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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 0:53:03 GMT -5
Do you think all the plagues and woes it speaks about in Revelations could happen AFTER the 1000 year reign when the devil is loosed again? it says in revelation that after the 1000 year reign satan will be loosed for a "little" season. i don't know if thats enough time to do plagues or woes. i suspect that that will happen up to and through the 7 years of tribulation...
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Post by nathan on Apr 10, 2020 0:53:55 GMT -5
Here is a cutious question. When will the Jews be grafted in again? Will it be before the return of Christ or after Christ returns. I find no Scripture that explains that one way or another. I don't see that it is our ministry that has a part in that, do you? Good question... Here is my understanding... There has been a minority of the Jews have become Christians since the time of apostles and during the Gentiles era for the last 2000 years. I believe the Majority of the Jews will confess Jesus is the Christ/Messiah after His second coming.
Many workers have gone to Israel and preached there for many years but NOT much success, they might have worked with mostly among the Messianic Jews. I have met a few Jewish friends through the years. There are Two Jewish twins sisters preached in Africa. They have one of the most interesting testimonies, have you read it?Romans 11:22-28 22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off. And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again. For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree? 25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.
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Post by iam on Apr 10, 2020 0:59:03 GMT -5
Do you think all the plagues and woes it speaks about in Revelations could happen AFTER the 1000 year reign when the devil is loosed again? it says in revelation that after the 1000 year reign satan will be loosed for a "little" season. i don't know if thats enough time to do plagues or woes. i suspect that that will happen up to and through the 7 years of tribulation... Where does it say 7 years tribulation? And when do feel like that happens?
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Post by nathan on Apr 10, 2020 1:02:25 GMT -5
Do you think all the plagues and woes it speaks about in Revelations could happen AFTER the 1000 year reign when the devil is loosed again? it says in revelation that after the 1000 year reign satan will be loosed for a "little" season. i don't know if thats enough time to do plagues or woes. i suspect that that will happen up to and through the 7 years of tribulation... There are many things we don't understand or know how it works AFTER Jesus returns but this we KNOW this much get in the bus FIRST, then the rest We will get to see it clearly with our NEW resurrection bodies. Many of us are guessing on 7 years tribulation... Is that before or after Jesus has returned... nobody knows, it's NOT going to be fun to go through it.
What we face now with Corona Virus is hell hole for years to endure for millions of people. No jobs, no money to pay rent, foods, and so on... Is this part of the 7 year Tribulation before Jesus returns that God's people must endure?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 1:04:43 GMT -5
it says in revelation that after the 1000 year reign satan will be loosed for a "little" season. i don't know if thats enough time to do plagues or woes. i suspect that that will happen up to and through the 7 years of tribulation... Where does it say 7 years tribulation? And when do feel like that happens? OOPS during the 7 year peace treaty during which there will be tribulation after awhile....that would be in daniel maybe and not revelation edit: daniel 9 says seven years of tribualtion/peace treaty combination
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Post by iam on Apr 10, 2020 1:39:46 GMT -5
Where does it say 7 years tribulation? And when do feel like that happens? OOPS during the 7 year peace treaty during which there will be tribulation after awhile....that would be in daniel maybe and not revelation edit: daniel 9 says seven years of tribualtion/peace treaty combination Oh. Thanks.
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Post by Dan on Apr 10, 2020 3:13:31 GMT -5
it says in revelation that after the 1000 year reign satan will be loosed for a "little" season. i don't know if thats enough time to do plagues or woes. i suspect that that will happen up to and through the 7 years of tribulation... Many of us are guessing on 7 years tribulation... Is that before or after Jesus has returned... nobody knows, it's NOT going to be fun to go through it.
What we face now with Corona Virus is hell hole for years to endure for millions of people. No jobs, no money to pay rent, foods, and so on... Is this part of the 7 year Tribulation before Jesus returns that God's people must endure? I believe the 7 years of tribulation will be shortened to 3.5 years, possibly 5 months?. “And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.” (Matthew 24:22). Notice that it says for the "elect's sake", which would seem to indicate that there will be no rapture for Christians. We will all be here for the party.
It will be interesting to see how this corona virus plays out. Everyone is under the impression that after 6 weeks of hiding, the war is won and the virus is gone? Hopefully a vaccine won't cause it to mutate and return more deadlier than before? I don't know if tribulation has begun, but some days it sure feels like it
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Post by nathan on Apr 10, 2020 3:28:38 GMT -5
Many of us are guessing on 7 years tribulation... Is that before or after Jesus has returned... nobody knows, it's NOT going to be fun to go through it.
What we face now with Corona Virus is hell hole for years to endure for millions of people. No jobs, no money to pay rent, foods, and so on... Is this part of the 7 year Tribulation before Jesus returns that God's people must endure? 1) I believe the 7 years of tribulation will be shortened to 3.5 years, possibly 5 months?. “And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.” (Matthew 24:22). Notice that it says for the "elect's sake", which would seem to indicate that there will be no rapture for Christians. We will all be here for the party.
~~ Hi Dan, I believe Matthew 24:22 Jesus was talking about the destruction of the city of Jerusalem which was taken place in 70 A.D. It was Jesus warning here that the apostles and disciples remember and they left the city, before Titus came back from Rome and burned the temple down to the ground. Over 1 millions bodies toss over the walls. people died of starvation and they ate their own children to survive...
Here is the rest Matthew 24:16-22 16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
2) It will be interesting to see how this corona virus plays out. Everyone is under the impression that after 6 weeks of hiding, the war is won and the virus is gone? Hopefully a vaccine won't cause it to mutate and return more deadlier than before? I don't know if tribulation has begun, but some days it sure feels like it ~~ I believe the tribulation began after 2012.. The weather went bonker! on us the last 8 years.. Now, with the deadly viruses, What is next? I want to go home.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 3:43:12 GMT -5
I giggle to myself how fairy tails with a bit of manipulation and a huge dose of imagination can be made to fit events happening on Earth. It is clever but stupid. Myself I am a Math, Science person, prefer a bit of logic and commonsense.But then I suppose it is each to their own.
Is the Rapture starting, is it not. It doesn't quite fit so we will hedge our bets for awhile. It is all very fluid at any time, subject to change as required. Makes more sense to put your money on a Horse.
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Post by christiansburg on Apr 10, 2020 9:48:03 GMT -5
Do you think all the plagues and woes it speaks about in Revelations could happen AFTER the 1000 year reign when the devil is loosed again? Thanks. I was familiar with those verses but was just wondering if that occurred before or after the return of Christ. I have had the feeling that something as great as that would be done in some miraculous way: a sign, an awakening or some great event far beyond what we are doing in preaching the gospel of Christ. Just a thought.
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Post by iam on Apr 10, 2020 11:12:28 GMT -5
Do you think all the plagues and woes it speaks about in Revelations could happen AFTER the 1000 year reign when the devil is loosed again? Thanks. I was familiar with those verses but was just wondering if that occurred before or after the return of Christ. I have had the feeling that something as great as that would be done in some miraculous way: a sign, an awakening or some great event far beyond what we are doing in preaching the gospel of Christ. Just a thought. Yeah I tend to think so too
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Post by iam on Apr 10, 2020 11:17:44 GMT -5
I giggle to myself how fairy tails with a bit of manipulation and a huge dose of imagination can be made to fit events happening on Earth. It is clever but stupid. Myself I am a Math, Science person, prefer a bit of logic and commonsense.But then I suppose it each to their own. Is the Rapture starting, is it not. It doesn't quite fit so we will hedge our bets for awhile. It is all very fluid at any time, subject to change as required. Makes more sense to put your money on a Horse. I've never bet on horses because I always figured I would lose but if you're one of the lucky ones and have a hot lead on a good horse to bet on...care to share? A little extra cash on the dash is always nice 😁
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Post by iam on Apr 10, 2020 11:23:39 GMT -5
Many of us are guessing on 7 years tribulation... Is that before or after Jesus has returned... nobody knows, it's NOT going to be fun to go through it.
What we face now with Corona Virus is hell hole for years to endure for millions of people. No jobs, no money to pay rent, foods, and so on... Is this part of the 7 year Tribulation before Jesus returns that God's people must endure? I believe the 7 years of tribulation will be shortened to 3.5 years, possibly 5 months?. “And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.” (Matthew 24:22). Notice that it says for the "elect's sake", which would seem to indicate that there will be no rapture for Christians. We will all be here for the party.
It will be interesting to see how this corona virus plays out. Everyone is under the impression that after 6 weeks of hiding, the war is won and the virus is gone? Hopefully a vaccine won't cause it to mutate and return more deadlier than before? I don't know if tribulation has begun, but some days it sure feels like it I know. I really feel for the people that have a high overhead. It's never a bad thing when we get to simplify our lives and live with much less but I hope we all support each other as we are able and have empathy.
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Post by nathan on Apr 10, 2020 11:54:09 GMT -5
Thanks. I was familiar with those verses but was just wondering if that occurred before or after the return of Christ. I have had the feeling that something as great as that would be done in some miraculous way: a sign, an awakening or some great event far beyond what we are doing in preaching the gospel of Christ. Just a thought. Yeah I tend to think so too I believe the gospel to preach again and it will be preaching by the believers with the resurrection bodies throughout the Universe/Trillions Galaxies. There are billions intelligence beings are out there living in these planets need to be SAVED and God wants us/believers to help them.
That is why God and Christ want His apostles and believers to recruit Gentiles from all nations on earth the last 2000 years to be His Living Witnesses to Rule with Christ on earth and throughout the Universe during the 1000 yrs Reign.
Satan, 1/3 of fallen angels and his demonic army of unbelievers are alive on earth and they have been TRYING to STOP God's servants and people from recruiting/converting people into His kingdom through believing in Christ as the Redeemer and Savior.
Like I have mentioned in the past heaven is NOT going to be ONLY SAVED humans but many intelligence beings in the Trillion galaxies/planets also. It's going to be ONE big AMAZING! Family of God from all walks of life.
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Post by slowtosee on Apr 10, 2020 12:42:52 GMT -5
And just to add a little , some letters from William Irvine , founder of present day f&w church - 1923: "The 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month is Armistice day. The year is probably from the year that Abram got the promise of the Land. If you look up you will find it about 1923 B.C. as we see 1923 the probable year in which it will be fulfilled" (Robert Skerritt Dec. 1, 1922). 1934: "So Rev. IX is easier to read now than ever. 11.11.11 Jewish time was the hour, day, month of 1914 war. August 1st Jewish time it began and finished. 11.11.11 Christian time, and the coming war hour, day month & year may be 1st Aug. 1934. And John's coming at same time, for the world war, famine, pest & plagues I expect will begin together. So our long expectations may now be in sight. 20 years to a day from 1914 war" ( Fountains June 22, 1934). 1938: "we are now entering the 17 hour of His sufferings; and so the 18th year of Judgment; and now the 1st year of Tribulation, which is the last 7 years ...for this time next year, when John will have come, and the Woman be invited to come to Palestine" (Fountains Aug. 2, 1930). 1938: "So here I am awaiting my reward, with all the other 2,000 million on the earths to be signed and sealed by John from Heaven-- probably at the end of the 24 years from 1914�. Jesus' sufferings in the 24 hours ending in the Tomb helps us to see the preparation in these 24 years ending in the Tomb for the unregenerate world. The day, hour, month and year: 1914 + 24 = 1938" (Edwards Jan. 7, 1938). 1938: "This is my spiritual birthday and I expect we will be having a happy New Year and a real Xmas in John's coming at the end of 24 years from 1914 war coming on when the 7 seals had been opened in heaven. The 24 hours of Jesus' sorrow, death and burial have been well carried through since 1914, and now 6 months ahead the end will come" (Skerritts Jan. 6, 1938). 1938: "The Wall Street joke of raising a 5-million dollar fund to offer Roosevelt if he retires in 5 months�all these 5's seem to draw our attention to our being in the last 5 months of the 24 years of Beginning of Sorrows, and helps to place the hour, day, month and year for Tribulation about 6th August" [1938] (Edwards March 11, 1938). Note: The Tribulation is seven years before the end of the world. 1952: "So the great quake comes at the end � about 7 years from now" (Sutter & Pincetl Nov. 18, 1945) www.tellingthetruth.info/founder_letters/wmiletprophesying.php
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Post by nathan on Apr 10, 2020 12:54:33 GMT -5
And just to add a little , some letters from William Irvine , founder of present day f&w church - 1923: "The 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month is Armistice day. The year is probably from the year that Abram got the promise of the Land. If you look up you will find it about 1923 B.C. as we see 1923 the probable year in which it will be fulfilled" (Robert Skerritt Dec. 1, 1922). 1934: "So Rev. IX is easier to read now than ever. 11.11.11 Jewish time was the hour, day, month of 1914 war. August 1st Jewish time it began and finished. 11.11.11 Christian time, and the coming war hour, day month & year may be 1st Aug. 1934. And John's coming at same time, for the world war, famine, pest & plagues I expect will begin together. So our long expectations may now be in sight. 20 years to a day from 1914 war" ( Fountains June 22, 1934). 1938: "we are now entering the 17 hour of His sufferings; and so the 18th year of Judgment; and now the 1st year of Tribulation, which is the last 7 years ...for this time next year, when John will have come, and the Woman be invited to come to Palestine" (Fountains Aug. 2, 1930). 1938: "So here I am awaiting my reward, with all the other 2,000 million on the earths to be signed and sealed by John from Heaven-- probably at the end of the 24 years from 1914�. Jesus' sufferings in the 24 hours ending in the Tomb helps us to see the preparation in these 24 years ending in the Tomb for the unregenerate world. The day, hour, month and year: 1914 + 24 = 1938" (Edwards Jan. 7, 1938). 1938: "This is my spiritual birthday and I expect we will be having a happy New Year and a real Xmas in John's coming at the end of 24 years from 1914 war coming on when the 7 seals had been opened in heaven. The 24 hours of Jesus' sorrow, death and burial have been well carried through since 1914, and now 6 months ahead the end will come" (Skerritts Jan. 6, 1938). 1938: "The Wall Street joke of raising a 5-million dollar fund to offer Roosevelt if he retires in 5 months�all these 5's seem to draw our attention to our being in the last 5 months of the 24 years of Beginning of Sorrows, and helps to place the hour, day, month and year for Tribulation about 6th August" [1938] (Edwards March 11, 1938). Note: The Tribulation is seven years before the end of the world. 1952: "So the great quake comes at the end � about 7 years from now" (Sutter & Pincetl Nov. 18, 1945) www.tellingthetruth.info/founder_letters/wmiletprophesying.php All of the above written by William Irvine AFTER he had been excommunicated from the ministry and fellowship in 1917 as the overseer of the 2x2. He preached about the end of the world in 1917 and told the friends to sell their homes and caused much confusion among the friends and workers.
William Irvine believed he and John the apostle were TWO living Witnesses in Rev. 11 to be raised up. Therefore, he went and lived in Jerusalem until the day of his death 1947.
William Irvine kept on preaching his false doctrines by starting two new groups of his own followers, the Omega and another group after he left the 2x2. William Irvine two groups of his own followers are dying and slowly disappearing after his death in Jerusalem 1947. The 2x2s which he had part in 1898 are still growing in many nations around the world as Jesus had commanded His apostles and followers on the Great Commission in Matthew 28 to the time of His returns.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 13:54:14 GMT -5
You can cherry pick predictions to find one to suit the occasion. There are many predictions in the Bible if you search long enough you will find one that fits. In a lottery 200,000 tickets are sold, one ticket wins, 199,999 get it wrong.
It is a bit like me saying today, " The Sun will rise on July 27th 2020". Come July 27 the Sun rises as usual and I say "See I got it right the Sun rose this morning, I predicted that on March 11" I conveniently leave out the fact that it rose 106 times between now and then. Probably 106 other people predicted those dates, someone will get it right.
With Google it is now easier to find a prediction to fit. There are trillions out there, one or none might be right. I prefer Science, it does not just make a stab in the dark.
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Post by slowtosee on Apr 10, 2020 14:11:53 GMT -5
You can cherry pick predictions to find one to suit the occasion. There are many predictions in the Bible if you search long enough you will find one that fits. In a lottery 200,000 tickets are sold, one ticket wins, 199,999 get it wrong. It is a bit like me saying today, " The Sun will rise on July 27th 2020". Come July 27 the Sun rises as usual and I say "See I got it right the Sun rose this morning, I predicted that on March 11" I conveniently leave out the fact that it rose 106 times between now and then. Probably 106 other people predicted those dates, someone will get it right. With Google it is now easier to find a prediction to fit. There are trillions out there, one or none might be right. I prefer Science, it does not just make a stab in the dark. I’ve been having 100 percent good success with my prophetic “algorithm “ for a long time now - “ getting dark tonight and lighter towards morning “ Alvin
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Post by BobWilliston on Apr 10, 2020 14:24:47 GMT -5
I giggle to myself how fairy tails with a bit of manipulation and a huge dose of imagination can be made to fit events happening on Earth. It is clever but stupid. Myself I am a Math, Science person, prefer a bit of logic and commonsense.But then I suppose it is each to their own. Is the Rapture starting, is it not. It doesn't quite fit so we will hedge our bets for awhile. It is all very fluid at any time, subject to change as required. Makes more sense to put your money on a Horse. I found that the rapture has been happening on occasion off and on for half a century already.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 14:47:45 GMT -5
Yes Bob I've been in rapture for 80 years. More so since I married my Wife 59 years ago, and left the 2x2 Church 53 years ago.
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Post by nathan on Apr 10, 2020 14:57:30 GMT -5
Jesus said in Matthew 24:32-44 "But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only. As were the days of Noah, so will be the coming of the Son of man. For as in those days before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day when Noah entered the ark, and they did not know until the flood came and swept them all away, so will be the coming of the Son of man. Then two men will be in the field; one is taken and one is left. Two women will be grinding at the mill; one is taken and one is left."
Paul wrote in I Thess 5:1-3 Now about the times and seasons, brothers, we do not need to write to you. For you are fully aware that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. While people are saying, “Peace and security,” destruction will come upon them suddenly.
The rapture or Jesus 2nd coming is NOT IFs but WHEN! That is what Jesus wants us to be ready every day then it doesn't matter when he comes again.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 16:30:14 GMT -5
Well I jumped the gun, I have been in rapture all my life. The rapture of nature. Just so much to enjoy, that brings peace and happiness. That rapture is here and now, make the most of it, don't speculate about the future, that is the great unknown.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 17:47:31 GMT -5
IMO I think it’s time to be pragmatic re workers. Relinquish this old line, “go 2x2 & homeless” ( scripture is open to interpretation as to what, who, when & why). A home is a home is a home.
Buy a modest home for 2 workers to live in ( allow workers to marry for heavens sake as Ralph & Rene Beattie, Hilda & Frank Quick, Bill & Maggie Carroll, Wilson & Annie McClung etc did ). Not having a mortgage/rent , their outgoings will be minimal & paid by contributions. Those over 65 would get the Super anyhow in this country. Let them continue with this pastoral care exercise which seems to be happening predominately now; it’s evolved into this; it’s what they do best.
Reduce the amount of workers. 2 workers could have a larger area to offer pastoral care. Still have their hall meetings to invite others to. Still have the fellowship meetings as are in place. And even once a week voluntary support for the country’s poor & homeless.
Time to stop trying to live as if, in the 2,000 years ago Middle East culture ( interwoven with some of the English Victorian era).
Was owning an iPad & Smartphone part of the Middle East culture 2,000 years ago? At the flick of a finger able to watch T.V or U tube?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 19:04:03 GMT -5
IMO I think it’s time to be pragmatic re workers. Relinquish this old line, “go 2x2 & homeless” ( scripture is open to interpretation as to what, who, when & why). A home is a home is a home. Buy a modest home for 2 workers to live in ( allow workers to marry for heavens sake as Mr and Mrs Ralph Beattie, Mr and Mrs Frank Quick, Mr and Mrs Bill Carroll etc did ). Not having a mortgage/rent , their outgoings will be minimal & paid by contributions. Those over 65 would get the Super anyhow in this country. Let them continue with this pastoral care exercise which seems to be happening predominately now; it’s evolved into this; it’s what they do best. Reduce the amount of workers. 2 workers could have a larger area to offer pastoral care. Still have their hall meetings to invite others to. Still have the fellowship meetings as are in place. And even once a week voluntary support for the country’s poor & homeless. Time to stop trying to live as if, in the 2,000 years ago Middle East culture ( interwoven with some of the English Victorian era). Was owning an iPad & Smartphone part of the Middle East culture 2,000 years ago? At the flick of a finger able to watch T.V or U tube? if it ain't broke don't fix it. it isn't really broke despite the nay sayers, CSA and the origins...
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Post by nathan on Apr 10, 2020 19:16:11 GMT -5
IMO I think it’s time to be pragmatic re workers. Relinquish this old line, “go 2x2 & homeless” ( scripture is open to interpretation as to what, who, when & why). A home is a home is a home. Buy a modest home for 2 workers to live in ( allow workers to marry for heavens sake as Mr and Mrs Ralph Beattie, Mr and Mrs Frank Quick, Mr and Mrs Bill Carroll etc did ). Not having a mortgage/rent , their outgoings will be minimal & paid by contributions. Those over 65 would get the Super anyhow in this country. Let them continue with this pastoral care exercise which seems to be happening predominately now; it’s evolved into this; it’s what they do best. Reduce the amount of workers. 2 workers could have a larger area to offer pastoral care. Still have their hall meetings to invite others to. Still have the fellowship meetings as are in place. And even once a week voluntary support for the country’s poor & homeless. Time to stop trying to live as if, in the 2,000 years ago Middle East culture ( interwoven with some of the English Victorian era). Was owning an iPad & Smartphone part of the Middle East culture 2,000 years ago? At the flick of a finger able to watch T.V or U tube? if it ain't broke don't fix it. it isn't really broke despite the nay sayers, CSA and the origins... Amen, to that. The Apostles, Vaudois/Waldenses, the Faith Mission preachers, and the 2x2s did NOT set up or come up with the apostolic ministry moving from house to house of believers for the nights but it was God the Father that set these things up and He sent Jesus to carry it out in the gospels, and the book of Acts and through down the centuries.
God and Christ had these things figure it out before the foundation of the world. They set up a ministry and worship gathering that it will work in any ages until Jesus comes again.
Yes, I agree, if it ain't broken DON'T Fix it. God's Way is better than humans by far.... He is from heaven and we humans are from the dust of the ground on earth.
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Post by iam on Apr 10, 2020 19:20:51 GMT -5
IMO I think it’s time to be pragmatic re workers. Relinquish this old line, “go 2x2 & homeless” ( scripture is open to interpretation as to what, who, when & why). A home is a home is a home. Buy a modest home for 2 workers to live in ( allow workers to marry for heavens sake as Mr and Mrs Ralph Beattie, Mr and Mrs Frank Quick, Mr and Mrs Bill Carroll etc did ). Not having a mortgage/rent , their outgoings will be minimal & paid by contributions. Those over 65 would get the Super anyhow in this country. Let them continue with this pastoral care exercise which seems to be happening predominately now; it’s evolved into this; it’s what they do best. Reduce the amount of workers. 2 workers could have a larger area to offer pastoral care. Still have their hall meetings to invite others to. Still have the fellowship meetings as are in place. And even once a week voluntary support for the country’s poor & homeless. Time to stop trying to live as if, in the 2,000 years ago Middle East culture ( interwoven with some of the English Victorian era). Was owning an iPad & Smartphone part of the Middle East culture 2,000 years ago? At the flick of a finger able to watch T.V or U tube? if it ain't broke don't fix it. it isn't really broke despite the nay sayers, CSA and the origins... Wally, seperate from CSA and the origins, there is very very much broken. The WAY is a very small part of it. I get fed up of the self-righteousness and tradition and hypocrisy in the way. It chokes me and it bothers me because I am keenly aware how a little leaven leavens the whole lump and that's why it's impossible to be surrounded by that and not BE that. But I doubt if anything can be done about it now except to watch and pray.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 20:06:17 GMT -5
if it ain't broke don't fix it. it isn't really broke despite the nay sayers, CSA and the origins... Wally, seperate from CSA and the origins, there is very very much broken. The WAY is a very small part of it. I get fed up of the self-righteousness and tradition and hypocrisy in the way. It chokes me and it bothers me because I am keenly aware how a little leaven leavens the whole lump and that's why it's impossible to be surrounded by that and not BE that. But I doubt if anything can be done about it now except to watch and pray. self-righteousness and tradition and hypocrisy are part of every church/denom/religion on the planet its not unique to the truth, there is no where to go to get away from that, grow where you are planted....
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Post by iam on Apr 10, 2020 20:42:19 GMT -5
Wally, seperate from CSA and the origins, there is very very much broken. The WAY is a very small part of it. I get fed up of the self-righteousness and tradition and hypocrisy in the way. It chokes me and it bothers me because I am keenly aware how a little leaven leavens the whole lump and that's why it's impossible to be surrounded by that and not BE that. But I doubt if anything can be done about it now except to watch and pray. self-righteousness and tradition and hypocrisy are part of every church/denom/religion on the planet its not unique to the truth, there is no where to go to get away from that, grow where you are planted.... That's right, Wally, it's everywhere. It doesn't excuse us.
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