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Post by nathan on Jan 8, 2021 15:57:31 GMT -5
I am well aware how Forums work. You expect both positive and negative feedback, that is good, normal debate. But I do not regard calling people liars as feedback. I find it downright rude. I remember a Worker who stayed in our home a lot and he drilled into us, never call anybody a liar. Have never forgotten that. Wally and Nathan do it all the time and it must stop. ** You and those like you on here do to Wally, Shushy and me constantly by calling us Liars.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 16:03:57 GMT -5
you forgot the rest of that verse: Joh_8:11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more. one can't very well seek and get forgiveness if they turn around and go right back to do the same sin(adultery remarriage). yes its well recognized that we will still do sin and all fall short and have to seek his forgiveness everyday but adultery remarriage takes that to a new level. for example if a murder is forgiven and then yet everyday commits another murder we would soon say they are not really repenting and are not really forgiven. *** I agree with you Wally. However, if they asked God to forgive their Adultery sin and He forgave them, who are the workers to tell them they can't take parts in praising Him every Sunday morning? Did God tell families to split up or the workers rules for remarriage with little children involved. Tell them to go to God and ask God and Christ forgiveness and leave that between them and God. The Workers need to stay out of it and try NOT to play God. It's God who forgives and restores His Spirit to them NOT the workers. I have seen those who God has forgiven have beautiful broken, humble spirits in the Sunday morning meetings. we have had 2 people(both men) receive word from God that they(AB and DM) should separate from their 2nd wife until the 1st wife dies for AB it happened but not yet for DM. children were involved with AB and they handled it fairly well. its too bad others don't heed the same message from God.
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Post by Grant on Jan 8, 2021 16:11:57 GMT -5
If you want to do it the Bible way then it says you can divorce if the other party commits adultry.
Divorce means cut free, release, you are no longer married which leaves them free to remarry. If divorce means you're still bound to that person as long as you live, then why did Jesus use the word divorce?
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Post by BobWilliston on Jan 8, 2021 16:20:18 GMT -5
Wally needs to be reminded often of the statement on the home page. "New readers should not be surprised or discouraged by the tone of non-believers on the board, who are as welcome as any to post." Repeat, NON-BELIEVERS ON THE BOARD, WHO ARE AS WELCOME AS ANY TO POST. TMB is not an exclusive Forum, where Wally and Nathan can post their version of the Gospel. As for asking Laura for permission to post, I would say to Wally mind your own business. Wally should maybe organize an Occupy TMB insurgency -- if only we believed in buildings.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 16:29:22 GMT -5
Hard to understand the thinking. Wally confessed some time ago how many Girlfriends he has had. From memory about six give or take a few. That is OK provided you don't marry them.
Guess that is not as sinful as King Solomon who went through 700 wives and 300 concubines. Wally should have tried to beat that, he may get his name in the Guinness Book Of Records.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jan 8, 2021 16:33:02 GMT -5
Hard to understand the thinking. Wally confessed some time ago how many Girlfriends he has had. From memory about six give or take a few. That is OK provided you don't marry them. Guess that is not as sinful as King Solomon who went through 700 wives and 300 concubines. Wally should have tried to beat that, he may get his name in the Guinness Book Of Records. Well, he still qualifies for pope, under the present rules.
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Post by Annan on Jan 8, 2021 16:36:00 GMT -5
I am well aware how Forums work. You expect both positive and negative feedback, that is good, normal debate. But I do not regard calling people liars as feedback. I find it downright rude. I remember a Worker who stayed in our home a lot and he drilled into us, never call anybody a liar. Have never forgotten that. Wally and Nathan do it all the time and it must stop. ** You and those like you on here do to Wally, Shushy and me constantly by calling us Liars.
A spade's a spade is it not?
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Post by Dan on Jan 8, 2021 16:58:17 GMT -5
I enjoyed both video's, thanks for posting them... Lots of confusion out there, so hearing both those girls experiences and feelings was enlightening.
I had some similar observations prior to leaving, didn't understand why it was hard to profess with all the rules and restrictions, especially when Jesus said his yoke was easy and his burden was light.
Never understood why divorcee's were not allowed to take part either (if they re-married). Jesus said there was just one unforgivable sin, and that wasn't it.. What did he tell the adulteress, "Neither do I condemn thee".
Sometimes a church just takes one verse and runs with it, I think they miss the big picture when they focus on superficial things like dress codes etc especially when Jesus himself never mentioned it.
And I think they emulate the Amish with the "come out from among them and be separate". There's a difference in not being all caught up in worldly affairs and hiding from the world, Jesus certainly never did that.. jmo
you forgot the rest of that verse: Joh_8:11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more. one can't very well seek and get forgiveness if they turn around and go right back to do the same sin(adultery remarriage). yes its well recognized that we will still do sin and all fall short and have to seek his forgiveness everyday but adultery remarriage takes that to a new level. for example if a murder is forgiven and then yet everyday commits another murder we would soon say they are not really repenting and are not really forgiven.
I imagine a divorcee repents of their first marriage .. Jesus allowed divorce in cases of infidelity (Matthew 19:9), as was the case in that Jessica Baker interview.
You got to feel for women who may be beaten, abused, or cheated on. Is it right to condemn them to a solitary life because they married the wrong person? Paul said "Husbands, love your wives" (Ephesians 5:25). But their are men who don't. Jesus said, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning". I suspect it was for our sake's that divorce was permitted, because it probably prevented murder
Remarriage is adultery, but I personally don't view it as a repetitious sin. Its simply a redo of a previous mistake and an effort to get it right the second time around. People change over time, so if a women is abused (or a guy), the sin might be in forcing them to stay together. I wonder what Jesus would tell a woman who remarried because she was caught in a violent or abusive first marriage? I suspect he'd say, go and sin no more?
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Post by bfvernon on Jan 8, 2021 17:08:09 GMT -5
Sin is sin is sin is sin ......
“For those tears I died”
Haven’t you guys ever heard of “grace”?
We have to forgive ourselves. God has. He alone has seen what went on behind closed doors. (And in my case, some of it is in the public domain now! - not that any of the 2x2s have said they are sorry for their dreadful judgement).
God is the judge. His judgement is righteous.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 17:38:54 GMT -5
you forgot the rest of that verse: Joh_8:11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more. one can't very well seek and get forgiveness if they turn around and go right back to do the same sin(adultery remarriage). yes its well recognized that we will still do sin and all fall short and have to seek his forgiveness everyday but adultery remarriage takes that to a new level. for example if a murder is forgiven and then yet everyday commits another murder we would soon say they are not really repenting and are not really forgiven.
I imagine a divorcee repents of their first marriage .. Jesus allowed divorce in cases of infidelity (Matthew 19:9), as was the case in that Jessica Baker interview.
You got to feel for women who may be beaten, abused, or cheated on. Is it right to condemn them to a solitary life because they married the wrong person? Paul said "Husbands, love your wives" (Ephesians 5:25). But their are men who don't. Jesus said, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning". I suspect it was for our sake's that divorce was permitted, because it probably prevented murder
Remarriage is adultery, but I personally don't view it as a repetitious sin. Its simply a redo of a previous mistake and an effort to get it right the second time around. People change over time, so if a women is abused (or a guy), the sin might be in forcing them to stay together. I wonder what Jesus would tell a woman who remarried because she was caught in a violent or abusive first marriage? I suspect he'd say, go and sin no more?
no one is saying divorce is sin we are saying though that adultery remarriage is. and leaving because of violence is okay with me as it should be for anyone. yep divorce and remarriage is allowed for fornication(read found not being a virgin) but no other reasons are allowed or mentioned in the NT. one should note we know that is what Joseph was going to do to mary when he ASSumed she was no longer a virgin.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 17:43:43 GMT -5
Hard to understand the thinking. Wally confessed some time ago how many Girlfriends he has had. From memory about six give or take a few. That is OK provided you don't marry them. Guess that is not as sinful as King Solomon who went through 700 wives and 300 concubines. Wally should have tried to beat that, he may get his name in the Guinness Book Of Records. Well, he still qualifies for pope, under the present rules. Would you have to be a Catholic Bob, Don't think Wally likes Catholics. Come to think of it he doesn't seem to like anybody, only Nathan.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 17:46:29 GMT -5
If you want to do it the Bible way then it says you can divorce if the other party commits adultry. Divorce means cut free, release, you are no longer married which leaves them free to remarry. If divorce means you're still bound to that person as long as you live, then why did Jesus use the word divorce? wrong its says fornication. which generally involves people who are single not married. adultery however is about married people doing the nasty with someone other than their spouse..
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 17:50:38 GMT -5
Hard to understand the thinking. Wally confessed some time ago how many Girlfriends he has had. From memory about six give or take a few. That is OK provided you don't marry them. Guess that is not as sinful as King Solomon who went through 700 wives and 300 concubines. Wally should have tried to beat that, he may get his name in the Guinness Book Of Records. i have had more than 6 girlfriends but i only slept with 4...that is called fornication not adultery or adultery remarriage. there is a difference...
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Post by Grant on Jan 8, 2021 17:52:39 GMT -5
If you want to do it the Bible way then it says you can divorce if the other party commits adultry. Divorce means cut free, release, you are no longer married which leaves them free to remarry. If divorce means you're still bound to that person as long as you live, then why did Jesus use the word divorce? wrong its says fornication. which generally involves people who are single not married. adultery however is about married people doing the nasty with someone other than their spouse.. So if your spouse has an affair with an unmarried person then you can divorce them and are free to remarry if we are to take the word divorce literally, but if your spouse has an affair with another married person you cannot. Discernment is needed here. Always it's been the woman who has to be the virgin but nothing about the man. There is often no way of knowing if the woman is a virgin or not and what about a woman whose been sexually abused.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 17:54:42 GMT -5
Well, he still qualifies for pope, under the present rules. Would you have to be a Catholic Bob, Don't think Wally likes Catholics. Come to think of it he doesn't seem to like anybody, only Nathan. see this is the lying that you do that gets you called a lair...that would be some negative feedback if you are not aware of it...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 18:03:33 GMT -5
Wally a bright chap like you would understand the meaning of "don't think" and "doesn't seem", you use that ploy all the time. Gives you wriggle room.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 18:05:10 GMT -5
wrong its says fornication. which generally involves people who are single not married. adultery however is about married people doing the nasty with someone other than their spouse.. So if your spouse has an affair with an unmarried person then you can divorce them and are free to remarry if we are to take the word divorce literally, but if your spouse has an affair with another married person you cannot remarry. Discernment is needed here. Always it's been the woman who has to be the virgin but nothing about the man. There is often no way of knowing if the woman is a virgin or not and what about a woman whose been sexually abused. no the adultery YOU would be committing has nothing to do with the status of the other person(although if the other one was married too that would be adultery on their part also but it should not be confused with fornication) its YOUR status as married that causes the infraction... I.E two single unmarried people having sex = fornication a single person having sex with a married person = adultery two people married to other people and they are having sex = adultery remarrying after a divorce sex is implied = adultery remarriage
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 18:07:52 GMT -5
Wally a bright chap like you would understand the meaning of "don't think" and "doesn't seem", you use that ploy all the time. Gives you wriggle room. you were trying to set another narrative, you are not fooling anyone...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 18:26:32 GMT -5
You do it all the time Wally, but you don't see it as a narrative. I don't understand how you can accuse somebody of something that you don't agree with, but you do the same thing yourself. Maybe as I said recently you may be eristic.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 18:32:48 GMT -5
You do it all the time Wally, but you don't see it as a narrative. I don't understand how you can accuse somebody of something that you don't agree with, but you do the same thing yourself. Maybe as I said recently you may be eristic. my "narrative" generally comes from an objective biblical standpoint yours however comes from the subjective standpoint.
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Post by nathan on Jan 8, 2021 18:36:25 GMT -5
Well, he still qualifies for pope, under the present rules. Would you have to be a Catholic Bob, Don't think Wally likes Catholics. Come to think of it he doesn't seem to like anybody, only Nathan. haha... Wally and I LOVE you, too.
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Post by joanna on Jan 8, 2021 18:36:28 GMT -5
bfvernon Sin is an anachronistic term used by those who possess a religious faith. The use of this term perpetuates the freedom of faith-believers to designate a certain act as a "sin" and to impose even serious punishment. Muslims believe that blasphemy is a sin punishable by death. Amnesty International Global Report Death Sentences & ExecutionsThat you and other Christians promote the concept of sin is unsurprising as that is what we were indoctrinated to believe when listening to those preaching the teachings of Jesus. All persons indoctrinated into any religious belief system share the same mindset regardless of the differences in the doctrine they follow. This mindset accepts that which is unevidenced as if it were factual. You write "God is the judge. His judgment is righteous" despite there being a complete lack of evidence for your claims. Religiosity divides and pits believers against believers despite them having so much in common and even when worshipping the same god. This continual dissent amongst faith-based believers, whether between Sunni- Shiite muslims; ex 2x2 against 2x2; protestant against roman catholic etc and knowing the terrible consequences of this dissent throughout history should prompt the thinking person to apply some skepticism as to why a belief in the alleged omnipresent, omniscient, omnipotent and benevolent god has such a confusing and divisive influence?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 18:47:24 GMT -5
You do it all the time Wally, but you don't see it as a narrative. I don't understand how you can accuse somebody of something that you don't agree with, but you do the same thing yourself. Maybe as I said recently you may be eristic. my "narrative" generally comes from an objective biblical standpoint yours however comes from the subjective standpoint. You are right Wally as always. I use the brain I was given, you choose to use someone else's. If you have no faith in your own brain, good policy to use someone else's ideas. Garden is full of weeds, must pull them out, gives me satisfaction sorting them out.
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Post by Dan on Jan 9, 2021 0:04:35 GMT -5
bfvernon Sin is an anachronistic term used by those who possess a religious faith. The use of this term perpetuates the freedom of faith-believers to designate a certain act as a "sin" and to impose even serious punishment. Muslims believe that blasphemy is a sin punishable by death. Amnesty International Global Report Death Sentences & ExecutionsThat you and other Christians promote the concept of sin is unsurprising as that is what we were indoctrinated to believe when listening to those preaching the teachings of Jesus. All persons indoctrinated into any religious belief system share the same mindset regardless of the differences in the doctrine they follow. This mindset accepts that which is unevidenced as if it were factual. You write "God is the judge. His judgment is righteous" despite there being a complete lack of evidence for your claims. Religiosity divides and pits believers against believers despite them having so much in common and even when worshipping the same god. This continual dissent amongst faith-based believers, whether between Sunni- Shiite muslims; ex 2x2 against 2x2; protestant against roman catholic etc and knowing the terrible consequences of this dissent throughout history should prompt the thinking person to apply some skepticism as to why a belief in the alleged omnipresent, omniscient, omnipotent and benevolent god has such a confusing and divisive influence?
Its not the belief in God that divides. its the religiosity that pits one group against another. That's why I never considered myself religious (nondenominational). There was one life, one teaching, and one example.
The simplicity of Christ isn't confusing;
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2021 0:11:35 GMT -5
So true Dan, that is why I will remain an Agnostic Independent Christian until I die. And thereafter while at University.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jan 9, 2021 0:30:34 GMT -5
Well, he still qualifies for pope, under the present rules. Would you have to be a Catholic Bob, Don't think Wally likes Catholics. Come to think of it he doesn't seem to like anybody, only Nathan. Yes, he's more WASP than Catholic. Precisely American Christian nationalist -- hard core. More so than even 2x2.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2021 0:48:43 GMT -5
OMG he could be dangerous, they can give you a nasty sting.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jan 9, 2021 1:10:05 GMT -5
OMG he could be dangerous, they can give you a nasty sting. No kidding.
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