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Post by believingjesus on Mar 13, 2020 21:33:47 GMT -5
I told you people have MET Jesus face to face inside the planet of Venus! So, how can Bart say Jesus has NEVER existed? You believe in a Quack Bart and don't even know it.
STR, has mentioned many time on this board, that she has met Jesus face to face.
Oh, really? Sounds like STR had a great dream. And when has anyone on this board or Ehrman himself stated Jesus doesn’t exist? He’s a scholar that argues that Jesus existed. Shows your lack of understanding of a person you keep calling a quack!! This post is pure awesomeness 😁. Of course Ehrman believes Jesus existed. He wrote an entire book defending the proposition against people who deny or say he MAY NOT have existed (Richard Carrier, Earl Doherty and Robert Price to name a few of Ehrman’s contemporaries).
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Post by ant_rotten on Mar 13, 2020 21:34:20 GMT -5
Do these “intelligent beings that populate other galaxies and planets believe in the story of genesis or do they have their own bible? Do they believe in Jesus? If Jesus such of such importance to this planet, how are the intelligent beings living on other planets going to be saved? Or isn’t god concerned about these people? Are they going to hell? What’s gods purpose for all these others “intelligent beings” that you claim are out there in the universe? Yes, the EBEN intelligence beings race knows that Jesus a special man came to earth 2000 yrs ago, but they don't KNOW He is the Second Person of the Godhead Yahweh. They said they were monitoring him while he was on earth.
The fallen angels and demons on earth KNOW who Jesus is the Son of God and NOT God the Father and he told them to be quite and NOT to talk about it.
Your views as a “Christian” are so skewed that you’ll probably end up in hell like us non believers..
Hell, I wouldn’t even call you a Christian.
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Post by believingjesus on Mar 13, 2020 21:38:43 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2020 21:39:49 GMT -5
I think it’s important to read or listen to his whole story to get it in context.
Bart- “But as a historian I think evidence matters. And the past matters. And for anyone to whom both evidence and the past matter, a dispassionate consideration of the case makes it quite plain: Jesus did exist. He may not have been the Jesus that your mother believes in or the Jesus of the stained-glass window or the Jesus of your least favorite televangelist or the Jesus proclaimed by the Vatican, the Southern Baptist Convention, the local megachurch, or the California Gnostic. But he did exist, and we can say a few things, with relative certainty, about him .”*****
I just listened to him and he makes it very clear, he believes Jesus did exist.
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Post by nathan on Mar 13, 2020 21:40:10 GMT -5
Yes, the EBEN intelligence beings race knows that Jesus a special man came to earth 2000 yrs ago, but they don't KNOW He is the Second Person of the Godhead Yahweh. They said they were monitoring him while he was on earth.
The fallen angels and demons on earth KNOW who Jesus is the Son of God and NOT God the Father and he told them to be quite and NOT to talk about it.
Your views as a “Christian” are so skewed that you’ll probably end up in hell like us non believers..
Hell, I wouldn’t even call you a Christian. Most of you atheists are just believe in yourself and that is ALL.. You/atheists are NOT alone in the Universe! Hell, I don't give a baloney sandwich whatever you want to call me.
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Post by BobWilliston on Mar 13, 2020 21:40:39 GMT -5
Well that’s a claim that Ehrman himself has NEVER made.. Bart wrote: And so, with Did Jesus Exist?, I do not expect to convince anyone in that boat. What I do hope is to convince genuine seekers who really want to know how we know that Jesus did exist, as virtually every scholar of antiquity, of biblical studies, of classics, and of Christian origins in this country and, in fact, in the Western world agrees. Many of these scholars have no vested interest in the matter. As it turns out, I myself do not either. I am not a Christian, and I have no interest in promoting a Christian cause or a Christian agenda. I am an agnostic with atheist leanings, and my life and views of the world would be approximately the same whether or not Jesus existed. My beliefs would vary little. The answer to the question of Jesus’s historical existence will not make me more or less happy, content, hopeful, likable, rich, famous, or immortal. strangenotions.com/skeptic-bart-ehrman-on-whether-jesus-really-existed/There is NOTHING in that quote that means Ehrman thinks Jesus never existed. It means he doesn't personally care whether he existed. Somewhat like the way I don't care at all where you live or what you do for a living. Knowing that you even exist will not make me more or less happy, content, hopeful, likable, rich, famous, or immortal. On the other hand, like Ehrman's concentration on Jesus, I may still be interested in investigating every tiny thing there is to know about YOU in case some people want to know whether you're a fraud or not.
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Post by ant_rotten on Mar 13, 2020 21:40:41 GMT -5
Well that’s a claim that Ehrman himself has NEVER made.. Bart wrote: And so, with Did Jesus Exist?, I do not expect to convince anyone in that boat. What I do hope is to convince genuine seekers who really want to know how we know that Jesus did exist, as virtually every scholar of antiquity, of biblical studies, of classics, and of Christian origins in this country and, in fact, in the Western world agrees. Many of these scholars have no vested interest in the matter. As it turns out, I myself do not either. I am not a Christian, and I have no interest in promoting a Christian cause or a Christian agenda. I am an agnostic with atheist leanings, and my life and views of the world would be approximately the same whether or not Jesus existed. My beliefs would vary little. The answer to the question of Jesus’s historical existence will not make me more or less happy, content, hopeful, likable, rich, famous, or immortal. strangenotions.com/skeptic-bart-ehrman-on-whether-jesus-really-existed/I see you’ve taken the bold section as proof that Ehrman said he doesn’t believe in Jesus? You’ve completely missed his point about vested interest, which is what he’s referring to in the middle section you’ve highlighted..
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Post by believingjesus on Mar 13, 2020 21:42:32 GMT -5
Well that’s a claim that Ehrman himself has NEVER made.. Bart wrote: And so, with Did Jesus Exist?, I do not expect to convince anyone in that boat. What I do hope is to convince genuine seekers who really want to know how we know that Jesus did exist, as virtually every scholar of antiquity, of biblical studies, of classics, and of Christian origins in this country and, in fact, in the Western world agrees. Many of these scholars have no vested interest in the matter. As it turns out, I myself do not either. I am not a Christian, and I have no interest in promoting a Christian cause or a Christian agenda. I am an agnostic with atheist leanings, and my life and views of the world would be approximately the same whether or not Jesus existed. My beliefs would vary little. The answer to the question of Jesus’s historical existence will not make me more or less happy, content, hopeful, likable, rich, famous, or immortal. strangenotions.com/skeptic-bart-ehrman-on-whether-jesus-really-existed/It’s always honest when someone cherry-picks their quotations <sarcasm>
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Post by nathan on Mar 13, 2020 21:43:03 GMT -5
Bart wrote: And so, with Did Jesus Exist?, I do not expect to convince anyone in that boat. What I do hope is to convince genuine seekers who really want to know how we know that Jesus did exist, as virtually every scholar of antiquity, of biblical studies, of classics, and of Christian origins in this country and, in fact, in the Western world agrees. Many of these scholars have no vested interest in the matter. As it turns out, I myself do not either. I am not a Christian, and I have no interest in promoting a Christian cause or a Christian agenda. I am an agnostic with atheist leanings, and my life and views of the world would be approximately the same whether or not Jesus existed. My beliefs would vary little. The answer to the question of Jesus’s historical existence will not make me more or less happy, content, hopeful, likable, rich, famous, or immortal. strangenotions.com/skeptic-bart-ehrman-on-whether-jesus-really-existed/There is NOTHING in that quote that means Ehrman thinks Jesus never existed. It means he doesn't personally care whether he existed. Somewhat like the way I don't care at all where you live or what you do for a living. Knowing that you even exist will not make me more or less happy, content, hopeful, likable, rich, famous, or immortal. On the other hand, like Ehrman's concentration on Jesus, I may still be interested in investigating every tiny thing there is to know about YOU in case some people want to know whether you're a fraud or not. It's a COP OUT! but WE KNOW what Bart believes. He is NOT a Christian but an agnostic with an atheist leanings!
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Post by BobWilliston on Mar 13, 2020 21:43:34 GMT -5
I think it’s important to read or listen to his whole story to get it in context. Bart- “But as a historian I think evidence matters. And the past matters. And for anyone to whom both evidence and the past matter, a dispassionate consideration of the case makes it quite plain: Jesus did exist. He may not have been the Jesus that your mother believes in or the Jesus of the stained-glass window or the Jesus of your least favorite televangelist or the Jesus proclaimed by the Vatican, the Southern Baptist Convention, the local megachurch, or the California Gnostic. But he did exist, and we can say a few things, with relative certainty, about him .”***** I just listened to him and he makes it very clear, he believes Jesus did exist. You have excellent deductive reasoning. Not everyone has that. It's an indication of higher reading skills.
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Post by BobWilliston on Mar 13, 2020 21:44:55 GMT -5
There is NOTHING in that quote that means Ehrman thinks Jesus never existed. It means he doesn't personally care whether he existed. Somewhat like the way I don't care at all where you live or what you do for a living. Knowing that you even exist will not make me more or less happy, content, hopeful, likable, rich, famous, or immortal. On the other hand, like Ehrman's concentration on Jesus, I may still be interested in investigating every tiny thing there is to know about YOU in case some people want to know whether you're a fraud or not. It's a COP OUT! but WE KNOW what Bart believes. He is NOT a Christian but an agnostic with an atheist leanings!
You're not a Muslim. Does that mean you don't believe Muhammad ever lived?
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Post by BobWilliston on Mar 13, 2020 21:46:27 GMT -5
Bart wrote: And so, with Did Jesus Exist?, I do not expect to convince anyone in that boat. What I do hope is to convince genuine seekers who really want to know how we know that Jesus did exist, as virtually every scholar of antiquity, of biblical studies, of classics, and of Christian origins in this country and, in fact, in the Western world agrees. Many of these scholars have no vested interest in the matter. As it turns out, I myself do not either. I am not a Christian, and I have no interest in promoting a Christian cause or a Christian agenda. I am an agnostic with atheist leanings, and my life and views of the world would be approximately the same whether or not Jesus existed. My beliefs would vary little. The answer to the question of Jesus’s historical existence will not make me more or less happy, content, hopeful, likable, rich, famous, or immortal. strangenotions.com/skeptic-bart-ehrman-on-whether-jesus-really-existed/I see you’ve taken the bold section as proof that Ehrman said he doesn’t believe in Jesus? You’ve completely missed his point about vested interest, which is what he’s referring to in the section you’ve highlighted.. "vested interest" is a very difficult concept to understand.
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Post by ant_rotten on Mar 13, 2020 21:49:32 GMT -5
I see you’ve taken the bold section as proof that Ehrman said he doesn’t believe in Jesus? You’ve completely missed his point about vested interest, which is what he’s referring to in the section you’ve highlighted.. "vested interest" is a very difficult concept to understand. Yes, seems Nathan has no understanding of the sentence before the middle section he’s highlighted. How convenient..
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Post by believingjesus on Mar 13, 2020 21:51:30 GMT -5
There is NOTHING in that quote that means Ehrman thinks Jesus never existed. It means he doesn't personally care whether he existed. Somewhat like the way I don't care at all where you live or what you do for a living. Knowing that you even exist will not make me more or less happy, content, hopeful, likable, rich, famous, or immortal. On the other hand, like Ehrman's concentration on Jesus, I may still be interested in investigating every tiny thing there is to know about YOU in case some people want to know whether you're a fraud or not. It's a COP OUT! but WE KNOW what Bart believes. He is NOT a Christian but an agnostic with an atheist leanings!
As you say, he is an agnostic but that doesn’t mean that therefore he denies Jesus existed as a historical figure. It’s possible you know (there are MANY people out there who hold the same position.) He simply does not believe Jesus was divine/the son of a god.
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Post by ant_rotten on Mar 13, 2020 22:09:31 GMT -5
Your views as a “Christian” are so skewed that you’ll probably end up in hell like us non believers..
Hell, I wouldn’t even call you a Christian. Most of you atheists are just believe in yourself and that is ALL.. You/atheists are NOT alone in the Universe! Hell, I don't give a baloney sandwich whatever you want to call me. How do you not realise that the views you hold about Jesus living in the center of Venus is not a Christian view, nor ever has been? It’s you and Frank stooges view against every other Christian on the planet. Your the minority and are gong to be punished for it.
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Post by nathan on Mar 13, 2020 22:17:16 GMT -5
Most of you atheists are just believe in yourself and that is ALL.. You/atheists are NOT alone in the Universe! Hell, I don't give a baloney sandwich whatever you want to call me. How do you not realise that the views you hold about Jesus living in the center of Venus is not a Christian view, nor ever has been? It’s you and Frank stooges view against every other Christian on the planet. Your the minority and are gong to be punished for it. I don't think so, ant... It might be the other way around.
~~ Valiant Thor "Created Being" from Interior planet of Venus arrived in 1957-60 at the Pentagon said to Pastor/Dr. Frank Stranges, " There is LIFE on MANY other Planets, that the people of this earth know nothing about. There are presently 77 of us/Venusians walking among you in the United States. We are constantly coming and going. "
We (Pastor Frank and Valiant Thor) discussed the merits of Jesus Christ ... how He gave His Life freely... so that men could enjoy the benefits of eternal life. I questioned him about a Bible on Venus and he assured me that a personal unbroken fellowship with the "Author" did not necessitate the printing of a "book". He found it amusing that many theologians attempt to discredit both Jesus Christ and The Bible. The very God many have said is "dead" continues to lavish them with all good things. Perhaps they will, in time, permit the spark of Divine Light to again illuminate their troubled hearts. In answer to my question of what he thought of Jesus Christ, he said, "I know that Jesus is the Alpha and Omega of yours and everyone else faith. He today has assumed His rightful position as the ruler of the universe and is preparing a place and a time for all who are called by His Name to ascend far above the clouds to where His Power and Authority shall never again be disputed.There are more solar systems for which man has not even given God credit. There are many beings that have never transgressed the perfect laws of God. Man does not possess the right to condemn the whole of God's creation because he himself has broken the perfect laws of God through disobedience." www.galactic-server.net/rune/valthor2.html
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Post by ant_rotten on Mar 13, 2020 23:36:41 GMT -5
How do you not realise that the views you hold about Jesus living in the center of Venus is not a Christian view, nor ever has been? It’s you and Frank stooges view against every other Christian on the planet. Your the minority and are gong to be punished for it. I don't think so, ant... It might be the other way around.
~~ Valiant Thor "Created Being" from Interior planet of Venus arrived in 1957-60 at the Pentagon said to Pastor/Dr. Frank Stranges, " There is LIFE on MANY other Planets, that the people of this earth know nothing about. There are presently 77 of us/Venusians walking among you in the United States. We are constantly coming and going. "
We (Pastor Frank and Valiant Thor) discussed the merits of Jesus Christ ... how He gave His Life freely... so that men could enjoy the benefits of eternal life. I questioned him about a Bible on Venus and he assured me that a personal unbroken fellowship with the "Author" did not necessitate the printing of a "book". He found it amusing that many theologians attempt to discredit both Jesus Christ and The Bible. The very God many have said is "dead" continues to lavish them with all good things. Perhaps they will, in time, permit the spark of Divine Light to again illuminate their troubled hearts. In answer to my question of what he thought of Jesus Christ, he said, "I know that Jesus is the Alpha and Omega of yours and everyone else faith. He today has assumed His rightful position as the ruler of the universe and is preparing a place and a time for all who are called by His Name to ascend far above the clouds to where His Power and Authority shall never again be disputed.There are more solar systems for which man has not even given God credit. There are many beings that have never transgressed the perfect laws of God. Man does not possess the right to condemn the whole of God's creation because he himself has broken the perfect laws of God through disobedience." www.galactic-server.net/rune/valthor2.html
Nathan, what is it that makes you believe in frank so much? What is it that has you convinced that what he is saying is fact? Because everything you have shown on this thread regarding frank raises serious questions for everyone. I think you lack in the critical thinking department if you can not see how franks ideas raise serious questions. But then again, critical thinking isn’t a skill most Christians use when evaluating sources. Just reading and believing might have you barking up the wrong tree..
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Post by nathan on Mar 13, 2020 23:50:54 GMT -5
I don't think so, ant... It might be the other way around.
~~ Valiant Thor "Created Being" from Interior planet of Venus arrived in 1957-60 at the Pentagon said to Pastor/Dr. Frank Stranges, " There is LIFE on MANY other Planets, that the people of this earth know nothing about. There are presently 77 of us/Venusians walking among you in the United States. We are constantly coming and going. "
We (Pastor Frank and Valiant Thor) discussed the merits of Jesus Christ ... how He gave His Life freely... so that men could enjoy the benefits of eternal life. I questioned him about a Bible on Venus and he assured me that a personal unbroken fellowship with the "Author" did not necessitate the printing of a "book". He found it amusing that many theologians attempt to discredit both Jesus Christ and The Bible. The very God many have said is "dead" continues to lavish them with all good things. Perhaps they will, in time, permit the spark of Divine Light to again illuminate their troubled hearts. In answer to my question of what he thought of Jesus Christ, he said, "I know that Jesus is the Alpha and Omega of yours and everyone else faith. He today has assumed His rightful position as the ruler of the universe and is preparing a place and a time for all who are called by His Name to ascend far above the clouds to where His Power and Authority shall never again be disputed.There are more solar systems for which man has not even given God credit. There are many beings that have never transgressed the perfect laws of God. Man does not possess the right to condemn the whole of God's creation because he himself has broken the perfect laws of God through disobedience." www.galactic-server.net/rune/valthor2.html
Nathan, what is it that makes you believe in frank so much? What is it that has you convinced that what he is saying is fact? Because everything you have shown on this thread regarding frank raises serious questions for everyone. I think you lack in the critical thinking department if you can not see how franks ideas raise serious questions. But then again, critical thinking isn’t a skill most Christians use when evaluating sources. Just reading and believing might have you barking up the wrong tree.. I studied Frank Stranges life for 5 years... I read many of his writings, listen to many of his sermons, and read what people close to him write about him. I studied and read Valiant Thor teachings/writings also. I know these two people and Donn Thor and the Venusians like the back of my hands.
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Post by fixit on Mar 14, 2020 0:33:01 GMT -5
On the other hand, like Ehrman's concentration on Jesus, I may still be interested in investigating every tiny thing there is to know about YOU in case some people want to know whether you're a fraud or not. Does Nathan exist?
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Post by fixit on Mar 14, 2020 0:39:37 GMT -5
~~ Valiant Thor "Created Being" from Interior planet of Venus arrived in 1957-60 at the Pentagon said to Pastor/Dr. Frank Stranges, " There is LIFE on MANY other Planets, that the people of this earth know nothing about. There are presently 77 of us/Venusians walking among you in the United States. We are constantly coming and going. " Are you one of them Nathan?
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Post by nathan on Mar 14, 2020 0:40:23 GMT -5
On the other hand, like Ehrman's concentration on Jesus, I may still be interested in investigating every tiny thing there is to know about YOU in case some people want to know whether you're a fraud or not. Does Nathan exist? I think most of the readers on TMB KNOW I am for real and NOT a fraud by NOW for 20 years.
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Post by nathan on Mar 14, 2020 0:51:34 GMT -5
~~ Valiant Thor "Created Being" from Interior planet of Venus arrived in 1957-60 at the Pentagon said to Pastor/Dr. Frank Stranges, " There is LIFE on MANY other Planets, that the people of this earth know nothing about. There are presently 77 of us/Venusians walking among you in the United States. We are constantly coming and going. " Are you one of them Nathan? I don't KNOW I might be one of them from Interior planet of Venus and God sent me down here as a human being.... like John the Baptist, Paul, Isaiah, and Jeremiah
Jeremiah 1:5 God said "Before I formed you/Jeremiah in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations."
Paul wrote in Gal. 1:14-15 And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers. But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
"The Lord called me before I was born, while I was in my mother's womb he named me. He made my mouth like a sharp sword, in the shadow of his hand he hid me; he made me a polished arrow, in his quiver he hid me away" (Isaiah 49:1-2).
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Post by dmmichgood on Mar 14, 2020 0:51:46 GMT -5
Someone said an authentication factor used is the factor of embarrassment or shame. It seems that in Josephus’ works there was something to do with that angle. I guess I’ll have to go to the library to see if I can find it. I’d stupidly gave my Josephus book away. I didn’t have it all , I think is why. I still can't figure out what you meant by "an authentication factor used is the factor of embarrassment or shame. It seems that in Josephus’ works there was something to do with that angle."
I know the remark that he made and I can't understand what you mean by your statement.
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Post by BobWilliston on Mar 14, 2020 1:19:09 GMT -5
On the other hand, like Ehrman's concentration on Jesus, I may still be interested in investigating every tiny thing there is to know about YOU in case some people want to know whether you're a fraud or not. Does Nathan exist? I recall meeting him once -- but then, you're free to believe that I'm just saying that to make myself sound authoritative.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Mar 14, 2020 1:34:55 GMT -5
Someone said an authentication factor used is the factor of embarrassment or shame. It seems that in Josephus’ works there was something to do with that angle. I guess I’ll have to go to the library to see if I can find it. I’d stupidly gave my Josephus book away. I didn’t have it all , I think is why. I still can't figure out what you meant by "an authentication factor used is the factor of embarrassment or shame. It seems that in Josephus’ works there was something to do with that angle."
I know the remark that he made and I can't understand what you mean by your statement. youtu.be/XAN3kQHTKWI
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Post by fixit on Mar 14, 2020 1:46:40 GMT -5
Are you one of them Nathan? I don't KNOW I might be one of them from Interior planet of Venus and God sent me down here as a human being.... like John the Baptist, Paul, Isaiah, and Jeremiah
Jeremiah 1:5 God said "Before I formed you/Jeremiah in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations."
Paul wrote in Gal. 1:14-15 And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers. But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
"The Lord called me before I was born, while I was in my mother's womb he named me. He made my mouth like a sharp sword, in the shadow of his hand he hid me; he made me a polished arrow, in his quiver he hid me away" (Isaiah 49:1-2).
John the Baptist, Paul, Isaiah, and Jeremiah got their messages from God. Not from YouTube and internet websites.
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Post by nathan on Mar 14, 2020 2:03:11 GMT -5
I don't KNOW I might be one of them from Interior planet of Venus and God sent me down here as a human being.... like John the Baptist, Paul, Isaiah, and Jeremiah
Jeremiah 1:5 God said "Before I formed you/Jeremiah in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations."
Paul wrote in Gal. 1:14-15 And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers. But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
"The Lord called me before I was born, while I was in my mother's womb he named me. He made my mouth like a sharp sword, in the shadow of his hand he hid me; he made me a polished arrow, in his quiver he hid me away" (Isaiah 49:1-2).
John the Baptist, Paul, Isaiah, and Jeremiah got their messages from God. Not from YouTube and internet websites. I got my message from reading His words, mediating, praying to God.... We are living in the 21st century! youtube and internet is another way to get messages and learning from others... you can reach millions of people with message boards in a matter of seconds. God gives us brains so, let us use it, fixit.
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Post by ant_rotten on Mar 14, 2020 2:09:31 GMT -5
John the Baptist, Paul, Isaiah, and Jeremiah got their messages from God. Not from YouTube and internet websites. I got my message from reading His words, mediating, praying to God.... We are living in the 21st century! youtube and internet is another way to get messages and learning from others... you can reach millions of people with message boards in a matter of seconds. God gives us brains so, let us use it, fixit.
If god gave gave us brains, did he forget to show you how use yours?
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