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Post by chuck on Jul 3, 2020 6:00:32 GMT -5
Were have I suggested if you do not see it like me you will burn in hell?. Were have I suggested CSA is associated with truth, because thats what 2x2ism does, they deny it of course but its rife with it, so I hardly see how they can claim to be "the truth" with that running rife, and claim to be "the truth" with sooooo much hypocrisy. I don't believe I have claimed to be "the truth" have I?. If I have I'll gladly address it?. Sure I dish out my opinion, just like others, but I am not bold enough to claim it's ultimate truth so therefore xyz will die a death of a 1000 cuts or whatever threats and bondage religon uses. What is your view of truth?. Oh, -you surely do "dish out" your opinion, -Chuck! Like telling wally "It's not "the truth" wally, that's very very dishonest."
Wally said : "through the website i use to have on 2x2's i helped about 24 people recontact the truth plus at least 1 other person was an outsider....don't know how it went for them but nevertheless i tried....
Why do you lambast him for that saying it is " being dishonest?"
You say that you don't believe that anyone will "burn in hell" nor some other beliefs that you discount as just stories. Yet you yourself still hang on to a supernatural part of Christianity when you say you believe in the birth and resurrection of Christ."
How can you denounce some people for their supernatural beliefs when you still hang onto some of your own?
PROVE IT! Reply Quick Reply Im unsure what your point is, I just said I give my opinion so repeating what I just said is silly. So you agree "the truth" is the truth then?. I say it is dishonest because nowhere does the scriptures support 2x2ism, as in if you dont join "the truth" you will burn in hell. The writers of Scripture in the NT would look at you like a looney for suggesting hell is some everlasting fire in the bowels of the earth or wherever it is meant to be. They did not think like that at all. So suggesting it is is not true, and the bases of 2x2ism is if you dont see it like us, your off to hell. It's not true. It wasn't true then, it isn't true now. When Jesus talked about Hell they knew exactly where, as in Ghenna the town rubbish dump or the grave or some sort of condition of heart here and now. So I stand by my words, calling 2x2ism "the truth" is dishonest because you are not going to hell and burn if you don't see it like they do, period. Also, I fail to see how "the truth" can be associated with CSA, that is not truth, I see somewhere today Nathan talking about workers getting CSA guidance or words to that effect, I mean really, "the truth" needs that?. Has the actual truth stooped that low it needs help with CSA. What a joke. I will say it again, My belief is not based in the supernatural, It is Christ is the best way to live your life. Full stop. The unatural events surrounding Christ hold some meaning for people to die spreading the Gospel story, I cannot prove Christ literally was virgin born or rose from the dead, the disciples saw something in the Character of Christ and the events that were supposedly unatural, they thought was worth dying for, The Character of Christ is the best way to live your life, and in no way does this "living" mean religion, religous ritual, idol worship or anything else that pertains to religion. That has all been introduced by man. Living the best life to me is worth dying for, the disciples thought so, Im sure you would think so, many others to, Its just a pity man wants to control others and has taken something beatiful and butchered it for selfish gain. You can take me to task on the unatural events surrounding Christ, they dont offend me because something special happened, even if its not literal the hope Christ gave those in bondage is amazing to see when you can ditch religion and the image its created. This is nothing like the dishonesty of calling something like 2x2ism "the truth". It is real and living, and the world is getting better because of the Character of Christ lived out in people, even people who call themselves Atheists!. See if you can read this without the imagery created by religion. Praise the Lord, my soul; all my inmost being, praise his holy name.Praise the Lord, my soul, and forget not all his benefits—who forgives all your sins and heals all your diseases,who redeems your life from the pit and crowns you with love and compassion,who satisfies your desires with good things so that your youth is renewed like the eagle’s.The Lord works righteousness and justice for all the oppressed.He made known his ways to Moses, his deeds to the people of Israel:The Lord is compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, abounding in love.He will not always accuse, nor will he harbor his anger forever;he does not treat us as our sins deserve or repay us according to our iniquities.For as high as the heavens are above the earth, so great is his love for those who fear him;as far as the east is from the west, so far has he removed our transgressions from us.As a father has compassion on his children, so the Lord has compassion on those who fear him;for he knows how we are formed, he remembers that we are dust.The life of mortals is like grass, they flourish like a flower of the field;the wind blows over it and it is gone, and its place remembers it no more.But from everlasting to everlasting the Lord’s love is with those who fear him, and his righteousness with their children’s children —with those who keep his covenant and remember to obey his precepts.The Lord has established his throne in heaven, and his kingdom rules over all.Praise the Lord, you his angels, you mighty ones who do his bidding, who obey his word.Praise the Lord, all his heavenly hosts, you his servants who do his will.Praise the Lord, all his works everywhere in his dominion. Praise the Lord , my soul. - Psalm 103:1-22
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Post by nathan on Jul 3, 2020 8:16:56 GMT -5
I WOULD NOT want to be in Cherie, Doug Parker and others like them standing before God in the Day of Judgment... thousands of 2x2s and who know how many people they have lead astray and AWAY from the Truth of Jesus in the 21st century through their anti-2x2 websites.
Peter wrote in II Peter 4:17-18 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
Don't worry about Doug - he is already with the Lord and trusted in Him completely. As a result he had complete assurance when he died that Christ's righteousness would cover his sins completely on the Day of Judgement. From my discussions with Cherie over the years, she also trusts in Christ for her future. Just focus on your own salvation as we are all asked to do. I didn't leave the 2x2's because of Doug or Cherie. I'm thankful for what they have written and recorded, but we made our own decision to leave because what the workers preach did not line up with the Bible in key areas. A relationship with Christ doesn't depend on membership of a particular group or church. It's a personal thing between Christ and the individual - always has been and always will be. Well, that is your/ex-2x2 opinion and some in the 2x2s feel about Cherie, Doug and MANY exes like them but MOST of the workers and friends believe the apposite... After death they and us will KNOW where we will end up.
There is MORE than just Christ and individual according to the teachings of Jesus and the apostles/workers... It's VERY imporant being part of God's New Testament sheep pen/fold/fellowship through the centuries. If you are NOT part of the New Testament fellowship/sheep pen then your SINS are NOT forgiven. I John 1:1-7 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; (for the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;) that which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full.
This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
Jesus said in Matt. 7:21-28 these people did NOT have God's approval because they do things their own way and preach a different than His teachings, which he has taught his apostles/workers.
" Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: and the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: and the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it. And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:
~~ A true born again believer MUST have all three MOST important thing: First Jesus Christ as your Savior. Secondly, personal individual relationship with the Godhead and lastly, be part fellowship of His/their New Testament sheep pen/fold then His blood will continually cleanse us daily.
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Post by Roselyn T on Jul 3, 2020 8:37:44 GMT -5
Don't worry about Doug - he is already with the Lord and trusted in Him completely. As a result he had complete assurance when he died that Christ's righteousness would cover his sins completely on the Day of Judgement. From my discussions with Cherie over the years, she also trusts in Christ for her future. Just focus on your own salvation as we are all asked to do. I didn't leave the 2x2's because of Doug or Cherie. I'm thankful for what they have written and recorded, but we made our own decision to leave because what the workers preach did not line up with the Bible in key areas. A relationship with Christ doesn't depend on membership of a particular group or church. It's a personal thing between Christ and the individual - always has been and always will be. Well, that is your/ex-2x2 opinion and some in the 2x2s feel about Cherie, Doug and MANY exes like them but MOST of the workers and friends believe the apposite... After death they and us will KNOW where we will end up.
There is MORE than just Christ and individual according to the teachings of Jesus and the apostles/workers... It's VERY imporant being part of God's New Testament sheep pen/fold/fellowship through the centuries. If you are NOT part of the New Testament fellowship/sheep pen then your SINS are NOT forgiven. I John 1:1-7 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; (for the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;) that which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full.
This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
Jesus said in Matt. 7:21-28 these people did NOT have God's approval because they do things their own way and preach a different than His teachings, which he has taught his apostles/workers.
" Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: and the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: and the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it. And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:
~~ A true born again believer MUST have all three MOST important thing: First Jesus Christ as your Savior. Secondly, personal individual relationship with the Godhead and lastly, be part fellowship of His/their New Testament sheep pen/fold then His blood will continually cleanse us daily.
Well nathan the F&Ws believe the opposite of what YOU DO ...so maybe you need to take your own advice !!! You are so busy finding fault with others yet are so blind to your own BS ideas !
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2020 9:39:59 GMT -5
I'm sure many people on here have been contacted from people over the years as a result of writing the books, websites etc. I guess Cherie and others lost count years ago. I WOULD NOT want to be in Cherie, Doug Parker and others like them standing before God in the Day of Judgment... thousands of 2x2s and who know how many people they have lead astray and AWAY from the Truth of Jesus in the 21st century through their anti-2x2 websites.
Peter wrote in II Peter 4:17-18 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
saying "I wouldn't want to be them in judgement" is judging. How do you not see that?
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Post by nathan on Jul 3, 2020 11:17:25 GMT -5
I WOULD NOT want to be in Cherie, Doug Parker and others like them standing before God in the Day of Judgment... thousands of 2x2s and who know how many people they have lead astray and AWAY from the Truth of Jesus in the 21st century through their anti-2x2 websites.
Peter wrote in II Peter 4:17-18 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
saying "I wouldn't want to be them in judgement" is judging. How do you not see that? *** That is the TRUTH, and if they KNEW the TRUTH now and REPENT and change then they escapse the Judgment of God. God And Christ are the JUDGES! Not me I am just a messenger sent here to warn, educate and inform people about these things.
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Post by Annan on Jul 3, 2020 14:44:00 GMT -5
saying "I wouldn't want to be them in judgement" is judging. How do you not see that? *** That is the TRUTH, and if they KNEW the TRUTH now and REPENT and change then they escapse the Judgment of God. God And Christ are the JUDGES! Not me I am just a messenger sent here to warn, educate and inform people about these things. ***You're a legend in your own mind, Nathan.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jul 3, 2020 14:51:24 GMT -5
So the impression I'm getting its the saints job to live quiet godly lives with in their place with hope that some one might ask them about their belief because they live and act differently like a Christian and it's the saints hope to help the outsider meet the workers who then try to explain and help the the outsider become saved. And that's not the saints responsibility. And the reason Wally and Nate are more active in this process is because they use to be workers. In 1 peter 3:15 Paul is encouraging the saints to be able to defend the hope that is with in them when they are asked. And in the most part that defense would be I can introduce you to the workers who can explain things to you. Is this correct. So there isn't much of a defense other than this? Except one case where family members helped another family member have an understanding and he became a part of the fellowship but no one understands how that happened because he hadn't met a worker yet and it normally doesn't happen that way. Ok thank you. nathan was a worker but not me i offered but was told no.... That's quite understandable.
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Post by nathan on Jul 3, 2020 15:08:53 GMT -5
nathan was a worker but not me i offered but was told no.... That's quite understandable. ** Wally, You would have made a wonderful worker, loyal companion and a steady 2x2 and you understand Jesus New Testament teachings. I wouldn't mind to be your companion if we were in the work.
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Post by fixit on Jul 3, 2020 15:42:40 GMT -5
That's quite understandable. ** Wally, You would have made a wonderful worker, loyal companion and a steady 2x2 and you understand Jesus New Testament teachings. I wouldn't mind to be your companion if we were in the wor. My understanding of Jesus New Testament teaching is that it's summed up quite well in the following scripture. Effective gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude, or they would be more usefully employed pumping petrol. Matthew 11:28 Then Jesus said, “Come to me, all of you who are weary and carry heavy burdens, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you. Let me teach you, because I am humble and gentle at heart, and you will find rest for your souls.
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Post by nathan on Jul 3, 2020 16:44:28 GMT -5
** Wally, You would have made a wonderful worker, loyal companion and a steady 2x2 and you understand Jesus New Testament teachings. I wouldn't mind to be your companion if we were in the wor. My understanding of Jesus New Testament teaching is that it's summed up quite well in the following scripture. Effective gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude, or they would be more usefully employed pumping petrol. Matthew 11:28 Then Jesus said, “Come to me, all of you who are weary and carry heavy burdens, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you. Let me teach you, because I am humble and gentle at heart, and you will find rest for your souls. ** There you go again making fun of my occupation like redback and you yourself an elder of 2x2 and claim to be humnle, quoting all kind of scriptures. Wow! Talking about a hypocrite.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jul 3, 2020 16:49:41 GMT -5
My understanding of Jesus New Testament teaching is that it's summed up quite well in the following scripture. Effective gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude, or they would be more usefully employed pumping petrol. Matthew 11:28 Then Jesus said, “Come to me, all of you who are weary and carry heavy burdens, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you. Let me teach you, because I am humble and gentle at heart, and you will find rest for your souls. ** There you go again making fun of my occupation like redback and you yourself an elder of 2x2 and claim to be humnle, quoting all kind of scriptures. Wow! Talking about a hypocrite. It says in the bible that you believe in that your god hates liars. Do you ever consider that verse when you talk about hollow planets, Frank Strange, Valiant Thor and Admiral Byrd. Or does that verse not apply to you?
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Post by fixit on Jul 3, 2020 17:08:20 GMT -5
My understanding of Jesus New Testament teaching is that it's summed up quite well in the following scripture. Effective gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude, or they would be more usefully employed pumping petrol. Matthew 11:28 Then Jesus said, “Come to me, all of you who are weary and carry heavy burdens, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you. Let me teach you, because I am humble and gentle at heart, and you will find rest for your souls. ** There you go again making fun of my occupation like redback and you yourself an elder of 2x2 and claim to be humnle, quoting all kind of scriptures. Wow! Talking about a hypocrite. I'm sorry that you interpreted that as making fun of your occupation. I didn't mean to do that. Retailing petrol is an important service. I could equally have said something like: Effective gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude, or they would be more usefully employed driving a truck. Or building houses. Or like me, punching keys on a keyboard. The point is, gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude to be effective.
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Post by nathan on Jul 3, 2020 17:14:34 GMT -5
** There you go again making fun of my occupation like redback and you yourself an elder of 2x2 and claim to be humnle, quoting all kind of scriptures. Wow! Talking about a hypocrite. It says in the bible that you believe in that your god hates liars. Do you ever consider that verse when you talk about hollow planets, Frank Strange, Valiant Thor and Admiral Byrd. Or does that verse not apply to you? ** I told you so MANY times already these men are NOT liars nor am I. You are accusing these men and myself liars when we are NOT.
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Post by nathan on Jul 3, 2020 17:22:45 GMT -5
** There you go again making fun of my occupation like redback and you yourself an elder of 2x2 and claim to be humnle, quoting all kind of scriptures. Wow! Talking about a hypocrite. I'm sorry that you interpreted that as making fun of your occupation. I didn't mean to do that. Retailing petrol is an important service. I could equally have said something like: Effective gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude, or they would be more usefully employed driving a truck. Or building houses. Or like me, punching keys on a keyboard. The point is, gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude to be effective. ** I am very gentle, caring person and patience for Jesus sake. If I wasn't nice I wouldn't continuing putting up all kinds of Baloney from MANY of you on TMB for over 20 years.
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Post by openingact34 on Jul 3, 2020 17:36:02 GMT -5
** There you go again making fun of my occupation like redback and you yourself an elder of 2x2 and claim to be humnle, quoting all kind of scriptures. Wow! Talking about a hypocrite. I'm sorry that you interpreted that as making fun of your occupation. I didn't mean to do that. Retailing petrol is an important service. I could equally have said something like: Effective gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude, or they would be more usefully employed driving a truck. Or building houses. Or like me, punching keys on a keyboard. The point is, gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude to be effective. There are many different useful places in the work. Some are good at preaching, filling people with fear that God is going to send them to hell and convincing people to profess. Others are good at organizing things, they are able to arrange and run conventions. Others are good at discipline. They can do difficult excommunications when necessary and make sure people maintain the right clothes and hair. Others are good in the homelife, making sure people know how to raise their children, what they should be cooking, how their furniture should be arranged, etc. Jesus had a couple of his disciples lug around weapons. I think Wally would have been very useful in the place of an armed gospel worker
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jul 3, 2020 18:43:32 GMT -5
It says in the bible that you believe in that your god hates liars. Do you ever consider that verse when you talk about hollow planets, Frank Strange, Valiant Thor and Admiral Byrd. Or does that verse not apply to you? ** I told you so MANY times already these men are NOT liars nor am I. You are accusing these men and myself liars when we are NOT. I have shown you so many times that you base your beliefs on lies and fiction. Believing them and repeating them may mean that you will burn in the everlasting lake of fire you believe in.
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Post by Annan on Jul 3, 2020 18:47:31 GMT -5
It says in the bible that you believe in that your god hates liars. Do you ever consider that verse when you talk about hollow planets, Frank Strange, Valiant Thor and Admiral Byrd. Or does that verse not apply to you? ** I told you so MANY times already these men are NOT liars nor am I. You are accusing these men and myself liars when we are NOT. **I for one am not calling you a liar, Nathan. I am calling the words of that stfange fellow lies. To quote the words of others is hearsay. No way you can prove it is eye witness testimony. [/b]
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Post by nathan on Jul 3, 2020 19:15:47 GMT -5
** I told you so MANY times already these men are NOT liars nor am I. You are accusing these men and myself liars when we are NOT. **I for one am not calling you a liar, Nathan. I am calling the words of that stfange fellow lies. To quote the words of others is hearsay. No way you can prove it is eye witness testimony. [/b][/quote] ** You can believe wherever you want, I believe Pastor Frank Stranges, Admiral Richard E. Byrd, Air Force Col. Billy Woodward and U.S. gov't geologist Phil S. Are telling the TRUTH of what he had see and witnessed.
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Post by speak on Jul 3, 2020 21:17:00 GMT -5
** There you go again making fun of my occupation like redback and you yourself an elder of 2x2 and claim to be humnle, quoting all kind of scriptures. Wow! Talking about a hypocrite. I'm sorry that you interpreted that as making fun of your occupation. I didn't mean to do that. Retailing petrol is an important service. I could equally have said something like: Effective gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude, or they would be more usefully employed driving a truck. Or building houses. Or like me, punching keys on a keyboard. The point is, gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude to be effective. I would go as far to say that Christians must reflect a humble and gentle attitude to be effective. In most respects we are no different for God has chosen us to be His children, some to preach the Gospel of His Son, but above all to be kind and love one another and our neighbours, none of us being exempt.
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Post by speak on Jul 3, 2020 21:20:55 GMT -5
I'm sorry that you interpreted that as making fun of your occupation. I didn't mean to do that. Retailing petrol is an important service. I could equally have said something like: Effective gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude, or they would be more usefully employed driving a truck. Or building houses. Or like me, punching keys on a keyboard. The point is, gospel workers must reflect a humble and gentle attitude to be effective. ** I am very gentle, caring person and patience for Jesus sake. If I wasn't nice I wouldn't continuing putting up all kinds of Baloney from MANY of you on TMB for over 20 years. Some of your wording could change a little to actually show that you are what you say you are. We are not given the luxury of showing disdain to others if we want to be the example of the Beloved One.
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Post by speak on Jul 3, 2020 21:40:21 GMT -5
**I for one am not calling you a liar, Nathan. I am calling the words of that stfange fellow lies. To quote the words of others is hearsay. No way you can prove it is eye witness testimony. [/b][/quote] ** You can believe wherever you want, I believe Pastor Frank Stranges, Admiral Richard E. Byrd, Air Force Col. Billy Woodward and U.S. gov't geologist Phil S. Are telling the TRUTH of what he had see and witnessed. [/quote] Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them? What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ? What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said? Just seems to me that these men are being used to show us where Christ is when we already know where He is. Matthew 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. Matthew 24:26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel. John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
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Post by nathan on Jul 3, 2020 22:44:08 GMT -5
[/b][/quote] ** You can believe wherever you want, I believe Pastor Frank Stranges, Admiral Richard E. Byrd, Air Force Col. Billy Woodward and U.S. gov't geologist Phil S. Are telling the TRUTH of what he had see and witnessed. [/quote] Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them? What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ? What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said? Just seems to me that these men are being used to show us where Christ is when we already know where He is. Matthew 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. Matthew 24:26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel. John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [/quote] So, Speak... Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords.
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Post by Ross.Bowden on Jul 3, 2020 22:44:50 GMT -5
Don't worry about Doug - he is already with the Lord and trusted in Him completely. As a result he had complete assurance when he died that Christ's righteousness would cover his sins completely on the Day of Judgement. From my discussions with Cherie over the years, she also trusts in Christ for her future. Just focus on your own salvation as we are all asked to do. I didn't leave the 2x2's because of Doug or Cherie. I'm thankful for what they have written and recorded, but we made our own decision to leave because what the workers preach did not line up with the Bible in key areas. A relationship with Christ doesn't depend on membership of a particular group or church. It's a personal thing between Christ and the individual - always has been and always will be. Well, that is your/ex-2x2 opinion and some in the 2x2s feel about Cherie, Doug and MANY exes like them but MOST of the workers and friends believe the apposite... After death they and us will KNOW where we will end up.
There is MORE than just Christ and individual according to the teachings of Jesus and the apostles/workers... It's VERY imporant being part of God's New Testament sheep pen/fold/fellowship through the centuries. If you are NOT part of the New Testament fellowship/sheep pen then your SINS are NOT forgiven. I John 1:1-7 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; (for the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;) that which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full.
This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
Jesus said in Matt. 7:21-28 these people did NOT have God's approval because they do things their own way and preach a different than His teachings, which he has taught his apostles/workers.
" Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: and the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: and the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it. And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:
~~ A true born again believer MUST have all three MOST important thing: First Jesus Christ as your Savior. Secondly, personal individual relationship with the Godhead and lastly, be part fellowship of His/their New Testament sheep pen/fold then His blood will continually cleanse us daily.
Actually all a person has to do is turn to Christ and accept Him as Lord and Saviour. They are born again with the Spirit which I assume you’ve overlooked. He adopts them as His children - they are part of His church, and we have the privilege of knowing and being right with the Father through Him. Of course there is more than just Christ and His finished work in your gospel. I think we know that by now. Quite different to the gospel Paul preached to the Gentiles (1 Cor 15).
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Post by nathan on Jul 3, 2020 22:46:49 GMT -5
Well, that is your/ex-2x2 opinion and some in the 2x2s feel about Cherie, Doug and MANY exes like them but MOST of the workers and friends believe the apposite... After death they and us will KNOW where we will end up.
There is MORE than just Christ and individual according to the teachings of Jesus and the apostles/workers... It's VERY imporant being part of God's New Testament sheep pen/fold/fellowship through the centuries. If you are NOT part of the New Testament fellowship/sheep pen then your SINS are NOT forgiven. I John 1:1-7 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; (for the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;) that which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full.
This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
Jesus said in Matt. 7:21-28 these people did NOT have God's approval because they do things their own way and preach a different than His teachings, which he has taught his apostles/workers.
" Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: and the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: and the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it. And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:
~~ A true born again believer MUST have all three MOST important thing: First Jesus Christ as your Savior. Secondly, personal individual relationship with the Godhead and lastly, be part fellowship of His/their New Testament sheep pen/fold then His blood will continually cleanse us daily.
Actually all a person has to do is turn to Christ and accept Him as Lord and Saviour. They are born again with the Spirit which I assume you’ve overlooked. He adopts them as His children - they are part of His church, and we have the privilege of knowing and being right with the Father through Him. Of course there is more than just Christ and His finished work in your gospel. I think we know that by now. Quite different to the gospel Paul preached to the Gentiles (1 Cor 15). Currently, You believe a different Jesus than what I read in the New Testament Church, that is your choice.
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Post by speak on Jul 4, 2020 0:39:11 GMT -5
[/b][/quote] ** You can believe wherever you want, I believe Pastor Frank Stranges, Admiral Richard E. Byrd, Air Force Col. Billy Woodward and U.S. gov't geologist Phil S. Are telling the TRUTH of what he had see and witnessed. [/quote] Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them? What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ? What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said? Just seems to me that these men are being used to show us where Christ is when we already know where He is. Matthew 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. Matthew 24:26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel. John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [/quote] So, Speak... Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords.
[/quote] Well Christ said my Father and I will come and dwell with you, so He is with us in us. This is what the Bible teaches. Christ is as the Father is a Spirit who does not dwell in a single place, He is waiting in our hearts, we see Him now and He will come again in the clouds.
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Post by nathan on Jul 4, 2020 2:05:35 GMT -5
[/b][/quote] ** You can believe wherever you want, I believe Pastor Frank Stranges, Admiral Richard E. Byrd, Air Force Col. Billy Woodward and U.S. gov't geologist Phil S. Are telling the TRUTH of what he had see and witnessed. [/quote] Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them? What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ? What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said? Just seems to me that these men are being used to show us where Christ is when we already know where He is. Matthew 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. Matthew 24:26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel. John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [/quote] So, Speak... Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords.
[/quote] Well Christ said my Father and I will come and dwell with you, so He is with us in us. This is what the Bible teaches. Christ is as the Father is a Spirit who does not dwell in a single place, He is waiting in our hearts, we see Him now and He will come again in the clouds.[/quote] What you said are TRUE. However, Jesus said He is with/sitting at His Father's right hand. He went back to heaven to prepare a place for the believers... Which place was Jesus talking about? Where does your and mine soul depart to AFTER we died?
There is a PLACE where God the Father, Christ and the Holy angels are LIVING together, with the Old and New Testament AFTER the believers/souls had died.... John the apostle saw that place when God took him there while he was on the island of Patmos.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jul 4, 2020 2:20:19 GMT -5
Oh, -you surely do "dish out" your opinion, -Chuck! Like telling wally "It's not "the truth" wally, that's very very dishonest."
Wally said : "through the website i use to have on 2x2's i helped about 24 people recontact the truth plus at least 1 other person was an outsider....don't know how it went for them but nevertheless i tried....
Why do you lambast him for that saying it is " being dishonest?"
You say that you don't believe that anyone will "burn in hell" nor some other beliefs that you discount as just stories. Yet you yourself still hang on to a supernatural part of Christianity when you say you believe in the birth and resurrection of Christ."
How can you denounce some people for their supernatural beliefs when you still hang onto some of your own?
Im unsure what your point is, I just said I give my opinion so repeating what I just said is silly. So you agree "the truth" is the truth then?. I say it is dishonest because nowhere does the scriptures support 2x2ism, as in if you dont join "the truth" you will burn in hell. The writers of Scripture in the NT would look at you like a looney for suggesting hell is some everlasting fire in the bowels of the earth or wherever it is meant to be. They did not think like that at all. So suggesting it is is not true, and the bases of 2x2ism is if you dont see it like us, your off to hell. It's not true. It wasn't true then, it isn't true now. When Jesus talked about Hell they knew exactly where, as in Ghenna the town rubbish dump or the grave or some sort of condition of heart here and now. So I stand by my words, calling 2x2ism "the truth" is dishonest because you are not going to hell and burn if you don't see it like they do, period. Also, I fail to see how "the truth" can be associated with CSA, that is not truth, I see somewhere today Nathan talking about workers getting CSA guidance or words to that effect, I mean really, "the truth" needs that?. Has the actual truth stooped that low it needs help with CSA. What a joke. I will say it again, My belief is not based in the supernatural, It is Christ is the best way to live your life. Full stop. The unatural events surrounding Christ hold some meaning for people to die spreading the Gospel story, I cannot prove Christ literally was virgin born or rose from the dead, the disciples saw something in the Character of Christ and the events that were supposedly unatural, they thought was worth dying for, The Character of Christ is the best way to live your life, and in no way does this "living" mean religion, religous ritual, idol worship or anything else that pertains to religion. That has all been introduced by man. Living the best life to me is worth dying for, the disciples thought so, Im sure you would think so, many others to, Its just a pity man wants to control others and has taken something beatiful and butchered it for selfish gain. You can take me to task on the unatural events surrounding Christ, they dont offend me because something special happened, even if its not literal the hope Christ gave those in bondage is amazing to see when you can ditch religion and the image its created. This is nothing like the dishonesty of calling something like 2x2ism "the truth". It is real and living, and the world is getting better because of the Character of Christ lived out in people, even people who call themselves Atheists!. See if you can read this without the imagery created by religion. Praise the Lord, my soul; all my inmost being, praise his holy name.Praise the Lord, my soul, and forget not all his benefits—who forgives all your sins and heals all your diseases,who redeems your life from the pit and crowns you with love and compassion,who satisfies your desires with good things so that your youth is renewed like the eagle’s.The Lord works righteousness and justice for all the oppressed.He made known his ways to Moses, his deeds to the people of Israel:The Lord is compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, abounding in love.He will not always accuse, nor will he harbor his anger forever;he does not treat us as our sins deserve or repay us according to our iniquities.For as high as the heavens are above the earth, so great is his love for those who fear him;as far as the east is from the west, so far has he removed our transgressions from us.As a father has compassion on his children, so the Lord has compassion on those who fear him;for he knows how we are formed, he remembers that we are dust.The life of mortals is like grass, they flourish like a flower of the field;the wind blows over it and it is gone, and its place remembers it no more.But from everlasting to everlasting the Lord’s love is with those who fear him, and his righteousness with their children’s children —with those who keep his covenant and remember to obey his precepts.The Lord has established his throne in heaven, and his kingdom rules over all.Praise the Lord, you his angels, you mighty ones who do his bidding, who obey his word.Praise the Lord, all his heavenly hosts, you his servants who do his will.Praise the Lord, all his works everywhere in his dominion. Praise the Lord , my soul. - Psalm 103:1-22 Chuck, -you say this now: "I will say it again, My belief is not based in the supernatural, It is Christ is the best way to live your life. Full stop".
But you have said in the past:
I choose to believe in the miracles of Christ but am not offended by those who don't.
So, do you or don't you, believe in the "miracles of Christ?"
If you don't consider a miracle as "supernatural," then just what is it that you do consider "supernatural?"
definition of miracle
miracle
a surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency.
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Post by speak on Jul 4, 2020 3:41:55 GMT -5
[/b][/quote] ** You can believe wherever you want, I believe Pastor Frank Stranges, Admiral Richard E. Byrd, Air Force Col. Billy Woodward and U.S. gov't geologist Phil S. Are telling the TRUTH of what he had see and witnessed. [/quote] Nathan I urge you to consider these verses and show where those people you have mentioned would be found in them? What is their place in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ? What does anything these men have said point us to Jesus other than what Jesus has already said? Just seems to me that these men are being used to show us where Christ is when we already know where He is. Matthew 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. Matthew 24:26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. Mark 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel. John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [/quote] So, Speak... Where do you THINK Christ is now? One of them telling us Where Jesus is right now and he is waiting for the time when God the Father will send Him back to earth to establish His earthly kingdom and to RULE with His believers, and Him as the King of kings and LORD of lords.
[/quote] I sought of don't understand why you have neglected to answer the questions i posed?
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