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Post by jetmech on Jul 1, 2020 12:38:37 GMT -5
" ... I do nothing of myself; but as my father has taught me ... " John 8:28 " ... and he that sent me is with me the father hath not left me alone, for I do those things that please him ..." John 8:29 If Jesus is GOD why would he be concerned with not doing what pleases himself but with what pleases GOD? "... I speak of that which I have seen with my father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father ..." John 6:38 If Jesus is GOD why would he compare the relationship between us and our fathers to him and his father? " ... Jesus said, I proceeded forth and came from GOD; neither came I of myself but he sent me ..." John 8: 42 If Jesus is GOD why would he say he "proceedeth forth and came FROM" GOD? " " ... and he said, Thou canst not see my face, for there shall no man see me, and live ..." ... It is my father that honoreth me ..." John 8:54 Would GOD honoreth himself?
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Post by nathan on Jul 1, 2020 21:34:27 GMT -5
The Father is God; Christ is God and the Holy Spirit also God= The Godhead/Trinity.
~~ God the Father is the Creator/Designer of the Universe and of all things, and Christ the Lord God is the Father Co-creator of all things also.
God the Father called to Christ/Son Lord and God. Heb. 1: 8-12 8 But unto the Son he saith, "Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows. And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands: They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment; And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail."
The 2nd century apostles.... From A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David W. Bercot
Hippolytus (205 A.D.) "Go and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." By this, He showed that whoever omits any one of them, fails in glorifying God perfectly. For it is through the TRINITY that the Father is glorified. For the Father willed, the Son did, and the Spirit manifested.
It is the Father who commands, and the Son who obeys, and the Holy Spirit who give understanding. The Father is above ALL, the Son is through ALL, and the Holy Spirit is in ALL. Paul the apostle explains that there is the exact same order within the TRINITY, saying, "I want you to know that the head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God." (I Cor. 11:3). So the Father has authority over the Son. The Son is sent by the Father; the Son does the will of the Father; and the Son sits at the Father's right hand. This hierarchy of order can not be reversed. Yet this hierarchy of order in no way diminishes the Son's divinity.
Tertullian (212 A.D.) For the very church itself is properly and principally the Spirit Himself, in whom is the TRINITY of the One Divinity: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
Cyprian (250 A.D.) Observing the third, sixth, and nineth month for a sacrament of the TRINITY, which was to be manifested in the last times. For the first hour in its progress to the third declared the completed number of the TRINITY. The TRINITY names of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. We are NOT ignorant that there is ONE God; and One Christ, the Lord; and One Holy Spirit. Jesus said, "Go therefore and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son, and Holy Spirit." He suggested that TRINITY, in whose sacrament the nations were to be baptized.
Origin (225 A.D.) Saving baptism was NOT complete except by the authority of the most excellent TRINITY of them all. That is, it is made complete by naming the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. In this, we join the name of the Holy Spirit to the Unbegotten God (the Father) and to His Only-begotten Son.
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Post by nathan on Jul 1, 2020 21:38:42 GMT -5
Here is what I read in Revelation chapter 1:8 Jesus said "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty."
Jesus said in both places Rev. 21:6-7 and Rev. 1:8 He is the Lord, the I am Alpha and Omega, and the Almighty/God.
In Revelation 19:11-13 He has eyes like blazing fire, and many royal crowns on His head. He has a name written on Him that only He Himself knows. He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and His name/Christ Jesus is The Word of God. The armies of heaven, dressed in fine linen, white and pure, follow Him on white horses.…
John the apostle wrote in John 1:1-3 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
~~ According to the Scriptures Both the Father and the Christ/the Son and the Holy Spirit are part the Godhead. The Father is God, so is the Christ/the Son and the Holy Spirit.
Acts 5:3-4 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land? Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2020 21:48:42 GMT -5
" ... I do nothing of myself; but as my father has taught me ... " John 8:28 " ... and he that sent me is with me the father hath not left me alone, for I do those things that please him ..." John 8:29 If Jesus is GOD why would he be concerned with not doing what pleases himself but with what pleases GOD? "... I speak of that which I have seen with my father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father ..." John 6:38 If Jesus is GOD why would he compare the relationship between us and our fathers to him and his father? " ... Jesus said, I proceeded forth and came from GOD; neither came I of myself but he sent me ..." John 8: 42 If Jesus is GOD why would he say he "proceedeth forth and came FROM" GOD? " ... It is my father that honoreth me ..." John 8:54 Would GOD honoreth himself? because he was in human form and subject to temptation the same as we are... because he came to be an example of what a son or daughter to God should be... because thats the being that God is 3 beings yet 1...
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Post by openingact34 on Jul 1, 2020 22:14:55 GMT -5
This song explains these kind of situations
Coming up next, I'm my own rape baby
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Post by chuck on Jul 1, 2020 23:10:54 GMT -5
" ... I do nothing of myself; but as my father has taught me ... " John 8:28 " ... and he that sent me is with me the father hath not left me alone, for I do those things that please him ..." John 8:29 If Jesus is GOD why would he be concerned with not doing what pleases himself but with what pleases GOD? "... I speak of that which I have seen with my father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father ..." John 6:38 If Jesus is GOD why would he compare the relationship between us and our fathers to him and his father? " ... Jesus said, I proceeded forth and came from GOD; neither came I of myself but he sent me ..." John 8: 42 If Jesus is GOD why would he say he "proceedeth forth and came FROM" GOD? " ... It is my father that honoreth me ..." John 8:54 Would GOD honoreth himself? What is your image of God?
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Post by chuck on Jul 1, 2020 23:31:21 GMT -5
" ... I do nothing of myself; but as my father has taught me ... " John 8:28 " ... and he that sent me is with me the father hath not left me alone, for I do those things that please him ..." John 8:29 If Jesus is GOD why would he be concerned with not doing what pleases himself but with what pleases GOD? "... I speak of that which I have seen with my father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father ..." John 6:38 If Jesus is GOD why would he compare the relationship between us and our fathers to him and his father? " ... Jesus said, I proceeded forth and came from GOD; neither came I of myself but he sent me ..." John 8: 42 If Jesus is GOD why would he say he "proceedeth forth and came FROM" GOD? " ... It is my father that honoreth me ..." John 8:54 Would GOD honoreth himself? because he was in human form and subject to temptation the same as we are... because he came to be an example of what a son or daughter to God should be... because thats the being that God is 3 beings yet 1... what sort of being?.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jul 1, 2020 23:45:00 GMT -5
One would have to have more of a vivid imagination than common sense to believe in anything in the bible.
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Post by chuck on Jul 1, 2020 23:54:23 GMT -5
One would have to have more of a vivid imagination than common sense to believe in anything in the bible. Like I said elsewhere, your perspective is from the one you were sold now don't believe. Do you believe you should treat people as you would like to be treated?. Do you believe that if you have more than plenty its right to to share with those that don't?. Do you believe someone that's a backstabber and when it comes back to bite him is living hell?.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jul 2, 2020 2:15:30 GMT -5
One would have to have more of a vivid imagination than common sense to believe in anything in the bible. Like I said elsewhere, your perspective is from the one you were sold now don't believe. Do you believe you should treat people as you would like to be treated?. Do you believe that if you have more than plenty its right to to share with those that don't?. Do you believe someone that's a backstabber and when it comes back to bite him is living hell?. But chuck, -were you not also a 2x2? Your own perspective is from the same which you were "sold" at one time but now apparently don't believe either!
Yet, you are still trying to retain the supernatural part of that same belief!
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Bigbiddy
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Post by Bigbiddy on Jul 2, 2020 3:38:50 GMT -5
How can you contemplate the thought that the God of the Old Testament is the same God (Jesus) of the new.
The trinity is a thought bubble of the Catholic Church.
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Post by chuck on Jul 2, 2020 5:04:39 GMT -5
Like I said elsewhere, your perspective is from the one you were sold now don't believe. Do you believe you should treat people as you would like to be treated?. Do you believe that if you have more than plenty its right to to share with those that don't?. Do you believe someone that's a backstabber and when it comes back to bite him is living hell?. But chuck, -were you not also a 2x2? Your own perspective is from the same which you were "sold" at one time but now apparently don't believe either!
Yet, you are still trying to retain the supernatural part of that same belief! No it's not from the perspective I was sold and Im still currently a 2x2. I you reread my comments you will see the supernatural is not the bases for my belief. But you argue from the bases of supernatural. I dont.
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Post by Ross.Bowden on Jul 2, 2020 8:27:06 GMT -5
The 2x2's have really dug themselves into a hole on who God is.
Historically, they believed that the Lord God was the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. There is absolutely no doubt on this point if you study sermons, hymns etc.
In the late 1960's this changed and most followed the Dan Hilton line that "the Trinity was a concoction of the Catholic Church". This all culminated in the hymn changes in the 1987 book. Very few workers now understand who the Lord God is but some, like Titus Lehman (Overseer of Colorado) still uphold and preach that Jesus is God (Mudgee Convention - Australia - 2016).
Most workers would understand though that thousands of people have left the 2x2's over the years re this issue. That trend continues.
That is why some churches (Mormons, JW's etc) are classified by Christian pastors as cults. A cult, from a Christian perspective is simply a church that claims to be based or rooted in historic Christianity, but has deviated from or abandoned the finished work of Christ, or compromised on his person.
Most workers have done this - a few haven't.
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Bigbiddy
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Post by Bigbiddy on Jul 2, 2020 19:41:25 GMT -5
In my view the God of the Old Testament was evil, corrupt and a murderer. He slew innocent children. He caused the deaths of an unknown but huge number of humans
The Christ of the New Testament was the opposite. He gave life. He did not take it.
When we talk of giving forgiveness to those who have fallen to earthly traits, and the inability of some to forgive, how can you forgive God for his deeds in the Old Testament,.
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Post by nathan on Jul 2, 2020 23:18:35 GMT -5
" ... I do nothing of myself; but as my father has taught me ... " John 8:28 " ... and he that sent me is with me the father hath not left me alone, for I do those things that please him ..." John 8:29 If Jesus is GOD why would he be concerned with not doing what pleases himself but with what pleases GOD? "... I speak of that which I have seen with my father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father ..." John 6:38 If Jesus is GOD why would he compare the relationship between us and our fathers to him and his father? " ... Jesus said, I proceeded forth and came from GOD; neither came I of myself but he sent me ..." John 8: 42 If Jesus is GOD why would he say he "proceedeth forth and came FROM" GOD? " ... It is my father that honoreth me ..." John 8:54 Would GOD honoreth himself? because he was in human form and subject to temptation the same as we are... because he came to be an example of what a son or daughter to God should be... because thats the being that God is 3 beings yet 1... One Godhead but 3 Supreme beings God the Father, Christ the LORD our God and Savior and the Holy Spirit our Teacher, Protector and Guide us to understand the Godhead functions, and each has a role to play in our Salvation. Just like the word Family/plural= Father, Mother and their children, grand children and great, great grand children.
There are THREE but they are ONENESS in Unity, Harmony, and mind and agreement as One Godhead . John wrote in I John 5: 7-8 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
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Post by nathan on Jul 2, 2020 23:41:15 GMT -5
In my view the God of the Old Testament was evil, corrupt and a murderer. He slew innocent children. He caused the deaths of an unknown but huge number of humans The Christ of the New Testament was the opposite. He gave life. He did not take it. When we talk of giving forgiveness to those who have fallen to earthly traits, and the inability of some to forgive, how can you forgive God for his deeds in the Old Testament,. In the Old Testament the Godhead= God the Father, Christ the Lord God of children Israel Redeemer/Savior, and Holy Spirit was dealing with Satan and 1/3 of the fallen angels of God. These EVIL angelic beings seek to destroy the coming Christ's Seed of the Messiah/Redeemer of Humanity, which the Godhead had promised He would come to die for our sins. Genesis 3:15.
These EVIL angelic beings tried to wipe out the whole race of humanity with genetic manipulation breeding between the fallen angels with women of this earth= the Nephilim/giants to wipe out mankind so the Messiah would NOT and could NOT be born into the world in the person Jesus/Yashua/Salvation to SAVE the humans race/humanity. To understand this a person has to read the first 8 chapters of the book of Enoch.
The book of Enoch on line: hiddenbible.com/enoch/online.html/
Satan/Serpent had his own genetic breeding with Eve to create His own EVIL children through the SEED of Cain= Illuminati/Elites through the centuries to RULE over the fallen humans race as their slaves... Genesis chapter 2. The Godhead was dealing with Evil beings/angels and THEY had to destroy their Evil children on earth who wanted to KILL the Messiah Seed, by using their EVIL children on earth= the Nephilim, Pharaohs, and the Nephilim/7 giants nations to kill the children of Israel of the face of the earth so there would be NO Salvation for mankind if the Messiah/Jesus had NOT been born through the Seed of Adam and Eve.
ALL the killings of the children of evil fallen angels on earth that the Godhead did in the Old Testament was for the SALVATION and Survivor of all the humans race.
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Post by nathan on Jul 2, 2020 23:49:59 GMT -5
How can you contemplate the thought that the God of the Old Testament is the same God (Jesus) of the new. The trinity is a thought bubble of the Catholic Church. The Trinity concept is taught in the Old Testament chapter 1:26 ; 3:22. King David KNEW about the Godhead/Trinity sharing in a few of his Ps. and spoken by Jesus Christ in John chapters 14-17; Matthew 28: 19-20... the early church fathers or the apostolic in the 2nd Century they coined the word Trinity/Triune God to describe the Godhead= God the Father, Christ the Lord God our Savior, and the Holy Spirit/Trinity or TRIUNE God.
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Post by Dan on Jul 3, 2020 5:03:38 GMT -5
" ... I do nothing of myself; but as my father has taught me ... " John 8:28 " ... and he that sent me is with me the father hath not left me alone, for I do those things that please him ..." John 8:29 If Jesus is GOD why would he be concerned with not doing what pleases himself but with what pleases GOD? "... I speak of that which I have seen with my father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father ..." John 6:38 If Jesus is GOD why would he compare the relationship between us and our fathers to him and his father? " ... Jesus said, I proceeded forth and came from GOD; neither came I of myself but he sent me ..." John 8: 42 If Jesus is GOD why would he say he "proceedeth forth and came FROM" GOD? " ... It is my father that honoreth me ..." John 8:54 Would GOD honoreth himself?
That's the brain teaser that people have a tough time grasping, e.g; if Jesus was God, who was he praying too?
Jesus was the Word from the beginning, and the Word was God (John 1:1). When the Word was manifested in the flesh, it was necessary for Jesus to refer to the Father in the third person even though they are one (John 10:30). But even though the Word became the Son of Man, he was also Emmanuel (God with us). I believe that for example sake, Jesus demonstrated as a man what pleases God the Father and how we should relate to Him. God's Word is not separate from God, just as your words and spirit are you, because they can emanate from no one else. God is a Spirit (John 4:24), and the same Spirit descended upon Jesus (Luke 3:22). So the Father, Son, & Spirit are one in the same, just revealing different aspects and functions of a single entity. Jesus told Philip that seeing him was seeing the Father (John 14:9). Heaven is where God is, Jesus said, "The kingdom of God is in your midst" (Luke 17:21 NIV).
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Post by chuck on Jul 3, 2020 8:38:39 GMT -5
In my view the God of the Old Testament was evil, corrupt and a murderer. He slew innocent children. He caused the deaths of an unknown but huge number of humans The Christ of the New Testament was the opposite. He gave life. He did not take it. When we talk of giving forgiveness to those who have fallen to earthly traits, and the inability of some to forgive, how can you forgive God for his deeds in the Old Testament,. He didn't do any such thing unless you think God is a actual existent being.
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Post by nathan on Jul 3, 2020 9:00:17 GMT -5
" ... I do nothing of myself; but as my father has taught me ... " John 8:28 " ... and he that sent me is with me the father hath not left me alone, for I do those things that please him ..." John 8:29 If Jesus is GOD why would he be concerned with not doing what pleases himself but with what pleases GOD? "... I speak of that which I have seen with my father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father ..." John 6:38 If Jesus is GOD why would he compare the relationship between us and our fathers to him and his father? " ... Jesus said, I proceeded forth and came from GOD; neither came I of myself but he sent me ..." John 8: 42 If Jesus is GOD why would he say he "proceedeth forth and came FROM" GOD? " ... It is my father that honoreth me ..." John 8:54 Would GOD honoreth himself?
That's the brain teaser that people have a tough time grasping, e.g; if Jesus was God, who was he praying too?
Jesus was the Word from the beginning, and the Word was God (John 1:1). When the Word was manifested in the flesh, it was necessary for Jesus to refer to the Father in the third person even though they are one (John 10:30).
But even though the Word became the Son of Man, he was also Emmanuel (God with us). I believe that for example sake, Jesus demonstrated as a man what pleases God the Father and how we should relate to Him. God's Word is not separate from God, just as your words and spirit are you, because they can emanate from no one else.
God is a Spirit (John 4:24), and the same Spirit descended upon Jesus (Luke 3:22). So the Father, Son, & Spirit are one in the same, just revealing different aspects and functions of a single entity. Jesus told Philip that seeing him was seeing the Father (John 14:9). Heaven is where God is, Jesus said, "The kingdom of God is in your midst" (Luke 17:21 NIV).
Amen, Amen... The confusion part for MANY Christians and the current workers and friends today they believe the Word God refers ONLY to God the Father and NOT to Christ or the Holy Spirit. When the Bible teach the word God they automaticly THINK God the Father ONLY! so there goes the confusion when believers say God the Son/Christ. El/God is singular but Elohim/plural in Genesis 1:26. God Elohim said, "Let US create man in OUR imagine and in OUR Likeness." The THREE= Father, Christ and Holy Spirit were there and speaking to each others.
At the Cross God/Christ the Son Jesus prayed to God the Father in heaven, "My God, my God why, has thou forsaken me?". In the book of Hebrews chapter 1:8-12 God the Father called/addressed the Son/Christ Jesus "God and Lord" who created the heavens/Universe, the angels and the humans.
There is ONE Godhead but 3 beings= One God the Father, One Christ who is our Savior, and One Holy Spirit as our Teacher, Protector and Guide in ONENESS of Unity, harmony, and Mind.
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Bigbiddy
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Post by Bigbiddy on Jul 3, 2020 18:57:53 GMT -5
The 2x2's have really dug themselves into a hole on who God is. Historically, they believed that the Lord God was the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. There is absolutely no doubt on this point if you study sermons, hymns etc. In the late 1960's this changed and most followed the Dan Hilton line that "the Trinity was a concoction of the Catholic Church". This all culminated in the hymn changes in the 1987 book. Very few workers now understand who the Lord God is but some, like Titus Lehman (Overseer of Colorado) still uphold and preach that Jesus is God (Mudgee Convention - Australia - 2016). Most workers would understand though that thousands of people have left the 2x2's over the years re this issue. That trend continues. That is why some churches (Mormons, JW's etc) are classified by Christian pastors as cults. A cult, from a Christian perspective is simply a church that claims to be based or rooted in historic Christianity, but has deviated from or abandoned the finished work of Christ, or compromised on his person. Most workers have done this - a few haven't. On this basis and the perspective you quote, the Church of England may well be consider a cult by the Catholic Church. Henry VIII abandoned the Catholic Church for his own gratification
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jul 3, 2020 19:07:31 GMT -5
The 2x2's have really dug themselves into a hole on who God is. Historically, they believed that the Lord God was the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. There is absolutely no doubt on this point if you study sermons, hymns etc. In the late 1960's this changed and most followed the Dan Hilton line that "the Trinity was a concoction of the Catholic Church". This all culminated in the hymn changes in the 1987 book. Very few workers now understand who the Lord God is but some, like Titus Lehman (Overseer of Colorado) still uphold and preach that Jesus is God (Mudgee Convention - Australia - 2016). Most workers would understand though that thousands of people have left the 2x2's over the years re this issue. That trend continues. That is why some churches (Mormons, JW's etc) are classified by Christian pastors as cults. A cult, from a Christian perspective is simply a church that claims to be based or rooted in historic Christianity, but has deviated from or abandoned the finished work of Christ, or compromised on his person. Most workers have done this - a few haven't. On this basis and the perspective you quote, the Church of England may well be consider a cult by the Catholic Church. Henry VIII abandoned the Catholic Church for his own gratification Henry abandoned the Catholics because he wanted a divorce. The Anglicans were founded because of divorce. How ironic and hypocritical then that Edward who was to be King was sent packing because he wanted to marry a divorced woman.
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Post by jetmech on Jul 4, 2020 10:48:37 GMT -5
" ... I do nothing of myself; but as my father has taught me ... " John 8:28 " ... and he that sent me is with me the father hath not left me alone, for I do those things that please him ..." John 8:29 If Jesus is GOD why would he be concerned with not doing what pleases himself but with what pleases GOD? "... I speak of that which I have seen with my father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father ..." John 6:38 If Jesus is GOD why would he compare the relationship between us and our fathers to him and his father? " ... Jesus said, I proceeded forth and came from GOD; neither came I of myself but he sent me ..." John 8: 42 If Jesus is GOD why would he say he "proceedeth forth and came FROM" GOD? " ... It is my father that honoreth me ..." John 8:54 Would GOD honoreth himself?
That's the brain teaser that people have a tough time grasping, e.g; if Jesus was God, who was he praying too?
Jesus was the Word from the beginning, and the Word was God (John 1:1). When the Word was manifested in the flesh, it was necessary for Jesus to refer to the Father in the third person even though they are one (John 10:30). But even though the Word became the Son of Man, he was also Emmanuel (God with us). I believe that for example sake, Jesus demonstrated as a man what pleases God the Father and how we should relate to Him. God's Word is not separate from God, just as your words and spirit are you, because they can emanate from no one else. God is a Spirit (John 4:24), and the same Spirit descended upon Jesus (Luke 3:22). So the Father, Son, & Spirit are one in the same, just revealing different aspects and functions of a single entity. Jesus told Philip that seeing him was seeing the Father (John 14:9). Heaven is where God is, Jesus said, "The kingdom of God is in your midst" (Luke 17:21 NIV).
" ... No man hath seen GOD at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him ..."John 1:18 God told Moses in Exodus 33:20 " ...Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live ..." IJOHN 4-15" ... No man hath seen GOD at any time. If we love one another; God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us ..." " ...he hath given us of his spirit..." " ... and we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the son to be the saviour of the world ..." "Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God" NOTE: " ... GOD sent the son ..." It says "whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the 'son' of GOD..." It does not say to confess that 'JESUS IS GOD' Why would GOD be so evasive if JESUS were actually GOD, and why did GOD exhalt Jesus? Why wouldn't Jesus say I AM GOD! Why the big secret and mystery?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2020 15:14:03 GMT -5
Okay,.. I'm willing to be convinced either way... Nathan, Ross, I think you're both on the same page on this one (and others too I'm sure). How about joining forces to help me out here?
1. I don't see the necessity of believing one way or the other. 2. the difference in belief/understanding being (tell me your understanding if different a. He was a man with the holy spirit, same as any born again Christian, from then to now. With the possibility of loosing faith (going to hell) b. He was God, in a man's clothing so to speak: - before, throughout, forever, no chance of screwing up, no matter what.
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Post by nathan on Jul 4, 2020 17:44:55 GMT -5
That's the brain teaser that people have a tough time grasping, e.g; if Jesus was God, who was he praying too?
Jesus was the Word from the beginning, and the Word was God (John 1:1). When the Word was manifested in the flesh, it was necessary for Jesus to refer to the Father in the third person even though they are one (John 10:30). But even though the Word became the Son of Man, he was also Emmanuel (God with us). I believe that for example sake, Jesus demonstrated as a man what pleases God the Father and how we should relate to Him. God's Word is not separate from God, just as your words and spirit are you, because they can emanate from no one else. God is a Spirit (John 4:24), and the same Spirit descended upon Jesus (Luke 3:22). So the Father, Son, & Spirit are one in the same, just revealing different aspects and functions of a single entity. Jesus told Philip that seeing him was seeing the Father (John 14:9). Heaven is where God is, Jesus said, "The kingdom of God is in your midst" (Luke 17:21 NIV).
" ... No man hath seen GOD at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him ..."John 1:18 God told Moses in Exodus 33:20 " ...Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live ..." IJOHN 4-15" ... No man hath seen GOD at any time. If we love one another; God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us ..." " ...he hath given us of his spirit..." " ... and we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the son to be the saviour of the world ..." "Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God" NOTE: " ... GOD sent the son ..." It says "whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the 'son' of GOD..." It does not say to confess that 'JESUS IS GOD' Why would GOD be so evasive if JESUS were actually GOD, and why did GOD exhalt Jesus? Why wouldn't Jesus say I AM GOD! Why the big secret and mystery? *** OK my friend let me try... Before the foundation of the Universe the Godhead exists as we KNOW now God the Father, Christ God the Son and the Holy Spirit. God the Father and God the Christ/ Son create the Universe, all the angels, the intelligence beings and populate them in trillions galaxies. They create the animals, plants and the humans. The Bible teaches that no man has seen God at anytime, John the apostle was talking about God the Father, only God the Christ and Holy Spirit have seen God the Father. People or humans ONLY heard God the Father voice speaking from heaven. The God that the humand seen in the Old Testament was God the Christ and He appeared in human form to have fellowship with them in the garden of Eden. God/the Christ had fellowship with Abraham one on once face to face in human form. Christ/God showed Moses His God form of glory. Then 2000 years ago, Christ/God came down from heaven to live in the human person Jesus to die for our sins as He had promised to Ada and Eve in Genesis 3:15. Christ/God the humans Creator who loves us so much that he was willing to die in our place because of sins so, we can become IMMORTAL beings like God for eternity.
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Post by jetmech on Jul 4, 2020 20:29:00 GMT -5
" ... No man hath seen GOD at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him ..."John 1:18 God told Moses in Exodus 33:20 " ...Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live ..." IJOHN 4-15" ... No man hath seen GOD at any time. If we love one another; God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us ..." " ...he hath given us of his spirit..." " ... and we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the son to be the saviour of the world ..." "Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God" NOTE: " ... GOD sent the son ..." It says "whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the 'son' of GOD..." It does not say to confess that 'JESUS IS GOD' Why would GOD be so evasive if JESUS were actually GOD, and why did GOD exhalt Jesus? Why wouldn't Jesus say I AM GOD! Why the big secret and mystery? *** OK my friend let me try... Before the foundation of the Universe the Godhead exists as we KNOW now God the Father, Christ God the Son and the Holy Spirit. God the Father and God the Christ/ Son create the Universe, all the angels, the intelligence beings and populate them in trillions galaxies. They create the animals, plants and the humans. The Bible teaches that no man has seen God at anytime, John the apostle was talking about God the Father, only God the Christ and Holy Spirit have seen God the Father. People or humans ONLY heard God the Father voice speaking from heaven. The God that the humand seen in the Old Testament was God the Christ and He appeared in human form to have fellowship with them in the garden of Eden. God/the Christ had fellowship with Abraham one on once face to face in human form. Christ/God showed Moses His God form of glory. Then 2000 years ago, Christ/God came down from heaven to live in the human person Jesus to die for our sins as He had promised to Ada and Eve in Genesis 3:15. Christ/God the humans Creator who loves us so much that he was willing to die in our place because of sins so, we can become IMMORTAL beings like God for eternity. Thanks Nathan Could you please shoot me a Bible reference where GOD THE CHRIST had fellowship with Abraham? Thanks again my friend.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2020 21:15:11 GMT -5
God wouldn't honor himself - too egotistical.
Instead, create a talking ape 4 dimensions below yourself and tell it to honor you, or you'll burn it forever. Kill kid to make sure ape gets the message.
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Post by nathan on Jul 4, 2020 21:57:49 GMT -5
*** OK my friend let me try... Before the foundation of the Universe the Godhead exists as we KNOW now God the Father, Christ God the Son and the Holy Spirit. God the Father and God the Christ/ Son create the Universe, all the angels, the intelligence beings and populate them in trillions galaxies. They create the animals, plants and the humans. The Bible teaches that no man has seen God at anytime, John the apostle was talking about God the Father, only God the Christ and Holy Spirit have seen God the Father. People or humans ONLY heard God the Father voice speaking from heaven. The God that the humand seen in the Old Testament was God the Christ and He appeared in human form to have fellowship with them in the garden of Eden. God/the Christ had fellowship with Abraham one on once face to face in human form. Christ/God showed Moses His God form of glory. Then 2000 years ago, Christ/God came down from heaven to live in the human person Jesus to die for our sins as He had promised to Ada and Eve in Genesis 3:15. Christ/God the humans Creator who loves us so much that he was willing to die in our place because of sins so, we can become IMMORTAL beings like God for eternity. Thanks Nathan Could you please shoot me a Bible reference where GOD THE CHRIST had fellowship with Abraham? Thanks again my friend. Christ/God had MANY names... One of the is the Yahweh, LORD/Adonai.... Read Genesis chapters 17-19, Where God/LORD Christ made a covenant with Abraham and Sarah that He would be born in the person Jesus through their descendants.
God the Christ appeared in a human form/body with TWO of His humans looking-angels/the Venusians... Like Valiant, Donn Thor to tell Abraham and Sarah the birth of their son Isaac and one of his descendants to be the human/Jesus Redeemer and Savior. 10 Powerful Names of God that refer to God the Christ. www.ibelieve.com/faith/10-powerful-names-of-god-and-what-they-mean-for-us-today.html
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