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Post by Brick on Mar 8, 2020 1:43:31 GMT -5
this chapter is also an early version of the lineage of Christ to show earlier promises/prophecies that were made were being kept and adam mentioned in your chapter was the 1st man that lead to sin and the coming Christ was the new 1st man leading to salvation.... None of what you said is in the chapter. It's merely a genealogy. If you want to believe it says things that aren't there, that's fine. I think that's called faith. When children do it, we call it cute. When they continue doing it after they are adults, we call them...Well, I'll just leave that one alone.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 1:47:11 GMT -5
None of what you said is in the chapter. It's merely a genealogy. If you want to believe it says things that aren't there, that's fine. I think that's called faith. When children do it, we call it cute. When they continue doing it after they are adults, we call them...Well, I'll just leave that one alone. maybe a course in how to study or understand scripture would help? - wally
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Post by speak on Mar 8, 2020 2:36:20 GMT -5
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Post by Brick on Mar 8, 2020 2:48:18 GMT -5
maybe a course in how to study or understand scripture would help? - wally I'd need a course on creative imagination.
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Post by fixit on Mar 8, 2020 3:45:22 GMT -5
You're on! I Chronicles 1. Gimme some meaning! Bring it! Spiritualize! I'm looking forward to some spiritual contributions from those who say it's our attitude to the study that is the problem. 1 Chronicles 1 1 Adam, Sheth, Enosh, 2 Kenan, Mahalaleel, Jered, 3 Henoch, Methuselah, Lamech, 4 Noah, Shem, Ham, and Japheth. 5 The sons of Japheth; Gomer, and Magog, and Madai, and Javan, and Tubal, and Meshech, and Tiras. 6 And the sons of Gomer; Ashchenaz, and Riphath, and Togarmah. 7 And the sons of Javan; Elishah, and Tarshish, Kittim, and Dodanim. 8 The sons of Ham; Cush, and Mizraim, Put, and Canaan. 9 And the sons of Cush; Seba, and Havilah, and Sabta, and Raamah, and Sabtecha. And the sons of Raamah; Sheba, and Dedan. 10 And Cush begat Nimrod: he began to be mighty upon the earth. 11 And Mizraim begat Ludim, and Anamim, and Lehabim, and Naphtuhim, 12 And Pathrusim, and Casluhim, (of whom came the Philistines,) and Caphthorim. 13 And Canaan begat Zidon his firstborn, and Heth, 14 The Jebusite also, and the Amorite, and the Girgash-e, 15 And the Hivite, and the Arkite, and the Sinite, 16 And the Arvadite, and the Zemarite, and the Hamathite. 17 The sons of Shem; Elam, and Asshur, and Arphaxad, and Lud, and Aram, and Uz, and Hul, and Gether, and Meshech. 18 And Arphaxad begat Shelah, and Shelah begat Eber. 19 And unto Eber were born two sons: the name of the one was Peleg; because in his days the earth was divided: and his brother's name was Joktan. 20 And Joktan begat Almodad, and Sheleph, and Hazarmaveth, and Jerah, 21 Hadoram also, and Uzal, and Diklah, 22 And Ebal, and Abimael, and Sheba, 23 And Ophir, and Havilah, and Jobab. All these were the sons of Joktan. 24 Shem, Arphaxad, Shelah, 25 Eber, Peleg, Reu, 26 Serug, Nahor, Terah, 27 Abram; the same is Abraham. 28 The sons of Abraham; Isaac, and Ishmael. 29 These are their generations: The firstborn of Ishmael, Nebaioth; then Kedar, and Adbeel, and Mibsam, 30 Mishma, and Dumah, Massa, Hadad, and Tema, 31 Jetur, Naphish, and Kedemah. These are the sons of Ishmael. 32 Now the sons of Keturah, Abraham's concubine: she bare Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah. And the sons of Jokshan; Sheba, and Dedan. 33 And the sons of Midian; Ephah, and Epher, and Henoch, and Abida, and Eldaah. All these are the sons of Keturah. 34 And Abraham begat Isaac. The sons of Isaac; Esau and Israel. 35 The sons of Esau; Eliphaz, Reuel, and Jeush, and Jaalam, and Korah. 36 The sons of Eliphaz; Teman, and Omar, Zephi, and Gatam, Kenaz, and Timna, and Amalek. 37 The sons of Reuel; Nahath, Zerah, Shammah, and Mizzah. 38 And the sons of Seir; Lotan, and Shobal, and Zibeon, and Anah, and Dishon, and Ezar, and Dishan. 39 And the sons of Lotan; Hori, and Homam: and Timna was Lotan's sister. 40 The sons of Shobal; Alian, and Manahath, and Ebal, Shephi, and Onam. and the sons of Zibeon; Aiah, and Anah. 41 The sons of Anah; Dishon. And the sons of Dishon; Amram, and Eshban, and Ithran, and Cheran. 42 The sons of Ezer; Bilhan, and Zavan, and Jakan. The sons of Dishan; Uz, and Aran. 43 Now these are the kings that reigned in the land of Edom before any king reigned over the children of Israel; Bela the son of Beor: and the name of his city was Dinhabah. 44 And when Bela was dead, Jobab the son of Zerah of Bozrah reigned in his stead. 45 And when Jobab was dead, Husham of the land of the Temanites reigned in his stead. 46 And when Husham was dead, Hadad the son of Bedad, which smote Midian in the field of Moab, reigned in his stead: and the name of his city was Avith. 47 And when Hadad was dead, Samlah of Masrekah reigned in his stead. 48 And when Samlah was dead, Shaul of Rehoboth by the river reigned in his stead. 49 And when Shaul was dead, Baalhanan the son of Achbor reigned in his stead. 50 And when Baalhanan was dead, Hadad reigned in his stead: and the name of his city was Pai; and his wife's name was Mehetabel, the daughter of Matred, the daughter of Mezahab. 51 Hadad died also. And the dukes of Edom were; duke Timnah, duke Aliah, duke Jetheth, 52 Duke Aholibamah, duke Elah, duke Pinon, 53 Duke Kenaz, duke Teman, duke Mibzar, 54 Duke Magdiel, duke Iram. These are the dukes of Edom.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 3:45:58 GMT -5
The format I believe was adopted from the Prayer Union gatherings set up by William Irvine before he split his converts away from the Faith Mission to become, initially a 'church' of homeless preachers only. About 1903 Edward Cooney began to encourage non-preaching membership, instituting a few members gathering on Sundays, later on called "fellowship meetings" but these members and gatherings were not sanctioned by William Irvine until 1908. And from that time forward workers were no longer homeless as they had non-preaching members with homes that welcomed workers to stay in, be fed in etc.
It is interesting to notice that not many years ago, online many professing folks used Hymns Old and New as if it were a doctrinal statement. And perhaps in line with that, the meeting format has doctrinal foundation in the following hymn:
Hymn number 155 Hymns Old and New 1951 edition
In the 1951 Music edition this hymn shows no author (the pocket edition shows no authors at all). The hymn does not appear to be retained in the 1987 edition. However, the hymn was undoubtedly written by a worker or friend as it depicts the 2x2 "Fellowship Meeting" format perfectly.
1 Father as we meet, Humbly, and with fear, May thy presence sweet To each heart draw near.
2 Father as we pray, May we rightly ask Grace to tread thy way, Strength to do our task.
3 Father as we speak, May the words be Thine, We, a mouth-piece weak, Ut-ring things Divine,
4 Each word living bread, Broken Lord by Thee, On Thy table spread, Sacrifice so free.
5 Father as we part, May there deeper be, Purpose in each heart Just to live for Thee.
6 As we live for Thee, Lord, our lives control: In Thy service free Other lives enrol.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 3:49:32 GMT -5
I find the frustration with 2x2 thinking is the obscurity of it. It is not clearly defined, very flexible. And if you ask a question they will always "Toe the Company Line" It is annoying you like people who are positive, and think for themselves and let commonsense control their minds. If you ask a straight question you don't expect evasive gobbledygook.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 4:02:27 GMT -5
Thank you Gratu, at least you have shed some light on it. It is just interesting to know why that particular format was chosen. Most Churches are able to tell you the reason why they do what they do. 2x2's seem to believe in obscurity, I guess it gives then wriggle room to avoid questioning. Frustrating.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 4:06:19 GMT -5
The obscurity of 2x2ism dates from its roots as an integral (necessary) part of secret sects. And with regard to its historical secrecy, one might take note of the fact that William Irvine was a Free Mason. Try asking Free Masons questions about Free Masonry, and one is likely to get the same type of "gobbledygook."
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Post by Brick on Mar 8, 2020 4:12:30 GMT -5
And one more thing... abraham offered up his son issac as a precursor sacrifice to the coming Christ...an example of we not having to die for our sins and God picking the sacrifice instead with Jesus Christ/the ram... A god that would command someone to kill their innocent son is not a god to be worshiped.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 4:16:18 GMT -5
Good thinking Gratu, the obscurity probably comes from the Mason influence introduced by WI. When you look at 2x2 history there seems to a bit of everything thrown into the mix. Bit like a Dog's breakfast.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 4:44:08 GMT -5
It is sad that they have got into the way of shallow thinking. It seems to have spread like a common cold. Not good when minds are changed like that, can affect mental health.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 5:08:01 GMT -5
In a sense, the obscurity is a type of mysticism encouraged by workers historically – it has always depicted the presence of a “spirit” (small case) that is necessary to even understand the workers' messages (sermons). And THAT provides the common membership the 'elite' airs, as if 2x2ism is ALONE in having such a 'unique' “spirit” supposedly in control of it. And THAT might give you yet another clue as to why few 2x2s have ever wondered or questioned the format of their "Fellowship Meetings.”
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 5:15:07 GMT -5
It is sad that they have got into the way of shallow thinking. It seems to have spread like a common cold. Not good when minds are changed like that, can affect mental health. And it does affect mental health in 2x2ism - psychiatrists have stated that they have 2x2 patients - who pose particularly difficult cases to even attempt to treat because a psychiatrist (or even a counselor) needs to dig out every nitty bit he/she ever gains regarding the 2x2 religious beliefs. And you think it is frustrating to you, redback - try earning your living trying to help 2x2s with mental 2x2 quirks - first you have to find the chickens that have rotten teeth, then try to pull their rotten teeth - without a clue as to WHY those patients believe whatever you manage to get dug out of them. There is NO professional qualified to help 2x2s mainly because of the obscurity of 2x2ism historically. And THAT is why very well founded Bible-believing former 2x2s are about the only source of help to any troubled 2x2.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 5:25:44 GMT -5
The secrecy and obscurity may have worked in the past, but will not work now. Times have changed, people are more factual. They want accurate up to date information. And if they can't get it from their leaders they soon find proper answers elsewhere.
There is concern in Australia with Overseers playing "Musical Chairs". Does not give the rank and file confidence in them, because they don't know the reason why. All decided at secret Worker's meetings, reasons not made known. Not the way to run an organisation nowadays.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 5:43:35 GMT -5
Well, now, there you may well have more understanding than I have -- I haven't been in 2x2 meetings of any sort on any frequent basis for most of my lifetime. Occasionally I do learn of the location of a 2x2 Gospel Meeting and attend it, only to find the same old same old workers' messages being preached without any hint of any changes whatsoever. But it is becoming obvious that the newer generations of 2x2s are nowhere near as blindly led as in the past generations. Just where that will lead the majority in the future remains to be seen.
A very similar case some years ago materialized in Armstrong's Woldwide Church of God when Armstrong died. New leadership began teaching Biblical teachings for the first time. And the church of Armstrong began to fracture and splinter as a result. And today, the Worldwide Church of God is as Biblically sound as any other denomination - actually it stands ALONE in church history as a 'cult' that became orthodox. Just maybe 2x2ism will be the second to do the same - who knows. There is certainly nothing seriously wrong with the 2x2 church form - the problem with 2x2ism has always been its unBiblical teachings - right from Irvine onward. And the very few workers who did get close to preaching sound Biblical doctrines were soon kicked out by the unBiblical-teaching hierarchy - starting with John Long, one of Irvine's first "companions."
And in line with that, redback, your questioning of 2x2 meeting format is a great start.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 5:50:39 GMT -5
In a sense, the obscurity is a type of mysticism encouraged by workers historically – it has always depicted the presence of a “spirit” (small case) that is necessary to even understand the workers' messages (sermons). And THAT provides the common membership the 'elite' airs, as if 2x2ism is ALONE in having such a 'unique' “spirit” supposedly in control of it. And THAT might give you yet another clue as to why few 2x2s have ever wondered or questioned the format of their "Fellowship Meetings.” Gratu, interesting what you have said. Very clever strategy to instill the idea that you had to be "In the Spirit" to have any understanding. Gave the Workers complete control almost like hypnotism. Helps me to understand how many of us with strong minds did not fall under that spell.
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Post by mountain on Mar 8, 2020 8:19:47 GMT -5
Nathan as usual you dodge the question. Why that set format???. What is the justification for it. I doubt you will come up with a reasonable answer. I think the meetings are based on the Prayer Fellowship/Union Meetings that the Faith Mission had back in the day. Bill just didn't carry over the 2x2 ministerial format, but also the meetings format. However, the bread and wine may have been added to it?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2020 9:25:22 GMT -5
Any of the 2x2s can avoid the mystical aspects of the workers' teachings - even those workers. And while strong minds might avoid such teachings indeed, it does not require human strength of mind.
The Holy Spirit teaches believers through the Word of God, and by His power any 2x2 can be a believer in spite of the unBiblical teachings of 2x2ism historically. I believe that the workers' rule that 2x2s read their Bible instead of enjoying any entertainments is a rule that workers might start obeying themselves, but few 2x2s that I ever knew did more Bible reading than a few hours the night before a meeting, if not just a few minutes before that meeting.
I was no longer a 2x2 when I was staying at an elders home overnight a few years ago - overnight on a Saturday night with meeting of course right there next morning. In the morning with chairs all set, bread and wine set, the elder and I were seated about a half hour before the meeting, he with his Bible open on his lap. I took the earlyness to advantage and asked him, "Can I show you something in your Bible?" He agreed, so I went over to him and opened his Bible to 1 Corinthians 15 and pointed my finger at verse one and asked him to read aloud to me through verse 8. And when he had done so, he exclaimed, "That's what all the other churches founded by men teach. We are the only church that was not founded by a man." I replied, "Have you ever heard of the worker named William Irvine?" He replied, "He started well and soon lost out!"
I quietly went back and sat waiting for meeting to start, knowing that even with the evidence of the whole real gospel right in his Bible seemingly flying right over his head unnoticed by him, perhaps a 'seed' was planted in good soil.
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Post by nathan on Mar 8, 2020 10:10:00 GMT -5
Nathan as usual you dodge the question. Why that set format???. What is the justification for it. I doubt you will come up with a reasonable answer. I think the meetings are based on the Prayer Fellowship/Union Meetings that the Faith Mission had back in the day. Bill just didn't carry over the 2x2 ministerial format, but also the meetings format. However, the bread and wine may have been added to it? Oh, this is the kind of format Redback talking about, I thought he was asking and talking about the Bible studies format... Here is my understanding on the history of the 2x2 format. Edward Cooney had met in home with his friends for meetings before he met William Irvine the Faith Mission preacher in 1898. The 2x2 Jesus apostolic ministry format came from William Irvine the Faith Mission preacher in 1897 and the Faith Mission Prayer Fellowship/Union meetings with no partaken the emblems/Eucharist, no baptism were done either.
Then in 1903 Edward Cooney and the early workers who came from various denomination had taken the emblems in their former churches so, they established the Sunday morning meetings in the homes of the friends, the believers to partake the emblems, and converts were baptized by the workers like they read in the New Testament had done by Jesus and the apostles.
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Post by nathan on Mar 8, 2020 10:31:48 GMT -5
“Oh, this is the kind of format Redback talking about, I thought he was asking and talking about the Bible studies format...“ Clearly, drawing a distinction where there is no appreciable difference – Sunday Morning Fellowship Meeting format: hymn, prayer, hymn, testimonies, communion, closing hymn. Wednesday Night Bible Study Meeting format: hymn, prayer, hymn, testimonies, closing hymn. Convention Meetings format: hymn, prayer, hymn, sermons, closing hymn. Gospel Meeting format: hymn, prayer, hymn, sermons, closing hymn. I answered Redback question on Page 1. the format came from the teachings of Jesus in Luke 22 and in I Cor. chapters 13-14. so, I don't understand why in the world he is complaining.
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Post by nathan on Mar 8, 2020 11:19:47 GMT -5
Luke 22 is the Format for the New Testament believers to follow Christ's Passover. The believers come together to have fellowship with Christ/God, and with one another, they sang hymns, sharing with one another about the things of God.
Paul wrote In I Cor. epistle... I Cor. chapters 13-14. We read the believers came together to worship God and Christ, and having fellowship with one another. They prayed, sharing testimonies, singing hymns on 1st day of the week/Sunday to remember Jesus resurrection day! They partake the emblems= Bread and Wine... in rememberance of Jesus life, death, and resurrection to the time He comes again.
Paul wrote I Cor. 5:7 Our Passover lamb is Christ, who has already been sacrificed. Good News Translation For our Passover Festival is ready, now that Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed.
~~ If you were a 2x2 and had participated in many Sunday morning meetings yourself then you would what I am talking and you would KNOW how it works!
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Post by Get off of TMB on Mar 8, 2020 12:21:24 GMT -5
irish breakaway groups trying to separate from the Catholic-prostestant fighting.
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Post by mountain on Mar 8, 2020 12:25:13 GMT -5
Gratsius, exactly what do those in 2x2 meetings NOT observe in what you have stated below? Remove the speaking in tongues (foreign languages), no longer a spritual gift but a linguistic learned ability, which can have applications, I see the below being fulfilled. Verse 14.26 kills stone dead the false interpretation of 14.34 that women should not participate orally in chuch proceedings/ worship participation. Remember, back then church was in the homes of believers and women were the home makers. This command was for reverance to be shown, not restricting participation. Back then, as now, when women assemble in a home, or indeed anywhere, a clangour ensues. This is what Paul is addressing. I see it every Sunday that I attend my local baptist church.
Church order requires a format. A simplistic format however arranged should include the below attributes as part of the formal but simple service. Indeed what other church meets these requirements? Personally I think you are not seeing the woods for the trees? There again, you have yet to disclose your dietry intake of rice!
Grats opined.
Church Order
14:26 What should you do then, brothers and sisters?11 When you come together, each one has a song, has a lesson, has a revelation, has a tongue, has an interpretation. Let all these things be done for the strengthening of the church. 14:27 If someone speaks in a tongue, it should be two, or at the most three, one after the other, and someone must interpret. 14:28 But if there is no interpreter, he should be silent in the church. Let him speak to himself and to God. 14:29 Two or three prophets should speak and the others should evaluate what is said. 14:30 And if someone sitting down receives a revelation, the person who is speaking should conclude. 14:31 For you can all prophesy one after another, so all can learn and be encouraged. 14:32 Indeed, the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets, 14:33 for God is not characterized by disorder but by peace.
As in all the churches of the saints,12 14:34 the women13 should be silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak.14 Rather, let them be in submission, as in fact the law says. 14:35 If they want to find out about something, they should ask their husbands at home, because it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in church.15 14:36 Did the word of God begin with you,16 or did it come to you alone?
14:37 If anyone considers himself a prophet or spiritual person, he should acknowledge that what I write to you is the Lord’s command. 14:38 If someone does not recognize this, he is not recognized. 14:39 So then, brothers and sisters,17 be eager to prophesy, and do not forbid anyone from speaking in tongues.18 14:40 And do everything in a decent and orderly manner.
Please point out the 2x2 Meeting format because I see no such thing, please pardon the NET Bible use – it is full quoted here by permission. Look up any of the translators notes online at bible.org if you want to see if the translators said anything about Meeting format in those three full chapters.
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Post by nathan on Mar 8, 2020 12:32:44 GMT -5
The Passover 22:7 Then the day for the feast22 of Unleavened Bread came, on which the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed.23 22:8 Jesus24 sent Peter and John, saying, “Go and prepare the Passover25 for us to eat.”26 22:9 They27 said to him, “Where do you want us to prepare28 it?” 22:10 He said to them, “Listen,29 when you have entered the city, a man carrying a jar of water30 will meet you.31 Follow him into the house that he enters, 22:11 and tell the owner of the house,32 ‘The Teacher says to you, “Where is the guest room where I may eat the Passover with my disciples?”’ 22:12 Then he will show you a large furnished room upstairs. Make preparations there.” 22:13 So33 they went and found things34 just as he had told them,35 and they prepared the Passover. The Lord’s Supper 22:14 Now36 when the hour came, Jesus37 took his place at the table38 and the apostles joined39 him. 22:15 And he said to them, “I have earnestly desired40 to eat this Passover with you before I suffer. 22:16 For I tell you, I will not eat it again41 until it is fulfilled42 in the kingdom of God.”43 22:17 Then44 he took a cup,45 and after giving thanks he said, “Take this and divide it among yourselves. 22:18 For I tell you that from now on I will not drink of the fruit46 of the vine until the kingdom of God comes.”47 22:19 Then48 he took bread, and after giving thanks he broke it and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body49 which is given for you.50 Do this in remembrance of me.” 22:20 And in the same way he took51 the cup after they had eaten,52 saying, “This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant53 in my blood. A Final Discourse Did the Passover feast happen every Sunday – I think it happened once per year. And under topic of the Passover meal I see nothing regarding “ The believers come together to have fellowship with Christ/God, and with one another, they sang hymns, sharing with one another about the things of God." They met to eat the Passover meal together – evidently it was a meal during which ”...he took bread, and after giving thanks he broke it and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body49 which is given for you.50 Do this in remembrance of me.” 22:20 And in the same way he took51 the cup after they had eaten,52 saying, “This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant53 in my blood." Again through the whole Passover and its Final Discourse I see no 2x2 Meeting format of “ The believers come together to have fellowship with Christ/God, and with one another, they sang hymns, sharing with one another about the things of God.” They came together to eat the Passover meal. Now I could continue similarly analysing nathan's insertions into the text, but I won't bother for now, since I believe nathan has shown up with intention to demolish this thread with his long winded and boring typical “gobbdygook” that may soon include a hollow planet or two and three Gods stuck in there to drive away even 2x2/visitors who might gain some benefit from this thread. *** You are off your rocker, again... If you were 2x2 you should know these things by now.
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Post by mountain on Mar 8, 2020 12:47:29 GMT -5
The Passover 22:7 Then the day for the feast22 of Unleavened Bread came, on which the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed.23 22:8 Jesus24 sent Peter and John, saying, “Go and prepare the Passover25 for us to eat.”26 22:9 They27 said to him, “Where do you want us to prepare28 it?” 22:10 He said to them, “Listen,29 when you have entered the city, a man carrying a jar of water30 will meet you.31 Follow him into the house that he enters, 22:11 and tell the owner of the house,32 ‘The Teacher says to you, “Where is the guest room where I may eat the Passover with my disciples?”’ 22:12 Then he will show you a large furnished room upstairs. Make preparations there.” 22:13 So33 they went and found things34 just as he had told them,35 and they prepared the Passover. The Lord’s Supper 22:14 Now36 when the hour came, Jesus37 took his place at the table38 and the apostles joined39 him. 22:15 And he said to them, “I have earnestly desired40 to eat this Passover with you before I suffer. 22:16 For I tell you, I will not eat it again41 until it is fulfilled42 in the kingdom of God.”43 22:17 Then44 he took a cup,45 and after giving thanks he said, “Take this and divide it among yourselves. 22:18 For I tell you that from now on I will not drink of the fruit46 of the vine until the kingdom of God comes.”47 22:19 Then48 he took bread, and after giving thanks he broke it and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body49 which is given for you.50 Do this in remembrance of me.” 22:20 And in the same way he took51 the cup after they had eaten,52 saying, “This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant53 in my blood. A Final Discourse Did the Passover feast happen every Sunday – I think it happened once per year. And under topic of the Passover meal I see nothing regarding “ The believers come together to have fellowship with Christ/God, and with one another, they sang hymns, sharing with one another about the things of God." They met to eat the Passover meal together – evidently it was a meal during which ”...he took bread, and after giving thanks he broke it and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body49 which is given for you.50 Do this in remembrance of me.” 22:20 And in the same way he took51 the cup after they had eaten,52 saying, “This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant53 in my blood." Again through the whole Passover and its Final Discourse I see no 2x2 Meeting format of “ The believers come together to have fellowship with Christ/God, and with one another, they sang hymns, sharing with one another about the things of God.” They came together to eat the Passover meal. Now I could continue similarly analysing nathan's insertions into the text, but I won't bother for now, since I believe nathan has shown up with intention to demolish this thread with his long winded and boring typical “gobbdygook” that may soon include a hollow planet or two and three Gods stuck in there to drive away even 2x2/visitors who might gain some benefit from this thread. *** You are off your rocker, again... If you were 2x2 you should know these things by now. From what Paul writes the partaking of bread and the wine was far more regular than an annual event. In fact I believe it likely occurred at every main meal? Perhaps this is how giving thanks before a meal should be, at least regularly? Jesus took two things that were almost ever present at a main meal back then, i.e bread and wine, to symbolise his sacrifice and life. He kept things simple and convenient as well as sincere. 1 Corinthians 11:26 King James Version (KJV) 26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.
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Post by nathan on Mar 8, 2020 13:00:00 GMT -5
*** You are off your rocker, again... If you were 2x2 you should know these things by now. From what Paul writes the partaking of bread and the wine was far more regular than an annual event. In fact I believe it likely occurred at every main meal? Perhaps this is how giving thanks before a meal should be, at least regularly? Jesus took two things that were almost ever present at a main meal back then, i.e bread and wine, to symbolise his sacrifice and life. He kept things simple and convenient as well as sincere. 1 Corinthians 11:26 King James Version (KJV) 26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come. *** Read I Cor.16:1. It seemed the believers came together to commemorate Christ's Passover every Sunday/1st day of the week. I read the early apostolic church fathers history book had celebrate the Eucharist/Christ Passover on EVERY Sunday in the church elders homes where the believers come together to remember Jesus life, death and resurrection.
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Post by fixit on Mar 8, 2020 13:06:22 GMT -5
Luke 22 1 Corinthians 13 1 Corinthians 14 Please point out the 2x2 Meeting format because I see no such thing, please pardon the NET Bible use – it is full quoted here by permission. Look up any of the translators notes online at bible.org if you want to see if the translators said anything about Meeting format in those three full chapters. Please point out how you come to your conclusion that 2x2 meeting format is required doctrine. It's what is done by habit, but I've never heard from anyone that it is essential.
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