing sources. Again, in many cases, someone totally unconnected to a case can find the best insight. This is why judges, and lawyers, for example will recuse themselves from taking certain cases in court. There is a conflict of interest.
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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 17:33:36 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by 1chinesewhispers on Mar 30, 2023 17:33:36 GMT -5
Lyle Schober is one of the letters I've seen that recognizes the need for going to the authorities when there are underage victims. AND he has been consistent with that. wingsfortruth.info/breaking-the-silence-2/letters-to-friends-and-workers/lyle-schober/Here in 2007, 16 years ago, he's telling everyone in his field that any sexually inappropriate behavior should be immediately reported to the police. Let us recognize the good as well as the bad. I have always advocated that as well. Reporting to the lawful authorities. CSA is criminal activity.
Part of the problem is, many of the friends have traditionally somehow gotten the idea that they should "keep things in the Kingdom". Therefore, sometimes they are reluctant even seek out professional help from non professing sources. Again, in many cases, someone totally unconnected to a case can find the best insight. This is why judges, and lawyers, for example will recuse themselves from taking certain cases in court. There is a conflict of interest. I hope your aunt will come through with shining colors . I am grateful my parents are not around for this and my oldest daughter as well ! She too endured abuse in the way at age 9 ! I will certainly keep your aunt in my thoughts .
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peggysullivan
Senior Member
What is living if I can't be free? What is freedom if I can't be me?
Posts: 662
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Post by peggysullivan on Mar 30, 2023 17:46:58 GMT -5
I have always advocated that as well. Reporting to the lawful authorities. CSA is criminal activity.
Part of the problem is, many of the friends have traditionally somehow gotten the idea that they should "keep things in the Kingdom". Therefore, sometimes they are reluctant even seek out professional help from non professing sources. Again, in many cases, someone totally unconnected to a case can find the best insight. This is why judges, and lawyers, for example will recuse themselves from taking certain cases in court. There is a conflict of interest. I hope your mom will come through with shining colors . I am grateful my parents are not around for this and my oldest daughter as well ! She too endured abuse in the way at age 9 ! I will certainly keep your mom in my thoughts . Thank you, chinesewhispers. Aunty is a very strong woman and has been through many storms. I think she will be okay. We keep in close touch and I am glad she can talk to me freely about these matters. The mentality of hush hush don't talk about it has got to be thrown out, IMO. I am certainly not in favor of a witch hunt and people just pointing fingers all over the place that are not in good faith. But, sadly, whistle blowers can take a beating and so people become afraid and nothing gets resolved. I know there are many companies that deal with workplace issues by having a hotline that people can report in to and they guarantee there will be NO RETALIATION if one reports a concern in GOOD FAITH. And, maybe that is the deal right there: things that are reported in GOOD FAITH. I know it's not preferable to condemn, but neither is it preferable to look the other way when there is a problem!
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Post by chuck on Mar 30, 2023 20:02:14 GMT -5
"Our purpose as Christians and as messengers sent with the gospel, is to manifest our belief by our life and behavior among all people."
This is a transaction. You are guilty, I did something so you are not guilty, now you behave in a certain way for me or your still guilty.....Telling people this is not spreading the gospel and it most definitely is not the philosophy of those people in the 1st century.
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Post by verna on Mar 30, 2023 20:10:08 GMT -5
"Our purpose as Christians and as messengers sent with the gospel, is to manifest our belief by our life and behavior among all people." This is a transaction. You are guilty, I did something so you are not guilty, now you behave in a certain way for me or your still guilty.....Telling people this is not spreading the gospel and it most definitely is not the philosophy of those people in the 1st century. Who are you quoting Chuck?
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Post by Pragmatic on Mar 30, 2023 20:25:26 GMT -5
"Our purpose as Christians and as messengers sent with the gospel, is to manifest our belief by our life and behavior among all people." This is a transaction. You are guilty, I did something so you are not guilty, now you behave in a certain way for me or your still guilty.....Telling people this is not spreading the gospel and it most definitely is not the philosophy of those people in the 1st century. Not sure that I understand your point, sorry Chuck. Can you elaborate?
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Post by BobWilliston on Mar 30, 2023 21:15:03 GMT -5
Sorry, what I meant to say was that your statement describes an idolatrous concept: Questioning a worker is like questioning God himself.Whatever you meant or I meant, there is an idolatrous element in the group fixated on the workers, varying in degree from member to member. I was informed by a worker one time that the first question one of the friends asks, when they meet someone from another place, is "Who are the workers in your field?" I've met a lot of friends from a lot of places, and I can't remember a single time I've asked that question. Honestly, I really didn't care because how good is a name of someone I'd never heard of.
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Post by BobWilliston on Mar 30, 2023 21:26:59 GMT -5
Thx Wally for weighing in yet again . Your actions cause harm sometimes ! But dude whatever makes you happy 😊 go with your god about your day . If you actually worked the front line which you didn’t , you could have a better understanding . Here's the deal, I am not unhinged. I have spoken clearly and concisely and gave information most didn't know. I do not appreciate the remarks of me being "unhinged" when I am only helping. I am glad you showed your psychiatrist the things I said because if I said anything wrong or inappropriate we are all sure you would have told me. Sheesh, this is your life, you have nothing else. I'm sad for you. Go ahead and say what you like about me and continue assuming. But remember "it was I" that said many things first which shows I have info most don't. Anyway I sincerely hope that you and all the victims can get the help you need and the perpetrators convicted. God bless you. It wasn't chinesewhispers who said you were unhinged. Also, chinesewhispers is not a dingbat when it comes to understanding her condition. She's worth a listen.
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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 21:32:13 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by chuck on Mar 30, 2023 21:32:13 GMT -5
"Our purpose as Christians and as messengers sent with the gospel, is to manifest our belief by our life and behavior among all people." This is a transaction. You are guilty, I did something so you are not guilty, now you behave in a certain way for me or your still guilty.....Telling people this is not spreading the gospel and it most definitely is not the philosophy of those people in the 1st century. Who are you quoting Chuck? Sorry Verna, it was in the 2nd paragraph from Lyle Shober's letter above.
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Post by verna on Mar 30, 2023 21:54:03 GMT -5
Who are you quoting Chuck? Sorry Verna, it was in the 2nd paragraph from Lyle Shober's letter above. Oh ok. I’ve been reading too many letters. I’m getting confused. This is the statement that got me “One part of the armor of God is to have our feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace”. Tell me, what century are people living in that they talk like this”? Is there any interest is having people understand or is the intent to bamboozle?
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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 22:02:34 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by chuck on Mar 30, 2023 22:02:34 GMT -5
"Our purpose as Christians and as messengers sent with the gospel, is to manifest our belief by our life and behavior among all people." This is a transaction. You are guilty, I did something so you are not guilty, now you behave in a certain way for me or your still guilty.....Telling people this is not spreading the gospel and it most definitely is not the philosophy of those people in the 1st century. Not sure that I understand your point, sorry Chuck. Can you elaborate? Yep no problem. "Our purpose as Christians and as messengers sent with the gospel, is to manifest our belief by our life and behavior among all people." Would it be fair to say Lyle's belief is "Jesus died to pay for his/our sin's"? My question is how do you manifest that belief?, well we know how Lyle manifests that belief, he goes around telling people that Jesus died to pay for their sins and in return they must behave a certain way to manifest their beliefs, part of that behaviour involves practising rituals and keeping traditions. This is a transaction. Jesus did x, so we must do y in order to receive x. If you know anything about Yom Kippur you know this transaction theory was not something that Jesus would have taught or told people to spread as good news. It's the antithesis of Yom Kippur and the Jewish philosophy. The reason I say it was also not the philosophy of 1st century people is it seems the wording in the original greek could be translated "Jesus died because of our sins", and to add to that in the first 1000 years of Christianity was the payment theory core to Christianity?. The Christ character most definitely dies because of our sins, Jesus dying to pay for our sins was popularised by Anselm according to Marcus Borg. I haven't found anything yet to counter his argument. I know fundementlists at this point would just quote "The Bible" or "the bible says" but if your presupposition is incorrect quoting the bible is worthless. marcusjborg.org/posts-by-marcus/lent-and-the-cross/Jesus died because of peoples sins. The Christ character cannot be buried, it rises again. This was told in various ways by various authors in their own particular way. To me it's a pity the wrong parts have been literalised through ignorance of the relevant cultures and their methods of passing things on and also their superstition because they didn't have the luxury knowing what we have learnt in the last 2000+ years. Hope this makes it clearer??.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2023 22:36:34 GMT -5
"Our purpose as Christians and as messengers sent with the gospel, is to manifest our belief by our life and behavior among all people." This is a transaction. You are guilty, I did something so you are not guilty, now you behave in a certain way for me or your still guilty.....Telling people this is not spreading the gospel and it most definitely is not the philosophy of those people in the 1st century. Well, that would be your slant, which isn't much...
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Dean Bruer
Mar 30, 2023 22:46:15 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by chuck on Mar 30, 2023 22:46:15 GMT -5
Sorry Verna, it was in the 2nd paragraph from Lyle Shober's letter above. Oh ok. I’ve been reading too many letters. I’m getting confused. This is the statement that got me “One part of the armor of God is to have our feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace”. Tell me, what century are people living in that they talk like this”? Is there any interest is having people understand or is the intent to bamboozle? No problem, I should have made it obvious were I was quoting from. Verna what is interesting is peoples eagerness to speak in King James English but yet almost every other part of their life is grounded in the 21st century. What needs to happen is people need to translate the earliest copies of scripture into 21st century words, the trouble is I think that would make what is know as Christianity today irrelevant. King James translated for his purposes, and people today ignorantly follow King Jame's reason for translating it with absolutely no idea about the original people who these concepts originated from... Another thing to note is people speaking one way in Meetings Missions and Conventions and the when mixing with the general public drop their 15th century lingo are described in their own bibles as wearing a mask!.......
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