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Post by chuck on Jul 4, 2020 20:20:26 GMT -5
Nathan nothing you say lines up with the Revelation of God to the Hebrew people in the scriptures. You are back with Abraham worshipping the sun/moon and sacrificing children so to speak. We see it regularly here, you sacrificing people to please your sky god!.You, like some workers with your god complex have zero authority over lives. Stop pretending you do, it is evil.
Go and study Hebrew history, culture and lore before you sacrifice any more lives. I have no clue what you are sprouting here, Chuck. Your non-2x2 exclusive belief is getting out of control and don't make any sense.
Well how could it make sense if you've never looked. I may be wrong on lots of things, but you sir suffer from the "dunning kruger effect". A bit of Hebrew knowledge shows this. You ask how I know this, It showed me how badly I was suffering from the "Dunning Kruger effect". I probably still am, but I can now recognise I am in no position to say Im exclusive, and someone is in or out based on what my idea of in or out is, because the scriptures wreck the 2x2ism idea of whos in and out. I can now also see the whole sky imagery of god is just made up by man and the scriptures show this progressive revelation to man. If you are ignorant of Hebrew knowledge none of this makes sense and you read the scriptures all literally. Hence why in your dunning kruger effect you can boldy claim people not like you will burn in a literal hell. It's not true.
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Post by chuck on Jul 4, 2020 20:26:41 GMT -5
Im unsure what your point is, I just said I give my opinion so repeating what I just said is silly. So you agree "the truth" is the truth then?. I say it is dishonest because nowhere does the scriptures support 2x2ism, as in if you dont join "the truth" you will burn in hell. The writers of Scripture in the NT would look at you like a looney for suggesting hell is some everlasting fire in the bowels of the earth or wherever it is meant to be. They did not think like that at all. So suggesting it is is not true, and the bases of 2x2ism is if you dont see it like us, your off to hell. It's not true. It wasn't true then, it isn't true now. When Jesus talked about Hell they knew exactly where, as in Ghenna the town rubbish dump or the grave or some sort of condition of heart here and now. So I stand by my words, calling 2x2ism "the truth" is dishonest because you are not going to hell and burn if you don't see it like they do, period. Also, I fail to see how "the truth" can be associated with CSA, that is not truth, I see somewhere today Nathan talking about workers getting CSA guidance or words to that effect, I mean really, "the truth" needs that?. Has the actual truth stooped that low it needs help with CSA. What a joke. I will say it again, My belief is not based in the supernatural, It is Christ is the best way to live your life. Full stop. The unatural events surrounding Christ hold some meaning for people to die spreading the Gospel story, I cannot prove Christ literally was virgin born or rose from the dead, the disciples saw something in the Character of Christ and the events that were supposedly unatural, they thought was worth dying for, The Character of Christ is the best way to live your life, and in no way does this "living" mean religion, religous ritual, idol worship or anything else that pertains to religion. That has all been introduced by man. Living the best life to me is worth dying for, the disciples thought so, Im sure you would think so, many others to, Its just a pity man wants to control others and has taken something beatiful and butchered it for selfish gain. You can take me to task on the unatural events surrounding Christ, they dont offend me because something special happened, even if its not literal the hope Christ gave those in bondage is amazing to see when you can ditch religion and the image its created. This is nothing like the dishonesty of calling something like 2x2ism "the truth". It is real and living, and the world is getting better because of the Character of Christ lived out in people, even people who call themselves Atheists!. See if you can read this without the imagery created by religion. Praise the Lord, my soul; all my inmost being, praise his holy name.Praise the Lord, my soul, and forget not all his benefits—who forgives all your sins and heals all your diseases,who redeems your life from the pit and crowns you with love and compassion,who satisfies your desires with good things so that your youth is renewed like the eagle’s.The Lord works righteousness and justice for all the oppressed.He made known his ways to Moses, his deeds to the people of Israel:The Lord is compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, abounding in love.He will not always accuse, nor will he harbor his anger forever;he does not treat us as our sins deserve or repay us according to our iniquities.For as high as the heavens are above the earth, so great is his love for those who fear him;as far as the east is from the west, so far has he removed our transgressions from us.As a father has compassion on his children, so the Lord has compassion on those who fear him;for he knows how we are formed, he remembers that we are dust.The life of mortals is like grass, they flourish like a flower of the field;the wind blows over it and it is gone, and its place remembers it no more.But from everlasting to everlasting the Lord’s love is with those who fear him, and his righteousness with their children’s children —with those who keep his covenant and remember to obey his precepts.The Lord has established his throne in heaven, and his kingdom rules over all.Praise the Lord, you his angels, you mighty ones who do his bidding, who obey his word.Praise the Lord, all his heavenly hosts, you his servants who do his will.Praise the Lord, all his works everywhere in his dominion. Praise the Lord , my soul. - Psalm 103:1-22 Chuck, -you say this now: "I will say it again, My belief is not based in the supernatural, It is Christ is the best way to live your life. Full stop".
But you have said in the past:
I choose to believe in the miracles of Christ but am not offended by those who don't.
So, do you or don't you, believe in the "miracles of Christ?"
If you don't consider a miracle as "supernatural," then just what is it that you do consider "supernatural?"
definition of miracle
miracle
a surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency.
How about you adress what I actually say and answer at least one question before I attempt to answer anymore of yours. This trend is getting old.
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Post by speak on Jul 4, 2020 22:09:05 GMT -5
[/b][/quote] ** You can believe wherever you want, I believe Pastor Frank Stranges, Admiral Richard E. Byrd, Air Force Col. Billy Woodward and U.S. gov't geologist Phil S. Are telling the TRUTH of what he had see and witnessed. [/quote] Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them? What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ? What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said? Just seems to me that these men are being used to show us where Christ is when we already know where He is. Matthew 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. Matthew 24:26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel. John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [/quote] So, Speak... Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords.
[/quote] I sought of don't understand why you have neglected to answer the questions i posed? [/quote] I explained and answered your questions but it seems you don't understand or get it.[/quote] [/quote][/b]Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords. How is that the answer to [ What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ?] or [ What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said?] or [ Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them?]
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Post by speak on Jul 4, 2020 22:16:21 GMT -5
It is not a solid place like the earth or one of the planets, we don't need such when we dead in the earthly body it is completely spiritual. I don't know.... is it? (completely spiritual) New Heaven, New earth, incorruptible body, many mansions.. the book of Revelations is of very tangible, solid stuff. To me it's pretty much a cop out to say, - well, it's beyond our understanding. Trust in me, I believe you'll like it. Comes down from Heaven which is completely Spiritual which is not beyond the understanding we are given. But I don't know how you think I don't understand?
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Post by nathan on Jul 4, 2020 22:28:47 GMT -5
[/b][/quote] ** You can believe wherever you want, I believe Pastor Frank Stranges, Admiral Richard E. Byrd, Air Force Col. Billy Woodward and U.S. gov't geologist Phil S. Are telling the TRUTH of what he had see and witnessed. [/quote] Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them? What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ? What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said? Just seems to me that these men are being used to show us where Christ is when we already know where He is. Matthew 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. Matthew 24:26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel. John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [/quote] So, Speak... Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords.
[/quote] I sought of don't understand why you have neglected to answer the questions i posed? [/quote] I explained and answered your questions but it seems you don't understand or get it.[/quote] [/quote][/b]Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords. How is that the answer to [ What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ?] They are here to tell us that the humans are NOT alone in the Universe... There will be work to be done when Jesus Returns to reign and rule in the Universe as King of kings. We will share the gospel of Christ as God/Yahweh of the Universe to other intelligence beings out there who had NOT heard about God the Father, Christ our Savior and Holy Spirit. [ What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said?] Jesus did not tell us a whole lot about E.T. beside the humans that He had created throughout the trillions galaxies.
or [ Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them?] Not in the Bible but through the writings of the Dead Sea Scrolls.
[/quote]
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Post by Grant on Jul 4, 2020 22:44:48 GMT -5
No it's not in the Dead Sea Sea scrolls. Frank Stranges made up his interpretation of them also. He never had access to them but claimed God revealed what was in them to him. That is what you have said on this board so are you now denying this.
Seems as if you'd believe this Stranges guy over and above the workers. He wasn't part of the ministry so why would you follow his teachings.
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Post by fixit on Jul 5, 2020 1:12:29 GMT -5
So, Speak... Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords. You seem to have great difficulty discerning between spiritual and physical. I don't know how I can help you.
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Post by fixit on Jul 5, 2020 1:19:16 GMT -5
All of this confusion reinforces, at least for me, the importance of Cherie's work to professionally document W&F history beginning with William Irvine's ministry. Truth can be rather inconvenient, but to worship God in truth we must rise above what is not true. Lies or untruths or partial truths have no part in true worship. God is spirit. To worship God in spirit we must rise above what we see and handle. When our worship is centered around physical things it is idolatry. John 4:23 But the time is coming—indeed it’s here now—when true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and in truth. The Father is looking for those who will worship him that way. 24 For God is Spirit, so those who worship him must worship in spirit and in truth. ** As a 2x2 elder you don't truly/ fully understand Jesus and the apostles/workers New Testament teachings. You're entitled to your opinion. Luke 6:26 Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.
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Post by speak on Jul 5, 2020 1:56:03 GMT -5
[/b][/quote] ** You can believe wherever you want, I believe Pastor Frank Stranges, Admiral Richard E. Byrd, Air Force Col. Billy Woodward and U.S. gov't geologist Phil S. Are telling the TRUTH of what he had see and witnessed. [/quote] Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them? What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ? What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said? Just seems to me that these men are being used to show us where Christ is when we already know where He is. Matthew 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. Matthew 24:26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel. John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [/quote] So, Speak... Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords.
[/quote] I sought of don't understand why you have neglected to answer the questions i posed? [/quote] I explained and answered your questions but it seems you don't understand or get it.[/quote] [/quote][/b]Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords. How is that the answer to [ What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ?] They are here to tell us that the humans are NOT alone in the Universe... There will be work to be done when Jesus Returns to reign and rule in the Universe as King of kings. We will share the gospel of Christ as God/Yahweh of the Universe to other intelligence beings out there who had NOT heard about God the Father, Christ our Savior and Holy Spirit. [ What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said?] Jesus did not tell us a whole lot about E.T. beside the humans that He had created throughout the trillions galaxies.
or [ Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them?] Not in the Bible but through the writings of the Dead Sea Scrolls.
[/quote] [/quote] Why do you think Jesus didn't tell us these things? And what importance do you think Jesus has placed upon what He has not told us? Do you consider the dead sea scrolls are written with the blessing of God? Don't you think that Jesus would have told us things if they were so important for salvation? Or is it that they are not?
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Post by Lee on Jul 5, 2020 7:49:33 GMT -5
I don't know.... is it? (completely spiritual) New Heaven, New earth, incorruptible body, many mansions.. the book of Revelations is of very tangible, solid stuff. To me it's pretty much a cop out to say, - well, it's beyond our understanding. Trust in me, I believe you'll like it. Comes down from Heaven which is completely Spiritual which is not beyond the understanding we are given. But I don't know how you think I don't understand? What if it was our destiny to be corporeal? I’ve always suspected the desire to be wholly spiritual of the desire to be holy God.
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Post by Annan on Jul 5, 2020 7:50:23 GMT -5
A bright morning star is a star that outshines all the others. Jesus, as God incarnate, the Lord of the universe, is the BRIGHT and morning star. Jesus is the most holy and powerful light in all the universe. Jesus is the light of the world (John 9:5). Only Jesus’ light is bright and self-existent. Jesus Christ, the light of the world.Paraphrased from www.gotquestions.org/morning-star.html
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Post by Lee on Jul 5, 2020 7:53:31 GMT -5
I was looking at Venus this morning. Noticing its phase, it must be occupied by communists.
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Post by nathan on Jul 5, 2020 9:19:31 GMT -5
So, Speak... Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords. You seem to have great difficulty discerning between spiritual and physical. I don't know how I can help you. Both sides Physical and Spirit side exist for millions and billions of years before God and Christ created the humans.
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Post by nathan on Jul 5, 2020 9:55:54 GMT -5
Jesus is alive and living interior planet is mentioned in Rev.22:15-16... This is the home they created where they God the Father, Christ, the Holy Spirit and all of the good angels of God abide/ the Center of the Universe. Rev 22:15-16 doesn't say anything about a planet, Venus or a planet/Venus being the home God created where they now live. You've just made it all up.
I did NOT make up these things, RossB. Valiant Thor The Human Alien From Venus, Washington D.C. V.I.P. During Late 50's
The Valiant Thor Landing 002741-57 Room 4D-717 Project Blue Book
April, 1957 During the winter of 1956-57, the Washington, D.C. area was extremely cold, but it was a good feeling to be working in a high security position in the Pentagon. I lived only a short distance away in Georgetown, the old section of the Nation's Capital. Senator John F. Kennedy lived on "O" Street just a block away from our house on Prospect. During a successful tour with the U.S. Naval Ceremonial Honor Guard, we had met with astronauts Glen Cooper, Wally Sherrar, who were the first wave of successful space travelers. Also we had visited the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier numerous times. It seemed like every time a visiting dignitary came to Washington, they lay a wreath at the tomb. We had met the Queen of England several times at the airport, as these were some of the duties I performed as a young officer in the Navy. After carrying the 2-Star flag at the funeral of my late uncle, Rear Admiral Richard E. Byrd, I was recommended for a security clearance and was granted a Top Secret Clearance after a lengthy six-month background study (B1 complete 1957). After being transferred to the Chief of Naval Information (CHINFO), I worked in the Security Clearance section before being indoctrinated into the branch office of the Air Force called PROJECT BLUE BOOK. It was a joint service office; that is, two Marines, two Army, two Navy and three Air Force officers. The work was routine, opening incoming mail, sorting out what was called actual sightings as opposed to many fake UFO photos. We also acted as a Public Information Office (PIO), much like a public relations office. Every publisher's dream was to get the real low down on the UFO situation, which was suppressed by the group that dictated national policy on the UFO matter. In mid March, 1957, we received an urgent message from the Alexandria Police Department. The message indicated that two of their on-duty police officers had picked up an alien who had landed some 14 miles south of Pentagon Boulevard, and the occupant was transported to the Pentagon to meet with the Under Secretary of Defense and then shuttled underground to meet with President Eisenhower and Vice President Richard Nixon. The meeting lasted for nearly an hour and then, the alien visitor was put on VIP status and was shuttled back to the Pentagon where he spent the night in the Army reception office on the first floor near the concourse. This alien's name was Valiant Thor.
Commander James was on duty at the Security Clearance and Review for the branch officer of the Project Blue Book. He oversaw the meeting through official channels and reported the landing and meeting of the "space emissary", as he was labeled by the Department of Defense, to a governing group of high military officials including Secretary of Defense F.F. Forestall and other scientific men of which there were twelve. They in turn made recommendations to the President and Cabinet members, the CIA, FBI, NSA, and so on. The landing of Valiant Thor was perhaps the first documented landing of a human-type alien by military officials. He contacted an individual in the Pentagon who was an advocate of the UFO alien situation. "Nancy Warren" in turn contacted a minister, who was also a private investigator and theologian, a Dr. Frank E. Stranges, who then met with this individual. Dr. Stranges had been a guest speaker at the National Evangelistic Center for two weeks. Val Thor landed in Alexandria and met with the President to discuss the world's problems and offer advice and counsel on how to deal with and eliminate them. Safe to say that the problems he was discussing were more complex than savings bonds. He indicated to Mr. Eisenhower that the world was in a precarious situation and that if the world continued to proceed on a war footing - it would cause an economic imbalance throughout the world. Val Thor stayed on Earth until March 16, 1960, and then disembarked to his home planet Venus. He indicated that his race of people lived and dwelled underground and that many of the planets throughout the universe sustain life in this same manner. He also mentioned the waves of aliens who would land around the world to help with the Earth's seemingly insurmountable problems. He stated that a group from a distant planetary system would be coming to give aid and data to help the Earth's progress. Val Thor spoke of Christ's presence in the universe and that it was heartwarming to see Christ's advanced teaching continuing. This visitation at the Pentagon marks perhaps a new era in knowledge, wisdom and understanding on our planet.
- Harley Andrew Byrd (the grandson of Admiral Richard E. Byrd)
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Post by Annan on Jul 5, 2020 10:02:28 GMT -5
Rev 22:15-16 doesn't say anything about a planet, Venus or a planet/Venus being the home God created where they now live. You've just made it all up.
I did NOT make up these things, RossB. Valiant Thor The Human Alien From Venus, Washington D.C. V.I.P. During Late 50's
The Valiant Thor Landing 002741-57 Room 4D-717 Project Blue Book
April, 1957 During the winter of 1956-57, the Washington, D.C. area was extremely cold, but it was a good feeling to be working in a high security position in the Pentagon. I lived only a short distance away in Georgetown, the old section of the Nation's Capital. Senator John F. Kennedy lived on "O" Street just a block away from our house on Prospect. During a successful tour with the U.S. Naval Ceremonial Honor Guard, we had met with astronauts Glen Cooper, Wally Sherrar, who were the first wave of successful space travelers. Also we had visited the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier numerous times. It seemed like every time a visiting dignitary came to Washington, they lay a wreath at the tomb. We had met the Queen of England several times at the airport, as these were some of the duties I performed as a young officer in the Navy. After carrying the 2-Star flag at the funeral of my late uncle, Rear Admiral Richard E. Byrd, I was recommended for a security clearance and was granted a Top Secret Clearance after a lengthy six-month background study (B1 complete 1957). After being transferred to the Chief of Naval Information (CHINFO), I worked in the Security Clearance section before being indoctrinated into the branch office of the Air Force called PROJECT BLUE BOOK. It was a joint service office; that is, two Marines, two Army, two Navy and three Air Force officers. The work was routine, opening incoming mail, sorting out what was called actual sightings as opposed to many fake UFO photos. We also acted as a Public Information Office (PIO), much like a public relations office. Every publisher's dream was to get the real low down on the UFO situation, which was suppressed by the group that dictated national policy on the UFO matter. In mid March, 1957, we received an urgent message from the Alexandria Police Department. The message indicated that two of their on-duty police officers had picked up an alien who had landed some 14 miles south of Pentagon Boulevard, and the occupant was transported to the Pentagon to meet with the Under Secretary of Defense and then shuttled underground to meet with President Eisenhower and Vice President Richard Nixon. The meeting lasted for nearly an hour and then, the alien visitor was put on VIP status and was shuttled back to the Pentagon where he spent the night in the Army reception office on the first floor near the concourse. This alien's name was Valiant Thor.
Commander James was on duty at the Security Clearance and Review for the branch officer of the Project Blue Book. He oversaw the meeting through official channels and reported the landing and meeting of the "space emissary", as he was labeled by the Department of Defense, to a governing group of high military officials including Secretary of Defense F.F. Forestall and other scientific men of which there were twelve. They in turn made recommendations to the President and Cabinet members, the CIA, FBI, NSA, and so on. The landing of Valiant Thor was perhaps the first documented landing of a human-type alien by military officials. He contacted an individual in the Pentagon who was an advocate of the UFO alien situation. "Nancy Warren" in turn contacted a minister, who was also a private investigator and theologian, a Dr. Frank E. Stranges, who then met with this individual. Dr. Stranges had been a guest speaker at the National Evangelistic Center for two weeks. Val Thor landed in Alexandria and met with the President to discuss the world's problems and offer advice and counsel on how to deal with and eliminate them. Safe to say that the problems he was discussing were more complex than savings bonds. He indicated to Mr. Eisenhower that the world was in a precarious situation and that if the world continued to proceed on a war footing - it would cause an economic imbalance throughout the world. Val Thor stayed on Earth until March 16, 1960, and then disembarked to his home planet Venus. He indicated that his race of people lived and dwelled underground and that many of the planets throughout the universe sustain life in this same manner. He also mentioned the waves of aliens who would land around the world to help with the Earth's seemingly insurmountable problems. He stated that a group from a distant planetary system would be coming to give aid and data to help the Earth's progress. Val Thor spoke of Christ's presence in the universe and that it was heartwarming to see Christ's advanced teaching continuing. This visitation at the Pentagon marks perhaps a new era in knowledge, wisdom and understanding on our planet.
- Harley Andrew Byrd (the grandson of Admiral Richard E. Byrd) **So what's the purpose of posting this on two different threads, Nathan? Do you not remember that was proven to be a lie that Harley is Admiral Byrd's grandson? You must have a very short memory or you are hoping it was forgotten about. Someone's a liar, Nathan. You or Harley? professing.proboards.com/thread/24559/god-deal-non-truthers?page=5
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 5, 2020 17:08:26 GMT -5
Nathan's cloud is becoming quite a whirlwind.
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Post by speak on Jul 5, 2020 17:43:08 GMT -5
Comes down from Heaven which is completely Spiritual which is not beyond the understanding we are given. But I don't know how you think I don't understand? What if it was our destiny to be corporeal? I’ve always suspected the desire to be wholly spiritual of the desire to be holy God. Well then the case would be that we would be so [bodily fleshly carnal corporal human mortal earthly] with no hope of attaining the heavenly realm which is Holy.
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Post by Lee on Jul 5, 2020 18:23:42 GMT -5
Are they mutually exclusive?
If so, God’s grace is insufficient on its own to supply our calling and sanctification.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2020 19:15:36 GMT -5
I don't know.... is it? (completely spiritual) New Heaven, New earth, incorruptible body, many mansions.. the book of Revelations is of very tangible, solid stuff. To me it's pretty much a cop out to say, - well, it's beyond our understanding. Trust in me, I believe you'll like it. Comes down from Heaven which is completely Spiritual which is not beyond the understanding we are given. But I don't know how you think I don't understand? Hi Speak, Sorry about any poorly worded sentences if it implied you don't understand. I don't know if you do or don't, or to what detail or depth you do or not. My comment "... it's beyond our understanding. Trust in me, I believe you'll like it." It being heaven or the hereafter. What I express has unfortunately been the ultimate answer I've most often received when I try to enquire more deeply and specifically about the hereafter. fwiw, I can easily believe that there is physical everything, with the ability to lay it aside, I also believe that our thoughts and feelings, our spirit, will be as open and apparent to one another as our physical being. In other words, you won't be able to hide any thought or feeling or attitude. But these are just my amalgamations.
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Post by fixit on Jul 6, 2020 14:34:14 GMT -5
Rev 22:15-16 doesn't say anything about a planet, Venus or a planet/Venus being the home God created where they now live. You've just made it all up.
I did NOT make up these things, RossB. Valiant Thor The Human Alien From Venus, Washington D.C. V.I.P. During Late 50's
The Valiant Thor Landing 002741-57 Room 4D-717 Project Blue Book
April, 1957 During the winter of 1956-57, the Washington, D.C. area was extremely cold, but it was a good feeling to be working in a high security position in the Pentagon. I lived only a short distance away in Georgetown, the old section of the Nation's Capital. Senator John F. Kennedy lived on "O" Street just a block away from our house on Prospect. During a successful tour with the U.S. Naval Ceremonial Honor Guard, we had met with astronauts Glen Cooper, Wally Sherrar, who were the first wave of successful space travelers. Also we had visited the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier numerous times. It seemed like every time a visiting dignitary came to Washington, they lay a wreath at the tomb. We had met the Queen of England several times at the airport, as these were some of the duties I performed as a young officer in the Navy. After carrying the 2-Star flag at the funeral of my late uncle, Rear Admiral Richard E. Byrd, I was recommended for a security clearance and was granted a Top Secret Clearance after a lengthy six-month background study (B1 complete 1957). After being transferred to the Chief of Naval Information (CHINFO), I worked in the Security Clearance section before being indoctrinated into the branch office of the Air Force called PROJECT BLUE BOOK. It was a joint service office; that is, two Marines, two Army, two Navy and three Air Force officers. The work was routine, opening incoming mail, sorting out what was called actual sightings as opposed to many fake UFO photos. We also acted as a Public Information Office (PIO), much like a public relations office. Every publisher's dream was to get the real low down on the UFO situation, which was suppressed by the group that dictated national policy on the UFO matter. In mid March, 1957, we received an urgent message from the Alexandria Police Department. The message indicated that two of their on-duty police officers had picked up an alien who had landed some 14 miles south of Pentagon Boulevard, and the occupant was transported to the Pentagon to meet with the Under Secretary of Defense and then shuttled underground to meet with President Eisenhower and Vice President Richard Nixon. The meeting lasted for nearly an hour and then, the alien visitor was put on VIP status and was shuttled back to the Pentagon where he spent the night in the Army reception office on the first floor near the concourse. This alien's name was Valiant Thor.
Commander James was on duty at the Security Clearance and Review for the branch officer of the Project Blue Book. He oversaw the meeting through official channels and reported the landing and meeting of the "space emissary", as he was labeled by the Department of Defense, to a governing group of high military officials including Secretary of Defense F.F. Forestall and other scientific men of which there were twelve. They in turn made recommendations to the President and Cabinet members, the CIA, FBI, NSA, and so on. The landing of Valiant Thor was perhaps the first documented landing of a human-type alien by military officials. He contacted an individual in the Pentagon who was an advocate of the UFO alien situation. "Nancy Warren" in turn contacted a minister, who was also a private investigator and theologian, a Dr. Frank E. Stranges, who then met with this individual. Dr. Stranges had been a guest speaker at the National Evangelistic Center for two weeks. Val Thor landed in Alexandria and met with the President to discuss the world's problems and offer advice and counsel on how to deal with and eliminate them. Safe to say that the problems he was discussing were more complex than savings bonds. He indicated to Mr. Eisenhower that the world was in a precarious situation and that if the world continued to proceed on a war footing - it would cause an economic imbalance throughout the world. Val Thor stayed on Earth until March 16, 1960, and then disembarked to his home planet Venus. He indicated that his race of people lived and dwelled underground and that many of the planets throughout the universe sustain life in this same manner. He also mentioned the waves of aliens who would land around the world to help with the Earth's seemingly insurmountable problems. He stated that a group from a distant planetary system would be coming to give aid and data to help the Earth's progress. Val Thor spoke of Christ's presence in the universe and that it was heartwarming to see Christ's advanced teaching continuing. This visitation at the Pentagon marks perhaps a new era in knowledge, wisdom and understanding on our planet.
- Harley Andrew Byrd (the grandson of Admiral Richard E. Byrd) You're quoting science fiction again Nathan: Valient Thor landed in AlexandriaWhy don't you find a science fiction forum to discuss this stuff on?
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Post by speak on Jul 6, 2020 16:01:04 GMT -5
[/b][/quote] ** You can believe wherever you want, I believe Pastor Frank Stranges, Admiral Richard E. Byrd, Air Force Col. Billy Woodward and U.S. gov't geologist Phil S. Are telling the TRUTH of what he had see and witnessed. [/quote] Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them? What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ? What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said? Just seems to me that these men are being used to show us where Christ is when we already know where He is. Matthew 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. Matthew 24:26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel. John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [/quote] So, Speak... Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords.
[/quote] I sought of don't understand why you have neglected to answer the questions i posed? [/quote] I explained and answered your questions but it seems you don't understand or get it.[/quote] [/quote][/b]Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords. How is that the answer to [ What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ?] They are here to tell us that the humans are NOT alone in the Universe... There will be work to be done when Jesus Returns to reign and rule in the Universe as King of kings. We will share the gospel of Christ as God/Yahweh of the Universe to other intelligence beings out there who had NOT heard about God the Father, Christ our Savior and Holy Spirit. [ What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said?] Jesus did not tell us a whole lot about E.T. beside the humans that He had created throughout the trillions galaxies.
or [ Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them?] Not in the Bible but through the writings of the Dead Sea Scrolls.
[/quote] [/quote] I was wondering why you had missed these questions? If you are unable then that is fine.Why do you think Jesus didn't tell us these things? And what importance do you think Jesus has placed upon what He has not told us? Do you consider the dead sea scrolls are written with the blessing of God? Don't you think that Jesus would have told us things if they were so important for salvation? Or is it that they are not?
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Post by nathan on Jul 6, 2020 16:15:54 GMT -5
I did NOT make up these things, RossB. Valiant Thor The Human Alien From Venus, Washington D.C. V.I.P. During Late 50's
The Valiant Thor Landing 002741-57 Room 4D-717 Project Blue Book
April, 1957 During the winter of 1956-57, the Washington, D.C. area was extremely cold, but it was a good feeling to be working in a high security position in the Pentagon. I lived only a short distance away in Georgetown, the old section of the Nation's Capital. Senator John F. Kennedy lived on "O" Street just a block away from our house on Prospect. During a successful tour with the U.S. Naval Ceremonial Honor Guard, we had met with astronauts Glen Cooper, Wally Sherrar, who were the first wave of successful space travelers. Also we had visited the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier numerous times. It seemed like every time a visiting dignitary came to Washington, they lay a wreath at the tomb. We had met the Queen of England several times at the airport, as these were some of the duties I performed as a young officer in the Navy. After carrying the 2-Star flag at the funeral of my late uncle, Rear Admiral Richard E. Byrd, I was recommended for a security clearance and was granted a Top Secret Clearance after a lengthy six-month background study (B1 complete 1957). After being transferred to the Chief of Naval Information (CHINFO), I worked in the Security Clearance section before being indoctrinated into the branch office of the Air Force called PROJECT BLUE BOOK. It was a joint service office; that is, two Marines, two Army, two Navy and three Air Force officers. The work was routine, opening incoming mail, sorting out what was called actual sightings as opposed to many fake UFO photos. We also acted as a Public Information Office (PIO), much like a public relations office. Every publisher's dream was to get the real low down on the UFO situation, which was suppressed by the group that dictated national policy on the UFO matter. In mid March, 1957, we received an urgent message from the Alexandria Police Department. The message indicated that two of their on-duty police officers had picked up an alien who had landed some 14 miles south of Pentagon Boulevard, and the occupant was transported to the Pentagon to meet with the Under Secretary of Defense and then shuttled underground to meet with President Eisenhower and Vice President Richard Nixon. The meeting lasted for nearly an hour and then, the alien visitor was put on VIP status and was shuttled back to the Pentagon where he spent the night in the Army reception office on the first floor near the concourse. This alien's name was Valiant Thor.
Commander James was on duty at the Security Clearance and Review for the branch officer of the Project Blue Book. He oversaw the meeting through official channels and reported the landing and meeting of the "space emissary", as he was labeled by the Department of Defense, to a governing group of high military officials including Secretary of Defense F.F. Forestall and other scientific men of which there were twelve. They in turn made recommendations to the President and Cabinet members, the CIA, FBI, NSA, and so on. The landing of Valiant Thor was perhaps the first documented landing of a human-type alien by military officials. He contacted an individual in the Pentagon who was an advocate of the UFO alien situation. "Nancy Warren" in turn contacted a minister, who was also a private investigator and theologian, a Dr. Frank E. Stranges, who then met with this individual. Dr. Stranges had been a guest speaker at the National Evangelistic Center for two weeks. Val Thor landed in Alexandria and met with the President to discuss the world's problems and offer advice and counsel on how to deal with and eliminate them. Safe to say that the problems he was discussing were more complex than savings bonds. He indicated to Mr. Eisenhower that the world was in a precarious situation and that if the world continued to proceed on a war footing - it would cause an economic imbalance throughout the world. Val Thor stayed on Earth until March 16, 1960, and then disembarked to his home planet Venus. He indicated that his race of people lived and dwelled underground and that many of the planets throughout the universe sustain life in this same manner. He also mentioned the waves of aliens who would land around the world to help with the Earth's seemingly insurmountable problems. He stated that a group from a distant planetary system would be coming to give aid and data to help the Earth's progress. Val Thor spoke of Christ's presence in the universe and that it was heartwarming to see Christ's advanced teaching continuing. This visitation at the Pentagon marks perhaps a new era in knowledge, wisdom and understanding on our planet.
- Harley Andrew Byrd (the grandson of Admiral Richard E. Byrd) You're quoting science fiction again Nathan: Valient Thor landed in AlexandriaWhy don't you find a science fiction forum to discuss this stuff on? ** Why, don't you, Curly and others stop asking and posting these things on the main page? Or take the poll about Jesus from Venus and STOP being a 2x2 elder hypocrite.
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Post by speak on Jul 6, 2020 16:20:50 GMT -5
** Why, don't you, Curly and others stop asking and posting these things on the main page? Or take the poll about Jesus from Venus and STOP being a 2x2 elder hypocrite.Nathan using words like I have highlighted bring no credibility to your story or yourself in fact they degrade you and your story.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jul 6, 2020 16:42:10 GMT -5
I have no clue what you are sprouting here, Chuck. Your non-2x2 exclusive belief is getting out of control and don't make any sense.
Well how could it make sense if you've never looked. I may be wrong on lots of things, but you sir suffer from the "dunning kruger effect". A bit of Hebrew knowledge shows this. You ask how I know this, It showed me how badly I was suffering from the "Dunning Kruger effect". I probably still am, but I can now recognise I am in no position to say Im exclusive, and someone is in or out based on what my idea of in or out is, because the scriptures wreck the 2x2ism idea of whos in and out. I can now also see the whole sky imagery of god is just made up by man and the scriptures show this progressive revelation to man. If you are ignorant of Hebrew knowledge none of this makes sense and you read the scriptures all literally. Hence why in your dunning kruger effect you can boldy claim people not like you will burn in a literal hell. It's not true. Thanks for that information. I had never heard of the "Dunning–Kruger effect " before.
In the field of psychology, the Dunning–Kruger effect is a cognitive bias in which people with low ability at a task overestimate their ability. It is related to the cognitive bias of illusory superiority and comes from the inability of people to recognize their lack of ability.
Dunning–Kruger effect - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
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Post by dmmichgood on Jul 6, 2020 17:00:20 GMT -5
Chuck, -you say this now: "I will say it again, My belief is not based in the supernatural, It is Christ is the best way to live your life. Full stop".
But you have said in the past:
"I choose to believe in the miracles of Christ but am not offended by those who don't."
So, do you or don't you, believe in the "miracles of Christ?"
If you don't consider a miracle as "supernatural," then just what is it that you do consider "supernatural?"
definition of miracle
miracle
a surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency.
How about you adress what I actually say and answer at least one question before I attempt to answer anymore of yours. This trend is getting old. I AM addressing what YOU actually say, Chuck!
I specifically quoted your exact statements!
Can't you see the quotation marks?
Are you denying that you said what I quoted you as saying?
Just what question of yours is it that you think I should answer?
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Post by nathan on Jul 6, 2020 19:09:39 GMT -5
1) Speak wrote: Why do you think Jesus didn't tell us these things? And what importance do you think Jesus has placed upon what He has not told us? Do you consider the dead sea scrolls are written with the blessing of God? Don't you think that Jesus would have told us things if they were so important for salvation? Or is it that they are not?
**** Jesus said these in the Dead Sea scrolls but people don't believe it is NOT include in the Bible. Just like the Jews, he came unto His own people and they receive Him NOT, it is the same today!
These Dead Sea Scrolls were to be released to the public but they had been withheld from us.
God and Christ KNOWS how to RELEASE the Dead Sea writtingsto the public to aware Christ's latest teachings to prepare us for His 2nd coming.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jul 6, 2020 19:20:13 GMT -5
1) Speak wrote: Why do you think Jesus didn't tell us these things? And what importance do you think Jesus has placed upon what He has not told us? Do you consider the dead sea scrolls are written with the blessing of God? Don't you think that Jesus would have told us things if they were so important for salvation? Or is it that they are not? **** Jesus said these in the Dead Sea scrolls but people don't believe it is NOT include in the Bible. Just like the Jews, he came unto His own people and they receive Him NOT, it is the same today! These Dead Sea Scrolls were to be released to the public but they had been withheld from us. God and Christ KNOWS how to RELEASE the Dead Sea writtingsto the public to aware Christ's latest teachings to prepare us for His 2nd coming. The dead sea scrolls you keep banging on about are a fraud.
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Post by nathan on Jul 6, 2020 20:36:26 GMT -5
1) Speak wrote: Why do you think Jesus didn't tell us these things? And what importance do you think Jesus has placed upon what He has not told us? Do you consider the dead sea scrolls are written with the blessing of God? Don't you think that Jesus would have told us things if they were so important for salvation? Or is it that they are not? **** Jesus said these in the Dead Sea scrolls but people don't believe it is NOT include in the Bible. Just like the Jews, he came unto His own people and they receive Him NOT, it is the same today! These Dead Sea Scrolls were to be released to the public but they had been withheld from us. God and Christ KNOWS how to RELEASE the Dead Sea writtingsto the public to aware Christ's latest teachings to prepare us for His 2nd coming. The dead sea scrolls you keep banging on about are a fraud. Let me repeat it again.... It's NOT a fraud but God's revelation to mankind through His Holy angels of God.
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